Hello my name is Ryan I am currently building a Ebike. Have not finished ordering parts, had a question about setup. Basically i am building a battery it is 20s12p using Samsung 30Q cells 18650. So the battery will be 180Amp discharge with 36AH and 72V. I plan on using either a sabvoton Or Kelly controller Either controller I end up going with will be 150A and 72v controller. For the motor I plan on using a QS205 V3 not sure if 5T or 3.5T but that doesn’t matter. My question is on QSMOTOR website it says the QS105 has 45A continuous current and 80A peak up to 100A peak. But my controller is outputting 150A so wouldn’t that burn out the motor?. Also my battery outputs 13Kw because 180A x 72V = roughly 13000w or 13Kw. But the QS205 is only 5Kw motor and 8Kw peak on QSMOTOR website but then a bunch of YouTubers say you can put like 15 or 17 or 13 Kw through this motor. So I am just so unsure if I am going to burn out the motor or mess up the motor. Can I run 13Kw and 150A through that motor?
Ryan HH's question and help thread
- Thread starter Ryan HH
- Start date
The controller limits current in the system. Most only monitor and limit the battery side current. Some monitor the motor phase current instead, and limit based on that. The phase current can be significantly more than the battery current. Which one the controller is advertised as limiting isn't always easy to tell, so you may need to ask the manufacturer or seller specifically which limit they refer to, and what exactly it is.
For the motor limit, ask the manufacturer which current limit they are referring to. The only limit that matters for the motor is phase current (because it never sees battery current), but that may not be what they used, and they dont' directly translate.
Use a controller that doesn't draw more than the battery can continuously handle, or that is programmable to be less than the battery max. Also ensure that if it does monitor and limit phase current, that it will supply enough to make the motor do what you want it to do, but not enough to damage the motor under your riding conditions and style.
The battery supplies all the current, power, voltage in the system, so it has to be good enough to handle the demands of your system. But it does not "push" this to the system, it only supplies what the system asks for. The conditions you ride under put a load on the motor, which puts a load on the controller, which puts a load on the battery, and the battery supplies power to satisfy that load, as long as it is capable of doing so.
So a battery with more capability won't hurt the controller, though a controller with more capability than the motor, *if the motor load asks for that capability*, *can* hurt the motor, if the motor gets hot enough under the specific conditions you're using it under to damage the magnets, the hall sensors, or the windings.
You need to decide what you want the whole system to do for you, under what specific riding conditions (hills, wind, speed, terrain, road conditions, total weight, etc), to figure out how much power it will take to do that. ONce you know that, you can then find a motor and controller that will do that work for you. Then, after you know all that, you can determine what battery to buy or build that will be able to *easily* support that, without pushing the battery it near it's limits.
If you build a system that takes more than the battery can easily handle, and pushes it's limits, it will perform less well than it should, or even poorly, and it will not have as long a lifespan.
So use a battery that has at least 20-25% more capacity than you need, 20-25% more current-delivery capability than you need, and don't run it down to cutoff very often, and it will perform well and last a long time.
Regarding determining your power usage, if you use the http://ebikes.ca/tools/simulator.html you can play with existing setups first to see how conditions vs system affect how well it works and for how long. Then you can input your own conditions and your own system (using the custom options based on the instructions below the graph and chart), and see what it takes to do what you want.
For the motor limit, ask the manufacturer which current limit they are referring to. The only limit that matters for the motor is phase current (because it never sees battery current), but that may not be what they used, and they dont' directly translate.
Use a controller that doesn't draw more than the battery can continuously handle, or that is programmable to be less than the battery max. Also ensure that if it does monitor and limit phase current, that it will supply enough to make the motor do what you want it to do, but not enough to damage the motor under your riding conditions and style.
The battery supplies all the current, power, voltage in the system, so it has to be good enough to handle the demands of your system. But it does not "push" this to the system, it only supplies what the system asks for. The conditions you ride under put a load on the motor, which puts a load on the controller, which puts a load on the battery, and the battery supplies power to satisfy that load, as long as it is capable of doing so.
