The SB Cruiser: Amberwolf&Dogman's 2WD CargoTrike&DogCarrier

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amberwolf   100 GW

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Re: Amberwolf & Dogman's Cargo Trike (yet to be named)

Post by amberwolf » Mar 22 2015 4:12pm

That spring may well be what I'll use something similar to (I also have some dampers meant for powerchairs, but I dunno where they are or if they'd work for this--they were originally to be used on CrazyBike2).

When i had said I wanted to put some limiters on the steering for how far I could push the tiller, so it couldn't be pushed so far the wheel would no longer work normally, like I have on CB2, Dogman had suggested some form of bungee or spring to do that. So I guess it would do dual duty if I add soemthng like that.

Lunchtime now, so while I cool off and eat, some more trike stuff after the interlude below.

I havent' got very far on the trike directly today or yesterday, cuz I have also been clearing out the 3rd shed, as it is the best choice as a garage for the trike and it's bits while I'm working on it, rather than just leaving it all spread aroudn the yard. (makes it hard for the dogs to run around, trying to avoid all my bits and bobs). I've also been looking for stuff in there that I can use for it--found a number of them, includng some boxes of hardware and whatnot. Of course, getting rid of 7bunches of stuff I either will never use, or was never meant to be saved during the housefire cleanup, but was boxed up and dumped in there by various helpers, or has been destroyed in the intervening time (mostly books and papers that got damp or bug eaten). Probably cleared out *at least* as much volume as teh trike itself takes up, if it were a solid box with it's maximum length, height, and width. And I still have at least enough to fill up the blue recycle bin one more time.
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Stuff that might be things others would want I've got boxed up for the neighbor, who sometimes goes to swapmeets and whatnot.
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There's still quite a bit of stuff in there that I need to go thru. Some of it is not to be saved, some is, maybe 1:3 ratio? Won't know till I get to sort it more. But now there's room to park the trike in there. :)
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Tiny wasnt' particularly happy with me making all the noise, so she went inside stayed first in the back room, then moved and stayed by the front door so I couldn't sneak out. ;)
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Yogi spent a fair bit of time just around the corner from her in the hall in one of his favorite spots.
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The rest of the time, when he wasn't barking at the people from across the street when they were in my alley dumping their trash in my can (instead of the one behind their own house, which AFAICT they never use), he spent snoozing or lazing around near me, wherever I was in the yard.
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After spending a while on the cleanup, till it got too hot in the direct sun, I moved to the shade of the back porch area, and started working on the trike again, cutting and shaping the tubing for the "mixte" bracing just behind the headtube/cranks, which will give me an enclosable area for the controller and wiring, as well as strengthen the frame torsionally a little (so Dogman and I hope).
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First I shaped one bar, then I mirror-cut the second, clamped them in place, and tacked them on.
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Because the bar I started with is actually warped in a slight curve, I chose to use that curve as part of the brace, and clamped the bottom first, tacked it, clamped the center, tacked it, and then clamped the top, which at that point had almost 1/4" of gap between the toptube and the mixte tubes, eliminated during the clamping. I could have straighened the tubes and notched out for the center tube, but decided to leave it and weld it like that. The BB shell also is welded to the front side of the tubes.

I tried to form the bottom of the tubes like I did on Bill's bike rack, but I didnt weld it right, and kept burning thru it so it's nearly a solid mass of metal at the tips now. :oops: Very ugly.
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I cleaned up a number of welds near the top with the angle grinder, but most I left as they were, cuz I realy don't need ti to be pretty--I just don't wanna catch my fingers or clothes on weld bits up at the top or middle, and tear stuff.

I also cut the toptube even with the mixte tubes, so that I can use it for an ignition key, like i did the steerer tube on CB2 at one time. I was also going to angle in the ends of the tubes like I did at the bottom, but after the way they turned out down there I decided to just plug them with the little plastic caps that came on the tubing originally.
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Also note that when i switched to the black fork (yesterday?) I had to add spacer washers on the axle, cuz the fork legs rub on the wide x5304 casing. :( I didnt have but one washer that would fit over the axle (14mm?) and was too tired to deal with drilling out the washers I did have, so I put a couple broken grinding disc centers on there for now. (I wouldn't wanna ride it like that under hard acceleration/braking, but it'll let me pedal or roll it around at least).
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This is what the basic fender shape will look like, though I will have to use two coroplast sheets on each fender, and cut and bend to shape. Probably will fold over the excess and ziptie them to the frame, for ease of removal during repairs if necessary. Once the paint scheme is decided, they'll get painted to match teh rest of the trike.
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While digging in the shed, I found a couple of cables that could become phase wire upgrades later on, or battery wires right now. One (black, 3 large wires and one small ground, total bundle bigger than my thumb) was part of the old 220V 2phase mains input into the breaker box before the fire, and the other (green, 3 wires, total bundle bigger than my pinky) was part of a cut-up extension cord someone gave me a long time back, I think. (probably back when I was still using DayGlo Avenger).
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I also found my old music-making "portable" rig box, which originally was for a late-1970s or early '80s Sharp "portable" video camera the size of that thing Edison Carter carried around for Network23. :lol: I never ahd the camera, just the case.
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But because of it's size, it fits perfectly in the rear cargo area, between the fenders, though it does have to be raised up about two inches to allow the top to clear the fender when it hinges open, and to let me reach the "front" latch on it.
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But it would be a nifty cargo pod that doesn't take as much space or probably make as much aero drag as the dog kennel does, when i don't need to carry teh dogs around. It has more than the total volume of both the cargo pods on CrazyBike2, all in one space, so it can definitely carry anything CB2 could--sittng on top of it is one of the boxes like I used on CB2 (and DGA). And it could be made waterproof (or highly resistant, anyway), unlike the kennel.
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That will take some doing, though, because it's very old (at least 30 years, probably more) and the plastic has cracks in it from being buried under heavy stuff in the shed for the last year and a half or so. I can fix those with riveted-in reinforcements and glue that melts ABS together, but it's gonna take some time and work to do. It's liekly that I will continue to use the kennel as the cargo area for a while first.
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More later, of course. :)

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Re: Amberwolf & Dogman's Cargo Trike (yet to be named)

Post by dogman dan » Mar 23 2015 7:11am

Like that cargo pod! But it might start cracking more rolling around. Love how the frame braces also support the crank and bb a bit more. all good to add strength now, since so much was depending on that one weld of the 2" square tube.

There is a fairly cheap, but much thicker and stronger tote box in the stores if that cargo box doesn't work out after all. I like the size, able to carry small dog food bags inside, and a large one across the top.

Re the fork clearance, I used to just pinch the fork tube flatter to fix that problem, if it could not be spread.

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Re: Amberwolf & Dogman's Cargo Trike (yet to be named)

Post by amberwolf » Mar 23 2015 10:25am

I found some more broken controllers to use for parts to fix the others, if needed. Haven't got back to figuring out why the 18FET stopped working yet--that's the first one I'd like to use.

I have a 12FET somewhere that was gonna be backup on CB2, but it's never been tested, so I dunno if that works either (and I'll probably have tof igure out which wire does what; I don't remember if it's marked or not). I do recall it doenst' use JSTs or Andersons, so I'l lhave to splice wires to test it.

I also have the 6FET on DGA, but I don't imagine it will do much with the potential of the x5304. :lol:

I think the next metalwork on the trike will be to make the batterybox shleving and framing under teh seat, so I'll have somewhere to strap the pack down durng testing.

I'll leave the left fender frame just tacked up till I'm sure I dont' need to change it, and not build the right one till then either.

