E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Postby Cowardlyduck » Tue Jul 31, 2012 1:01 am

Mr Lowbank wrote:Is that a Shimano cleated pedal I see? How do you find the cleats I have thought about trying the cleats to stop me flying of the paddles in the ruff stuff. could be suicidal though.

It is indeed. See my post a few pages back for the info. :)
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=23996&start=2025#p606756
They work well, and with the right combination of the Schlumpf button sticking out, positioning of the cleat on shoes and loosening of the cleats, you can still click the button without popping out of the cleats. :)

I also like being able to lift the back wheel over obstacles and gutters although with the extra weight in the rear, it can be a bit of a stretch at times.

But yes they are good, and I feel much more in control now. Felt like I was just holding onto a bike taking me around everywhere before...now I feel like I'm actually controlling it. :mrgreen:

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Postby Cursed » Tue Jul 31, 2012 3:28 am

Justtoby wrote:Rix is correct, I have a switch in line that comes out of the side cover, simple switch on and off between power settings and you set the low power to whatever you want....obviously the factory cannot advise you on this for legal reasons.


Thanks Rix and Toby,one more thing anything i should look out for when placing a switch between the competition wire,so i will not get electrocuted.
That was my plan aswell Toby just put a stealth switch on the outside somewhere.
http://www.stealthelectricbikes.com.au/bomber.html
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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Postby cruzxia » Tue Jul 31, 2012 6:45 am

Rix

I have done about 360 miles so far, I changed the front tire after about 50 miles. I am using a 2.70" Gazza North Shore on the front, It has hardly warn. The Duro on the rear has had it now.
With your 17" rim and tyre, increasing the mass you will loose some HP, because it takes more power to spin up the weight.
On a 4x4 rally car we changed the street type tyres to the rally tires when we were dyno testing, and there was a 50 hp power loss due to the increased mass in the heavy duty tyres.
If you buy a 20" bicycle wheel the rim diameter is 16.5", If you get a 3" tyre you will end up at 22.5" but without the mass.

With your new motor, I would recommend testing it before you mod the shunt in your controller. I think that you should be careful trying to increase the current with the stock battery, as it has a maximum discharge rate, also the BMS will have a maximum switching ability.
If you push the battery to far you may kill it. Lifepo4 are normally around 5c (90A Max) If you move to Lipos you can get 60c , so pulling 100A is nothing.


Hyena

That is good to know, I suspected that the motor was much hotter inside, because they always heat soak when you stop riding. It is probably a good idea to go steady on the last half mile so the magnets don't get cooked when you stop. How do you get on with dust and dirt getting in through the holes. I have been thinking about how to cool the motor, oil, water or air. They all have there issues.

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Postby Hyena » Tue Jul 31, 2012 6:55 am

My thermostat is set at 100 degrees and doesn't trip until I actually stop, so it's only the heat soak without the air cooling that pushes it over the edge. And 100C is pretty conservative anyway so probably not too damaging.
Dust has been no issue on any of my air cooled motors in the past. Unless your riding through a storm of iron rich pebbles and dust...
I wipe the muddy side covers over with a wet rag and leave it at that. Not much gets in when it's spinning around so far.

As I just posted in my build thread, I got knocked off my bike today (commuter) at close to 50km/hr. I had my armoured jacket on and amazingly suffered no injuries other than a very sore chest from where I actually hit the car door on the way flying off the bike. But my first though was "thank Christ I'm not on the fighter, I'd be spewing if it got banged up like this" :lol:
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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Postby QuietRush » Tue Jul 31, 2012 7:39 am

Hyena wrote: I got knocked off my bike today (commuter) at close to 50km/hr. I had my armoured jacket on and amazingly suffered no injuries other than a very sore chest from where I actually hit the car door on the way flying off the bike. But my first though was "thank Christ I'm not on the fighter, I'd be spewing if it got banged up like this" :lol:


Heh, and ouch! chances are the door would also be a bit worse for wear if you'd been on the Fighter..
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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Postby Rix » Tue Jul 31, 2012 9:44 am

cruzxia wrote:Rix
I have done about 360 miles so far, I changed the front tire after about 50 miles. I am using a 2.70" Gazza North Shore on the front, It has hardly warn. The Duro on the rear has had it now.
With your 17" rim and tyre, increasing the mass you will loose some HP, because it takes more power to spin up the weight.
On a 4x4 rally car we changed the street type tyres to the rally tires when we were dyno testing, and there was a 50 hp power loss due to the increased mass in the heavy duty tyres.
If you buy a 20" bicycle wheel the rim diameter is 16.5", If you get a 3" tyre you will end up at 22.5" but without the mass.

