TSDZ2 or BBSxx?- Touring eBike Build

Howdy y'all. I'm currently (re)building my dream bike. It was already my dream build before a car smashed it to pieces...got a new frame, so this will be a frame-up build essentially. Might make a build thread later once I get to that point. Wanna learn as much as I can so I'm providing a lot of info here. TL;DR at the bottom.

Anyway, this won't be the first eBike I've put together, but it will be the first one that I own! (I assemble & wrench on other folks' bikes as a side gig sometimes). I've also only put together hub drives before when it comes to eBikes & I'm 99% certain a mid-drive will suit me better, so this will be a first for me in that sense also.

The frame I just replaced is a 46cm/XS Surly Disc Trucker (old version with the longer chainstays & better geometry for short riders like me). Sturdy CroMoly steel - It can handle just about anything short of having a 5000lb air conditioned mobile living room run into it at speed after getting doored by another 5000lb air conditioned living room (lessons learned the hard way). I love it. Love the way it handles heavy loads, flies on pavement & can still handle some moderate gravel & off-road sections. I think it being tough as nails makes it ideal for an electric conversion as well.

My main cycling pursuit at the moment is long distance touring, with extremely long distances being the goal I'm still working towards. I have done quite a few moderate length tours in the 100-300 mile range at this point & the only thing I struggled with were those days where I didn't get very many miles in due to huge amounts of climbing. I would say I'm pretty fit, not a world champion or anything but definitely above average. If I wasn't carrying a load on my bike I could handle the vast majority of hills with just my legs without much issue, but light "credit card" touring just isn't what appeals to me. As I've gotten more interested in eBikes & had the chance to build & test ride some, I've become enamored with the idea of adding a motor that I can use to assist me on those stretches, so I can take less of a penalty from terrain & inclement weather & still get some enjoyment out of those long days.

I want to get a high energy battery pack from EM3ev & run whatever motor I use as efficiently as possible most of the time with the option of adding a little extra oomph if I want or need it, and then to be able to really crank it up a notch when I come to steep hills & things of that nature. For the longest time I was most interested in the BBSxx kits, but a bit worried about losing the feel of a regular bike to too much power. I did a ton of research on how some folks adjust their settings to make it run more smoothly or at lower power in low PAS than the stock settings, and that seemed pretty appealing.

Then I learned about torque sensors & started reading about other mid-drive units like the TongSheng TSDZ2. I really LOVE the idea of retaining the feel of pedaling a normal bike as much as possible & running a motor that just sort of boosts me as I put out more of my own human power. I bike for transportation, enjoyment AND exercise. The TSDZ2 does appear to still have a throttle as an option if I ever felt like I needed or wanted to use that (when test riding other eBikes I really did enjoy having the option to tap the throttle at green lights as I started pedaling to keep up with traffic in certain places). The newer 750W TSDZ2 kits with HiGO connectors look really nice. I've also seen some "overdrive" models where the motor keeps working when pedaling up to 120RPM (instead of the traditional 90RPM on standard TSDZ2 units). My only concerns are that the build quality seems not quite as rugged. I saw that it's a little less waterproof & that some people have melted certain components when running the motor too hard or in the wrong gear. That concerned me a little because as awesome as that torque sensor-based PAS sounds, it's useless if the motor fails on me. I also saw that a lot of people seemed to be able to put an awful lot of miles on their units without any unresolvable issues, but I couldn't find a whole lot of info on how those people used/treated the motor when riding to get that longevity. Obviously paying attention to gearing is important, swapping out the nylon gear for a metal one & greasing it up so it doesn't rattle around makes sense, as does not over-doing it with the throttle or running it above 17/18A. But can it even handle long distance touring? Multiple 50+ mile days in a row? Tons of hill climbing, & maybe some bad weather here & there? (of course I'm not planning to ride in a hurricane or anything lol).

I'm 5'2"/160cm, ~105lb/47.5kg, so most high powered kits would probably be like a rocket for me. I don't necessarily need all that. If I got a BBSxx kit I would likely be turning the power way down most of the time, which was an idea I had been getting used to before I learned that torque sensors existed & supposedly do the thing I really want (apply power in proportionate response to pedaling for the most natural ride-feeling). I also kind of like the idea of having the option to kick up the power if I wanted to on occasion, so that was a partial draw to the BBSxx kits for me, but that's way less important to me than overall efficiency & enjoyment of the general ride experience. The TSDZ2 sounds in theory like the very specific tool I'm looking for, but I want to know if it's really durable enough for the kind of riding I want to do (long sustained distances, steep inclines, lying in the grass next to my tent overnight, but no aggressive singletrack riding or anything quite that intense).