While doing the metalwork, I've also gotta run the brake cables to teh rear, and install the rim brakes on teh front--I'll need those if I get the motor working. ;)

Lighting: I have some lighting off DGA (headlight, turn signals) but no taillight, and no downlighting, that I can take off something else. I have enough on the bakc of CB2 I could probably spare some, but I'd rather not change anything on it. So i need to build some. I do have the Honda incandescent taillight, I guess, but it's nto very bright vs the LED stuff.

I have some white LEDs I can use for downlighting that are in a silicone band, meant to b e water resistant, that run off 12V IIRC. Should basically be teh same look as what's on CB2; just have to decide exactly where they'll go. Probably on teh bottom of the downtube.

I have the remains of the LED taillgiht i started out with on CB2, but at least some of the LEDs are burned out. I may have spares, in that I found DGA's old taillight/turnsignal unit from when it still had baskets and friction drive. Dunno where the unused LEDs from that project went, if I even still have them, but they'd be handy about now. I did find the perfboard they were to be installed on, but theyr'e not with that. :/

I have one more LED taillight, but it's on the trailer, along with two LED turn signals, and again I'd rather not mess with that.

Power for the lighting will probalby come from a 4s LiPo pack, or 4s EIG NMC (if I have that many spares--I might if I include that weak cell I swapped out of the main CB2 pack). 16.4V is high for automotive incandescent, but it'll work. I can use a couple big fat heatsinked diodes in series with it if I have to, but if I don't tehy'll certainly be nice and bright. :lol:

Turn signal blinker...I found one in the stuff in that shed cleanout, but I dunno if it works--it looks like the one I had problems with from the original Honda scooter stuff, but I'm not sure. Gotta test it. I guess I can build one if I have to, a 555 timer setup and some FETs to switch the current ought to work ok, and I'm sure I have the stuff to do it--I ran across a box of electronics parts in tha shed, too.

I'm gonna either run the wiring thru the frame tubes, or use some of that stainless steel hose braid cover I had planned to eventually use on CB2's harness (which may never happen).

The headlight is presently in the yellow "fairing" that's on DGA's handlebars. Since it's looking ilke I will decommission DGA anyway, I may move the whole fairing over to the trike, though I'm not sure exactly where it will mount.

I may instead just make a metal mount for the light, welded to the stem via brackets. Turn signals would go on the sides of that, like on CB2.

Primary turn signals and taillight on the rear will go on a bracket at "seated head height" whcih will be on the back of a "top rack" that can be taken off at need, and will go over the kennel.

Alternately, I might do something similar to what's on CB2, with teh bracket on teh back of the seat, except this bracket would come up from the base of teh seat frame or the front of the trike section, to just behind my head (above the kennel). This would be more practical, but could be blcoked by any cargo I have to tie down to the top of the kennel.

So what I could do is have the bracke twith teh lights itself be removable, and use the same 5-pin DIN plug I use on my trailer stuff to hook it to the trike, so I can have an extension cable (old AT-keyboard style) to move it to the back of teh top cargo rack if I use it.

I guess I fell asleep hard last night when i was typing up the above and didn't post it, so here it is a few hours "late". :oops: The good news is at least I got some sleep. :/

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Re: Amberwolf & Dogman's Cargo Trike (yet to be named)

Post by amberwolf » Mar 23 2015 10:47am

dogman dan wrote:Like that cargo pod! But it might start cracking more rolling around.
Oh, it won't be rolling around on its own wheels, if that's what you mean--those are coming off, and a new plate going over the inside and outside of that end for each half, probably pop-riveted on. Bolted if I have to. Similarly will reinforce with riveted-on plates at other cracked locations, and then glue the ABS itself.

If I have enough sheet aluminum, I might just add plates on the inside of all sides of it, with expanding foam sprayed underneath them for a little extra support. Then even if new cracks appear, they shouldn't allow it to come apart.

Right now it's still strong enough that I can sit on it while it's on the trike--I did that without thinking about it yesterday, while pondering things. :)

It's still old, and it'll still crack more as it gets used, but at present it's the largest, most durable, most secure container I have, other than the kennel itself. I have other things like an aluminum suitcase, medium sized, and a couple of small plastic cases by whoever does those gorilla ads, but none of them are big enough to do much with, especially after adding an inch or more of styrofoam insulation inside them (for carrying cold or frozen stuff from the grocery stores, or other things that would suffer from the heat in summer).
Love how the frame braces also support the crank and bb a bit more. all good to add strength now, since so much was depending on that one weld of the 2" square tube.
Yeah, after you'd suggested them that way I figured it'd be better to do it. On my own I wouldn't have thought of doing that.

There is a fairly cheap, but much thicker and stronger tote box in the stores if that cargo box doesn't work out after all. I like the size, able to carry small dog food bags inside, and a large one across the top.
If I just need to carry big/bulk stuff like those bags I'd just tie them down to the bed/rack. So far that works ok with the trailers I've used.

Totes are ok for carrying smaller items in, but they aren't secure and I've never seen one yet, even the pretty sturdy ones, that could be secured in any simple way (would require buildng a frame for the lid and top of container, bolting the frames to their parts, and adding locks to those). I'll have to take a look to see what's currently available around here. Do you remember the name or brand of the ones you've seen?

A lockable (or at least secure-looking) box is necessary for being able to shop at multiple places on a trip, so stuff can stay cool and secure inside it from place to place on an all-day trip around to various stores for things, so I don't have to shop at one place, take it all home, go all the way back to the same shopping center or one real near it for more stuff to take home, etc. Cuz that greatly increases time to do stuff, partly cuz I may have to recharge in there somewhere, too. I've had to do things that way before, and it's not much fun.

Cuz typically with CrazyBike2 I can do that, using the kennel trailer with coolers in it if necessary--shop at one place in an area, lock up the stuff in the pods or trailer, go to the next one, shop, lockup the stuff, etc. Or go to one place farthest away (like WinCo) then hit up the closer places on teh way back.

Re the fork clearance, I used to just pinch the fork tube flatter to fix that problem, if it could not be spread.
That's how I've done it before, too, and I tried that, but I can't squish it. Either the suspension bits inside are in the way (unlikely as it's nto rubbing) or I'm just not strong enough to do it (more likley) using any of the methods I could think of with tools at hand. I managed to dent it a little with the sledgehammer but not in teh right spot. :/

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Re: Amberwolf & Dogman's Cargo Trike (yet to be named)

Post by amberwolf » Mar 24 2015 12:17am

Not a lot done today. Got sidetracked a bunch of times, and ended up messing aroudn with the rear brakes for HOURS to no avail--they work *a little* if I grab the lever and squeeze with both hands as hard as I can, but otherwise even if I preset them so the pads actually touch the rims, and the cable is tensioned enough to actually begin braking with pretty much any normal brakes, this just doesn't do more than rub the rim a little. :(

I thought maybe it was my brake handle, so I tried several types, and none worked right (a couple were totally wrong kind and hit the bars before giving any pull).

I even used a wire wheel on the B&D rotary tool and removed all the paint from one of the rims, and it is alloy under there, and should grab ok with the pads, but it really just doesn't.

Just to test it I used a zip tie on each brake at the wheels, and tightened the brakes until they squeezed so hard I could see the pad rubber deform a little bit (broke a couple zipties trying to get it that tight). Even with that, it still didn't do enough braking to stop me from pedalling forward, even though it was pretty hard to do, both wheels (powered and unpowered) rolled. (with my right leg; I can't push hard enough with the left to do that cuz it hurts too much).

Well, anyway, I'll probably end up welding on regular brake bosses (harvested from other frames or forks) and use Vbrakes, like I am on the front (whcih work fine). They ought to work.

So here's some pics of the work I wasted today on. (not all wasted, but way too much of it).

