HS3540 on 18S lipo, basic questions

O

OlaGB

1 mW
Joined
May 24, 2014
Messages
17
Location
Norway
Hi all

Im doing my first project bike now, and even though ive searched and read looaaads on this board, i still need a few answers..

Setup is 18S lipo, 8ah (might be 16ah later), Lyen 3077 controller, HS3540 and CA v3.
Everything bought new from Lyen.

Its going on a 26" full suspension bike, and will be mostly used on road, but also some wood trails.
No massive climbs, or loong full speed runs, but will be doing alot of accelleration in midrange.

Questions:
-Drill holes in the motor cover.. Yes or no?
-water ingress, problem on new hs3540's? Anything i should do about it before starting using the motor?
-If the cover needs to be opened, are there a good manual/procedure i could look at before starting?
-what temps should i start worrying at..? Stator temps, read with CA v3 that is.

As i said, ive done alot of searches, but its hard to find good spesific answers sometimes.
 
I had a front HS3540 on a dual wheel drive bike. Never got warm. I was doing maybe 5000w peak into it. It worked maybe half as hard on that bike though.

I've heard the HS3540 can't handle many amps... that they got pretty hot. Not sure how much truth there is to it.

So how many amps are you putting into it?

Motor covers don't require holes.
I had water go into mine.. but I was riding mine through a foot of snow for hours on the 2WD bike.

Opening it is easy. First, mark the side covers position in relation to the rest of the hub, so that you can put them back on the same way they were before taking off.

Then take screws out and use a gear puller to seperate stator from rotor.
You can also press your weight down onto the hub to push the stator out of rotor. Never failed me. Careful not to damage axle this way.

and don't get your fingers caught under the side covers.
 
Well, i'm trying 40A atleast. Lyen said the 12fet 3077 could handle 3500w continous though, so that tells me maximum of 45-50A.. But i guess 40A will do, and hopefully make the bike handle well without needing to worry about overheating stuff all the time.

If (when) tired of it, ill build a crazy cromotor bike instead of tweaking every desimal out of this one..

So you think i should just leave it alone then? (I like the sound of that)
 
Build 2 in my sig, HS3540, 18s 16ah on a 40 amp controller, I know its a mid mount not in the wheel but top gear was 1:1, the motor was fine used in this gear and never really got more than warm. I don't think you need to do anything other than put it together and ride it. If your climbing banks off road or do some long road climbs then give the motor a thought and check its temp occasionally. Under normal riding conditions that don't include severe abuse it will be fine.
 
18S on a Hx35xx motor can pretty much be run all day at 35mph. I would definitely upgrade the phase wires as much as possible and build a solid wheel if going any faster.

Just don't try to run that speed up a hill for long, as it will burn out. At about 40 mph, those motors start to build heat (without cooling mods) and can only take that for so long (20-30 minutes maybe)
 
18S lipo is ~76V hot off the charger, while an IRF3077 based controller is likely to be limited to ~60V.
 
Mr Lyen recommended this controller, modified to the voltage im going to run.. Ihavent asked for the 3077, he told me what to run.. He also set me up with everything else i needed.

After reading alot on this fora about Edward, i believe im in good hands :)
 
Drunkskunk said:
Normally the 3077 is used in 48v controllers with 63v caps.
Click to expand...

This was my thinking. Assuming the rest of the controller is built to handle 75V the controller would have to be built to ensure no transient voltage spikes at the FETs, which seems like a very tall order. Don't 72V controllers normally use 100V rated FETs (like the 4110)?

Perhaps 3077 was a typo...
 
There is no doubt in that he has sold me a 12 fet 3077 mark II lyen edition controller, and he confirmed before i ordered that it will be perfect for my setup with 18s lipo, fully charged at 75v.

What he might have done to it, or not, i dont know..
 
What freewheel should i buy for the HS3540?
My bike has stock, a 9speed cassette.. So i guess i need to buy a 7speed freewheel thats threaded.

