E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

[Hyena]

Yeah that could be a point - bloody stealth and their obscure axle spacing!
What sort of gauge/thread size (not sure what the correct terminology is here) are you using ? I tried some nyloc nuts from bunnings and they wouldn't thread on the axle. I guess I need to go to a specialty fastener place

[remf]

The only ones I found at Bunnings that would fit are Champion 1/2" 20 TPI...they come in a pack of 4 with bolts and aren't Nyloc. They have 1/2" Nylocs but they're course pitch and don't fit. I think the Philidas nuts or spring washers may be the best idea.

[Kepler]

Yeah that could be a point - bloody stealth and their obscure axle spacing!
What sort of gauge/thread size (not sure what the correct terminology is here) are you using ? I tried some nyloc nuts from bunnings and they wouldn't thread on the axle. I guess I need to go to a specialty fastener place

I think its just a standard M14 course pitch thread. Nothing too exotic

[Rix]

Hyena, Kepler, and Snow child,

Thank you all for the lipo advise.

The chain on the bomber, looks like a Shadow Conspiracy interlocking BMX chain which doesn't come with a master link. Taking a link out or just breaking that chain requires a bicycle chain breaker. Taking a link out would move your axel forward and give you some more useful adjustment. I have broke this type of chain before and removed a 2 links on my friend's single speed mountain bike. The key is not pushing the pin all the way out with a chain breaker on the outside link plate that will be used to reattached with. Just push out the pin far enough so you can wiggle the other link loose. After the link is removed, flip the breaker around and line up the breaker's push post with the chainlink pin and push the pin back through the reconnected link. You should feel it hit and set. Then flex the chain on the pin to make sure it's not bound. Or after that chain stretches past the adjustments, just buy another chain with a master link, KMC and Whippleman make some high quality BMX chains for about around 20-30 USD. Rubberside down,

Rix

[Kepler]

Its probably worth noting also that if you decide to fit a gear cluster to your motor so you can try a few different ratios, you need to install a chain designed for that size cluster. The Chain on a Fighter or Bomber is too wide and will bind on the adjacent gears. Alternate is to strip down the cluster and just leave the lock gear on the cluster. I fitted a stripped down 5 speed cluster on my Bomber so I now have a 14 tooth free wheel. Perfect for being able to pedal comfortably at 60kph.

Of course you need to remove a link or two from the stock chain using the method described by Rix.

[Hyena]

The Chain on a Fighter or Bomber is too wide and will bind on the adjacent gears. Alternate is to strip down the cluster and just leave the lock gear on the cluster.

Yep, I tried this the other day and found out it was too wide. So I have the stripped down larger cluster as you suggested. I found with a single speed on right to the motor that the chain kept clipping the edge of the tyre and hitting the swing arm. Of course with the smaller gear on the stripped down cluster now the chain is too long as above. It's only 2 teeth different though so for now I'm getting around it by having the axle sit right at the back of the drop out. With it sitting futher forward the slack in the chain made it skip off every few minutes.
But yeah, schlumpfs 4TW! Being able to pedal at 60km/hr with a chain ring that size is great! People thing I'm ghost pedalling even when I'm not. You quickly realise when they get on and can't turn over the chain over without power because the gearing is so high.

[Rix]

Lowbank,

I didnt' catch it at first, but on your drive side axel block picture you posted, there is only one nut (10mm?) on the axel block post. Even though you are just about out of adjustment, the chain may be loosening because there isn't a jam nut behind the adjuster nut on the axel block post. Due the pushing power of the hub motor combined with pedal power, the nut maybe slowly rotating counter clockwise which is why the chain could be getting loose on you. It might help if you put another nut on the axel post. Adjust your chain tension, then using a wrench to hold the front nut in place, put another nut on it and tighten up.

Rix

[full-throttle]

I'm sure it's the regen, after tighening mine up I didnt feel the usual slight clunk I feel when engaging regen but a few minutes later it was back. I didnt check the nuts again when I got home but I'll bet they're loose again. Because I'm running a non-standard motor I have a nut on both the inside and the outside of the drop out - one tightening out, one tightening in. I'm not sure if that's better or worse...

