Need advice for Bafang battery

Batteries, Chargers, and Battery Management Systems.
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jucasan   10 mW

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Need advice for Bafang battery

Post by jucasan » Jan 15 2022 11:22am

I'm thinking about getting a Bafang 1000W kit but not sure what battery is the best option. I don't know but I read in a review that for example the 52V battery is not worth the money. It's better to stick with the 48V. I would like to keep it in the <$300 range.

Also, the gear sensor works with a Nuvinci system?
Thanks !!


1)48V 11.6Ah Ultra Slim Shark Ebike Battery (2900 18650 Cells)
Free

2) 48V 11.6Ah Mini Shark Ebike Battery (2900 18650 Cells)
$50.00

3) 48V 12.8Ah Mini Shark Ebike Battery (Panasonic NCR18650BD Cells)
$150.00

4) 48V 14.5 Ah Jumbo Shark Ebike Battery (2900 18650 Cells)
$125.00

5) 48V 16Ah Jumbo Shark Ebike Battery (Panasonic NCR18650BD Cells)
$450.00

6) 48V 20.3 Ah Whale Shark Ebike Battery (2900 18650 Cells)
$274.00

7) 52V 11.6 Ah Dolphin Ebike Battery (2900 18650 Cells)
$74.00

8) 52V 12.8 Ah Dolphin Ebike Battery (Panasonic NCR18650BD Cells)
$274.00

9) 52V 14.5Ah Jumbo Shark Ebike Battery (2900 18560 Cells)
$174.00

10) 52V 17.4Ah Whale Shark Ebike Battery (2900 18650 Cells)
$274.00

11) 52V 16Ah Jumbo Shark Ebike Battery (Panasonic NCR18650BD Cells)
$474.00

12) 52V 19.2Ah Whale Shark Ebike Battery (Panasonic NCR18650BD Cells)
$574.00

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amberwolf   100 GW

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Re: Need advice for Bafang battery

Post by amberwolf » Jan 16 2022 8:51pm

jucasan wrote:
Jan 15 2022 11:22am
I'm thinking about getting a Bafang 1000W kit but not sure what battery is the best option. I don't know but I read in a review that for example the 52V battery is not worth the money. It's better to stick with the 48V. I would like to keep it in the <$300 range.
Without knowing what "bafang 1000w kit" you're referring to, we can't know what that system's requirements or limitations are, and so can't match any battery to it. A link to the specific kit you are looking at would be helpful.

Without links to the specific sale pages for each one, we couldn't tell you anything about each battery (how good it is, etc) beyond the little info listed in each description in your post (quoted below). Some of that info is not clear what it is for.

Several of them say "2900" and then what kind of cell, implying it uses that many of that kind of cell, but having almost three thousand cells in there wouldn't fit in any of the case styles listed, so it can't be that. Without details from the sale pages themselves, it doesn't make sense.

Something you might consider when looking at packs is that if you see some that are a third (or some significant difference in price) of others with similar specs, like some I see that are only a couple Ah difference but one is three times the price of the other: that kind of difference may imply a similiar difference in quality, reliability, or even a pack that isn't actually what it says it is, for the one that is cheaper. Higher price is no guarantee of good quality either, but too low a price is often a pointer to low quality.
Also, the gear sensor works with a Nuvinci system?

If the NV is a two-cable system like the ones Iv'e worked with, the sensor would need to go inline with one of the cables. But the NV doesn't move very much for little shifts (because it is continously variable, there is no theoretical "minimum" shift though there may be a practical one), so it might not be enough cable movement to trigger the sensor, unless you make large enough shifts.

1)48V 11.6Ah Ultra Slim Shark Ebike Battery (2900 18650 Cells)
Free

2) 48V 11.6Ah Mini Shark Ebike Battery (2900 18650 Cells)
$50.00

3) 48V 12.8Ah Mini Shark Ebike Battery (Panasonic NCR18650BD Cells)
$150.00

4) 48V 14.5 Ah Jumbo Shark Ebike Battery (2900 18650 Cells)
$125.00

5) 48V 16Ah Jumbo Shark Ebike Battery (Panasonic NCR18650BD Cells)
$450.00

6) 48V 20.3 Ah Whale Shark Ebike Battery (2900 18650 Cells)
$274.00

7) 52V 11.6 Ah Dolphin Ebike Battery (2900 18650 Cells)
$74.00

8) 52V 12.8 Ah Dolphin Ebike Battery (Panasonic NCR18650BD Cells)
$274.00

9) 52V 14.5Ah Jumbo Shark Ebike Battery (2900 18560 Cells)
$174.00

10) 52V 17.4Ah Whale Shark Ebike Battery (2900 18650 Cells)
$274.00

11) 52V 16Ah Jumbo Shark Ebike Battery (Panasonic NCR18650BD Cells)
$474.00

12) 52V 19.2Ah Whale Shark Ebike Battery (Panasonic NCR18650BD Cells)
$574.00
If you found this advice helpful, supporting contributions are accepted here.

