Start of my second trike build.

My almost new trike. It has 200 miles on it. It is an HP Scorpion fs 26. German made. Full suspension. The first step I think was the toughest step. I have a 3/8" x 11 x 13 plate nicely installed below the seat. I was the helper. I don't weld anything. Still making it happen was like a marathon. And at the halfway point you stop to wrestle a bear and then finish the marathon. But it is done!

The 3/8" aluminum plate is welded in 4 places to gussets and the gussets are attached to existing bolt holes with replacement bolts that are a little longer for the gussets. It is solid, strong and overbuilt. The way I like it. The battery and other stuff will live there.

I got a 3540 crystalite hub and a 48v 20ah Lithium manganese. What are the letters to indicate the chemistry? I have a shimano shifter, chain for 7 speed, derailer, in the mail and should be here soon. Then the build will continue....

I'm glad the almn. plate is done.

Lithium Manganese Oxide: LiMn2O4 cathode. graphite anode
Short form: LMO or Li-manganese (spinel structure)

Excellent trike, we have a pair with Bodylink seats.

Do post what you learn.

Very nice trike and you put the battery exactly where it should go for good handling. These full suspension trikes really handle poorly if the battery is on a rear rack. That heavy Crystalite motor will really upset the ride. I noticed with my Steintrike that those DD motors require the rear suspension to be tightened down to avoid the clunk of overtravel in the spring and the ride got quite poor.

My solution is to put lightweight geared motors on the rear. I have used Q100 and currently have a Xiongda 2 speed. The ride is wonderful compared to my 9C DD motor on the rear.
Just my 2 euros
otherDoc
Oh yeah. Don't forget torque arms on the rear! I use one on my steel rear dropouts. You might consider 2 due to the alloy dropouts you have.
Finally, for comfort, mesh seats are great. I had the fiberglass seat and traded it for my mesh and it is much more comfortable.

Making progress. The new wheel and motor is installed. Which means the transmission has been changed to a seven speed freewheel. Also new shifters and derauiler.
Does this torque arm installation look right? My next step is to build a battery box. I will make it out of Starboard. It is made from the same chemicals as the plastic bags at the grocery store. Incredibly strong. It will not pain, glue or sand. It does cut easy. It can be planed. It drills easy and can hold a screw perfectly but accurate drilling is required.

Other Doc, I know that HP builds their trikes to accommodate a hub motor. This is somewhat bigger than what they install but I feel confident and now hopeful that my experience that you have had will not be mine. I expect the geometry is different for our trikes. HP makes various springs to be used in various situations. Another factor is added weight. I'm small. Maybe you are not? Regardless the build is on and the proof will be in the pudding!

ebent said:

Making progress. The new wheel and motor is installed. Which means the transmission has been changed to a seven speed freewheel. Also new shifters and derauiler.
Does this torque arm installation look right? My next step is to build a battery box. I will make it out of Starboard. It is made from the same chemicals as the plastic bags at the grocery store. Incredibly strong. It will not pain, glue or sand. It does cut easy. It can be planed. It drills easy and can hold a screw perfectly but accurate drilling is required.

Other Doc, I know that HP builds their trikes to accommodate a hub motor. This is somewhat bigger than what they install but I feel confident and now hopeful that my experience that you have had will not be mine. I expect the geometry is different for our trikes. HP makes various springs to be used in various situations. Another factor is added weight. I'm small. Maybe you are not? Regardless the build is on and the proof will be in the pudding!

Click to expand...

Nah I'm definitely not small 195cm and about 100 kilos. That should have made the motor less of a problem due to the large amount of sprung weight, namely me. But the ride still was much poorer than when the lightweight hub motor replaced the 9C. I had no trouble with my dropouts but use a torque arm anyways for safety. Always use torque arms.
otherDoc

Unsprung weight and cogging drag has me a bit on the fence for the FS26. Its pretty much between a 9C and Bafang CST although the higher heat soak & thermistor option is tilting towards the 9C. Considering the primamry route is up & down a mountain the 9C regen also offers an advantage. I ride with Schwalbe Big Apples in part to add the lateral grip. The Bodylink seat makes leaning into turns a natural motion; I take turns much faster on the FS26 then I do the ICE VTX. Big Apples should help offset the usprung weight but won't solve it.

Not fond of hose clamps on the torque arm. I would machine a piece of aluminum to attach between the rear caliper mount and keyed arm on the hub. That would also put the longitudinal member in tension rather then compression; in compression it may have a bend element in the stress dynamic.