Yep, I tried this the other day and found out it was too wide. So I have the stripped down larger cluster as you suggested. I found with a single speed on right to the motor that the chain kept clipping the edge of the tyre and hitting the swing arm. Of course with the smaller gear on the stripped down cluster now the chain is too long as above. It's only 2 teeth different though so for now I'm getting around it by having the axle sit right at the back of the drop out. With it sitting futher forward the slack in the chain made it skip off every few minutes.

None of these occur on stock Fighters BTW

It's like DIY car mods - if you don't have the skills (or tools) don't do it.

[Justtoby]

I'm sure it's the regen, after tighening mine up I didnt feel the usual slight clunk I feel when engaging regen but a few minutes later it was back. I didnt check the nuts again when I got home but I'll bet they're loose again. Because I'm running a non-standard motor I have a nut on both the inside and the outside of the drop out - one tightening out, one tightening in. I'm not sure if that's better or worse...

Yep, I tried this the other day and found out it was too wide. So I have the stripped down larger cluster as you suggested. I found with a single speed on right to the motor that the chain kept clipping the edge of the tyre and hitting the swing arm. Of course with the smaller gear on the stripped down cluster now the chain is too long as above. It's only 2 teeth different though so for now I'm getting around it by having the axle sit right at the back of the drop out. With it sitting futher forward the slack in the chain made it skip off every few minutes.

None of these occur on stock Fighters BTW

It's like DIY car mods - if you don't have the skills (or tools) don't do it.

Totally agree, I have modified a lot of cars over the years and even when using the pro's you soon realise the testing, development and design that the manufacturers put in saves a lot of problems that the aftermarket companies cannot deliver.

I wonder how John feels about the bikes being modded? I hope he enjoys seeing what people do.

[full-throttle]

Custom mods take a lot of time and understandably John is not happy about it. I'm in the same boat - any mods would have to wait till there's free time. And at the moment it doesn't look there will be any for another 6 month.

[Hyena]

None of these occur on stock Fighters BTW

Yes I should put that caveat on every post for those not following my prior posts! That said some of the others above have noted loose axle nuts too so it's worth warning everyone to keep an eye on them, checking for tightness from time to time or if the signs appear (clunking on regen etc) Mind you this is common to all ebikes. I suspect some of the people who buy a turn key performance ebike like a stealth aren't going to be inclined to do their own maintenance or checks, though that's probably not the target audience here.

And yeah it's totally understandable that John doesn't have time to do custom mods. You don't rock up to Holden and tell them you want XYZ custom mods on your new car. I guess if anything your state/country dealer may be willing to do small stuff like add ons or upgrades but for the most part it's going to be aftermarket.

[Justtoby]

I really meant about John having positive or negative feelings about other people modding his creations after they leave the factory, not John doing them himself.

I wondered if he felt his product was losing purity and possibly reputation if people report faliures casued by mods or if he is happy for it?

i.e. Rolls Royce took John Lennon to court (and lost) as he painted his Rolls in flower power livery.

[Mr Lowbank]

Lowbank,

I didnt' catch it at first, but on your drive side axel block picture you posted, there is only one nut (10mm?) on the axel block post. Even though you are just about out of adjustment, the chain may be loosening because there isn't a jam nut behind the adjuster nut on the axel block post. Due the pushing power of the hub motor combined with pedal power, the nut maybe slowly rotating counter clockwise which is why the chain could be getting loose on you. It might help if you put another nut on the axel post. Adjust your chain tension, then using a wrench to hold the front nut in place, put another nut on it and tighten up.

Rix

Rix pritty sure the axel in not moving. Just the chain stretching because new only 200km down so far. The axle could do with some improvements though to stop it coming loose. The threaded part could be shortened and the flat area that sits in the swing arm left the full width of the axle stock. This would reduce how much the axle can rotate in the swing arm. (But would reduce area to adjust chain.) If you look at modern MX bike you will have a fine thread on the axle with a nut that does up pretty tight. when undoing the nut there is a full rotation before it starts to come loose. I have never have one come loose when tightened up to the correct toque.