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jucasan   10 mW

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Re: Need advice for Bafang battery

Post by jucasan » Jan 17 2022 10:43pm

Sorry about the link
https://bafangusadirect.com/collections ... it-battery

and regarding the battery there is not much information and specifications. I'm struggling with the idea of how much is 1 amp. I know there are formulas and stuff like that, but I don't know how that translate to real life. For example, what is a better choice. A 48V 20.3Ah or a 52V 11.6Ah for $274? I also don't have a clue what the 2900 means. Apparently, the kit comes with a free 48v 11.6Ah. Is that too weak? I'm not trying to break a record, but I want something somehow fun to ride.

Any advice is welcome,
Thanks

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amberwolf   100 GW

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Re: Need advice for Bafang battery

Post by amberwolf » Jan 17 2022 11:38pm

jucasan wrote:
Jan 17 2022 10:43pm
Sorry about the link
https://bafangusadirect.com/collections ... it-battery
regarding the battery there is not much information and specifications. I'm struggling with the idea of how much is 1 amp. I know there are formulas and stuff like that, but I don't know how that translate to real life.
Well, I don't think that the "amp" you are referring to is the same as what the batteries you list have for specifications in your post. Those show Ah, which is amp-hours, which is a measure of capacity. A plain amp, or A, is a measure of current, or how much electricity is flowing at any particular instant. They look similar, but are very different things in relation to ebike part specifications.

For a rough idea of what Ah means practically, it may take 0.5 to 1Ah per mile for 15-20mph riding, depending on riding conditions, weather, terrain, riding style, and ebike system used. So that 11.6Ah could, under the right conditions, potentially give you 20 miles of motor-only range. If you also pedal, and/or use the motor a lot less, then could be a lot more than that. If you use only the motor and ride it hard and fast, you might get 10 miles or less.

Batteries have other important specifications like Amps (continous, and max/peak) that they can provide. If the motor takes more A to work than the battery can provide (say, 10A battery and 30A controller/motor), the battery may (if designed to) shutdown and turn off to protect itself, or if it cannot do so, it can be overheated and damaged, or at best just sag a lot in voltage while under that load, reducing speed and performance. If the battery has more ability to provide A than the motor needs, (say, 30A battery and 10A controller/motor), then the battery has an easy time of it and performs well and lasts longer.
For example, what is a better choice. A 48V 20.3Ah or a 52V 11.6Ah for $274? I also don't have a clue what the 2900 means. Apparently, the kit comes with a free 48v 11.6Ah. Is that too weak? I'm not trying to break a record, but I want something somehow fun to ride.
Fun is too subjective to truly help you decide on. ;) If you define specifics of what "fun" means to you in numbers, like speed, range, riding style, and on what terrain and weather conditions, etc., and possible total bike+rider weight (which changes performance on hills and at startups), it is a little easier to do.

If it comes with a free battery, try it out with that. If it doesn't do what you want, *then* start worrying about what to replace it with. ;)


If you provide a link to each specific battery you wish us to compare for you, we can do that. Otherwise we can't tell you which of them is better, except for some general guidelines.

A 52v battery is "14s", so it has one more cell group in series than a 48v "13s" battery, and so has a little more total Wh capacity if they are otherwise identical.

It also creates a slightly higher top speed of a motor, compared to the identical 48v battery, assuming the controller doesn't limit this already. That may not translate into higher bike speed, depending on your riding conditions, gearing, etc.


If a specific battery is lower priced compared to another one that is the same voltage and Ah (or very similar), especially by a lot, it's probably not as good a battery. You'd need details on each one to compare them. Without those details, you can generally assume it will not be as good or perform as well or last as long as the more expensive one. It may or may not be true; no way to know without side-by-side testing of both.

One sign of sellers to avoid is when you find conflicting info on a product page. The more conflicting items, the more I'd want to avoid them. It means they either change specs frequently enough to not catch all changes, or that they don't care enough to provide accurate info, or they copy/paste other sale pages (theirs or other people's) and edit them (poorly) to use them for their product, or even that they just make up info as needed to make thing sell faster.