Is ANY shimano 7speed threaded freewheel OK to buy, or do i need something spesific? Please guide me :)

The bike has a Deore XT derailure/gear if it matters. And yes, i understand that the 9 speed shifter isnt going to do a great job at this 7 speed thing, so i have to change the shifter later on i guess.
 
OlaGB said:
What freewheel should i buy for the HS3540?
My bike has stock, a 9speed cassette.. So i guess i need to buy a 7speed freewheel thats threaded.

Is ANY shimano 7speed threaded freewheel OK to buy, or do i need something spesific? Please guide me :)

The bike has a Deore XT derailure/gear if it matters. And yes, i understand that the 9 speed shifter isnt going to do a great job at this 7 speed thing, so i have to change the shifter later on i guess.
Click to expand...


Any 7-speed freewheel should work fine with a small spacer to keep the dropout from rubbing the chain.
 
The bike is running now! Got 80-100km on it, and it runs perfectly!
It makes 65km/h on flat ground, and can do 25km at 40km/h, just like the ebike calculator claimed!

After a full battery run at 40km/h, my stator is 62'C (25'C outside), so everything seems perfect!

Acouple more questions has come to mind though;
-When i go at full throttle accelleration, and release throttle, it keeps increasing speed for another 0.5-1sec. Anything i can do to make this not happen?
-when i try to use auto cruise control on the CA v3, it starts holding the throttle, but drops out after 2sec. I just release the throttle, and keep my hand away from it, but it still shuts off again. Is it something to do with too small deadband on low throttle setting in CA?
-Is there a group for power addicts, to stop the urge for wanting more? :twisted:
 
-When i go at full throttle accelleration, and release throttle, it keeps increasing speed for another 0.5-1sec. Anything i can do to make this not happen?

you can change the settings on the CA3 in the menue (think something like "Throttle out" Down: increase value to 99!)

-Is there a group for power addicts, to stop the urge for wanting more?
I have run my oilcooled hs 3540 with 22s and 65 A battery for over 2000 km. but you should watch temp carefully and ventilate or oilcool it!
 
OlaGB said:
-When i go at full throttle accelleration, and release throttle, it keeps increasing speed for another 0.5-1sec. Anything i can do to make this not happen?
Click to expand...

I had the same question on about pg 73 of this thread:

http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=37964&hilit=ykick&start=1800

teklektik said:
Ykick said:
When CAV3 is controlling throttle signal is there any setting(s) to reduce a slight but noticeable delay when letting off throttle input?
Click to expand...
There are two things you can try:

  • You can set ThrO->DownRate to 99 V/s so that there is no delay at all in the downward direction. This may help a bit.
  • You can try raising the appropriate PLim->AGain or PLim->WGain for Current or Power Throttle respectively to speed up the response a bit but things make get a little twitchy or begin 'hunting' if you go too high.

    This part of the issue is related to the CA PID controller logic that responds according to the AGain/WGain settings which are really coefficients for Integral or 'error' terms that determine correction based on recent past performance. This means that there must always be some small intrinsic delay because the correction is driven by the past not the present error. Higher gain settings make the PID controller more responsive (the integral error builds faster) but can lead to overshoot.
Also - remember that screen display values do not change immediately. With the exception of the IN/OUT voltages on the Diagnostic screen, displayed values are averaged over time and updated periodically as determined by Pref->Averaging. Readjusting this value or watching the IN/OUT display can help give you a more accurate feel for what the CA is really doing - although in the end it's the good old buttometer that really counts... :D

Anyhow - no big surprise - it's necessary to make some tradeoffs to get a balance of features/performance that's acceptable. Unfortunately, this means that if you want the improved throttle linearity and controllability of Current/Power throttle then you may have to forfeit some of the immediacy of direct throttle control provided by PassThru mode - at least for the present beta firmware...
Click to expand...
 
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