QS 138 70H with Gearbox

General Discussion about large electric scooters and motorcycles and other things with no pedals.
hugok   100 mW

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Re: QS 138 70H with Gearbox

Post by hugok » Mar 08 2021 4:01pm

Thanks for the excellent photos!

Regarding sprocket, do you think welding two together to get a wider sprocket would be better for the shaft? I don't want to round off the splines.

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jhoexp   100 mW

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Re: QS 138 70H with Gearbox

Post by jhoexp » Mar 08 2021 4:26pm

Jordan325ic wrote:
Mar 08 2021 9:37am
I wonder how sensitive the unit is to other mounting orientations, besides the increased difficulty in draining and re-filling the unit...
You are right about the orientation.

Are you thinking about using it with the transmission on the right?
I am not 100% sure, but considering how the venting system is done, using it on the right side probably the oil will end up in the "venting labyrint" and accumulate there. My understanding is that the oil will stay in the gearing chamber if it's mounted correctly and will tolerate a large angle of rotation, but 180° will probably cause some problems.

Elektrosherpa   100 W

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Re: QS 138 70H with Gearbox

Post by Elektrosherpa » Mar 08 2021 5:58pm

Jordan325ic wrote:
Mar 08 2021 9:37am
.. besides the increased difficulty in draining and re-filling the unit...
I would not worry too much about THAT point-finally it will be mounted into a bike.
You can always lean it, or even lay down, to one side for draining, and to the other for filling...

Jordan325ic   100 W

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Re: QS 138 70H with Gearbox

Post by Jordan325ic » Mar 08 2021 8:06pm

jhoexp wrote:
Mar 08 2021 4:26pm
Jordan325ic wrote:
Mar 08 2021 9:37am
I wonder how sensitive the unit is to other mounting orientations, besides the increased difficulty in draining and re-filling the unit...
You are right about the orientation.

Are you thinking about using it with the transmission on the right?
I am not 100% sure, but considering how the venting system is done, using it on the right side probably the oil will end up in the "venting labyrint" and accumulate there. My understanding is that the oil will stay in the gearing chamber if it's mounted correctly and will tolerate a large angle of rotation, but 180° will probably cause some problems.
I think you're right. My bike is left hand drive, no problem. I like the mounting points. Obviously they all won't be used, but two or three of them can be adapted to work with a variety of motorcycle frames.
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dforesi   10 mW

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Re: QS 138 70H with Gearbox

Post by dforesi » Mar 08 2021 10:31pm

Just mirroring what everyone else said. These are some great photos, turning into a very valuable thread for the community.

I also had some concerns about the orientation of the motor. I find it very odd that QS would design the motor in this way, they know these are being used for motorcycle conversions, why they would not design it for left side drive orientation is beyond me. It will be interesting if mounting it "up-side down" causes any issues with the lubrication.

Great to see that it has helical gears! I was worried about gear whine.
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SlowCo   10 MW

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Re: QS 138 70H with Gearbox

Post by SlowCo » Mar 09 2021 3:47am

dforesi wrote:
Mar 08 2021 10:31pm
I find it very odd that QS would design the motor in this way, they know these are being used for motorcycle conversions, why they would not design it for left side drive orientation is beyond me.
It IS designed for left hand side chain drive for motorcycle conversions. Or did you mean something else?

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Re: QS 138 70H with Gearbox

Post by MikeSnow » Mar 09 2021 4:26am

Is this motor using 60° or 120°Hall sensor phase angle? I hate that the information about QS motors are so limited.

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dforesi   10 mW

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Re: QS 138 70H with Gearbox

Post by dforesi » Mar 09 2021 10:16am

SlowCo wrote:
Mar 09 2021 3:47am
dforesi wrote:
Mar 08 2021 10:31pm
I find it very odd that QS would design the motor in this way, they know these are being used for motorcycle conversions, why they would not design it for left side drive orientation is beyond me.
It IS designed for left hand side chain drive for motorcycle conversions. Or did you mean something else?
You're correct... It was a late night. I was confusing myself.
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dforesi   10 mW

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Re: QS 138 70H with Gearbox

Post by dforesi » Mar 09 2021 10:17am

So for those who have ordered the QS 138 with or without gearbox to the USA who was the supplier you used?
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hugok   100 mW

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Re: QS 138 70H with Gearbox

Post by hugok » Mar 09 2021 11:08am

If you live in US you have these guys: https://www.facebook.com/ElectroBraap

I ordered from China to Sweden, QS138v3 (With gearbox), $430 including shipping but not including vat and tolls.

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Re: QS 138 70H with Gearbox

Post by Jordan325ic » Mar 09 2021 1:18pm

hugok wrote:
Mar 09 2021 11:08am
If you live in US you have these guys: https://www.facebook.com/ElectroBraap

I ordered from China to Sweden, QS138v3 (With gearbox), $430 including shipping but not including vat and tolls.
On the Electro&Co. website everything is listed as "international warehouse". Pretty sure it's just drop-shipping from the manufacturer.
I got mine from QS Alibaba, or easier would be SIAEcosys subsidaiary on Aliexpress.
https://qsmotor.en.alibaba.com/?spm=a27 ... 3e5f6kjwIA
https://www.aliexpress.com/store/507918 ... 6129YF5wt8

Be aware, shipping is a few hundred $ and it will take about 2 months to arrive.

john61ct   100 GW

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Re: QS 138 70H with Gearbox

Post by john61ct » Mar 09 2021 4:57pm

Yes shipping has gone up so much the delay then seems more of a pain.