I also don't know much of anything about the OpenSource firmware that's out there now for the TSDZ2 apparently, but what little I've heard sounds kinda neat. Would love to learn more about how that works. Would also really love to learn more about the limits of the TSDZ2 in general & what your options are for tuning the pedal assist/power output.

I was really enamored with the EggRider display available with many BBSxx kits, especially for the easy Wh/Mi readout. Super excited to see that the SW102 w/ Bluetooth for the TSDZ2 looks to be pretty much identical. Does it work the same as an EggRider & also have that Wh/Mi readout? Does it have the same sort of phone app & programming options?




TL;DR ---
• Is the TongSheng 750W TSDZ2 mid-drive a durable enough unit for long-distance eBike touring for a fit, small female rider on an XS Disc Trucker frame loaded up with gear & camping equipment? How well does it handle hills?

• Should I get a BBSxx kit instead for my intended motor application?

• Is the SW102 display like an EggRider/does it show Wh/Mi?

• How intuitive is the process of programming the TSDZ2? Is it particularly easy to customize, or is it really locked in to any particular settings?

• Considering a double chainring for the TSDZ2 (had been planning around a single with a BBSxx but retaining a second front chainring does sound kinda nice) - what size chainrings do you think make the most sense for someone who wants to pedal a lot & also climb hills? I have a brand new wide range 10-speed 11t-42t nickel-plated steel cassette I'm planning to install in the rear.



Thanks so much for any help or insight you can offer!!! I'm SUPER excited to finally be putting my bike back together & to make it BETTER THAN EVER this time.

Pic attached of my bike before the car smashed into it. I'll be rebuilding it very similarly to this, but electric of course.

As incredibly interested as I am in the TSDZ2's torque sensor because I REALLY want to retain the feeling of pedaling my bicycle, I'm somewhat starting to lean towards the BBSxx units because of how difficult it has been trying to find answers to some of these questions. I've reached out to sellers of the TSDZ2, read through a ton of tutorials that were not very easy to navigate, watched a whole lot of videos & reviews, and while there's some really good & useful info out there, I'm having a very hard time finding answers to some of the questions I have that seem the most simple.

Do ANY of the TSDZ2 units display Wh/Mi? That's such an important metric, especially for traveling long distances. I'm most interested in the SW102 or "Lightest" display (I've now seen this display that looks an awful lot like what I had previously known as an EggRider under a few different names) because of how small & discrete it is. I know the EggRider v2 displays Wh/Mi for BBSxx, but I can't find any reliable information about these other units for the TSDZ2 at all. I'm kind of shocked at the lack of tutorials, manuals, or review information on this display.

As for custom settings/programming of the TSDZ2, I'm also having a really hard time finding reliable information on that. I know there are four standard settings but I haven't seen specifics on exactly how much they assist or if that's something the user can modify. I keep hearing that the OSF is more flexible, but the sheer volume of the OSF wiki is really overwhelming for a new user who is a lot more hardware-inclined than software-inclined. I poured through it anyway, and despite that I still can't find much of the information I'm looking for, especially about how the display functions & how the user inputs data/settings.

It's kind of a downer that it's been so hard to find good information on certain specifics of the TSDZ2, because my eyes kind of light up whenever I see reviews about how ideal the pedal assist response/input is. That has been the one thing that's kept me hesitant about the BBSxx kits, is just that I don't really want an auto-throttle response to my pedal-input. I experienced that sensation on hub-drive kits I got to build & test ride for other people & it really wasn't quite what I was looking for.

Jaded said:

As incredibly interested as I am in the TSDZ2's torque sensor because I REALLY want to retain the feeling of pedaling my bicycle, ....

Click to expand...