I decided to route the cables thru the tubing wherever it isn't going to be covered up, so I drilled an elliptical hole in the top of the bend of the tiller tube, so the cables for everything on the bars can be hidden till they get down to the frame. They enter thru the open end of the tube, where the bars and stem clamp on the user-end of it. I pulled down on the tube pretty hard and it doesn't bend permanently, nor temporarily any more than it did before drilling it, so no reinforcement is necessary.
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Then I took some cable stops off a junk frame,
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and welded them onto the bottom of the "top tube" (red square tubing), so they'll be hidden inside whatever covering I use on there, if any. The small front one I couldn't clamp on directly, cuz there was no space for the clamp to spin one way or fit at all the other, so I clamped the tube at either side of it and used teh C of the clamp to pinch it in place while I tacked it on, then took the clamp off and welded it fully.
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I used the triple cable stop on teh rear cuz the theory is to split the single brake cable from teh lever so it drives both rear brakes the same time.
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Rather than using the pinch-bolt method I used on the front cable, I found an A-clamp meant for the older style brakes to split the cable from the top to each arm, and used that to connect the three cables together.
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Originally I was going to use the long end of the cables at the A-clamp, whcih is what all that stuff is hanging out on it, but I found it super-hard to pull the cable there enough to set up the rear brakes' tension, so I did it the other way instead, with the excess cable out the brakes' pinch bolt instead, like a normal person.
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I should have listened to my gut feeling right then, which told me that if it was *that hard* to pull against by hand for just *one* cable at a time, it probably wasn't going to work like I needed it to, and be too hard to pull for two of them at once. (whcih is why it takes me two hands to pull the lever now).
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At some point in there (cant' rememeber when) I flipped the rightside brake upside down to the bottom of the frame solely so taht it odesn't stick out past the right axle nut (so it has more clearance for doorways/etc). It didnt' make any difference to the braking problem, though.
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The left brake is left on top of frame, cuz it's already got the wide part inside the bed not sticking out hte side.
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I was pretty tired and frustrated at that point, so I decided to take the trike inside the front room and park it till I can work on the motor and controller issue, mayb ewhen I get done posting this (if I don't doze off again...then maybe hwen I wake up if I do doze).
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So here's some pics of it in the house, and next to CB2--it's longer by more than a foot, and that doesn't include the trailer hitch that's still yet to be added to the trike. :shock:
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But everything forward of the seat back is approximately the same relative positions as CB2's equivalents, for the important bits. The pedals appear a lot lower but because the seat is not tilted like CB2's, it's pretty much the same, relatively. This should make it feel about the same, though it's easier to put my feet on the ground flat with the trike vs CB2. Rear tire is about half of the wheel diameter farther back on the trike than CB2.

While I was taking pics I grabbed an MXUS/Amped DD hub (minus magnet ring) and stuck it on the frame under the seat in about the position it would need to be a Rassy-type chaindrive (motor runs backwards, drives downward on top of chain with the freewheel, so the pedals can be used without driving hte motor but the motor can still drive the chain). But the hub is at least a couple inches too large a diameter to fit in this space. If it werent' for the main large square tube at the bottom of the frame that runs al the way back to the trike axle mount, then I *could* fit it in there. But I don't wanna remove that, cuz the frame is almost certainly a lot stronger with it there.
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If I change the toptube (red square tube) so it goes up from the base of the seat (where the chrome tube is cut off) up to the headtube, then the DD could go just below that point, and should be out of the way of my legs and stuff when I'm riding. But I probably won't do that cuz it's defiitely easier to get on and off with teh tube lower like it is now.
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The Fusin "1000W" geared hub would fit in the underseat frame area, barely, but being geared with an internal clutch to freewheel the case when rolling along, it wont[ work directly as a Rassy style drive cuz it cant' go backwards like that.
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It *can* be used that way if I flip it around and drive it from the disc brake input instead; that's just more complicated cuz I gotta make an adapter. Or if I put it on the right side of the chain, but backwards, I can use the cassette to drive the chain. Problem with that is it takes up a significant part of the "battery / toolbox" area. So its more likley to be used driving the disc side and make an adapter to thread a singlespeed freewheel on there. (out of an old rear bike hub).

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Re: Amberwolf & Dogman's Cargo Trike (yet to be named)

Post by Chalo » Mar 24 2015 1:06am

Don't use single pivot caliper brakes. At least use V-brake or U-brake plates.
This is to express my gratitude to Justin of Grin Technologies for his extraordinary measures to save this forum for the benefit of all.

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Re: Amberwolf & Dogman's Cargo Trike (yet to be named)

Post by amberwolf » Mar 24 2015 1:36am

That's almost the plan at this point, cuz the ones on there simply don't do anything significant for braking. (my guess is the pads themselves, but it doens't really matter).

I was going to do that to start with, but it *should* have been easy to use these, for just a little extra braking.

The actual plan is to cut the bosses off other forks/frames and weld them to this one, like i did for CrazyBike2's rear frame, and like I did for Delta Tripper's front brakes.

I don't think I have two of teh complete Vbrake "horseshoe" with bosses, just the one off DT's 20" fork (which itself came off some other fork before, a 16" I think). If i did i'd just use them on there for ease of doing it, but since I don't I'll have to make something instead. Also gotta find a 2 pair of arms and noodles/etc.; I probably have them in the stuff I've been digging out of the sheds (just been tossing the bike parts into some boxes for later sorting/etc).

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Re: Amberwolf & Dogman's Cargo Trike (yet to be named)

Post by amberwolf » Mar 24 2015 8:42pm

Today was spent troubleshooting and fixing a controller. I actually tried to fix three, but only one was successful...for a while.

The last controller that I tried while Dogman was here, a week ago (doesnt' seem that long) was a sensorless Crystalyte 72V 40A controller that had been sent to me by Bikefanatic, IIRC, with a note on it that the motor it was controlling shuddered and then there was a pop.

Last week, I found that offground it seemed to work ok but it didnt' sound quite smooth; I'd thought at first it might be because of the X5304's design. Then tried to ride around the yard with it, and it would not really work right and could be heard to be missing a phase.

Troubleshooting it today I found the center phase was not getting any gate drive on half of the bridge (lower half I think)--maybe half a volt of garbage signal that sort of looked gate-drive-ish, and whose peaks of garbage coincided with the phase feedback to the MCU with that phase's signal.

I used CrazyBike2's cargo pod to hold the scope cuz whenever I moved it to the floor, Yogi kept investigating it and knocking it over or catching his feet in the leads...
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I traced it down to the gate drive transistor itself--on one side it had a clean input signal, and garbage on the output. The resistors connected to it measured the same as resistors on the other two phases' drive circuits, so that meant probably the transistor was toast for wahtever reason.

I knew I had just seen an old 18FET board that's just for parts (much already stripped) when cleaning out that shed--but I apparently didnt' put it with all the other controller stuff I found at the same time, in a box in teh house. I also couldn't find it in the few boxes of stuff left in teh shed, so I have no idea what I did with it. I found a 6FET (I think, have to look at the pics once I can get the card reader working again to upload them) that had all it's wires desoldered, nto sure if I did that or it was sent to me for parts that way, but anyway it had similar gate drive circuitry and parts, so I just swapped the first transistor off the gate on it onto the Crystalyte.
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That was not easy, between not really being able to see what I was doing and unsteady hands, but I managed it wihtout quite destroying anything, and only burning two fingers. Pardon the messy dusty surface of my "workbench" of the moment:
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Now I had a normal gate drive signal, and smoother sound to off-ground operation.

I could spin the motor up to full throttle, and apply the Vbrakes, and it put a lot of drag on teh motor, eventually slowing it to a stop, but it didn't have any abnormal sounds or reactions.

