I feel like my battery bike isn’t going as far as it should

Calication123

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I have a qs motor 72v 8kw, and a 72v 8kw 100 ah battery with a 150 ah bms in it, I just got plates on it so bench tested how long I could go and I ended up only getting 37 miles on its. When I plugged it in it said I still had 60% ah left. But it cut out on me. I had programmed so max line current is 250a. Max phase line is 850a. Is. There a way I can change programming to get more distance. I was only going like max 45 mph. Below is what the programming page looks like and thought I’d toss a pic of my bike in to.
 

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OK so let's say you were averaging 30 MPH and 4000 Watts. That's 55.5 Amps in 37 miles, so about what, 68 Amp hours? If you had 60% left that's good, I would have calculated you had 30% left.

If you really used 40 Ah, and had 60% left of 100 Ah, then 37 miles let's assume at 40 amps for one hour = 2880 watts average. Seems reasonable. The battery in theory should then last about 2.5 hours and about 90-95 miles. That's not bad is it?

Remember that 37 mph or whatever you are averaging is going to use way more power proportionally than a slower speed. 37 mph uses way more than twice as much power as 18 mph. It's not linear, it's more like natural logarithmic for power use vs. speed. If you only went 20 mph avg. you are going to notice much better battery efficiency.
 
I have a qs motor 72v 8kw, and a 72v 8kw 100 ah battery with a 150 ah bms in it,
Do you mean the BMS is rated 150A? (Ah is a unit of capacity, not current, so a BMS cannot have an Ah rating, only the cells or the pack as a whole)

What A (not Ah) are the cells in the battery rated for? The BMS (and the controller) need to be set to prevent drawing any more than that, preferably significantly less to keep from stressing them.

Note that if the BMS is rated for 150A, and you are potentially pulling 250A from it via the controller (line current setting), then you are probably going to blow up the BMS if it hasn't already been damaged by the nearly double current flow that it was designed for. (the failures are usually that the FETs fail stuck on, so the BMS can't turn off discharge and stop further draining when there is a problem).

If the BMS is rated the same as the cells, then you're also killing the cells.

To correct this you'd need to set the "line current" (battery current) to less than the BMS's (and cells') max current capability, so you aren't stressing them. (these ratings are usually already the absolute max, with no safety margin given, so running them at that max is as likely as not to cause a failure).




I just got plates on it so bench tested
FWIW, bench testing is doing a test "on the bench" so in your workshop, lab, etc. rather than an actual on-ground/on-road/in-use test. If you rode it out on the road, ti's called a "road test". ;)


how long I could go and I ended up only getting 37 miles on its. When I plugged it in it said I still had 60% ah left. But it cut out on me.
That could mean you have mismatched cells such that some have less capacity than others, probably a lot less if it had 60% left, so they dropped below LVC and triggered the BMS to shut off it's output (if power completely shut down) or the pack as a whole dropped below the controller's LVC and the controller shutdown.

Or perhaps the controller's LVC is set too high for the pack type and voltage; usually you'd set it (for LiIon) to about 3.1-3.3v/cell (or around 2.8v/cell for LiFePO4).

Or whatever it is that tells you you still had 60% is not correctly setup for the actual battery you have.

If it really had 60% of 80Ah left, it means it had 48Ah left. If you only went 37 miles, then that means around 32Ah took you 37 miles, which is probably not the case. A quick and dirty guesstimate with a simulator shows that at 45mph on flat terrain with no wind and good road conditions and not in stop/start traffic it should take about 110-120Wh/mile to do that. A 72v pack at 80Ah is about 5760Wh. 40% of that is 2304Wh, and 2304Wh / 37 miles = 62wh/mile. 120Wh/mile x 37 miles is about 4400Wh, which is over 76% of your pack. Non-flat roads, or headwinds, or having to stop and start again in traffic, will all make your Wh/mile usage go up.


I had programmed so max line current is 250a. Max phase line is 850a. Is. There a way I can change programming to get more distance. I was only going like max 45 mph.
To get more distance you have to use less power, which means going slower and accelerating less hard. So you'd have to turn down the current (which you should cut in half, or less, anyway, to protect your battery from destruction since it isn't capable of what you're asking of it at present).
 
OK so let's say you were averaging 30 MPH and 4000 Watts. That's 55.5 Amps in 37 miles, so about what, 68 Amp hours? If you had 60% left that's good, I would have calculated you had 30% left.

If you really used 40 Ah, and had 60% left of 100 Ah, then 37 miles let's assume at 40 amps for one hour = 2880 watts average. Seems reasonable. The battery in theory should then last about 2.5 hours and about 90-95 miles. That's not bad is it?

