Aprilia Enjoy

[Hillhater]

....The teeth on the motor pinion and main gear need to mesh/overlap as much as possible.

Sam, Whilst you are in there, its worth changing the bearings on the input pinion shaft. When mine started making a noise, it was those bearings being worn causing the gears to start to lose mesh and whine. The bearings were sloppy, but cheap and easy to replace ( from a local bearing supplier).

[Samd]

Ah that makes sense. And the motor input shaft is easy to get at, you don;t have to go inside the box.

I am still stumped though, I can't get the large gear off of the main crank shaft inside the case. Or the chain wheel.
I now need to pull my second bike apart and see if it will come apart. According to the exploded parts diagram it should. Urgh...

[tonyontopofabighill]

I took the motor out of my racing version and dropped it into my local motorcycle shop.I will be interested to see what they have to say .Fortunately they are an honest crowd so will do the right thing by me.I am looking forward to seeing what is wrong.I was surprised at how easy it was to remove the motor.I didn't even have to remove the side plastic fairings.Of course when I gave it to the bike shop they said..."What the hell is that off?"
We will see.

[Hillhater]

Tony,..did you remove the whole motor, gearbox and crankset, ..or just the motor ?
It sounded like your problem was in the gearbox / crankset area, not in the "motor" .

[Samd]

I grabbed my crankcase with one crank still atached last night. Applied some force to the remaining crank even though the guts were removed. A lot of flex in the end bearing farthest from the chainwheel.

Emails to date with the Melbourne aprilia dealers always seems to start with "what's the VIN number". Funny stuff....

[tonyontopofabighill]

G'day HH,

I gave them the entire unit.I haven't got the patience to try and pull it apart.I will give them a call tomorrow and see what is happening.I will let you all know the outcome.

[czach]

So I posted way back in the fall of last year about my Enjoy's controller being dead. Spent the winter fiddling with it, never got it to work. This morning I went out to the shed, looked at the bike all in parts and said to myself:

"It ain't gonna fix itself..."

And got to work.

First was the goal, to get the thing moving again. I decided to go with a simple contactor control with as much safety as possible. Then I could turn on and off the motor while riding as needed.

So. First step was to run new wires from the 24 volt power block the battery sits in to the motor and a contactor. I have an Elec-trak, and a bunchof 36 volt contactors which are perfect for the Aprilia.

Why? Well, they will close on 24 volts. And if voltage drops much below 20 they will cut out. So since the 24 volt pack has a low voltage cutoff of about 20v it's perfect to use as a low voltage cutout. Likewise 14 gauge wire will provide voltage drop from the pack to buffer hard starts on the motor.

Wiring for the motor is simple. Battery positive to contactor, contactor to motor, motor to battery negative. I used bolts and electrical tape so I didn't have to cut the motor wires.

The control circuit for the contactor is a bit more complex: I wanted to turn it on and off from the little speed select switch. And I wanted the motor to shut off if either brake was pulled. And I wanted it to do nothing with the key out. So I put all of these switches and such in series so the control circuit went:

Battery positive (at the contactor stud)-contactor coil-key switch-brake switch-brake switch-black wire for speed control-orange wire for speed control-battery negative.

Then I bolted the contactor to where the old controller screw went into the top body of the Aprilia, put the pack in, turned the key, and hit the switch.

Brief second of power, then nothing. Battery dead from sitting for a year. Charged battery. Tried again, motor spun with no wheels. Realized motor was hooked up backwards. Reversed motor wires, hit the switch.

Bike wheel spun. Hitting either brake would shut the motor off, and stop the bike. Same with the key being off. Safety is not bad.

Took it for a little ride, worked well. Starting it in first gear is best, by second it would tear along. Important to pedal with the motor, get a lot of torque. Then I took it to the park. Worked very well, I would pedal up to speed then let the motor carry the bike for a minute, then switch off and coast. Going up hill was simple with some pedaling assisting the motor. Nice.

Then I hit some debris and the back tire blew out. Great. Rode bike with flat in first gear back to car, end of day.

I'll fiddle with this some more, but I think this is a good start. Yes, I could put in a controller, but I kind of like the "power or no power" simplicity of the contactor. I don't know what kind of shape the battery is in, but it was charging for 3 hours at 3.5a rate, so it's got at least 10.5ah of capacity.

And at least it's working for now. Anyone else done something like this?