So I put it all back together, and velcro-strip-tied it to the bike, neatening the wiring only enough to ensure it didnt' get tangled or caught in anything. Then out for a test ride.
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Thsi was a little disappointing. It barely moved at all at first, and took some time to get up to maybe 8-10MPH (no speedo, so dunno for sure, just a wattmeter). It was drawing only a couple amps, and peaking at only around 200W. :? Wattmeter images attached to end of post.

Yogi and Tiny were disappointed that I kept working on the trike after coming back in, instead of giving them dinner (cuz that's what usually ahppens when I come home from work...but since this was only late afternoonish, they had HOURS to wait till dinnertime. ;))
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This was using the freshly-charged 14s RC LiPo ammocan, at about 56V with sag. The cutoff for the controller is 55V, so I thought perhaps the controller was limiting current to prevent battery abuse or something, at that low a voltage. (never used one like this, so don't know what features it has).

Given that as a possibility, and that it's a 72V 40A controller, I decided to try adding some more RC LiPo in series with it. A 72V "nominal" pack (assuming 20s) should be well over 80V fully charged, and I would expect a "72V" controller to be able to handle that, so I took 2 of the partly-discharged 6s Turnigy packs that were "spares" for the ammocan pack, and seriesed them up with it, for 80.6V.

WIth the 55V LVC I probably should have gone with 18s instead of 20s, but I was too lazy to open up the ammocan and take the 2s out of the series my later dismay.

(if a 48V controller typically handles ~60V easy, then a 72V should handle ~90V...but I have on rare occasions been known to be wrong. ;) ).

Unfortunately I forgot to take the Turnigy Wattmeter out of the circuit before hooking it up, and fried that because it doesnt' handle more than 60V normally. :( It might still work using hte aux power input to run it from a separate low voltage battery, but that will have to wait for another day to fix it.
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I took that out, connecting the controller directly to the battery via keyswitch, and it worked once, off ground, and then no more. Power light still on, but I could smell that hot-electronics smell from it, and knew it didnt' like something that had just happened.

Opened it up, and could see no visible damage anywhere, though the dropping resistors on the LV supply were still warm, which means they were pretty damned hot when operating.
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Verified this by hooking it back up to power, and within a couple of minutes as I measured voltages around the LV supply area one of the resistors (in the middle) desoldered itself. :shock:

Yeah, not hot at all. :roll:

The LM317's max voltage is about 4V on the righthand side pin, I think 1V on the left pin, and 3V on the middle, but I could be misremembering, it's been an hour already since I tested it, I think.

I'll have to take the extra 6s off and test it with the 14s pack, see what it gets me for voltages, and probably pull the LM317 off that other parts controller, and see if I killed anything else on here. Oh, and resolder in the middle dropping resistor. :/

(pics will be added later, once I get the card reader working or find the USB cable for direct camera hookup).
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Re: Amberwolf & Dogman's Cargo Trike (yet to be named)

Post by dogman dan » Mar 25 2015 6:57am

This controller is going to arrive at your house sometime after April 3. ... EBIDX%3AIT

Cheap junk, but should last a while at least. Theoretically 40 amps, but who knows what it will really pull. The wattage of 800w could be right, but I doubt it.

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Re: Amberwolf & Dogman's Cargo Trike (yet to be named)

Post by amberwolf » Mar 25 2015 9:11am

Well, thank you. :oops: It will probably cross in the mail with your magnets and wrench (whcih I hope to get out today or tomorrow).

I still need tof ix the ones I have (that are fixable), just to have around as spares...but at least it isn't such a big deal if a working one (hopefully ;)) is on it's way.

I'm still hoping to get something working on this for a better test trip today--probably the old Lyen 6FET off DayGlo Avenger, since that one still worked last I knew, even if it's way underpowered for this motor. Or the mystery 12FET (I think) that I have to determine the whole wiring for.

Pics thru the card reader are not happening, I get BSODs just having it plugged in. :( Still looking for the camera direct cable. Thought I put it with the charger and other thngs for it, but apparently not.

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Re: Amberwolf & Dogman's Cargo Trike (yet to be named)

Post by amberwolf » Mar 25 2015 6:01pm

Found the USB cable. Added the pics to the post from yesterday, and the ones from today are in this one.

Did some troubleshooting, and at one point had to move the scope out of CB2's pod, and had to keep watch on it cuz Yogi really likes it for some reason I can't figure out. Got this pic of him scoping it out ;) after the test ride.
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Tried just swapping out the 317 and that didnt' fix the Crystalyte 72/40, so set it aside for now.

The other Crystalyte, probably a 48/40, sort of works, but there is no valid combo for it; something must be wrong internally. With everything matching, it is closest--it does roll forward, unloaded, around 2A current draw, but it sounds grindy, and loaded it just sits there grumbling and stuttering at 10-20A draw (flickers fast).

A generic 6FET only intermittently responded to throttle, and then smoked suddenly while just sitting there, as I was off getting out the multimeter to check continuities. I didn't open it up to see what the problem is.

Another didnt' respond to anything; but does have 5V out, etc.

I coudlnt' get any response out of the 18FET either.

Another 18FET I had the power wires cut off of right at the case, but I dont' remember why. I didn't try it cuz there must be good reason for that drastic an action.

Down to the unknown 12FET (well, it *looks* like a 12FET; it's about the right size, but is a different case style from the usual...I'll open it up at some point just to see...*after* the controller from Dogman arrives and I've made sure it will work. :lol:). This one I got lucky--it worked with teh fourth combo I tried, and the throttle connector was almost standard Crystalyte (like even some C stuff it has the ground and signal reversed). Brakes were two pin, easy to figure out. Phase and halls and power are all that's left on it, and those were easy, though connectors are not standard or anything I have a mate for, so had to be removed (hall is still there for now cuz it made combo checking easy). First combo actually worked, but in reverse. :lol:
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Test ride was fine--I dont' know for sure what speed I got up to, but it felt less than 20MPH, maybe 17-18? I definitely ahve to slow down some for turns, but nothing like with Delta I think when I learn it's behavior, and have more of the stuff on it (bigger heavier battery, toolbox, rest of fender frame metal, etc) down low, it'll ride better, and I'll be able to ride thru a turn faster. Most likely with a dog or cargo in the back it'll be more stable, with teh weight over and past the back wheels like that.

I rode around the local block a couple of times, testing brakes from highest speed I could get to, and they work ok, but they won't stop it in less than two or three times it's own length, unless I set them so tight that they rub hard enough to make it very hard to pedal at all, and even slow down the motor (and increase it's power usage immensely).

I think I had a similar problem on DGA (where the locking lever came from) so it's probably teh wrong kind for the VBrakes. I'll try them on the WuXing ebrake lever and see if it's any different.

mmm...had a nap in there while typing.

Anyway, can't remember much of anythng else, other than it looks liek the controller can do around 1200W peak, it is a slowstartup type. I suspect I could get more power out of it but the RC LiPo pack (14s 2p) is puffy and saggy, down to 45V min at the 25A peak (resting voltage a little more than 54V). Only used just under 0.8Ah, ~37Wh out of the pack that was full when I started.
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Re: Amberwolf & Dogman's Cargo Trike (yet to be named)

Post by amberwolf » Mar 26 2015 11:54am

I just saw this post over in the Crank Length thread ... 8#p1025708
with these pictures (edited here for relevance) that show a similar trike rear end to mine, except that the "driveshaft" has been moved forward in front of the trike section, and this gives room for the chain to have a rear derailer at the left rear wheel, *and* a derailer on the input to the driveshaft from the cranks, *and* a derailer on the cranks themselves, giving quite a range of gearing available. (albeit at the cost of learning to manipulate 3-shifter complexity!).
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I don't think I would want to modify this trike to have that sort of gearing, as I can't pedal enough to use it anyway, but wanted to note this here in case I change my mind later on, or something happens to allow me to start pedalling again (or force me to). Since the main reason I don't pedal now is cuz my joints (knees/right ankle particularly) hurt at a speed high enough to keep a bike upright, which is irrelevant to a trike, then I *could* actually pedal this thing and perhaps even improve my joints (or at least my tolerance for the pain, I don't know which) in the process.