A distributor in each major market wojld really boost their sales.

Don't get me started on Nucular.

Time to grow up become a real global company guys!

hugok   100 mW

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Re: QS 138 70H with Gearbox

Post by hugok » Mar 10 2021 5:21am

I actually think ElectroBraap have motors in stock in the US, could be worth asking them.

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Re: QS 138 70H with Gearbox

Post by Clueless1 » Mar 12 2021 2:24pm

So from what I can tell, the shaft fits a 420 chain with a JTF249 sprocket from JT Sprockets. Same sprocket for Honda 125 Grom.

Does it need a retaining clip of some sort? If so, where do you find that? Or does that come with a JT249 sprocket when you order one...?

Jordan325ic   100 W

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Re: QS 138 70H with Gearbox

Post by Jordan325ic » Mar 12 2021 3:05pm

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A very standard "17mm splined shaft" 420 or 428 sprocket will fit. I may have found a source for a 520 sprocket... I will update if it comes to pass.

Mine came with a 15T 428 sprocket, with retainer plate/hardware.

Clueless1   1 mW

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Re: QS 138 70H with Gearbox

Post by Clueless1 » Mar 12 2021 9:39pm

I see. Thanks for clarifying. I’m trying to fit this to a KX100 which I believe has a stock 420 chain and rear sprocket so that’s where I’m coming from.

If the motor was designed around a 428 chain, then it might be worthwhile upsizing to a larger set up, especially if i am planning on running higher current/torque then what was intended. Last thing I want is to strip the shaft, if thats even possible.

hugok   100 mW

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Re: QS 138 70H with Gearbox

Post by hugok » Mar 14 2021 4:55pm

Finally a video of the motor in action from the guys at ZALO TECH

Found in the comments:
Battery:
24s17p VTC5A

Pushing 35 kw peak!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zhzN1Eg4tSk

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dforesi   10 mW

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Re: QS 138 70H with Gearbox

Post by dforesi » Mar 14 2021 9:31pm

hugok wrote:
Mar 14 2021 4:55pm
Finally a video of the motor in action from the guys at ZALO TECH

Found in the comments:
Battery:
24s17p VTC5A

Pushing 35 kw peak!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zhzN1Eg4tSk
That's a great find! Looks like it has a ton of power. I don't speak the language but the video speaks for itself. Packaging with this motor seems like it should be a breeze. I did notice it looked like it might be a hair too wide to accommodate the foot brake, but that's easy enough to fix.
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Loydbrawn101@gmail.com   100 mW

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Re: QS 138 70H with Gearbox

Post by Loydbrawn101@gmail.com » Mar 15 2021 2:36pm

Hello,I've been looking all over and I can't figure out what the "h" means in 70 h,please let me know

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dforesi   10 mW

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Re: QS 138 70H with Gearbox

Post by dforesi » Mar 15 2021 3:07pm

Not sure it really matters. There aren't any other versions that I know of. Not sure what QS stands for either lol
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hugok   100 mW

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Re: QS 138 70H with Gearbox

Post by hugok » Mar 15 2021 3:12pm

Quanshun Motor and 70mm magnet height :D

There there is a QS138 90H as well but not with gearbox.

john61ct   100 GW

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Re: QS 138 70H with Gearbox

Post by john61ct » Mar 15 2021 4:14pm

Is a "higher" magnet always better, as in stronger more powerful?

Only downside being maybe heavier?

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jhoexp   100 mW

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Re: QS 138 70H with Gearbox

Post by jhoexp » Mar 15 2021 5:07pm

john61ct wrote:
Mar 15 2021 4:14pm
Is a "higher" magnet always better, as in stronger more powerful?

Only downside being maybe heavier?
It's not "higher" it's just longer. It is not necessarly "better" than the shorter one that has a lighter rotor, less inertia, usually higher rpm, etc...

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Re: QS 138 70H with Gearbox

Post by john61ct » Mar 15 2021 5:18pm

OK how about "better" for long steep hills & heavy loads at low speeds. Very slow top speeds.

More mass means slower to overheat in that context?

Or are the magnets a small component of overall mass? When people talk about iron, and "moar copper", how do magnets fit in?

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jhoexp   100 mW

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Re: QS 138 70H with Gearbox

Post by jhoexp » Mar 15 2021 6:52pm

john61ct wrote:
Mar 15 2021 5:18pm
OK how about "better" for long steep hills & heavy loads at low speeds. Very slow top speeds.
Yes, exactly. It sure depends mostly on what use you want to make of it.
More mass means slower to overheat in that context?
I think you can say so, probably not much of a problem in most use cases.
Or are the magnets a small component of overall mass? When people talk about iron, and "moar copper", how do magnets fit in?
In this kind of IPM motors, magnet are embedded in the rotor laminations. Copper wire is in stator windings. How they influence performance is so complex that you can't really say much just from the lenght of the motor. I think you can probably assume that the longer motor will have higher torque and turn slower.

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