So a battery with more capability won't hurt the controller, though a controller with more capability than the motor, *if the motor load asks for that capability*, *can* hurt the motor, if the motor gets hot enough under the specific conditions you're using it under to damage the magnets, the hall sensors, or the windings.
You need to decide what you want the whole system to do for you, under what specific riding conditions (hills, wind, speed, terrain, road conditions, total weight, etc), to figure out how much power it will take to do that. ONce you know that, you can then find a motor and controller that will do that work for you. Then, after you know all that, you can determine what battery to buy or build that will be able to *easily* support that, without pushing the battery it near it's limits.
If you build a system that takes more than the battery can easily handle, and pushes it's limits, it will perform less well than it should, or even poorly, and it will not have as long a lifespan.
So use a battery that has at least 20-25% more capacity than you need, 20-25% more current-delivery capability than you need, and don't run it down to cutoff very often, and it will perform well and last a long time.
Regarding determining your power usage, if you use the http://ebikes.ca/tools/simulator.html you can play with existing setups first to see how conditions vs system affect how well it works and for how long. Then you can input your own conditions and your own system (using the custom options based on the instructions below the graph and chart), and see what it takes to do what you want.
Ryan HH said:
Cell question and buying help
Basically I am currently building an Ebike, I am now building the battery I have spent all day researching cells and have figured out I am either going to use the Samsung 30Q or the Epoch 30P I am not sure which one to use they are both 3000mah and 15AMP discharge. Also I am doing 20s12p so I need 240cells the epoch cells are about $950 and the Samsung cells are about $1150 which one would you go with. Also I am very unsure of what website to order my cells from as the seems to be so much debate on which websites are good or not. I’m thinking of using one of these sites which one would you use?
18650batterystore.com
bulkbattery.com
liionwholesale.com
imrbatteries.com
Basically I am currently building an Ebike, I am now building the battery I have spent all day researching cells and have figured out I am either going to use the Samsung 30Q or the Epoch 30P I am not sure which one to use they are both 3000mah and 15AMP discharge. Also I am doing 20s12p so I need 240cells the epoch cells are about $950 and the Samsung cells are about $1150 which one would you go with. Also I am very unsure of what website to order my cells from as the seems to be so much debate on which websites are good or not. I’m thinking of using one of these sites which one would you use?
18650batterystore.com
bulkbattery.com
liionwholesale.com
imrbatteries.com
docw009
1 MW
I've found 18650batterystore to be a good vendor. One order was short and all it took was a call, and he sent out the missing cells. Compare his prices for kapton tape, insulators, and holders. He' pretty good on the tape. I bought some nickel from him too.
Samsung 30Q's for $4.95 vs Epoch's for $3.99? Easy answer, It's the 30Q's.
Samsung 30Q's for $4.95 vs Epoch's for $3.99? Easy answer, It's the 30Q's.
Basically I am building an ebike using an Stealth bomber frame. The battary I am building has a continuous discharge of 180amps. I plan on using a qs205 v3 hub motor with hub sinks and statorade. Along with a sabvoton 72150 150amp controller. My question is can the qs205 even handle that 150amps of power? Can I use a 150 amp sabvoton with the qs205?
Basically I am building an ebike using an Stealth bomber frame. The battary I am building has a continuous discharge of 180amps. I plan on using a qs205 v3 hub motor with hub sinks and statorade. Along with a sabvoton 72150 150amp controller. My question is can the qs205 even handle that 150amps of power? Can I use a 150 amp sabvoton with the qs205?
Ryan HH said:
What's the voltage and capacity of the battery? The motor doesn't have to handle 150A continuous. It only has to handle 150A for as long as the battery can provide it. So if it were a 100Ah battery, that's 40 minutes going from full to empty, or less if your charging routine isn't that abusive.
Can you actually pull that current for that long? Are you hauling cargo?
DogDipstick
100 kW
Ryan HH said:
Yes. You should be fine, just monitor the temp. The V3 motor will laugh at a Sab150 more or less, if you peak alot and dont sit on full power, at speed, up hills, for the entire range of your battery.
