Evolution of Skill....

[valsislav]

Hey Jake!

[ohzee]

nice wish we'd get more then 1 inch of snow.. and holy crap I could take your pulse from that video - going to be pretty fun
when your out on your bike.

[Lenk42602]

well, well, well.

guess who's forecast for tomorrow includes 50 degrees and sun?


go pro time...

[ohzee]

Yea get us some nice video please.. I know I plan on riding my bike into work tomorrow.. gonna start charging my batteries now.

[Lenk42602]

So much for the first longer than 10 mile ride...Trouble in paradise...

Got about 15 miles or so on the bike until trouble..Long way in to work today. Was taking it easy on a bike path around mile 14-15, cruising at 20 mph, and all of a sudden the 5303 slowed to a stop. the pack bms did not cut out, so I have it isolated to the hub motor or controller.

I have video footage of the bike when it lost power - really felt like a hall wire short - the motor had increased wheel drag after losing power the and made a dragging sound inside the motor. After pedaling the 120 pound bike with a 44/34 gear several miles to work (1 hour, 10 minutes....) I opened up the hub, pulled the stator and inspected it. Wierd, I was half expecting to see the sensors damaged? All I could see was some cracking of the epoxy, but the were firmly set still into their slots.

I did however see some exposed wire from insulation on the hall wires. It just seems odd to be putting along at 25 mph and then nothing at all after 8000 miles of use. I would venture to guess that the wires have been like that for some time.

I will post up some video tomorrow of the FAIL, pics of the stator, etc.

I am also going to upgrade all the wires now - something I neglected to do when building up the bike in the first place....

If this doesn't do the trick, next is the conttroller.. i hope its not that the 18X4115 controller doesn't like low speeds.....

really hafta finish this kitchen now......

back on the pedal bikes until darth vader is sorted. trying my damnest to keep un-fit on the ebike:mrgreen:

Len

[Lenk42602]

[Lenk42602]

got the vid uploaded finally. this one ends right before I start my death pedal to the shop....

[full-throttle]

Thanks! Good to see what/where other people ride.

Hope you get it all sorted soon

[Lenk42602]

a few minutes after that section of paved trail was the singetrack....twas a bitch pedaling and pushing up through the mud!!!

kinda fun and hilarious in a ridiculous kind of way....

I should get her back up in no time....

have another clip of me passing a few bicycle cops on a pedal bike going into work the other day. I will post it up shortly.

editing, uploading, takes a good bit of time, eh?

[ohzee]

I very much enjoyed it. Did not realize how nice Pittsburgh was.

[XLR8]

I noticed on your last video that you had a keyswitch on the top panel of your bonsa bike. Does it energize a relay or does it take the full load of the system? If so, what sort is it?
Kev

[GCinDC]

sweet vid, len.

i was thinking back on the hall sensor fail i had and recall that it seemed entirely heat related... not sure a visual inspection is enough.

what was the voltage when it cut? did you disconnect the controller after you got home and charged up?

is it all apart now?

[Lenk42602]

noticed on your last video that you had a keyswitch Kev

just a power switch cut off sitch for the bike. i've made it a habit to cut power to the bike when not riding asap. personal past experience.....

sweet vid, len.

i was thinking back on the hall sensor fail i had and recall that it seemed entirely heat related... not sure a visual inspection is enough.

what was the voltage when it cut? did you disconnect the controller after you got home and charged up?

is it all apart now?

I have the stator out of the motor -The stator really looks fine considering the power levels - the coating on the windings is as fresh as it was when I bought it several years ago...

I will be throwing some pics up of the stator when get a chance. I will also be putting a meter across the motor wires and see what I come up with... Just have this feeling its not at the hub....

I was cruising at about 22 mph and pulling about 700 watts, 77.3 volts when I lost power. I can run at 3000 watts for about 10 minutes at speed and the case of the x5 is just mildly warm. The case covers were cold on this particular day.

I have my max amps limited to 50 and LVC set to 68

I threw the pack on the charger and it charged up fine.

have yet to pull the controller out of the bike and inspect. I have the week end off, but gotta get through the kitchen remodel first.

at least now I have ann incentive to finish!

[GCinDC]

have yet to pull the controller out of the bike and inspect.

just fyi: i did have a problem once when acceleration seemed to get 'grainy', much like it might feel with a hall, but it ended up being some FETs. i seemed to notice it more with regen, but continued to ride until it blew. i guess the system can still run with a FET leg or two broken, but can't last long..

good luck w/ the reno

[fractal]

Hey Len, cool video. Now try and take it to the next level and put some music and a couple of more shots!!!

[Lenk42602]

Gents,

back in the hunt finally. Since the bike has been down I have taking a bit of an e-break.... Been back on pedal bikes with aveangance, even back in the woods a bit.. Feels good when there is less jiggle on my muffin top....

Anyway, I sourced my problem to pretty much one issue -

I checked continuity across all of the mosfet legs and cae up with quite a few that were shorted out. Oddly enough there is no visual indication on the fets themselves of damage. I sent Lyen my asv. profile my controller is set at to see if user programming error was the reason.....

My halls are still good, and considering the nature of how she crapped out on me (instantly) i am pretty certain I am getting somewhere.

In the meantime, i have been gathering footage while riding bicycles over the last few months. here is a short clip....



Len

[Lenk42602]

Finally!

Controller was the issue. Lyen rocks! Just when I was getting biycle only - fit..