With your new motor, I would recommend testing it before you mod the shunt in your controller. I think that you should be careful trying to increase the current with the stock battery, as it has a maximum discharge rate, also the BMS will have a maximum switching ability.
If you push the battery to far you may kill it. Lifepo4 are normally around 5c (90A Max) If you move to Lipos you can get 60c , so pulling 100A is nothing.

Hyena
That is good to know, I suspected that the motor was much hotter inside, because they always heat soak when you stop riding. It is probably a good idea to go steady on the last half mile so the magnets don't get cooked when you stop. How do you get on with dust and dirt getting in through the holes. I have been thinking about how to cool the motor, oil, water or air. They all have there issues.
Cruzxia


Cruzxia,
I know what you mean with HP scavaging losses from rotational mass. But with the hub motor, I am betting that it won't be as significant. I am thinking it will be the equivelant of putting a heavier flywheel on a motorcycle. Revs a little slower, but once up to speed, maintains momentum which should off set the increased rolling resistance and weight a little from the "huge by mountain bike standards" knobbies. I also think some of the scavaging losses from the heavier tire will be offset by the smaller wheel and the mechanical leverage I gain. (78.55" to 72.27" per rotation or approximately 7.5% gain in mechanical advantage). I will not be getting too crazy with the Rshunt mod. I will be pushing between 6 and 6.5 KW max. Figure my CA will be set somewhere in the neighborhood of 75 to 80 amps. Of course, all of this is speculation, wont know until I get the wheel on the bike and start messing around with it. And in the event that my idea with the motorcycle rim and tire suck, I can always go back to a 24" tire (20.5" rim). The more I read and research venting hub motors, the more impressed I am. Referencing a PM I sent to Hyena, he has never ever had a problem with foriegn debris getting into his vented hubs. Judging by Hyena's vids, he's fast and not easy on his bike so that says alot. Also via PM, Kepler hasn't had any problems with pushing 10+ kw through is non vented 5405 either riding smartly. Either way you go, these guys are the go to guys involving anything electrical and the advise we get from them is definately solid. One thing I know for sure, excessive heat is a huge killer for electric motors. For that reason, I will probably be venting the 5404 with 8 14mm holes on each side. On the disk side, I will drill them closer to the center of the hub and out towards the edges on freewheel side. How are the forks working out? Besides the improvement in small bump compliance, are they significantly better on the fast stuff? BTW, I got my flange nuts in from the UK. Just like you said, they are narrower than the stock nuts and the flange portions are not threaded. What a waste of 45 USD. Looks like the caslte nuts and drilling cotter pin holes int he axle is my next move.

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Postby Cowardlyduck » Tue Jul 31, 2012 7:09 pm

Cursed wrote:
Justtoby wrote:Rix is correct, I have a switch in line that comes out of the side cover, simple switch on and off between power settings and you set the low power to whatever you want....obviously the factory cannot advise you on this for legal reasons.


Thanks Rix and Toby,one more thing anything i should look out for when placing a switch between the competition wire,so i will not get electrocuted.
That was my plan aswell Toby just put a stealth switch on the outside somewhere.


You guy's should check out my button solution for power limiting. http://australia.rs-online.com/web/p/push-button-switches/7027112/
http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=23996&start=945#p518679
Image

It's the exact perfect size to sit in the end of the handle bar. :) You just need to route the wires through the handle bar or, like I did, cut a small notch to sit the wires in so the switch doesn't cut them when pressed in.

Hyena, glad to hear you and the Fighter are OK mate. Makes me glad I'm wearing this now.
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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Postby Cursed » Wed Aug 01, 2012 3:14 am

That is one nice stealth switch indeed Cowardly will check into it.
So no chance i can electrocute myself attaching it?