I'd still have to use the motor, most likely, and I will still want a motor (or two) with the torque to really get it going quick with me *and* Yogi or Tiny (or both) on there, for traffic situations and work commutes, but when I am not in traffic, and don't have a time constraint, like on bike trails and such, it might be fun to start just pedalling it around...and use the motor to get me back home when I can't take it anymore. ;)

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Re: Amberwolf & Dogman's Cargo Trike (yet to be named)

Post by DAND214 » Mar 26 2015 4:43pm

That's great great build, glad you have the help from your friends and Dogman too. Wish I had those skills.
AW would you let Yogi teach my to use the scope?
Looks a lot the scope I have but don't know how to use it. :mrgreen:


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Re: Amberwolf & Dogman's Cargo Trike (yet to be named)

Post by amberwolf » Mar 26 2015 7:05pm

I think I may have a name for the trike...maybe: The SB Cruiser.

Kinda like PT Cruiser, but for St. Bernards. :lol:

I've been doing various bits of work on it today. Changed out the tires and tubes on the rear (did the front yesterday I think).

Cut and welded in some of the tabs to screw the deck boards to, and touched up other welds, finished the bottom of the main deck welds (forgot to do this last week).

Cut the deck boards, and installed two of them. Gotta finish the mounting tabs before I can put the rest in. Couldn't find teh screws I meant to use for this, and had to cut longer ones down.

Something else, but I forget what it was.

Side note: Last Saturday when I was out with Bill for lunch, I was going to buy all new tires and tubes for it, given that all the 20" tires I have besides the one on the rear of CB2 are either old/cracked, thin, damaged, worn, or some combination thereof, and I will need this to be reliable if it's hauling me and a dog (or two).

But the place we went to (Gordy's up on Thunderbird and 43rd ave, I think it is), dind't have anything I would trust under the loads I'll be putting on them, especially at lower pressures. Mostly either the sidewalls were so thin I'd be afraid of a pinch or a tear, or they have no rating other than a high of 100psi+ (or none at all). None of them felt like they had much in the way of internal structure, either, as if the fabric/threads/cords inside (if any) were very thin and/or widely spaced.

They did have another of the CST "city" tires like I got for CB2's front 26" wheel, and that has worked out well for it. It's tread is like the Kenda Kross, which I liked, but the KK had weak sidewalls that shed rubber and tore apart, when I used them on DayGlo Avenger either on the motor wheel or the rear cargo wheel. That was with at least two different versions of them, and also with other Kenda tires before that on other pedal bikes, so eventually I stopped using any Kenda tires I could avoid. But the CST tires I've used have generally been pretty good to very good.

Anyway, I did get new thick tubes for all 3 wheels, which although they are branded something else on the boxes, are CST tubes inside the boxes. I was going to get some new tandem length cables (no housings, just cables) for brakes too, but they only had shifter cables, so I passed on everything else.

Total that was aorund $60 for the tubes and tire, and a new steerer star washer/nut to replace teh one I screwed up. I think so far I ahve put about $100 into this trike, including cutting discs and welding wire and electricity, and those tubes and tire. And I think $20 for the BMX bike those wheels came from, which had been planned for teh wide trailer. Not sure how much Dogman put into it, but at least $20-$30 or so in tool stuff and the cable sets he bought me.

Oh, I forgot that I'd paid about $30 for the trike rear end on DT a few years back, so I'll add that in, and say that so far this trike has about $170 of actual money into it. Could be more, but not a lot.

Pics of stuff shortly, I hope.

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Re: Amberwolf & Dogman's Cargo Trike (yet to be named)

Post by amberwolf » Mar 26 2015 7:07pm

DAND214 wrote:That's great great build, glad you have the help from your friends and Dogman too. Wish I had those skills.
AW would you let Yogi teach my to use the scope?
Looks a lot the scope I have but don't know how to use it. :mrgreen:
Yogi gives great lessons in Doofus, but that's about his only class. ;)

Myself, I just twist the knobs till something recognizable shows up on the screen, then fiddle some more till it's stable. :lol:

There is a *little* more method than that to my madness, but not by much. If yours doens't have a good manual, the best way to learn to use a scope is to go by some of the old Tektronix manuals for their scopes. The knobs on yours may be in different places, but the labelling will be close enough to figure it out. I lost all of my hardcopy manuals along with the scopes themselves, but I bet they are still online somewhere. I think mine was a 531a or similar.

As for the skills, mine mostly come from just doing stuff until I get it right...or until it doesn't fall apart, etc. When I really don't know how to do somethng, and I have to do it, I'll look it up online and see if I can figure it out from that, using the stuff I have around to do it with.

Some things are beyond me, though. Programming, for one. And I don't have the patience to really finish things nicely, though I expect if I didn't have to work I would eventually be able to make stuff look really good...

but I'd have to keep going back to stuff cuz I've found that working retail for so long has permanently changed how I think/feel/do things. I can't do one thing for very long, without doing a bunch of other things at the same time (going back and forth between them).

I used to be able to do anything to the exclusion of everything else, forgetting to eat, move, sleep, etc. Now...I'm so used to having my attention pulled away from whatever I'm doing every few seconds to minutes, all day long, that I have a lot of trouble concentrating on one thing for very long.

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Re: Amberwolf & Dogman's Cargo Trike (yet to be named)

Post by dogman dan » Mar 27 2015 5:44am

SB cruiser, I like it.

Glad to hear you got something going, that cheapo new controller can be a spare then. I just thought it was time you had somebody send you something not broken. :roll: Wish I had your skills to fix a controller. I can't even see shit that small, even if I had the knowledge.

It didn't cost much, and I wanted to contribute more to the project monetarily, than a few cables and a few lunches. I knew you'd have to sink some cash into it, like tubes and or tires.

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Re: Amberwolf & Dogman's Cargo Trike (yet to be named)

Post by amberwolf » Mar 27 2015 8:49am

It's appreciated. :)

I will try the new controller on it first, cuz hopefully it supports regen--this one doesn't. (might have pads for enabling it inside, but I'm resisting all temptation to open it up till the other one is here and known to be working :lol: )

I forgot to get the pics of stuff up yesterday, so first here's the completed deck, with test subjects:
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Gives a sense of scale to the project to have a St Bernard sitting on it. ;) (even if they're not as big as they come)

First I got the boards roughly measured and cut, and a couple of them notched for the wheel axle area and fender frame, then laid on top to test fit. The gap between each is deliberate, around 1/4", partly to prevent boominess from vibrations (why I didnt' use a plywood sheet) so the dogs don't ahe to listen to it, partly for the look, and partly cuz if I have to tie things down other than cargo straps across teh whole load I can run paracord between the boards. Theoretically water drainage too, but that's rare enough worry it doesnt' matter.