I think they say 100A is fine? Qs.
150 is ok. I run 150 phase amps ( I think) ( might be 220pA, IDK, the controller I have came in two models and I dont have the id sticker on it anymore) .. Maybe a little more.. and can heat up my motor to upwards of 100 deg.. maybe 120* on the shell... but it was noting like the V1 thin, 1000w motor I had, that thing lived a hard life around 180*. Hit 220* regularly. Killed its sensors, and when I replaced them, took it for another 10,000 miles.. then put a more powerful controller on it and blew it up in a day... but that is the 1kW rated QS ( took 3.3kW contin for 10,000 miles) ....
So I run a 4.5kW contin controller and I heat it up a little, . I get about 120A out of the battery. Continuous. Racing up (long, three or four mile, plus.. ) hills at 50mph. Motor seems to take it well. I really gotta hold full throttle the whole battery to heat it up. ( I dont like doing it, it terrorizes the neighborhood) .
My motor is bare, no hubsinks or conductin fluid. Statoraid is shamelessly, silly, expensive.
Just for an idea.. THIS is a picture(s) of a QS 205 install that did 18kW peak on a 8kW continuous controller... Top out @ around 55mph also. This bike was 134 lbs. Moto rims, Eleek frame.
THIS controller was labeled as a 350 phase amp controller. 2x as powerful as the controller on my bike now.
Attachments
Please Help DCDC Buck Converter
Hello I am currently building an Ebike and have been working on this for weeks my main wiring diagram is not in this picture but this is a simplified wiring diagram for a part that I am very confused on the DC to DC converter.
[Converter I am using-](https://a.co/d/cjdnIAw)
Now I am wondering if you have any questions, comments, thoughts, concerns, or tips. And is this wiring diagram correct.
Explanation of diagram- Basically straight out of battery we have 72vDC and 150A of power. The main load of this battery is my Ebike controller which send power to my motor. Halfway through the connection I have a ferrule on the positive and negative line which allows the buck converter to get power. If my calculations are correct then there should be 72v and 1.75A of power running through that line. I got these numbers knowing that watts on both sides of buck converter are the same so 12V x 10A = 120W output. Then 120W/72V = 1.666A input. 1.666A/.95 efficiency = 1.75A input. I put a circuit breaker 32vDC 12A on the load side of the Buck converter because it says that this converter can take a max of 10A input or output doesn’t matter just can’t take more than 10A. Since this is Buck converter not a Boost the Output side will reach 10A much faster than input for example when the input of this converter is 72v 10a the output would be roughly 12v 57A. I put the circuit breaker on the positive line. Is the placement of the circuit breaker good? Then I have a 10A load on the buck converter output side. Load will probably more like 7.5A but for simplicity in this diagram I went for 10A.
TL
R: is this wiring diagram correct. I would appreciate it though if you could read above what I typed.
[Wiring diagram-](https://imgur.com/a/rlCtszG)
Hello I am currently building an Ebike and have been working on this for weeks my main wiring diagram is not in this picture but this is a simplified wiring diagram for a part that I am very confused on the DC to DC converter.
[Converter I am using-](https://a.co/d/cjdnIAw)
Now I am wondering if you have any questions, comments, thoughts, concerns, or tips. And is this wiring diagram correct.
Explanation of diagram- Basically straight out of battery we have 72vDC and 150A of power. The main load of this battery is my Ebike controller which send power to my motor. Halfway through the connection I have a ferrule on the positive and negative line which allows the buck converter to get power. If my calculations are correct then there should be 72v and 1.75A of power running through that line. I got these numbers knowing that watts on both sides of buck converter are the same so 12V x 10A = 120W output. Then 120W/72V = 1.666A input. 1.666A/.95 efficiency = 1.75A input. I put a circuit breaker 32vDC 12A on the load side of the Buck converter because it says that this converter can take a max of 10A input or output doesn’t matter just can’t take more than 10A. Since this is Buck converter not a Boost the Output side will reach 10A much faster than input for example when the input of this converter is 72v 10a the output would be roughly 12v 57A. I put the circuit breaker on the positive line. Is the placement of the circuit breaker good? Then I have a 10A load on the buck converter output side. Load will probably more like 7.5A but for simplicity in this diagram I went for 10A.