On me way to whip the kids buts on there 80cc mini bikes. (limited to 30Amps)

[Justtoby]

Why 30 amp limit?

Bike looks brilliant in orange! Cool pic

[Kepler]

Because he needs an excuse just incase the kids beat him

[Kepler]

OK something a little different.

I have been nagging John to build a light weight version of a Fighter using a geared hub for quite some time now. He wasn't that keen but my persistence finally payed off with him finally giving in to the concept.

The main frame was kept close to stock however, extensive modifications to the rear swing arm were required to suit the 135mm motor spacing. The rest was up to me. To be clear, the reasons why John agreed to this build was basically to gauge the feasibility of using a geared motor in Fighter. So its lucky me. I get to build the Fighter I always wanted.

Specs:

Stock Fighter main Frame.
Modified swing arm
Bafang code 10 geared hub motor.
Custom 6 FET Mini monster controller setup for 2000W max output. Mounted internally.
18S 75V LiPo. 8Ahr
MT2 Magura brake set

Target weight: 28kG
Target range: 25km to 40km depending on riding style.
Target top speed: 60kph

Assembly is going well and should be ready to go in week or two. The second picture shows the controller in position. The frame becomes the heatsink for the controller.

[kiqnkf]

It's a slender, fine looking bike, may I suggest the "Stealth Bolt" as in "Crossbow Bolt"??? Probably look ok with the lightning bolt shaped "S" they use too...

That seat pole looks about 50cm too short for you Kepler....

So, anyway, Cruising down the road in the Prius, HV battery warning comes on. Off to the factory, pull the battery out - start the reconditioning process...
Using the Commodore, short of it, 3rd gear starts to slip.... Off to my trans guy.
Monaro still sitting in the factory, haven't quite finished the window reg thing... maybe in a couple of weeks.
No more cars to drive, so go to rent a bomb, hire a junker.

Get home, my kids decided we should go for a ride to the skate park, and tear it up.

Get the Bomber out of the house, start pedalling, click.....click...click..click.clickclick.clickclick.... Crap. V-boxx buggered.... Thought I could rely on the bike at least!!! NO!!! Wont be attending the ride this weekend.... Worst part about it.

Not my week.....

Does anyone have a golden egg-laying goose I can rent for a week or so?

[Hyena]

Cool pic Mr Lowbank, only to be trumped shortly after by Kepler!

Nice work mate, 8ah is quite a small capacity. Have you enlarged the opening that the side covers usually go over ? Looks like it, but maybe I just haven't had a close look at them before with both covers off. Would I be correct in assuming with that small battery capacity and big internal space you'll be mounting a clear window in the side covers to try and maintain a hollow triangle ? That's what I'd do! and it's what I'm trying to achieve with the custom frame I'm planning - still good performance but more literally more stealth. Since riding my fighter in public alot lately I've never had so many people say "is that electric?!"
John should provide a jacket with the bike that has "YES, IT'S ELECTRIC" written across the back

[Kepler]

It's a slender, fine looking bike, may I suggest the "Stealth Bolt" as in "Crossbow Bolt"??? Probably look ok with the lightning bolt shaped "S" they use too...

That seat pole looks about 50cm too short for you Kepler....

So, anyway, Cruising down the road in the Prius, HV battery warning comes on. Off to the factory, pull the battery out - start the reconditioning process...
Using the Commodore, short of it, 3rd gear starts to slip.... Off to my trans guy.
Monaro still sitting in the factory, haven't quite finished the window reg thing... maybe in a couple of weeks.
No more cars to drive, so go to rent a bomb, hire a junker.

Get home, my kids decided we should go for a ride to the skate park, and tear it up.

Get the Bomber out of the house, start pedalling, click.....click...click..click.clickclick.clickclick.... Crap. V-boxx buggered.... Thought I could rely on the bike at least!!! NO!!! Wont be attending the ride this weekend.... Worst part about it.