Theyr'e just laid on top for these pics.
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Next was to cut the tabs the screws will go thru (from underneath), out of the scrap bits that were on some of this square tubing, and weld them on as close to flat with the bed structure surface as I could, then grind the welds flat so the boards would lay flat.
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Screws I was gonna use I have misplaced, so I used deck-type drywall screws (leftover from building the shed floors) and cut them short enough to not stick out the surface. In theory...I had to grind a few tips after installation.
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First two boards installed
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Then I had to take a break, which due to retroubleshooting computer problmes, locating parts and tools, and general housekeeping, was pretty long, so it was almost dark by the time I got back out there. Next pic shows the rest of the tabs installed and drilled.
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Then I got the rest of the boards installed, though they still need final trim on the back edge cuz I didn't quite alighn them like I meant to (front edge doesn't relaly matter as that probably won't be visible)
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I did screw up a couple placements too close to board edges, and angled the screws somehow and cracked one board for sure:
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Then I rode the trike around front and brought it in the house to do lighting fitting, figure out what I need to build for brackets to hold the turn signals, headlight, etc, but I didn't get anywhere with it cuz it was time to feed the dogs, then my dinner, further distractions and i dozed off.

But before that, Yogi and Tiny tried to help with taking the pic of the trike inside... (really they were pestering me for dinner, because it was almost time, and since I'd just "come home" thru the front door, well....)
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Re: Amberwolf & Dogman's Cargo Trike (yet to be named)

Post by docnjoj » Mar 27 2015 9:16am

That is looking seriously professional, AW. Are you going to build the same type of fender support on the right rear that you have on the left rear?. If this project turns out to be a major success, maybe consider building cargo trikes for others?
E-bike stable at our house

Steintrike Mad Max full suspension trike rear Cute 100H going on: Whoops, Cute wheel broke but I fixed it.
Sun USX delta trike EbikeKit small geared front wheel sort of front suspension for wife

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2x16000 Multisport from HK now gone as they died after 2 years
New Luna 10S bottle battery 13.6AH now on mine
Relatively New 10S4Px2 for wife's bike giving 20ah @ 40 volts home made Panasonic from Tumich. BMS's rule.

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Re: Amberwolf & Dogman's Cargo Trike (yet to be named)

Post by amberwolf » Mar 27 2015 9:32am

docnjoj wrote:That is looking seriously professional, AW.
Na, professional is stuff like Bluestreak's trikes, or Aussiejester's work.

Mine is still hack and slash, even if I'm paying a little more attention to detail this time, from the start.

I appreciate the thought, though. ;)
Are you going to build the same type of fender support on the right rear that you have on the left rear?.
Once I get the whole fender idea tested, and I'm sure I want it built that way, then yes. Lotta work to do so don't want to redo TWO of them. ;) Even the left one is only tacked together for now.
If this project turns out to be a major success, maybe consider building cargo trikes for others?

No, cuz of liability. I'd love to do it, but even people that are fine with my low-quality builds of junk would probably object when something breaks, and they probably can't fix it themselves, and bike shops don't wanna help wiht anything custom, especially stuff like this. Some like *looking* at them, but they wouldn't work on them. Probably too much liability for them.

So that means I'd end up fixing it everytime they abuse it or crash it or get themselves run over doing something stupid, and I'd probably not get paid to do it. So not worth doing as a business, and I don't have time or energy to do it even for myself usually, so if I'm not getting paid enough so I can work at the day job less to make the time to do it, well, it's just not really a fun idea.

There are a handful of friends I'd do it for, but I can't think of any of them that are interested in such things, except those that can and do build them themselves. Bill might be, but I think he's more interested in something that looks "normal". ;)

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Re: The SB Cruiser: Amberwolf & Dogman's CargoTrike & DogCar

Post by amberwolf » Mar 28 2015 12:45am

I got the headlight boom and turn signal brackets for the front made and installed, though I'm still deciding on where and how to mount the rear lights. Dunno if I wanna build the permanent stuff now, or wait till later and do something temporary under the cargo bed's rear edge (whcih is too low for good visibility to use permanently).
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I also put the downlighting strip on there, using a "12V" AC-powered PSU from who-knows-where, that only works with much smaller loads than the 6A it's rated for, and only puts out around 9VDC I think, so the LEDs are fairly dim compared to what they could be, but at least they work as downlighting and are in a water-resistant flexible silicone strip.

It's only tied on with twist ties ATM; I am not totally certain it's going where it is now; I may put it on so that half of it is on the bottom fo teh downtube facing forward lighting the front wheel and road, and the other half under the steering tiller, lighting the bike and some of me (kinda like the stuff on the steering linkage does on CB2).

I wish I had enough of this to put some on the back of the seat pointing down onto the cargo bed, but I don't. I do have other white LED flashlight stuff, and will probably use some on there for that, but they'll have to be wired up to work off 12V first.

Also wanna put a light in the kennel, to light it up from inside, that will work either on the trailer or on this trike. I have a 12VDC flat CCFL unit out of an old scanner lid, size of the palm of my hand or so, originally saved to do this with Hachi's original kennel trailer but never done cuz I lost track of the light before I got around to it. I found it agian last week in the shed cleanup, so now's the time to use it.

Turn signals... I've got two whole pair, off of DGA, both incandescent, and 1 & 1/2 off DT's front end. The DT ones have a two-filament bulb and 3 wires, so it has front marker lights all the time if I want them, plus turn signals (or just double-bright turn signals). I only have one of the amber lenses, though, cuz the other is on CB2's front left TS since I lost a lens off CB2 months ago, and it was run over and pulverized by traffic behind me before I could go back for it. They're just like the ones on the rear of the trailer (from the same source).

To keep the look the same front and rear, and for the marker lights, I may use these on the front and put the lens back on from CB2 while I'm using the trike, and just swap it back and forth as needed...or work out a different lens for CB2.

Then I have the rear ones off DGA taht look a lot like them, but have clear lenses and amber bulbs, and only one filament and 2 wires. Since these have clear lenses, I could also use red LEDs inside, in always on mode, to create more taillgihting. Could even wire those so they brighten for braking. I would have to get the LEDs off the broken MC taillight to do this, and/or out of the old DGA taillight if I can find it again (saw it a few days ago, can't remember where). Or out of those two red triangle flashlights from HF, though I'd rather leave those as-is, cuz I have ideas abotu using them whole. Either way, these are probably gonna be on the rear.

THen there are the plastic squarish ones with amber lenses, single filament and 2 wires, off DGA's front. Most likely these will go on the front. If I can get the LED MR-?? bulbs to fit in them in place of the incandescents, it'd be preferable, but if I can't, I'll still use them.

The headlight boom was easy; I just welded two 1" square tubes parallel to each other, perpendicular to the face of the headlight, on the top of the steel headlight casing/holder, pretty much like I did the single one on CB2.

This one I did not put any adjustments into, though I may do so later if it turns out to be needed. It's welded in four small spots to the tiller's stem. The problem with this mounting is that during a turn it points the light at the ground a lot closer than when straight. Not sure how to resolve that, or even if I need to.
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I also added the supports for the toolbox / battery areas, under the seat. If need be, these can also be used as supports for long cargo that is small enough to fit under the crossbar of teh front of the cargo area. Stuff like tubing and piping I someimtes run across can fit there, or broken-down pallets from work when they toss them out instead of sending them back (cuz the only ones we usually toss are the really nice looking ones that come under display fixtures; theyre what I made the cargo bed from, though those are aged a couple of years outside since I got them).
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And I got one of the mirrors installed (off of DGA), if I can get one of the ones off DT to fit and be stable I'll use it on the right.
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In other news, today, for no reason I can determine, the controller acts as if it isn't reading the halls right, stuttering, only working at all if I start it rolling first, then it will pull forward some, but not with full power.

