2000W MAC lawnmower motor

[neptronix]

Thanks toolman2, maybe this motor has hope
I look forward to seeing what it does at 78v and 57v, i guess i have to order up the bits and pieces for a secondary reduction system.

Torqueon, i am waiting on parts at the moment.

http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=40327

I will update this thread, as well as my killabicycle jr. build thread above, when i get something actually on the road.

[zappy]

Good work nep

Thanks for all the constructive input Toolman

kart sproket adaptor

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Neptronix at that lowish (3000) rpm you should be able to to get a way with a single stage kart 219" chain. 800kg-1000kg break.
Go karts put out about 20Nm at very high rpm. Ebay or online kart shops have a better range of ratios than most other pitches availble.
A medium size outrunner with a single stage reduction is probably a really good middle of the road between obese hub motors and the very small outrunners with multi drop gear sets and an erpm most availble controllers can't keep up with.
You would need to make up a kart sprocket to disk adaptor somthing like this and than your motor options are large.
It almost makes it worth welding up a motor test bike?

Zappy

[magudaman]

Hey guys just wanted to let you all know I am the one who purchased one of the motors from neptronix and will be making some postings about my experience with the motor. I received the motor on Friday (amazingly fast thanks neptronix) and looks great. The plastic case is actually well made and may end up staying on mine. The phase wires look pretty tiny though and I may consider replacing them.

I will be opening the motor up hopefully tomorrow and be taking some picture next to my BMC 1500W/2000w unit to contrast the two. I am also going to be machining the shaft down on the MAC to 5/8in and adding a 3/8in keyway (looks smaller currently. I'll have to look a bit closer but that bolt hole on the shaft look pretty large, and I hope 5/8in will work. I would also love to make a new mount plate for the motor but out of aluminum but I'll see if I'm feeling up for that.

Lastly I was thinking about adding some small fins on the magnet assembly to create a centrifugal fan of sorts. My BMC is currently cooled by a 12V fan, which sort of works but needs the air flow reversed.

I do intend (just as my BMC) adding a temp sensors a some winding and another for general air temp/magnet temp.

I am sure hoping this MAC has similar power as the BMC. I have pushed that old BMC upward of 8KW peaks and it just continued to seem to get more and more torque. Not to mention it has had a very hard life of too much heat and well over 1000 miles of really tough off road.

[neptronix]

Zappy: that is an awesome adapter, damn!!
You could run a huge sprocket on that with such a huge inward offset.

I did not know that such a thing existed nor do know a machine shop locally who could make one ( would probably be rather spendy ). I wonder if the chain would then rub on the tire, lol.. or maybe that's a 150mm wheel..

Anyway, i did order a sprocket from here: http://kingssalesandservice.com/. I ordered a 39t 40 pitch sprocket and will be using 12t. at the motor.

Yeah i agree that a mid-speed motor is really desirable. There aren't many of these out there. Come to think of it, the supply of cheap, lower KV BIG outrunners is kinda drying up these days, isn't it?

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__18184__Turnigy_Aerodrive_SK3_6374_149kv_Brushless_Outrunner_Motor.html

There are these - you'd just need a lot of them in parallel, and double reduction for sure.


Magudaman: Glad you got the motor in one piece

Hey, wasn't it you that melted the magnet epoxy off a 1.5kW rated BMC motor? Did you ever fix that motor?
Can't wait to see what you come up with.

[fizzit]

This motor looks pretty cool. Thanks for all the info, Neptronix. I wonder how well an HV160 could drive it?

[Hillhater]

.... I am also going to be machining the shaft down on the MAC to 5/8in and adding a 3/8in keyway (looks smaller currently. I'll have to look a bit closer but that bolt hole on the shaft look pretty large, and I hope 5/8in will work. .

You are probably aware that 3/4" ( 19.05mm) is an standard for industrial motor drives, which means there are lots of sprockets, hubs, clutches and adaptors etc available for that size.

[neptronix]

I had no problem ordering a 40 pitch sprocket for mine with the original 7/8 shaft from here:

http://www.robotmarketplace.com/products/sprockets_main.html

[magudaman]

I got some time today and pull my BMC motor off my motoped and started to take both of them apart. To summarize these motors are identical! The winding configuration is different but otherwise are exactly the same:
































So the bad news for me, the 7/8 shaft looks like it here to stay. That giant 3/8in 24tpi bolt hole down the middle is going to be pretty limiting. I was originally intending to take the shaft down to 5/8s put in a new 3/16th keyway. Now it looks like I need to bore out one of my belt sprockets to 7/8 and I will stick with their 4mm key.