Or weld the bolted area where the two parts meet. And of course no reason not to use 2 torque arms. If you are riding smooth roads than the motor weight on the rear arm really doesn't matter much. If you do any off road, well............It makes a big difference. My 9Cwith the wheel and tire is 16+ pounds. The xiongda is less than 8 lbs with tire. The Cute 100H wheel is less than 6 lbs. I can't tell the ride (and handling) difference between the 2 small motors, but I sure notice the 9C on rough roads. It is like having no rear suspension at all, or it bottoms out if I don't crank up the spring tension. It is a pain in my back.
otherDoc

Triketech, what would the machined aluminum look like and how would you attach it?

Otherdoc, I would be confidant, based on your experience and knowledge, that a heavy motor on a suspended steintrike is not good. But just because they are both suspended does not mean to me at this point the same results will happen to mine. You have added some doubt but I am to close to see what happens. I do know that the travel on your trike is more than mine and that HP builds them to support a hub motor. If it fails, no biggie. I will be able to sell an almost new motor and wheel. And I'll replace it with a smaller one. In a week or 2 I should have this up and running. Then we will see...wish me luck

Either way it should be a great trike! I look forward to seeing you ride it.
otherDoc

Nice. What did the 7spd setup cost you?

I"m pondering going to that when my freewheel is shot. don't need 10 spds

As I understand torque arms, your arms in the photo are not correct! The torque arm should be pulling the wheel back against the "opposite and equal reaction", that is it should be pulling in the same direction as the motor. The way you have it, the arm is being compressed toward the frame. The arm in your photo is pulling the wheel in the opposite direction from the motors torque - which is backward.

I do think you are going to love the ride, and the batteries will be perfectly situated. I have the same setup on my 9C trike, which is not suspended, and it is heaven to ride. Hopefully the suspension won't be an issue with the weight of that motor.

The Shimano parts were about $50. The freewheel was separate. Plus freight.

chvidgov, I think I get what you are implying. I'll look into that. Thanks.

It is powered but the transmission is not working. I got chain slack due to friction at the idler. So we are considering another idler. Not usable as it is. I changed the chain to a 7 speed chain I think that could be it. Is there such a thing as a 7 speed idler?

5 days later, it seems like 5 weeks, Transmission problem. 3 mechanics later. The chain was shipped sprayed with a protectant. It was not cleaned of and relubed and caused a lot of friction. Also 2 links were removed.

And best of all NO POGO!!!!! You had me worried. That and not usable got me down. I'm back now. Adding bling to my ride. Going to Ace hardware for a bolt.

On my routine ride from the past, I had a narrow line getting the smoothest surface I could find. I was riding a Catrike pocket with no suspension. It was easy to go airborne at speed. Not anymore. My past surgeries demanded I get suspended. I finally found it and the ride is smooth. Much different. Like night and day. I hit 31 mph today, A thrill. I still had more to go...and the bumps do not matter.

Interesting about the ride. My Steintrike is very stiffly sprung. It works well on large dips and bumps but it lets the small ones through. Those Scorpion folks must have done some suspension tuning. I know it has a anti-roll bar, so it could have softer springs. Sounds great!
otherDoc

otherdoc, HP built this trike with a hub motor as a likely upgrade. I do not think Steintrike will factory install a motor. There is the engineering that helps also. I've been told by reliable sources that the idler wheel is part of the engineering to eliminate the pogo issue. I think in Germany where they are made, around half get motorized there.

View attachment 3There are a few more details to go, but I'm getting there.The battery box is on riders left. The box is made out of starboard. On top of the box is a converter that provides me 12v. Also my grin controller. It has an on off switch that is easy access but the switch can not be seen. Also I have a ram mount to hold my iPhone. I have a plug for my phone to access my music library. On the riders right the black rectangle is the amp for my stereo system. Also is a marine grade bus bar that is wired from my converter for 12v. It powers my headlight and tail light.

This was a struggle for me but I'm pleased with the results. The quality of this build is mostly due to grin tech. They make a large difference. I was waiting to complete the last wire run, scratching my ass trying to figure out how to match pin connectors from my CA to the motor for a temp sensor. And there in the box the pre made cable was waiting for me the exact needed length. It was all labeled with high grade connectors. I got from grin; motor, controller, throttle, CA, battery and tail light. I gave them my rider demands and they perfectly specified the right parts. They deserved my business for what they did for the benefit of ES. I am lucky to have them as a source of knowledge and equipment. I feel that what they sell has been carefully vetted and passed their demands. I can't imagine taking the gamble of dealing with Asia.

I had local help in building and attaching the aluminum plate. No easy task. And done well. I have more tinkering to do. But it is now fit to ride! Ride till you die!

Actually the factory will install a BionX on the rear of a Steintrike. They are all steel. But they do have a stiff ride. Maybe if I were a downhill racer, it would be fine, but at 70 years old, that will not happen. :lol: :lol: Your trike really looks like a professional build. Enjoy!
otherDoc