I will be using my pitbike protective gear ;p ,including cross helmet...just a little worried i will draw to much attention with that helmet.

http://imgc.classistatic.com/cps/blnc/1 ... 6b_23.jpeg
http://www.stealthelectricbikes.com.au/bomber.html
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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Postby Cowardlyduck » Wed Aug 01, 2012 5:56 am

Cursed wrote:That is one nice stealth switch indeed Cowardly will check into it.
So no chance i can electrocute myself attaching it?

I will be using my pitbike protective gear ;p ,including cross helmet...just a little worried i will draw to much attention with that helmet.

http://imgc.classistatic.com/cps/blnc/1 ... 6b_23.jpeg


Nah you won't/can't electrocute yourself with those wires. :)

That gear looks nice. Just chuck a T-shirt over the top and none will notice. :)

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Postby Rix » Wed Aug 01, 2012 8:56 am

Cursed wrote:
Justtoby wrote:Rix is correct, I have a switch in line that comes out of the side cover, simple switch on and off between power settings and you set the low power to whatever you want....obviously the factory cannot advise you on this for legal reasons.


Thanks Rix and Toby,one more thing anything i should look out for when placing a switch between the competition wire,so i will not get electrocuted.
That was my plan aswell Toby just put a stealth switch on the outside somewhere.


Cursed, thats a clean set up there. No way of accidently hitting the switch (maybe tipover) and you don't have to remove anything to get to it. :)
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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Postby Hyena » Wed Aug 01, 2012 7:31 pm

Cursed wrote:anything i should look out for when placing a switch between the competition wire,so i will not get electrocuted.

Yeah there's no risk of electrocution - the CA does carry the full pack voltage if you're poking around the board but it's only ~80v DC. Sticking your tongue on it will give you some hurry up though :lol:
With the controller turned off (which you definitely want to do before doing any soldering or playing with wiring) there should be no voltage going to it anyway.
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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Postby Cowardlyduck » Wed Aug 01, 2012 7:35 pm

Had my second stack on the Fighter yesterday...nothing major...just annoying.
E-Bikes and Dogs don't mix. :)
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=42276#p618040

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Postby QMS » Wed Aug 01, 2012 7:54 pm

Cowardlyduck wrote:Had my second stack on the Fighter yesterday...nothing major...just annoying.
E-Bikes and Dogs don't mix. :)
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=42276#p618040

Cheers

Hey C D, i think you wife is right re the high frequency noise :shock: Dogs go mental around my place particularly when it is quiet late at night, and seems to be only the bigger type dogs too. Back in the forum someone else also stated the same thing after a strap late at night :mrgreen:
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Re:

Postby Rix » Thu Aug 02, 2012 2:47 pm

Here is the 100x70/17 maxxis motorcycle tire compared to the Arrow Primebite 24 x2.75 I have on the bomber. For ref., On my scale, the Duro 24x3" razorback weighed 3.4 pounds (1.55kg). The Maxxis on the left weighs 5.7 (2.59kg). Anyways, I am waiting on the 5404 to arrive and then its go time. Cant wait to try it out.

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Postby veloman » Thu Aug 02, 2012 3:56 pm

I just saw and talked to two Bomber riders on east 6th in Austin. Did a u turn when I saw them, had to get up to 34mph to catch them. (they were just cruising).

Good looking bikes. After looking at the clyte 54xx, my Mac looked tiny.... :lol:
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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Postby Kepler » Thu Aug 02, 2012 4:15 pm

veloman wrote:I just saw and talked to two Bomber riders on east 6th in Austin.
Must have been a bit of shock to two other high powered ebikes let alone Bombers :shock: Always good to see one in the flesh. Should have asked the dude for a swap ride. What color's were they.
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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Postby veloman » Thu Aug 02, 2012 4:23 pm

Kepler wrote:Must have been a bit of shock to two other high powered ebikes let alone Bombers :shock: Always good to see one in the flesh. Should have asked the dude for a swap ride. What color's were they.



They were both all black. Had some massive 3" slicks on them. I practically never see ebikes in my city, the only ways I had previously seen were low power mass produced type. I was heading back to work (from a lunch swim) and didn't have much time, but yeah it'd definitely be cool try one out sometime.