So does anyone know how the wire gauge difference will affect the power handling of these two motors considering most other variables are the same?

.... I am also going to be machining the shaft down on the MAC to 5/8in and adding a 3/8in keyway (looks smaller currently. I'll have to look a bit closer but that bolt hole on the shaft look pretty large, and I hope 5/8in will work. .

You are probably aware that 3/4" ( 19.05mm) is an standard for industrial motor drives, which means there are lots of sprockets, hubs, clutches and adaptors etc available for that size.

I am using non standard belt sprockets that are only ~1.5in in diameter, with the keyway it is a little tight.

I had no problem ordering a 40 pitch sprocket for mine with the original 7/8 shaft from here:

http://www.robotmarketplace.com/products/sprockets_main.html

Your going to need to make or purchase a stepped keyway.

[neptronix]

Your going to need to make or purchase a stepped keyway.

FML, oh well

That's rather astounding that they're the same motor. Looks like the MAC version is just a higher turn count edition of what you have, and thus has slightly thinner copper, but more winds of it.

70rpm/v versus your.. 100-125rpm/v?

I think it comes down to this...
You have a cooler looking case, and the construction looks a bit better..
The MAC is easier to gear down. It's what, half a pound lighter?

I think we can expect similar performance out of both. Still motivated to build a bike with the MAC?

[magudaman]

I get around 85 RPM/v on the BMC. When I talked to MAC a while ago they had told me that BMC and MAC used to actually be the same company. They split for some reason and apparently still have similar stuff. Whats great is I have taken that BMC up to crazy wattage and I'm sure we can expect the same from the mac.

I'm going to be machining a new mount plate and will go ahead and use that plastic case. I am thinking how I want to add the cooling fan, whether I do centrifugal attached to the magnet ring or just another 12v pushing or pulling cool air in. I think with the new plate and that plastic case I'll shave 2lbs off the total weight.

I may try to work out some sort of more dense filter this time too as my BMC had all kinds of little rocks stuck to the magnets and was quite full of dust. Atleast the MAC's bearings are both sealed type.

[torqueon]

I want one, please tell, how to get one !

[neptronix]

I want one, please tell, how to get one !

I can set up a group buy, but i want to see how magudaman's build goes first. These motors aren't going anywhere nor are they special builds - this is what MAC has been pushing for the electric lawnmower market for a considerable amount of time.

So if you can hang tight... i'd like to see what these can really do before helping a bunch of people buy them. Not interested in coordinating selling a motor that isn't 100% awesome.

[magudaman]

Just a heads up I won't have it mounted and running for about a week. I need to order connectors to hook it up to my Motoped setup. So I have some more Anderson powerpoles coming and need to make sure I have my little water proof 6 pin barrel connector too. This is also in addition to the machining I need to knock out too. But not having an ebike drives me crazy too so hopefully sooner.

[neptronix]

It's possible that i could beat you then
Do you have a build thread for your BMC double reduction, BTW?

Also, are you seeing 8000w peaks on 48v only? if so that's amazing... i was thinking about pushing mine up to 72v and do a huge reduction.. to get as rediculously high constant power as i could out of it..

[AmpEater]

I'd be interested in picking up a few of these for electric mower projects. I've been contemplating replacing the belt drive on my electric john deer with individual blade motors, these look perfect. 7/8" universal hubs for the blades are easy to find. And I've got a push mower with a dead engine that could use one too.

[nechaus]

The windings do look a fair bit different.

[torqueon]

Upon the search for the illusive brush less lawnmower motor, I have found 3 rider mowers and a snow blower, that use this type of motor. Here's what i found.

Rechargemowers Not to much info, as to replacement parts etc.

Ariens amp rider, and the Ariens sno-thro . claims 1.7 h,p for deck motors, and 4 hp for rider drive and snow blower motors. The last time I check the motors are available, for replacement

Hustler Zeon, the most interesting of all ! This is commercial mower !The last time checked, the motors are available as replacement parts. This motor looks much like the BMC/MAC. motors, in topic.

Ive been meaning to scope one out, on display. Made calls etc. the closest is in Co. springs. Hey neptronics have a look, if you can! Yes I know i am pushing, forgive me.

