Bare bones electric bike

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psych0hans

10 mW
Joined
Nov 14, 2015
Messages
25
Hi guys, I'm pretty new to the world of E-Bikes and was wondering if there was a demand for a bare bones electric bike within a budget of ~750$? Something like the Sonders bike, but with realistic figures and expectations. Probably a 750W motor and a 10amp hr battery pack. Aluminum frame construction and a fat-bike layout. I'm going to start an Indiegogo campaign eventually, once I have frozen the design and components.

What Features would you like to see on the bike? What's the ideal price point to sell at? Suspension, at this price point, might not be possible, but I'll definitely look into it. What kinds of range and speed figures would you like to see? Would definitely love your input on this, thanks :D

A little about myself, I'm based in India and my dad owns a company manufacturing exhaust systems and windscreen wipers for all the major auto manufacturers in India. Not at all new to the world of manufacturing and sales, but completely new to something like E-Bikes. I was thinking of only assembling initially and then eventually start manufacturing my own frames and wheels.

The questions I would love answered are :-

1) What kind of frame?
2) What sizes?
3) Fat bike or not?
4) What kind of wheels and tires?
5) Motor, 350W enough or at least 750?
6) Battery pack? Is 10ah good enough?
7) Geared or straight drive?
8 ) Optional extras? like light, etc...[/list]
 
Currently in touch with BaFang for complete EV drive kits. Only look at Mid-Drive for now.
 
Start with a base model, and make it affordable to the general people or casual users.

You can offer options and upgrades once you can set the base price. People want affordability more than anything else.

You can start with SLA batteries, and offer Li-ion upgrade.

Ask your non-bike friends how much they would be willing to pay for an electric bike which would give them 15-20 km range.

Get them in the door first, and once they get into yet, the rest will just happen. There should be a huge market for LEVs in India. Try to make the bike as lightweight as possible so one can easily carry it to office or store in a room.

That being said, who are you trying to market it to? General people? Casual users? Commuters? What price point are you shooting for?
 
Hi, thanks for your reply. I'm actually not planning on selling in India and only targeting the export market to America/Europe. I'll be targeting commuters looking for a low cost alternative to what's available on the market.
 
4374319603_0c11a21d42_o.jpg


Seen here:
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=19001

Me kicking around an idea (pun intended) a few years back... ("cheap", "practical", etc)

`Though today would think recumbent trike. ... and "Velomobile"-style shell re aerodynamics, rains and snows, plus heating. :)
 
psych0hans said:
Hi, thanks for your reply. I'm actually not planning on selling in India and only targeting the export market to America/Europe. I'll be targeting commuters looking for a low cost alternative to what's available on the market.
Click to expand...


China probably has you beaten on that.

ES is probably not the right place to ask about bare bones, since most users are hands-on and want the best, in terms of speed, reliability and quality.

If i were you, I would be asking locally or working with bike shops or focus groups, and coming out with a prototype as cheap as possible. (The bike should at least run 100 miles or so without any issues. I believe there was a research done but can't find a reference to it.. most casual users dont even exceed 100 miles or so on their bikes. Think wally-world/K-mart bikes, and the reason why these $100 bikes sell so well).

IMO, the easiest conversion is a front wheel 250 watt hub motor, running on 24 volts. This is as basic you can make. You can run these on two small SLA batteries or li-ion (recycled?) packs. The 24 volts packs are small and easy to procure as well.

Last by not least, the bike should not exceed $500-$600.
 
There's a "cautionary tale" thread on someone who tried to market a $750 bike on indiegogo; last I looked, no sign ups for the first several days.
 
Not a fat bike, please. A fat tire bike, sure. But if the tires stay under about 2.7", then you get to use normal parts that cost less and weigh less, are easier to service and easier to find replacements for.

In addition to their special frames, fat bikes use special bottom brackets, hubs, forks, rims, tires, tubes and rim strips that all cost more and weigh more than normal items. They are limited to disc brakes, which either cost a lot or suck a lot.

If you want to offer maximum quality and value at a low cost, normal 26" wheels and all-rigid format are the way to go. Include linear pull brakes, plus disc brake mounts for nincompoops who can waste their own money instead of yours.

If you want to offer conspicuous premium features, let them be useful ones, like Schwalbe Big Apple tires, 9 speed cassette gearing, 2 piece cranks, or integrated lighting.
 
Yes. It does seem likely the phrase "Bare bones electric bike" perhaps is intended to include stuff like a seat, some sort of gearing... Silly me to think of storage space. :oops:

Perhaps "bare bones" means comes with a really long extension cord or something.
 
Chalo said:
Not a fat bike, please. A fat tire bike, sure. But if the tires stay under about 2.7", then you get to use normal parts that cost less and weigh less, are easier to service and easier to find replacements for.

In addition to their special frames, fat bikes use special bottom brackets, hubs, forks, rims, tires, tubes and rim strips that all cost more and weigh more than normal items. They are limited to disc brakes, which either cost a lot or suck a lot.

If you want to offer maximum quality and value at a low cost, normal 26" wheels and all-rigid format are the way to go. Include linear pull brakes, plus disc brake mounts for nincompoops who can waste their own money instead of yours.

If you want to offer conspicuous premium features, let them be useful ones, like Schwalbe Big Apple tires, 9 speed cassette gearing, 2 piece cranks, or integrated lighting.
Click to expand...

Point duly noted, thanks a ton for your input. I've received a quote from BaFang for the motor-controller kits and there isn't a vast difference between the 250 and 350 models. Are the batteries required very different? Maybe I could offer three models at different price points with 250/350/750W motors respectively? With the higher end model having more bells and whistles and the lower end model being pretty basic?
 