TL
R: is this wiring diagram correct. I would appreciate it though if you could read above what I typed.[Wiring diagram-](https://imgur.com/a/rlCtszG)
Please Help DCDC Buck Converter
Hello I am currently building an Ebike and have been working on this for weeks my main wiring diagram is not in this picture but this is a simplified wiring diagram for a part that I am very confused on the DC to DC converter.
[Converter I am using-](https://a.co/d/cjdnIAw)
Now I am wondering if you have any questions, comments, thoughts, concerns, or tips. And is this wiring diagram correct.
Explanation of diagram- Basically straight out of battery we have 72vDC and 150A of power. The main load of this battery is my Ebike controller which send power to my motor. Halfway through the connection I have a ferrule on the positive and negative line which allows the buck converter to get power. If my calculations are correct then there should be 72v and 1.75A of power running through that line. I got these numbers knowing that watts on both sides of buck converter are the same so 12V x 10A = 120W output. Then 120W/72V = 1.666A input. 1.666A/.95 efficiency = 1.75A input. I put a circuit breaker 32vDC 12A on the load side of the Buck converter because it says that this converter can take a max of 10A input or output doesn’t matter just can’t take more than 10A. Since this is Buck converter not a Boost the Output side will reach 10A much faster than input for example when the input of this converter is 72v 10a the output would be roughly 12v 57A. I put the circuit breaker on the positive line. Is the placement of the circuit breaker good? Then I have a 10A load on the buck converter output side. Load will probably more like 7.5A but for simplicity in this diagram I went for 10A.
TLR: is this wiring diagram correct. I would appreciate it though if you could read above what I typed.
[Wiring diagram-](https://imgur.com/a/rlCtszG)
Hello I am currently building an Ebike and have been working on this for weeks my main wiring diagram is not in this picture but this is a simplified wiring diagram for a part that I am very confused on the DC to DC converter.
[Converter I am using-](https://a.co/d/cjdnIAw)
Now I am wondering if you have any questions, comments, thoughts, concerns, or tips. And is this wiring diagram correct.
Explanation of diagram- Basically straight out of battery we have 72vDC and 150A of power. The main load of this battery is my Ebike controller which send power to my motor. Halfway through the connection I have a ferrule on the positive and negative line which allows the buck converter to get power. If my calculations are correct then there should be 72v and 1.75A of power running through that line. I got these numbers knowing that watts on both sides of buck converter are the same so 12V x 10A = 120W output. Then 120W/72V = 1.666A input. 1.666A/.95 efficiency = 1.75A input. I put a circuit breaker 32vDC 12A on the load side of the Buck converter because it says that this converter can take a max of 10A input or output doesn’t matter just can’t take more than 10A. Since this is Buck converter not a Boost the Output side will reach 10A much faster than input for example when the input of this converter is 72v 10a the output would be roughly 12v 57A. I put the circuit breaker on the positive line. Is the placement of the circuit breaker good? Then I have a 10A load on the buck converter output side. Load will probably more like 7.5A but for simplicity in this diagram I went for 10A.
TL
R: is this wiring diagram correct. I would appreciate it though if you could read above what I typed.[Wiring diagram-](https://imgur.com/a/rlCtszG)
Nielsquake
100 µW
- Joined
- Jun 14, 2022
- Messages
- 8
I'm no pro or anything with this stuff but having used these DC-DC converters a lot I think this is fine! The diagram seems correct as I would assume the red and black wires are the input and the other black and yellow cables are the output.
RunForTheHills
1 kW
What light are you using that needs 10A at 12V? Is it an LED? I don't see anything wrong with your diagram, but I doubt you will need that much current.