I even bought a new road bike!





Now, back to that loop I never finished......

[Lenk42602]

The video above was after several fets were replaced.

so shortly after buttoning up the bike - I zipped down the street to run an errand and @ 1.2 miles the controller pooped the bed again.

18X4115 Lyen, paramters:

asvbb2.png (49.27 KiB) Viewed 871 times

Bike is seeing no more than about 48 amps max, so I am guessing the phase amps are what is causing the issue with the FETS. I spent a good deal of time reading about my 5303 and their infamy for chewing up controllers, but all of these instances were with a 5303 in a 26" wheel, most at hogher voltage. I figured that my nominal voltage of 74 @ 24s A123 cells, combined with my 20" wheel set up would keep me safe.

The last few days I have been sifting through 5303/controller threads on the site here. I am kinda stumped as to what direction to head next. Any input would be appreciated.

I am not sucking amps out of the batteries - the controller doesn't get warm, and the hub motor is nly slightly warm after hard use. Both times the controller failed onme now I was at partial throttle, not WOT.

What do you guys reckon I should do here? At the very least I am pretty dead set on going with an 18X4110 Lyen, but what about my almost sure-to-fail-again 18X4115?
Should I just consider that my project controller and start planning to hange all of the fets in it?

What about a 24 fet? I am not pulling mega - volts, remember, but inductance, apparently, is a bitch with my 5303......

Thanks,

len

[Arlo1]

You should get someone to mesure the 5303 for inductance my 5304 is 255uH so I would guess yours is ~ 143uH which should not eat controllers. But what controller was it you just popped? I use settings a little under that on my 12 fet with 4110 fets. and as a rule 2.5x ratio from battery to phase amps.
This is again an example of a china controller with not enough proper hardware to keep it self alive. All it would probably need is a fast phase current sensor and it would most likely be ok.
Another rule I use with china controllers is I never run more phase amps then 40% of the max HOT (100degC) rating of the fets.

[Lenk42602]

You should get someone to mesure the 5303 for inductance my 5304 is 255uH so I would guess yours is ~ 143uH which should not eat controllers. But what controller was it you just popped? I use settings a little under that on my 12 fet with 4110 fets. and as a rule 2.5x ratio from battery to phase amps.
This is again an example of a china controller with not enough proper hardware to keep it self alive. All it would probably need is a fast phase current sensor and it would most likely be ok.
Another rule I use with china controllers is I never run more phase amps then 40% of the max HOT (100degC) rating of the fets.

Arlo, thanks for the input - the controller is a LYEN 18X4115. I would imagine someone here has measured the inductance on a 5303 due to their in-famous history of eating controllers....

I pm'd bunch of folks and they are all providing similar input - either get an 18X4110 and be careful with the settings, or get a 24 fet and be done with it....

Len

[Arlo1]

You should get someone to mesure the 5303 for inductance my 5304 is 255uH so I would guess yours is ~ 143uH which should not eat controllers. But what controller was it you just popped? I use settings a little under that on my 12 fet with 4110 fets. and as a rule 2.5x ratio from battery to phase amps.
This is again an example of a china controller with not enough proper hardware to keep it self alive. All it would probably need is a fast phase current sensor and it would most likely be ok.
Another rule I use with china controllers is I never run more phase amps then 40% of the max HOT (100degC) rating of the fets.

Arlo, thanks for the input - the controller is a LYEN 18X4115. I would imagine someone here has measured the inductance on a 5303 due to their in-famous history of eating controllers....

I pm'd bunch of folks and they are all providing similar input - either get an 18X4110 and be careful with the settings, or get a 24 fet and be done with it....

Len

Yup 4115 mosfets are very weak. 4110 are a lot better. Lower RDSON meens less heat.

[Lenk42602]

Bike is back up again. 18X4110 controller V2. Waiting on the new jumper cable that is need with the new version boards in these controllers. Will be holding my breath until I get some miles underneath her.....

len

[GCinDC]

got any road tires for that puppy? you're needed at sandy hook on may 26...

now gotta ping mwkeefer..

[Lenk42602]

got any road tires for that puppy? you're needed at sandy hook on may 26...

now gotta ping mwkeefer..

I just might make it. Gotta get some days off and some cash in my pocket tho.

After the controller business got sorted, my alloy shell charger set to 86.7v decided to go buh-bye. The toroidal transformer fried - all the coating on the windings burned off, emitting lovely plumes of white smoke in the hall where it was charging. I also melted my power switch contacts on my last ride... Had the switch in line on the main pwer leads, rather than the "ignition switch" lead. Re-wired that tonight..

Fortunately, I bought a cheap ($60) 24s Lifepo4 charger on ebay last fall as a back up - She has been doing the job okay, but I gotta find a better built job if I am going to charge my pack quickly.

I can get away with using SLA chargers set up for 72v, an there are a few out there that seem to be viable. They all seem to charge at ~86 to 88 volts and then float at 81v..

cheap:
http://www.google.com/products/catalog? ... DcQ8wIwAg#

Well Built:
http://www.impactbattery.com/i7212-dual ... 2-amp.html

Kelly, but looks like all the turd chargers that are proving poorly built
http://kellycontroller.com/f7210-72v10a ... p-108.html

gotta find something that isnt crap!

Len

[Lenk42602]

My ride in yesterday am. No music. Bike sounds bad ass enough.



len