Good or bad reviews may or may not be definitive; that's a judgement call based on the seller and the reviews that you have to make.

A sign of sellers to buy from and stick with is accurate and complete info, prices that aren't "too good to be true", reviews both on their sale page and elsewhere on the internet, especially for people that have had problems with their pack, so you can tell how good their customer service and warranty actually are.



There are quite a few things to know about a battery before you can directly compare it to another, and the cheaper the pack the less likely this info will be provided (or it may be made up):

V
A (max/peak)
A (continous)
Ah
Cell type
Cell brand and model
Number of series and parallel cells (14s8p, etc).
BMS type (balancing, non balancing, etc)
(I've forgotten something but can't remember what :oops: )

Other info that's useful but rarely provided:
combined or separate charge and discharge ports
pack construction type (spotwelded, busbars, soldered, "weldless", etc.; cell holders or loose held only by welds/etc.)
water resistance level (IP67, potted, sealed, etc).
Pack weight, which can loosely be used to validate the actual number of cells/etc. (around 48g/cell, so if there's 100 cells, that would be 4.8kg, so a pack that weighs 5-6kg would be reasonable for that, etc...but a pack that only weighs 3kg can't possibly be real if it's supposed to have 100 18650 cells).
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amberwolf   100 GW

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Re: Need advice for Bafang battery

Post by amberwolf » Jan 17 2022 11:46pm

jucasan wrote:
Jan 17 2022 10:43pm
Sorry about the link
https://bafangusadirect.com/collections ... it-battery


For the specs on that page
Up to 1,764 watts with 52V battery (1,638 watts with 48V battery)
45 amp Anderson Connections to connect to battery
it means you would need to be sure that whatever battery you get can provide that power, call it 1800w peak, 1000w continous, without straining it. We'll use the worst case math for safety margin:

1800W/48V = 37.5A peak
1000W/48V = 20.8A continous.

So call it 38A peak, and 21A continous, that any battery you get must be able to provide, assuming that you ride using the system up to these limits.

If the batteries don't say if they can do this, then I'd avoid them, because you can't know if they'll work until you have them and can do load testing.
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tomjasz   10 GW

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Re: Need advice for Bafang battery

Post by tomjasz » Jan 18 2022 7:54am

Forget the myriad of details for a moment, the simple answer? Those prices should alarm you.
Thanks Justin_le we're here thanks to you. All the best to the mods for their tireless work keeping it on an even keel.

jucasan   10 mW

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Re: Need advice for Bafang battery

Post by jucasan » Jan 18 2022 12:32pm

tomjasz wrote:
Jan 18 2022 7:54am
Forget the myriad of details for a moment, the simple answer? Those prices should alarm you.
Really? Why. Too cheap or too expensive?? I'm thinking about just getting the "free" battery and with more time and research get something better.

I thought Bafang was a good quality product. There are better options out there?

Thanks

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Chalo   100 GW

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Re: Need advice for Bafang battery

Post by Chalo » Jan 18 2022 1:17pm

tomjasz wrote:
Jan 18 2022 7:54am
Forget the myriad of details for a moment, the simple answer? Those prices should alarm you.
Given that the first option is "free" (included in total?), I think the other prices reflect surcharge to upgrade rather than total retail price.
This is to express my gratitude to Justin of Grin Technologies for his extraordinary measures to save this forum for the benefit of all.

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amberwolf   100 GW

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Re: Need advice for Bafang battery

Post by amberwolf » Jan 18 2022 7:04pm

I can't tell, since no links have been provided for all the other options, only for the motor system. No other batteries are listed on that page and requests for links to each of them not fulfulled.
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jucasan   10 mW

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Re: Need advice for Bafang battery

Post by jucasan » Jan 18 2022 10:17pm

amberwolf wrote:
Jan 16 2022 8:51pm

Several of them say "2900" and then what kind of cell
I think is 2900 mAh

https://www.orbtronic.com/batteries-cha ... otect-case

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tomjasz   10 GW

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Re: Need advice for Bafang battery

Post by tomjasz » Jan 19 2022 10:23pm

Chalo wrote:
Jan 18 2022 1:17pm
tomjasz wrote:
Jan 18 2022 7:54am
Forget the myriad of details for a moment, the simple answer? Those prices should alarm you.
Given that the first option is "free" (included in total?), I think the other prices reflect surcharge to upgrade rather than total retail price.
Can you manage one of the budget packs? Sure! Can Amberwolf? Sure. Can the average DIY guy that got here by google? Stop and think...
Thanks Justin_le we're here thanks to you. All the best to the mods for their tireless work keeping it on an even keel.

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