This 400 lumen light from Grin pulls about 0.5A at 12V and less then 100mA at 72V. It has a wide range of input voltage, so you wouldn't need buck converter. I own this light and it is bright enough for road commuting. You might need something brighter for trails.
https://ebikes.ca/shop/electric-bicycle-parts/lights/roxim-x4-ebike-light.html
This 400 lumen light from Grin pulls about 0.5A at 12V and less then 100mA at 72V. It has a wide range of input voltage, so you wouldn't need buck converter. I own this light and it is bright enough for road commuting. You might need something brighter for trails.
https://ebikes.ca/shop/electric-bicycle-parts/lights/roxim-x4-ebike-light.html
Eastwood
100 kW
- Joined
- Jan 13, 2021
- Messages
- 1,479
I have the same buck connector although I never connected it, I’m still using a cheap one I bought off eBay.
Your wiring diagram looks just fine.
This converter has the ability to output 10amps. It doesn’t necessarily mean that’s what you’ll be pulling from it. If your light pulls 2amps that’s all the step down will output. Which is a good thing so the DC step down will not be running at its max output.
Your wiring diagram looks just fine.
This converter has the ability to output 10amps. It doesn’t necessarily mean that’s what you’ll be pulling from it. If your light pulls 2amps that’s all the step down will output. Which is a good thing so the DC step down will not be running at its max output.
Ok so I need some Help. I am building a super powerful ebike running 150amps and 72vDC. The wiring on this bike is multi thousands of dollars with battery and controller. I want to have at least some kind of safety to protect me and my bike.
I found two options -
1 - https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00SGGVPTK/ref=crt_ewc_title_dp_2?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A23ANDP8TQ5WFL
2 - https://www.amazon.com/Blue-Sea-Systems-5115-Electrical/dp/B00197PO54/ref=sr_1_1?crid=1OLF2HHXEQJWD&keywords=class+T+fuse+175a&qid=1657956171&s=sporting-goods&sprefix=class+t+fuse+175a%2Csporting%2C73&sr=1-1
I am leaning towards the circuit breaker since i also want to have a disconnect switch for my ebike. So my question is would it be better to use a fuse or circuit breaker. I saw when doing my research that there are so many different circuit breakers from GFCI to AFCI to GFI. And i dont know which one i need, but would this breaker linked above work for just protecting me from short circuits like if the positive and negative wires touched, and when i start over pushing my motor like pulling 200a would it break the circuit as well as work as a battery disconnect switch. Lastly Should i use 150a, 175a, or 200a circuit breaker or fuse?
Thankyou, Much Appreciated
I found two options -
1 - https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00SGGVPTK/ref=crt_ewc_title_dp_2?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A23ANDP8TQ5WFL
2 - https://www.amazon.com/Blue-Sea-Systems-5115-Electrical/dp/B00197PO54/ref=sr_1_1?crid=1OLF2HHXEQJWD&keywords=class+T+fuse+175a&qid=1657956171&s=sporting-goods&sprefix=class+t+fuse+175a%2Csporting%2C73&sr=1-1
I am leaning towards the circuit breaker since i also want to have a disconnect switch for my ebike. So my question is would it be better to use a fuse or circuit breaker. I saw when doing my research that there are so many different circuit breakers from GFCI to AFCI to GFI. And i dont know which one i need, but would this breaker linked above work for just protecting me from short circuits like if the positive and negative wires touched, and when i start over pushing my motor like pulling 200a would it break the circuit as well as work as a battery disconnect switch. Lastly Should i use 150a, 175a, or 200a circuit breaker or fuse?
Thankyou, Much Appreciated
Chalo
100 TW
Please don't spam the forum with duplicate posts.
Chalo
100 TW
I have tangential questions about this build. Is it your first e-bike? Are you a licensed motorcyclist? Are you a minor?
Ryan HH said:
Because you keep posting multiple threads for the same thing, all of your threads have been placed in a single thread, to help us help you more easily. Please use this thread only for your project and questions.
Creating multiple threads for the same thing wastes everyone's time, because it means multiple people trying to help in the threads end up duplicating efforts when if there was only one, they could easily see all the information and replies and not waste time answering questions already answered, or asking questions already asked to clarify details, etc.
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