Remember that 37 mph or whatever you are averaging is going to use way more power proportionally than a slower speed. 37 mph uses way more than twice as much power as 18 mph. It's not linear, it's more like natural logarithmic for power use vs. speed. If you only went 20 mph avg. you are going to notice much better battery efficiency.
Okay that’s good to hear I feel as if should be doing more, however at the 60% my bike shuts off
 
Okay that’s good to hear I feel as if should be doing more, however at the 60% my bike shuts off
How is 60% left determined, meter on the battery or on the display, and what's the corresponding voltage? It it's the display, and if the display calculates state of charge based on fully charged down to LVC, then you have a lot less than 60% left. The controller show LVC set to 56V or 2.8V per cell, so I'm assuming it's the BMS shutting off the bike to protect the battery.
 
Do you mean the BMS is rated 150A? (Ah is a unit of capacity, not current, so a BMS cannot have an Ah rating, only the cells or the pack as a whole)

What A (not Ah) are the cells in the battery rated for? The BMS (and the controller) need to be set to prevent drawing any more than that, preferably significantly less to keep from stressing them.

Note that if the BMS is rated for 150A, and you are potentially pulling 250A from it via the controller (line current setting), then you are probably going to blow up the BMS if it hasn't already been damaged by the nearly double current flow that it was designed for. (the failures are usually that the FETs fail stuck on, so the BMS can't turn off discharge and stop further draining when there is a problem).

If the BMS is rated the same as the cells, then you're also killing the cells.

To correct this you'd need to set the "line current" (battery current) to less than the BMS's (and cells') max current capability, so you aren't stressing them. (these ratings are usually already the absolute max, with no safety margin given, so running them at that max is as likely as not to cause a failure).





FWIW, bench testing is doing a test "on the bench" so in your workshop, lab, etc. rather than an actual on-ground/on-road/in-use test. If you rode it out on the road, ti's called a "road test". ;)



That could mean you have mismatched cells such that some have less capacity than others, probably a lot less if it had 60% left, so they dropped below LVC and triggered the BMS to shut off it's output (if power completely shut down) or the pack as a whole dropped below the controller's LVC and the controller shutdown.

Or perhaps the controller's LVC is set too high for the pack type and voltage; usually you'd set it (for LiIon) to about 3.1-3.3v/cell (or around 2.8v/cell for LiFePO4).

Or whatever it is that tells you you still had 60% is not correctly setup for the actual battery you have.

If it really had 60% of 80Ah left, it means it had 48Ah left. If you only went 37 miles, then that means around 32Ah took you 37 miles, which is probably not the case. A quick and dirty guesstimate with a simulator shows that at 45mph on flat terrain with no wind and good road conditions and not in stop/start traffic it should take about 110-120Wh/mile to do that. A 72v pack at 80Ah is about 5760Wh. 40% of that is 2304Wh, and 2304Wh / 37 miles = 62wh/mile. 120Wh/mile x 37 miles is about 4400Wh, which is over 76% of your pack. Non-flat roads, or headwinds, or having to stop and start again in traffic, will all make your Wh/mile usage go up.



To get more distance you have to use less power, which means going slower and accelerating less hard. So you'd have to turn down the current (which you should cut in half, or less, anyway, to protect your battery from destruction since it isn't capable of what you're asking of it at present).
This helped a lot I went home and adjusted the values.and the pictures below are where I ended up placing the perimeters at. Could you look at them and see if something should be moved around.
 

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So what you’re saying is that since I had my perimeters set above it’s capability, it’s drawing more amps shrinking the amount of AH that are actually usable. So something that is supposed to draw only 150amps max when it’s set to use 250 it’s gonna really 1/2 the amount of amp hours. Are there other perimeter on the controller I should lower to extende the range besides the lvc which I have set to 56v( I never got close to, lowest my battery has gone is 68v then shuts off). And the line current( which was originally set at 250 now lowered to 150, the max current for the batteries).
 
So what you’re saying is that since I had my perimeters set above it’s capability, it’s drawing more amps shrinking the amount of AH that are actually usable. So something that is supposed to draw only 150amps max when it’s set to use 250 it’s gonna really 1/2 the amount of amp hours. Are there other perimeter on the controller I should lower to extende the range besides the lvc which I have set to 56v( I never got close to, lowest my battery has gone is 68v then shuts off). And the line current( which was originally set at 250 now lowered to 150, the max current for the batteries).
Should I adjust the max phase current or is 850 okay?
 
You might want to try and cool you cells just as a mechanical suggestion besides your electrical programming thing.
 
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