Not my week.....

Does anyone have a golden egg-laying goose I can rent for a week or so?

Seat post is just for the bike stand to grip. I will be using a gravity dropper seat post to accommodate my freakily long legs.

Bad luck on all the failures. Perhaps you should look at Dilogic's V-boxx clinic thread.

[Kepler]

Cool pic Mr Lowbank, only to be trumped shortly after by Kepler!

Nice work mate, 8ah is quite a small capacity. Have you enlarged the opening that the side covers usually go over ? Looks like it, but maybe I just haven't had a close look at them before with both covers off. Would I be correct in assuming with that small battery capacity and big internal space you'll be mounting a clear window in the side covers to try and maintain a hollow triangle ? That's what I'd do! and it's what I'm trying to achieve with the custom frame I'm planning - still good performance but more literally more stealth. Since riding my fighter in public alot lately I've never had so many people say "is that electric?!"
John should provide a jacket with the bike that has "YES, IT'S ELECTRIC" written across the back

True, small battery capacity. Plan is to install the batteries in the upper half of the battery cavity to optimize front to back weight distribution. The frame opening is stock Fighter and will be fully covered to stay true to the Fighter's standard look. It will look slimmer though without the controller mounted underneath. I will also use a 5ah Aux pack in a seat bag for extended range when required.

I may use the lower section of the battery cavity for a permanent mounted 240V charger but haven't made a solid decision on this yet.

[kiqnkf]

Kepler, you legend....

I looked at it, got to the part that said "2 year warranty" and sent FullThrottle a PM.....

[voicecoils]

True, small battery capacity. Plan is to install the batteries in the upper half of the battery cavity to optimize front to back weight distribution. The frame opening is stock Fighter and will be fully covered to stay true to the Fighter's standard look. It will look slimmer though without the controller mounted underneath. I will also use a 5ah Aux pack in a seat bag for extended range when required.

I may use the lower section of the battery cavity for a permanent mounted 240V charger but haven't made a solid decision on this yet.

Super nice new project, now I know of at least 3 people who own a Bomber AND Fighter. Lucky owners!

If you could run a fan-cooled controller and charger both internally, that would be sweet.
[edit: reread your post, you already planned to mount the controller internally, nice.]

Have you had a look at the zippy compact range? You could do 18S, 11.6Ah with just 4 of these packs:
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__21386__ZIPPY_Compact_5800mAh_9S_25C_Lipo_Pack.html
4.5 kg for 772 Wh

[remf]

Yes you have to look closely at that pic to spot the controller mounted up there. Super sleek & very impressive John. Looks like it'll climb mountains.

[Justtoby]

I like the "lighter fighter" I think it should sell as a fighter rs like the Porsches.

I would want more range I think but I suggested to john a while back for a light weight 72v fighter.

Can't wait to see it in action, I assume you will add dérailleur?

[Kepler]

True, small battery capacity. Plan is to install the batteries in the upper half of the battery cavity to optimize front to back weight distribution. The frame opening is stock Fighter and will be fully covered to stay true to the Fighter's standard look. It will look slimmer though without the controller mounted underneath. I will also use a 5ah Aux pack in a seat bag for extended range when required.

I may use the lower section of the battery cavity for a permanent mounted 240V charger but haven't made a solid decision on this yet.

Super nice new project, now I know of at least 3 people who own a Bomber AND Fighter. Lucky owners!

If you could run a fan-cooled controller and charger both internally, that would be sweet.
[edit: reread your post, you already planned to mount the controller internally, nice.]

Have you had a look at the zippy compact range? You could do 18S, 11.6Ah with just 4 of these packs:
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__21386__ZIPPY_Compact_5800mAh_9S_25C_Lipo_Pack.html
4.5 kg for 772 Wh

Interesting option on the packs. I hadn't seen those yet. Might look at that at a later date. For now I have plenty of LiPo's though so I will stick with plan A for now