Ninja 250 conversion: Need some direction

[grindz145]

Controller is looking good man. I'm following closely.

[tostino]

So I got some work done on the heatsinks last night!

Take a look...

IMG_20110220_154024.jpg

The copper bars after I received them.

(146.32 KiB) Not downloaded yet

I cut some of the copper to attach to each bank of 6 fets on the high side

After I got the holes on one of the bars lined up exactly I used that to copy them to the rest

IMG_20110220_203448.jpg

Half way there!

(243.21 KiB) Downloaded 94 times

Yay!!

IMG_20110220_205617.jpg

The fets in the slots

(154.98 KiB) Not downloaded yet

Thoughts and opinions?

[tostino]

Ahh, I guess I hadn't explained my controller plan in this thread yet...

I was planning on attaching the three banks of 6 fets on the high side to their own 1/16" thick copper bars directly without any insulation between the metal on the fet and the bar (which is what is pictured above). That should allow all of the fets to heat more evenly than if it is insulated right from the start. Then those bars will be insulated with kapton tape from the 1/8" thick copper bars that will have 1/4" OD copper tubing soldered to it in a loop.

All of the low side fets will just be directly attached to the 1/8" copper bar without the need for any insulation at all. I hope that this will allow some sick currents to run through these things without anything blowing up

[tostino]

Yay! I got the tubing in last night!

Also got some project boxes that fit these controllers PERFECTLY. Pics to come later.

[Doctorbass]

Tostino, The copper is a nice idea!
This is great to see we are at least two persons here who want to test these 36 FET beast!

I would recommand you to ensure that the mosfet are not too thightened because it is know that the TO-220 tab bend easy and make small deformation that lift a bit the area right under the mosfet where the silicium chip is located. This area is exactly where the heat os the most important.




Using screw on the To-220 is more technical than it appear. The copper thread you have must not deform the flatness of the copper bar when you thighten the screw. Just few micron of space will destroy your good thermal resistance between the fet tab and the copper flat bar. Copper is soft metal and on 1/8 thick it can deform easy the faltness under the FET. Often you can't see it with eyes but there is real gap



That is why i think i blown many controllers.. there is only need of ONE FEt incorectly thightened to weak the entire controller

This time i prefered applying pressure on the mosfet instead of using screw. we'll see..




If you use Kapton, use very small qty of thermal paste to fill the little air gap of the imprefect flatness of the surface. Kapton is not soft enough to fill these gap.



Here is the link i use as a great information reference

http://sound.westhost.com/heatsink3.gif


I look forward for your results

Doc

[tostino]

So due to LFP's awesome video, I have decided that I would have to be retarded if I didn't end up soldering the fets directly to the copper heat sinks. I ordered some of this stuff: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 1995wt_905 and will see how it works.
I need to get some higher temp solder for the low side bar's tubing on the back, because I don't want that detaching while I try and solder the fets in place.

[tostino]

Yay! I got some high quality low esr caps in from Digikey! 160v 1000 microfarad! Also got in some 4w 0.001omh shunts.

Pictures later =D.

Edit: On another note: I signed up for my motorcycle endorsement class today for the weekend :p. Hopefully it won't be too bad.

[Doctorbass]

Yay! I got some high quality low esr Panasonic caps in from Digikey! 160v 1000 microfarad!

I bought the same for my first 18 fets lyen controller. I succeded to put 4 of them in that case!! 22mm diameter each if i remember.

I also compared them:

Infineon 1000uF 100V Rubycon: cap: 998uF ESR: 110mohms
Crystalyte 1000uF 100V DTDZ : cap: 1063uF ESR: 260mohms
Panasonic 1000uF 160V Panasonic:cap: 740uF ESR: 73mohms

http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=10312&p=163099&hilit=panasonic+esr#p163099

http://media.digikey.com/photos/Panasonic%20Photos/TSHC%20SERIES%2040,22D.jpg


Doc

[tostino]

Hmm, hopefully I didn't make a mistake with my cap choice...
I ended up with these: http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSea ... 93-1171-ND

[tostino]

Just a little update... I took my motorcycle enforcement class this weekend, it took about 11 hours a day both Saturday and Sunday. I passed!

[Doctorbass]

Just a little update... I took my motorcycle enforcement class this weekend, it took about 11 hours a day both Saturday and Sunday. I passed!

Congrat!

Now.. the ebike need your work!

[tostino]

I know I need to get going with it! Do you have any idea what I should use for some high temp solder for the tubing? I need to get some of that pretty soon if possible, and I don't even know what to look for as far as solders go.

P.S. what do you think of my cap choice?

[tostino]

Yay I got my leaded solder paste in the mail today!

[tostino]

Take a look at my sexy new caps! I soldered on three of the 6 total I want to put on the bottom of the board, because the other three need to be put on after I am done putting the fets/wires in.

[Arlo1]

Did you decide on a motor yet? I think collossus would be good!

[tostino]

If I can get the colossus, thats what I want to use! It seems like a better fit than the ME0913.

Higher rpm limit, more efficient, better cooling, lighter, probably more powerful... whats not to love?

I already talked to Burtie about getting a timing adjuster board, and am on the list for that. Now I just need to get Markobetti to respond to me so I can get in line for a Colossus lol.
Hopefully the Colossus will like my 150v setup, and not just want to murder my controllers lol. I'm hoping that by running the two 36 fets, i'll increase the motor resistance enough by splitting the windings, and the controllers will handle it well.

I'd sure love to see a 130mph top speed :p

[pgt400]

Nice work, which batterys are you going with? The Ninja is a great base. Be sure to brace the frame, the engine is a structural part.

Phil

[tostino]

Well, it's been a little while since I've done anything with the bike project. I got a promotion at work though, and now I actually make a little extra money I can use on this project as opposed to before :p.

So let's get right to it!

I got some more 1"x1/8" color bar, cut it to length and sanded it smooth.


Then I make some yummy dinner! :p. I soldered two lengths of pipe onto each of the 4 copper heatsinks.


They are just long enough for the two rows of 18 fets on my 36 fet controllers

[tostino]

So, I got a present in the mail today... the other two are still on their way.
http://db.tt/zjgkoQRW
http://db.tt/OCI4bgy2

[grindz145]

Watercooling FTW

[tostino]

Wow... just looked at the pics on a regular comp (not my tablet) and they are all frocking huge lol... I'll resize em now.

Edit: Fixed =)

[tostino]

So I am getting the remainder of my water cooling parts in the mail today!
I got one of these, three of these, and lastly one of these.

I'll be testing the heat-carrying ability of the system as soon as I get everything in. I'll just need to make a hot-plate of some sort that I can measure the power going in. Pictures to come tomorrow.

[Gordo]

What will you use for coolant? Pure water or glycol mix?

[tostino]

Most likely pure water... I live in Florida, we get a couple freezing nights a year. If anything, I will mix just a little glycol in with it, because we will never see temps below about 30f for more than an hour or so.

[farmkid4]

Any updates? I very interested to see how this goes.