Chris

[Hillhater]

.... Anyone else done something like this?

Chris

Hi Chris, That a co-incidence ! ..
..If you look back on page 2 of this thread, you will find a post from me detailing almost exactly the same mod that i did whilst waiting for a replacement controller
I was using a 40A rated auto relay, but eventually it melted the contacts ! ( scary as they melted closed !)
24v Brushed controllers are cheap and easy to fit in place of the Aprilia unit.
Lots of into in here to show you what to get and how to do it.

[Samd]

I rode last year with Kepler and AdrianSS, both with their friction drives. They use a button throttle with a ramp-up function that just holds them at straight line cruising speed. Makes sense for friction drives.

But I think applying all the power at low speed is a bad idea. I am currently repairing two aprilias with stripped gearboxes due to dumbwitted relatives applying stupid amounts of power (albeit from lithiums) whilst standing still for takeoff.

An LBD14 controller will cost you 21 bucks and a throttle nine dollars. I strongly suggest doing it now so you don't wear your gearbox to a pulp later....

[tonyontopofabighill]

The bike shop rang me today and said they did not have the right pullers to dismantle the motor.I am emailing a couple of the nearest Aprilia dealers.
My wife is off to Sydney tomorrow and was wondering if HH might know whether it is worth dropping it into John Sample Automotive up there.Do you know anything about them HH?

Tony.

[Hillhater]

Sorry Tony, i missed this until today.
My dealings with JS have been few, but they were very helpful when asked various questions..but i got the impression that they have little experience with the "Enjoy". Their approach to problems seems to be to sell a replacement , rather than fix a problem. !
Definitely worth a phone call to see if they have the tool.... but i wouldnt hold my breath

[tonyontopofabighill]

Thanks HH.

I have emailed them and will see what they say or IF they reply.I have emailed an Aprilia agent in Bungandore as well. By the sounds of it you have been able to dismantle yours but Sam is having a bit of trouble with it?

Cheers,
Tony.

[tonyontopofabighill]

John Sample Automotive didn't want to do the job but are willing to swap me a motor out of a demo model for mine.Not sure how much they want for the swap but they said that would be the best and cheapest outcome.I am keeping my fingers crossed .I will let you know when I get it back down here next week.

Cheers,
Tony.

[kralimarco08]

Hi Guys,
Is this thread still live? I was wondering what is the best and easiest way to replace/upgrade the battery in the Aprilia Enjoy Racing please?
Is it possible to put more power through the bike/motor, and if so, what is required please?
There is currently one for sale on ebay -

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/180899316243? ... 180wt_1142

Can the batteries/power be easily modified? Any help with this would be much appreciated. Thanks

[Hillhater]

Hi kralimarco08,
the simple answer is yes, the batteries can be replaced and the performance greatly improved, but weather you consider it "Simple" depends on your tech skill set and experience level. Its not a "Buy, Plug, and Play" mod, it needs a fair DIY effort on your part.
suggest you read through this thread as several of us have now upgraded our Aprillia's in this way, and the details are all posted.
Good luck. and let us know how you go.

[tonyontopofabighill]

I rang the guys at John Sample this morning to see how much the motor swap was going to cost me.They said "nothing!",I couldn't believe my ears.You win some and you lose some.He said they are a mongrel to get into and fix.I guess I am going to have to learn how to get into this side of these bikes as well.Went for a ride this morning and thought "yes" it is worth all the effort.

Tony.

[czach]

Well, this just keeps getting odder.

Today I took what was left of my dead controller, hooked it up to my 24 volt bench supply, put 12 volts (midpoint on a +12,-12 supply) on the yellow wire, wired together the blue/white wires, and

BEEEP!

Turned the voltage down to 21 volts, did the key again:

BEEEEP! BEEP BEEP BEEP

Or in other words the computer is working again on this stupid thing.

I have no idea why. Even odder the yellow wire is totally unnecessary, so this thing is *not* powering it's hotel power on the 12 volt line (which makes sense, that would unbalance the pack). It must be a sensor to detect pack imbalance.

Anyway, of course I have a nice contactor controller on my Aprilia, once I replace the tire I'll think about swapping this controller back in for some testing. Really odd that it is working again, not sure if I want it, although the ability for it to start based on pedal torque is nice. Maybe I'll ride around with the contactor for awhile first...