It's about time some real ebikes show up here. We have the perfect climate and crappy traffic to make them ideal. They said they haven't had any issues with police yet.
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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Postby cruzxia » Thu Aug 02, 2012 4:44 pm

Rix

That Arrow Primbite tyre looks good, where did you buy it, as I cant find in info on them. The maxis will be a tough tyre by bicycle standards, all the extra weight must be in the number of ply, so punctures should never occur.
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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Postby Cowardlyduck » Fri Aug 03, 2012 12:15 am

cruzxia wrote:Finished version, painted and installed.
Image

TESTED
I tested it with the nuts at 30 ft lb by accelerating to 60kmh then applying the regen. I did this about 60 times. at the end of testing I rechecked the torque on the nuts, and they were still at 30 ft lb.
Re-torqued to 45 after testing.

On the brake side I was getting about 1mm of axle slide, caused when braking hard over bumps. I filed some vertical grooves in the chain adjuster plate, to give it some friction with the swing arm, it never moved again. (The powder coated surface was to slick on both swing arm and chain adjuster)

The great part is that I don’t have to even think about the rear axle when riding, I know it won’t come loose, and I don’t need to carry a spanner anymore.

Cruzxia


Hey Cruzxia how is this setup holding up for you now?

My torque plates keep sliding backwards, and my nuts keep getting loose on me. Any chance I could get you to make one of these up for me also?

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Postby Hyena » Fri Aug 03, 2012 12:27 am

Cowardlyduck wrote:My torque plates keep sliding backwards, and my nuts keep getting loose on me

I've had this happen too, the first sign that something was wrong was my brake started rubbing at 60km/hr. I thought it was just mud or something in there causing the noise. When I got off I found it'd worked its way completely loose and the only thing really holding the motor to the swing arm was the tension of the chain :shock:
In this case loose nuts resulted in a tight sphincter :lol:
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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Postby Cowardlyduck » Fri Aug 03, 2012 12:57 am

Hyena wrote:In this case loose nuts resulted in a tight sphincter :lol:


Lol...I just knew someone would catch that one. :lol:

Problem for me is, I'm running with a derailleur, so if mine gets that loose, I will loose my back wheel entirely. :shock:

I'm thinking even some kind of welded on tabs at the back of the swingarm drop out would also help.
Shim2a.png
Shim2a.png (142.9 KiB) Viewed 322 times

That way, even if the nuts get loose, at least you'll get a bit of warning before it completely lets go. :)

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Postby Hyena » Fri Aug 03, 2012 1:10 am

If you're not fussed with losing the tensioner, cut off the bolt to have just the torque arm itself then drill a hole straight the the end of the swingarm/dropout (basically as you've drawn in red), whack a bolt through there with a nut on the end and you've essentially got a pinch drop out. It's not actually pinching on the axle in the traditional sense but on the torque arm itself, preventing any movement. This would solve the earlier shimming issues posted too. Even if your nuts come lose (there's still milage in the joke :P )the motor can't go anywhere. Win :)
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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Postby remf » Fri Aug 03, 2012 1:14 am

CD & Hyena, I've had the same on the Fighter but not on the Bomber. I use regen on both but think it's the culprit on the Fighter. Maybe time to try those Philidas nuts? They're difficult to find especially anyone who ships small quantities from the UK though I think this company ships overseas with a hefty surcharge.

http://www.fastfixdirect.co.uk/code/nav ... egoryID=12
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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Postby Cowardlyduck » Fri Aug 03, 2012 1:37 am

remf wrote:CD & Hyena, I've had the same on the Fighter but not on the Bomber. I use regen on both but think it's the culprit on the Fighter. Maybe time to try those Philidas nuts? They're difficult to find especially anyone who ships small quantities from the UK though I think this company ships overseas with a hefty surcharge.

http://www.fastfixdirect.co.uk/code/nav ... egoryID=12


Yeah, they look good, but which one exactly do you think?

Maybe this one?
http://www.fastfixdirect.co.uk/code/navigation.asp?fType=Fasteners&MainCategoryID=12&ProductCategoryID=303
Image

Is the Fighter axel 12mm?

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Postby remf » Fri Aug 03, 2012 2:07 am

Well I make it 1/2" UNC but I know others have stated M12 :D

I think maybe the flange nuts might be the ones? Or was it the turrets? Think it might be the M12 turret.

P479A.jpg
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