I messed with it a little, but didnt do full troubleshooting yet. Was depressing cuz I was gonna finish up the lighting wiring tonight, then take Yogi or Tiny up to work on a test trip tomorrow before lunch with Bill (it's getting too hot for the dogs to do it later than late morning). Am at this point too tired to concentrate while working on teh wiring, so fixing it tonight is out. (woke up about 5am and couldn't get back to sleep at all, and no naps today).

While I waited for stuff just welded or ground on to cool off so I could hold it and work with it, over the last few days I've been also working on Bill's bike rack. Today I got the rack finalized, primed, and painted, but it warped badly during final welding and now it's a PITA to actually install on the bike. I hope he never has to take it off. :/ Pics over in the housefire / blog thread.

Sometime today I also got a bit of something in my eye that I haven't gotten out yet, and it's really irritating. I felt it bounce off the inside of my glasses, and into my eye, while grinding. Had to stop quick cuz it hurt, and due to all the manipulation I've been doing to try to get it out, my left eye area looks like I got punched. Feels like it, too. :( I even stood in the shower running the warm water directly into the eye for several minutes, and all it did was irritate it more, especially when the eyelashes got "turned under" the lid. :(
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dogman dan   100 GW

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Re: The SB Cruiser: Amberwolf & Dogman's CargoTrike & DogCar

Post by dogman dan » Mar 28 2015 6:57am

OOO, I do like the way the deck turned out, and the light especially. Really turning out good since you have time, vs building something bit by bit, over a several month period.

The past experience shows in this build!

That stutter, I'm starting to wonder if something is up inside that motor. Like a flaky hall sensor. One sensor not stuffed all the way into the slot, one weak solder, something like that. Intermittent shit, works in a static test, but not when spinning?

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Re: The SB Cruiser: Amberwolf & Dogman's CargoTrike & DogCar

Post by jpgey » Mar 28 2015 7:17am

Hello Amberwolf, is your eye fine ? Did you show it to someone ?

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Re: The SB Cruiser: Amberwolf & Dogman's CargoTrike & DogCar

Post by amberwolf » Mar 28 2015 12:04pm

On the assumption that it is metallic debris I tried to use a little neo magnet on a badgeholder to pick up anything in my eye, but it hasn't worked, probably because I can't bring myself ot stick it under the eyelid (I have a thing about touching my eyes...which is another reason besides money that I can't go see someone about it).

I slept on my side (as much as possible) with my head positioned against pillows to put that eye's tearduct "down" with the magnet holder taped along my eyelid-meet line in hopes that as it moves around from the tears it would end up washed down there, and when I first got up I thought it had worked (even though I saw nothing on the magnet) but after a moment it got flicked back up under the eyelid....

I've gotten stuff in my eyes before, and when it won't wash out or be easily picked out, I can patch my eye and it will migrate out after a few days, withouth the eyelid moving it up and down around my eye forcing me to squint and whatnot from the scratching irritations. So I'll do that, unless something bad happens.

dogman dan wrote:OOO, I do like the way the deck turned out, and the light especially. Really turning out good since you have time, vs building something bit by bit, over a several month period.
It's nice to be able to do it "all at once" as it were. But time is basically out, so I don't know how much progress I'll make on it from here on out, until my housefire anniversary "vacation" in late April--a whole week.

This is sort of what was supposed to happen the week of the original housefire--finishing the new frame for CB2 that I'd started, and moving all it's parts over. Obviously that never happened, but this is the first time since then I've had the time and motivation to really try this, other than the time last fall (?) when I had to do stuff to beef up CB2's cargo frame and fix some critical stuff.

The past experience shows in this build!

Thanks--now if I could just *consistently* do things the right way, I'd be a lot better. Welding still is hit or miss. Sometimes I just can't seem to do it right no matter what, even when just did a joint on the same metal with the same settings.

Cutting things, too--I'll measure and mark something, check it against the rest of the workpiece, cut it right along the markings, check it against the workpiece again, and it aint' fittin'. Have to keep modifying almost everything I make for that sort of thing, or redo it entirely when it's too short to do that. Always been that way, something wrong with my perceptions or something; you'd think I'd've learned to work around it by now.

That stutter, I'm starting to wonder if something is up inside that motor. Like a flaky hall sensor. One sensor not stuffed all the way into the slot, one weak solder, something like that. Intermittent shit, works in a static test, but not when spinning?
I dunno. I gotta test it offground first, then if that works I'll put the ebike motor tester on there to see what the halls show me under load. If they're working they should change pattern.

Woulda been ok if I hadn't fried the sensorless Crystalyte controller. :roll:

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Re: The SB Cruiser: Amberwolf & Dogman's CargoTrike & DogCar

Post by amberwolf » Mar 28 2015 11:30pm

OK, this is just plain wierd.

I sat there and did all the external troubleshooting over again this evening, just after sunset when a friend (who brought others) I havent' seen in years came by while she was in town (and we all pedalled the trike around the yard and rode CrazyBike2 around the street). Unfortunately I didnt' do this before they came, cuz I didn't expect the solution to be so easy, but at least now it's working.
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First, I verified everything was connected, adn that it was the same as the pics I took of the connectors once I found the right combo, before I went on the first test ride with it (where it worked fine).

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Then I used the multimeter to verify each hall signal toggled as the mtoro was rotated by hand, measuring at the back of the connector on the controller side, so that measn that at least the contacts of the connector were getting the signal, and theoreticaly that the controller is, as the pullups are on that end AFAIK.

Still, I cut the connector off a couple inches into the wire cable for it, in case there's a broken wire near it, and directly soldered the hall wires, verifying they were still in the original combo.

I verified there was power getting to each phase, the average voltage of which went up and down with throttle, and was the same on each phase for the same throttle setting.

Then I got the scope out and verified the signals were correct on each phase and hall, no wierd distortions, and that all were the same type of signal relative to each other, just offset by time.

At that point, it SHOULD be wokring. But I noticed the controller was awfully warm for offground no load testing, which could be a false positive thing. Well that should be impossible, because it WAS fine with the combo I took pictures of...but hey, what have I got to lose?

So I did the first obvious thing, to make all the hall wires color match, leaving the phases alone (YYBGGB).

And it worked. :?

Buuuut...before, it was YYBGGB for phases, and YBGGBY for halls, in the pic of the working configuration. :/ And I have not undone any of the wires, either, in the time since the ride to now, and I've used it several times to ride from the front door to the backyard, and vice-versa, as well as around the block to test teh deck for sound/vibration, etc.

And there was no slobber or fuzz on the wires, so I doubt Yogi or Tiny messed with it. :P

I have no idea how it could possibly change, but it has. I soldered in the new combo and it's still working, tested ina bumpy ride around the yard.

New combo:
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On my eye, it either feels better or I'm used to it, but only occasionally does it end up in a spot that hurts. I tried a patch on the eye while I was out with Bill to see if it would keep me from blinking that eye, and force the debris to end up near the tear duct, but it didnt' work. I kept finding myself scrunching up that eyelid which just made the irritation worse. If I keep both eyes closed it's better, but pretty hard to do very much that way. (I can do a number of things around the house, but not everything; some just arent' safe tod o that way).

Earlier, while out with Bill, we stopped by some autoparts places to check out LED lighting and whatnot, in case they might have some cheap or clearance stuff. Some were interesting, and would work for the purposes I have, but are way too expensive ($30 for 24" of red flexi water resistant strip is the cheapest; it's pretty bright but I need enough of it that that would be exorbitantly expensive, at least $90 worth of that to do what I was thinking of, to put along the whole bottom edge of the cargo deck at the back, for red, with markers wrapping around the side/corner, and then using amber ones for turn signals parallel to the corner parts).