The bottom line is, we know these motors are made and used for something , and somewhere. The ?? is where and what, figure that out and they will be available.

[torqueon]

Been tempted to buy from the super kids store, as they have restocked the 2000 watt BMC motor, for $350, last look, now its at $400, dam it!!
The idea sounds good, is it worth it, will it work? I am looking for long hill climbing at 20 MPH, and getting away from car,s at intersections, for the most part my brushed motor is O K for short runs but get hot.

Pardon me for derailing the thread

[neptronix]

Gosh, that motor has been out of stock seemingly since i joined the forum. Took em long enough

I don't like the fact that it has a higher kV than the 1500w BMC ( ~111kV versus what, 105kV for the 1500w? )
It is going to cost double of what the 2kW MAC costs too. Yeah, $400 for a little motor like that is asking a bit much. Looks a lot better than the MAC version though, that's for sure.

In the name of science, and if you can't wait, it would be interesting to see what you get if you buy it.

I have most of the parts i need to get the 2kW MAC and motenergy motor running. I'm just waiting to get settled in my new place next month to start doing a serious chain drive build. Hang in there!!

[torqueon]

Ill leave science up to you guys, been watching this thread like a hawk!! In the mean time, I am going to buy a replacement motor for the ariens mower, mentioned above, good for 1.7 hp at 48 volts. Sells for $150.00, not painful, if it turns out to be a pig. The motenergy also make's good sense, want more power just add more batteries.

Think i have gotten O.C.D. from this endeaver, and love it.

[flathill]

Ill leave science up to you guys, been watching this thread like a hawk!! In the mean time, I am going to buy a replacement motor for the ariens mower, mentioned above, good for 1.7 hp at 48 volts. Sells for $150.00, not painful, if it turns out to be a pig. The motenergy also make's good sense, want more power just add more batteries.

Think i have gotten O.C.D. from this endeaver, and love it.

I have the ariens motor. It is the 4" transmagnetic motor. Seems well built with fan cooling. The windings have some space but they allow the air through. 4-5 pounds. I think 60kv. Huge bearing but very short shaft but should work with chains. The mags are screwed on so it should take high rpm well

[neptronix]

60kv? very nice. Where can you pick up one of those? I want to do a light weight chain drive build later and those are intriguing.

Torqueon, you'd be happy to know.. i just picked up a 16" wheeled motor test platform..



http://www.digglerstore.com/products/dirt-dawg.html

Got it for $75 used, not too bad.
I love how ~48mph is approx. 1000rpm on a 16" wheel. That makes gearing these things so dang easy.

When i get settled i am bolting the MAC and eTek up to this thing to find out what kinda power can be had continuously. Now the question is, where do i find tires that will tolerate it

[magudaman]

Those ariens motor could be interesting! $150 to your door is intriguing, I wonder how long they will continue to keep them stocked since that mower is discontinued. They also have a brushless 4hp motor that is bigger and much much more expensive like $600! Might as well get 4 of these other and run them together

I haven't made much progress on my motor either. I got my temp sensors placed for internal air temp and one on the windings for winding temperature. I replaced the phase wires with some good silicone 8ga wire and put on all my connectors that I use for my motoped setup so I can hot swap the motors. I'm headed to the shop on Thursday to lighten my steel plate and puts some holes in my aluminum mounting plate to fit the steel plate's mounting holes. Hopefully Friday I will have it on the bike and running but it might push into the weekend.


The green wire is in there just for reference and was the old phase wire:

[torqueon]

For locating the ariens motor Google small engine repair for lawnmowers 2 sites I check out are "Pats small engine parts" and "jacks small engine'"

Here's the model # for the ariens 1.7 hp deck motor 03729200 the # for 4 hp motor is 03367400 that one is $538

The hustler zeon deck motor cost $390+, P/N 601157 looks like a real beast, with a nice form factor. worth googling for look any how

Nep your not really going mount that motenergy on that kick scooter are you, sounds like a death wish !! Could be a real fun ride, but a short one
When I get all the motor details sorted out, it will all go on a moped. The moped I have is real simple and boxy, very few compounded angles, which will make fabercating easier.

Would post picture, however my computer is a mess right now.

Happy motoring

[neptronix]

Yes, i plan on mounting it up to that.
Yes, i know i am crazy.

It's a motor testing platform, no more. The 16" wheels enable quick mounting and testing of a high kV motor. I will be testing a lot of motors soon. Time to buy a motorcycle jacket!