LockH said:
Yes. It does seem likely the phrase "Bare bones electric bike" perhaps is intended to include stuff like a seat, some sort of gearing... Silly me to think of storage space. :oops:

Perhaps "bare bones" means comes with a really long extension cord or something.
Click to expand...

Hahaha :D I like the idea of the long extension cord!!! When I say bare bones, I mean something without smart phone connectivity or GPS and stuff. Just a simple hop on/hop off bike which will take you to your destination with the least possible fuss. A battery pack which won't burn rubber and will have JUST enough juice for your commute and no more, maybe a 20-30mile range with a 15-20mph top speed. My customer will be someone who's looking for a cheaper/more convenient alternate to travel, not someone who's looking for a high tech leisure toy.
 
Lighting? Sound signaling device ("bell", etc.)? And I'm still angling for storage capacity of some sort (file under "practicality" perhaps).

"simple hop on/hop off"... Legally of course, correct? All-weather capable? Or? (Must forgive perhaps if the term "bare bones" seems a bit suspicious. My "bare bones" includes a few bits/tools to effect a repair while in transit. Got to a meeting last week early enough to have time to install one new inner tube - and pump it up - using stuff I had in my bag.) :wink:
 
LockH said:
Lighting? Sound signaling device ("bell", etc.)? And I'm still angling for storage capacity of some sort (file under "practicality" perhaps).

"simple hop on/hop off"... Legally of course, correct? All-weather capable? Or? (Must forgive perhaps if the term "bare bones" seems a bit suspicious. My "bare bones" includes a few bits/tools to effect a repair while in transit. Got to a meeting last week early enough to have time to install one new inner tube - and pump it up - using stuff I had in my bag.) :wink:
Click to expand...

Hi Lightning, thanks for your reply. When I say "Bare Bones" I mean, it will have all the basic necessities needed to use the cycle. Not entirely sure about lights, definitely a bell and definitely some sort of storage. I'll definitely look into the possibility of a tool kit as well. What does a basic tool kit include?
 
psych0hans said:
What does a basic tool kit include?
Click to expand...

I'm currently rolling w/cloth bag containing:
1 new inner tube
1 tube repair patch kit
1 set of diff. sizes Allen keys
1 pr. small pliers w/cutters
1 tube Loctite
1 can oil
1 screw driver
1 air pump

:)
 
psych0hans said:
When I say "Bare Bones" I mean, it will have all the basic necessities needed to use the cycle. Not entirely sure about lights, definitely a bell and definitely some sort of storage.
Click to expand...
Lights *are* needed to use the cycle, unless you only ride in daytime. Many (probably most, maybe all) places legally require specific lights on any bicycle-class vehicle when riding at night. Some may even require them in daytime, though I can't think of any offhand.

A bell may not be required, but is useful if you ride among pedestrians or other cyclists you may be overtaking. If you ride in vehicular traffic it is just a waste of handlebar space, as virtually no one driving a car would pay attention to it even if they could hear it. :/
 
amberwolf said:
A bell may not be required, but is useful if you ride among pedestrians or other cyclists you may be overtaking. If you ride in vehicular traffic it is just a waste of handlebar space, as virtually no one driving a car would pay attention to it even if they could hear it. :/
Click to expand...

To deal with cars, you need a magic bell that summons lightning bolts and meteors. Could be expensive.
 
I'm very confused about which frame to go in for. Cruiser style? Or a Hybrid frame? or maybe a Fat bike frame? Fat bikes make ideal E-Bikes because of their hefty structure and thicker tires for better suspension. Any suggestions please?
 
LockH said:
Perhaps "bare bones" means comes with a really long extension cord or something.
Click to expand...

I get the joke, but the EE in me gets a thought of it running off a power supply... and with the peaks I tend to pull on my little scooter, that would have to be one hell of a good power supply. lol
 
I'm really digging this thread... https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=29709
 
psych0hans said:
I'm very confused about which frame to go in for. Cruiser style? Or a Hybrid frame? or maybe a Fat bike frame? Fat bikes make ideal E-Bikes because of their hefty structure and thicker tires for better suspension. Any suggestions please?
Click to expand...

Fat bike frames are just rigid MTB frames with a lot of nonstandard parts and extra clearance built in. What's wrong with a regular MTB frame?

Straight tube frames are intrinsically lighter and stronger than frames with curved tubes. They are also easier to manufacture.
 
I've come up with a basic feature list which I want to offer for the bike. I'm thinking of having three packages ranging from a very basic one, to a "less" basic one... Please critique.

Electric%20Bike%20package_zpstrfsengv.jpg
 
(From your packages listed) Motor capacity: "Eco" and "Comfort" and "Luxe"... (250w, 350w, 750w)

One thing we are perhaps blessed with in Canada is that LEGALLY we are "limited" to 500 Watts. BUT this is 500w CONTINUOUS, with no mention of PEAK outputs. ;)
So while our American cousins get to play with about one whole horse ("horsepower" ie 748w) at least we get pony powered, as still MUCH more powerful than any human athlete.

So. These packages? NON-switchable as firmware options? Or switchable via toggles, etc aka "on the fly"? :twisted:

BTW. As a recent convert to recumbent style, this `bent configuration of frame and vehicle is now "bare bones" for me. :wink:
 
Hi, thanks for your quick reply, I'll have to discuss that with BaFang to see how the output can be controlled for the Canadian customers. Also will look into the European regulations to see what they allow/disallow. Thanks again!
 
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