Chris

[czach]

Hill:

Yes, using a normal relay would be bad; the contacts would weld and there would be no way to easily stop the bike. That's normally defined as "bad". Oddly enough most cheap Chinese controllers use a FET to do the switching and when they fail, they fail shorted as well. Fun.

The problem with a car relay is that it's designed to close 12 volts, not 24. The arc on 24 is significantly bigger, especially on break, and the result is that it arcs, and then fuses short.

I'm using an Elec-trak contactor, which is rated to make and break 200-300a shunt motor loads at 36 volts DC. It also has a serious spring and an arc-extinguishing magnet. So it shouldn't lock closed, but it still concerns me a bit.

In the meantime my controller seems to work now (it must feel the sadness of being replaced) so I may try to swap it in. But first I'd like to play electric Moped for awhile. And I might just leave the contactor in there as a bypass "screw it, I want my power NOW" thing. Which might need a few relays as well so the contactor can "share" the brake circuit switches and the key (to drop it out if the key is off or the brakes are on)

Hm. Anyone tried that? Controller+full power bypass. Best of all worlds.

Chris

[Samd]

Full power bypass on NiMh is probably about as good as you'll get on Nimh batteries. Switch to lithium with a proper controller and you'll realise you've left the happy-go-lucky girl next door for a supermodel and several grams of cocaine....

On another note - getting into the motor and gearbox really is very easy. It's just getting that main 45 degree pinion off that is killing me - I think it may be because I tried to get the crank off without a proper crank tool.

I have a proper tool now and will try my second bike to see if it is easier. Otherwise we switch to method #3 with a bearing puller. If that fails it's method #6 - destructive, which in this case is grinding the old one off to see how they attach....

[Hillhater]

Hm. Anyone tried that? Controller+full power bypass. Best of all worlds.

Chris

Did you catch the info about cutting the white "loop" wire on the top of the controller ?
apparently that bypasses the speed limiter, but i dont know if it increases the current limit which is pretty low ( <10A ?) on that controller.
Yep, that contactor sound like the DB's !

[czach]

No, I didn't see that. Kind of makes sense actually; even with 14 gauge wire from the batteries to limit current this thing has a lot more power.

Finally got the tire replaced and took it out for a ride. I must have a weird controller because I was driving it all over the place and the battery never came close to pooping out. With the stock controller I would have lost power a long while ago. Here it just purrs, drives along, and when it sags going up a hill I just downshift and start pedaling.

One thing I did notice: The motor cut out once while I was testing start stop under load. After a minute it came back, wasn't a battery problem since I could hear the contactor clicking normally. The motor however was hot, is there a thermal breaker inside the motor itself?

Aside from that having one motor speed isn't as bad as one would think; speed can be controlled by the gears, when you hear the motor going slower than a certain speed just downshift to minimize lugging. But man this will make me one very. lazy. biker.

CZ

[Samd]

Some progress inside the gearbox. Not all, but some light forward.

Used a socket set socket (19mm i think) and a hammer and bashed the roller bearing out of the inside of main worn pinion. Result = I now know the pinions that wear go all the way thru. Thought it may be pressed on to the chain ring somehow. You can see down the center inside the main photo. These roller bearings are readily available. You can see the flats I ground to try and twist it off with some big vise grips. No luck. Thought it must be heat pressed for sure...

But under the bright lights I managed to find the end of the thread in the second photo. So I am going to bolt the chainring to a big wooden length (sleeper) with coach bolts, and make up a big torque arm to get the old pinion off.
I think I will need to heat it with an oxy too. I don't have one. Hmmm...

[Hillhater]

Sam, if it is threaded on,..it may just be a LH thread such that the drive load keeps tightening it ??

[tonyontopofabighill]

Hey Guys,

I went out for a ride this morning on my Aprilia city version and now it too is making some weird noises. Maybe there is an Aprilia Enjoy virus going around. Funny that both of your bikes are playing up Sam and now both of mine are too.Do you think it is the extra load from the lipo batteries causing it? My wife is bringing the swapped motor back this arvo for the racing version ,can't wait to put it back together.

Cheers,
Tony.

[Samd]

Roger that Hillhater. It did occur to me that it may be a reverse thread. The part is in the shed but from memory (I think) it is conventional. You can see it with a bit of careful lookery.

I will try to take a video soon of the worn end bearing that I think caused this. It is pretty easy to get to in contrast to my current gear woes....