I did buy an electronic flasher, as I am probalby not going to build my own the way things are going, and Iknow they'll work for LEDs or incandescents or combination, as its' the same one I have on CB2. Price went up at least a dollar or two since I got CB2's, and that wasn't even a year ago, I think?

I'm gonna look at Amazon or whatever for waterproof flexible cuttable LED strips and see what prices are for nice bright 12V red ones, white ones, and amber ones are. They're just a secondary thing, cuz I will still want regular turn signals and brake/tail lights on here, but more lights won't hurt and it looks pretty. :)

Timmy gave me a bike light from KoolGlo that is probably illegal to use here in AZ, cuz it's purple CFL, but I can use it inside the dog crate in place of or addition to the white CCFL. It's cool and i'd love to just put it on the lower back edge of the cargo area, where teh trailer hitch will be, but AFAICR purple is not on the list of legal colors for vehicle lighting, and the less reasons for anyone to pester me the better.
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Too bad the center reflector is just a nice if it had red LEDs in it. Guess I could fix that....


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Re: The SB Cruiser: Amberwolf & Dogman's CargoTrike & DogCar

Post by amberwolf » Mar 29 2015 10:49pm

Got a lot more done today, but I melted--it was almost 98F in the SHADE by just about 2pmish, and NO breeze. By a bit after 3pm it was down to 92F with a tiny breeze. Finally got below 80F by about 7pm or so, when it got dark enough I came inside to rest a little, before I go back out to wire up the lighting.
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Finished up the fender frames on both sides. I cut the pieces after measuring and marking them against the other side's pieces, writing what they were on each one as I did them. First I mocked them up uncut on the right side, and they looked like they'd fit perfect. Of course, I cut them wrong (twice for one part), too short by a lot, on several of them. I can't see how I did it wrong but this happens to me all the time. I'm just retarded like that about this sort of stuff. It's my magic power. :oops:
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Made the top rack over the kennel,
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which cna be used with it
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or by itself
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or not used at all.
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Uses four quick release pushpins like on crutches to take it off, with four little stiff stubs on the fender corners to support it,
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so it doens't get in the way of much when not attached. Am considering moving those down lower to leave the whole top of the fenders flat, but didn't think of it when I started on it. If I do, I'll have to lengthen the posts some to reach the new spots, and bend them a little.

It's not the stiffest structure, but I climbed up on it without the kennel under it, from the rider seat, and sat on it and swayed aroudn and wiggled and it didnt' collapse with my 180lbs on it, so it's strogn enugh for my purposes as-is.

It has a 1/2" gap between it's bottom adn the top of the kennel, just enough to slide some styrofoam sheet between, to help insulate teh dogs from direct midday sun on the kennel if I need to take them somewhere during that time. I'll probably glue some foam to two pieces of thin plastic so it goes all the way from front to back of kennel and is just pinched between rack and kennel when used. Will foil the top of it with an old opened-up dogfood bag I have saved for teh purpose, if I can find my sprayglue.

I test-fitted teh old Kawasaki windshield Bill gave me when he replaced his, quite a while back. Have considered it for CB2 a few times, but never did it. Might do it on this one, though, as it would fit pretty well over the tiller, something like this. Would help keep some rain off me in our few downpours. Dunno if anything would help the aero of this monstrosity, though. Looks sleek, though. :lol:
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Mounted the plastic yellow ex-DGA front turn signals next to the headlight.
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Test fitted the other cargo pod on TOP of the rack, for giggles.
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Haven't mounted the rest of the lights yet, but will be using the clear-lensed incandescent turn signals on the rear, mounted on the top rear of the rack. I haven't found the other Honda taillight (just the one I'd modded for a CFL, but it has a broken-in-half lens) but I'd like to use that with two LED lights in it (one for tail and add the other when braking).

I guess I will take the LED tow-hitch-cover unit off CB2 and put it on the trike for now, between the turn signals on the back of the top rack, cuz that's relatively easy and will be bright enough for the moment, at about eye level for many cars.

I'm not going to do the permanent wiring right now, because that will be time consuming and a PITA, and I want to get it rideable on the street ASAP to try it out on longer trips tahn around the local block. I'd like to test it for a grocery run, and also for a doggie transport run. I did test it around the block with Yogi in it, and it is MUCH more stable in turns with him back there. I probably went ~10MPH or more around a corner without tipping, but I could feel the back end skidding instead--sort of a skid-stop-skid-stop vibratey sort of feeling. Probably bad for the wheels but it was sort of fun. ;)

Yogi thought I was crazy and was really ready to get out when we got home.

Some pre-ride pics of letting him get used to the idea of getting in and out on his own. The trike basically doesn't move around when he does, as long as the front wheel brake is locked on. No tipping, etc. Guess I did something right, there. :)
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One problem I had was the short chain kept coming off between the left end of the driveshaft and the freewheel, if I pedalled while going at any speed at all on teh roads, from vibration I guess. I tried and tried but for some reason can no longer tighten it nearly enough. The driveshaft output is not bent, neither is the wheel axle, and the dropouts arent any closer to the shaft, so there's no reason I can see for it. Chain is aligned just fine, and it can't wear that fast to stretch, cuz I've almost pedalled it maybe 1/4 mile in tests, if that. Axle is not moving in the dropouts, either--I have L-hooked washers that are made to stop that and they are working. I may have to notch the dropout deeper for the axle.

I tried to primer the whole thing, to get it ready for the St Bernard color scheme, but the crappy Rustoleum primer (some new white, leftover from Bill's rack and some old gray from before teh fire meant for CB2) kept leaking and/or stopping up, requiring pulling out the cap and reseating it and continuously shaking the can and changing the angle at which I held it, making it really really hard to spray anything consistently.
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To help not waste it I put the kennel door on top of the rack/kennel when I painted it, so the overspray went onto both of those.
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I didn't take any stuff off when I did the painting, cuz everything is really temporary and if I do this like I want, none of it will show outside teh coroplast I'm gonna put over it anyway.
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Eventually the white just clogged up with about 1/4 can left, and the gray gave up about 1/3 left. Differnet nozzle from a working can doesn't help. So to finihs I used some purple that must be a couple of decades or more old, of a brand I cant' even remember, and it still works. I also used some Krylon gray primer I know is at least 30 years old and that also still worked, but there was only a little left.
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I'll have to go buy the rest of the stuff later; I've spent the money I can afford to this month. Maybe if I get a tax refund this year (instead of another notice that it's been taken for debt payment from a government guaranteed school loan from the late 80s, or nowadays more likley a fine for not being able to afford health insurance), I can use some of that.
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I put the little purple light just inside teh door of teh kennel,whcih looks pretty cool on the white kennel cagedoor, though youc ant' see it well in the pics. Still too light out when I took them, though not very.
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I am probably gonna use one of these for my "toolbox" temporarily, most likley the light blue one as it's shorter so the lid can open some without taking it off the trike, so I can bolt it to the frame from inside.
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I'll take the handle off so it doesn't rattle around though.
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The other one is taller by enough that it won't open enough to get my hand in or stuff out without taking it off the trike, or mounting it sideways so the lid opens downward or something, and then stuff could spill out unless I build barriers/etc.
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If I need another battery for range or wahtever, there is still some room next to the 50cal ammocan, but not much, cuz I decided to put it on the pedal side, so there'd be more room for the toolbox to go further in on the left side instead, and so it would be the same as on CB2. I may change it back cuz stuff fits better the way it was before, and leaves room for the 7.62 ammocan pack *and* a 50cal pack at the same time.

Still not sure if I'm just gonna strap the battery on or if I'll build a bolt-on fixture for it.

Also probably gonna use this rear fender for the front. Probably not gonna trim it, just use it as is, and make some holders for it (I have no idea what I did with the originals).
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