You are absolute right about the tsdz2. It is far from perfect, so it need a lot of changes to get it as you want.
But because the acces to hardware and software is so easy, means that there is a (too) lot of information.
Besides the Endless Spere topics and Youtube, the TDSZ2 wiki is the place where most of the information is collected and indeed, it is overwhelming if you look there for the first time.
There are people that cycles thousends of miles without a problem, but there are also people that has problems after some hundreds of miles. That is because the hardware has Chinese tolerances with unpredictable results. (but mostly blue gear and csk30P inside main gear)

For that reason some flash OSF, replacing bearings and insert heat improvements at once they have the motor, before build. Other try first everyting stock. On both cases there is no guarantee everthing goes well.

But TSDZ2 is the only motor where this is possible and have torque sensing too.
Lingbei (mm28) and Chengy (CMT06) have also torque sensing, but with closed firmware and almost no spare parts for servicing.
The other choice for torque sensing is a rear hub motor with a bottom bracket torque sensor. About these I don't know about reliability and servicing.

Flashing OSF has a lot of advantages, as more customizable settings, a better protection against blue gear breakage, higher cadence possible, less noisy etc.
If you don't want to flash OSF yourself. Eco cycles sells the tsdz2 with osf preinstalled, maybe too with the SW102. But for traveling long distances I think you need to do some hardware improvements too, like for better heat dissipation and simple bearing additions.

For long rides, light bicycle and flexibility on battery and optimize range, TSDZ2 is very good when running our OpenSource firmware: https://github.com/OpenSource-EBike-firmware/TSDZ2_wiki/wiki

You can use any custom battery voltage, from 24V up to 52V (7S up to 14S). No proprietary battery or charger, meaning you can easily make extra packs and easy charge with any charger small and weight optimized.

Do ANY of the TSDZ2 units display Wh/Mi? -- sure!! I was the one that implemented that feature on the 860C and SW102 displays. On 860C display, that variable can even be plotted on the graph!!

I use the same ebike daily on the city as also for long travels. Here as example the travel of yesterday, me and my wife, we rode to mountains far from home in total of 93 kms, +1280, battery of 500Wh with 5% left at the end of ride. Two ebikes with TSDZ2, no fails.





I know what are the common problems on and I did wrote the TSDZ2 FAQ with the common issues, possible causes and repair/solutions -- look at it before you decide to use or not.

See this build example: https://github.com/OpenSource-EBike-firmware/TSDZ2_wiki/wiki/bikesnobyyc-adventure-touring-bike

Elinx said:

You are absolute right about the tsdz2. It is far from perfect, so it need a lot of changes to get it as you want.
But because the acces to hardware and software is so easy, means that there is a (too) lot of information.
Besides the Endless Spere topics and Youtube, the TDSZ2 wiki is the place where most of the information is collected and indeed, it is overwhelming if you look there for the first time.
There are people that cycles thousends of miles without a problem, but there are also people that has problems after some hundreds of miles. That is because the hardware has Chinese tolerances with unpredictable results. (but mostly blue gear and csk30P inside main gear)

For that reason some flash OSF, replacing bearings and insert heat improvements at once they have the motor, before build. Other try first everyting stock. On both cases there is no guarantee everthing goes well.

Click to expand...

Yeah, I did go through a bunch of the topics here on this forum, as well as several YouTube videos & the wiki that you linked to. I just found it REALLY difficult to locate specific information that I was looking for on any of those sources. I found bits here & there buried in a lot of other info that I didn't quite know what to do with, and honestly some of it was kind of hard to wrap my head around without images or videos or any kind of visual to show what some of the texts were trying to convey when it came to things like display functionality. The tables comparing the displays were also pretty hard to understand, and I couldn't find anything about how to actually get things to work, like displaying Wh/Mi & adjusting the settings to user preference. It all seemed about 100x more complicated than anything I was reading in regards to setting up the BBSxx units.

I totally understand things like the nylon gear being a weak point & needing to do some maintenance on the unit here & there (like greasing everything up every so often). But like you said there's a lot of inconsistencies in terms of different people's experiences with the unit's longevity, and that made me kinda worried. I don't mind doing my own work & maintenance on my bike, but whenever something fails just too often I always replace it. I'm not quite prepared for that to be the case with a $450-600+ investment at the moment...and I was also underwhelmed by most of the warranties I saw companies offering for the TSDZ2 (90 days? Really? Does not instill one with much confidence... and yeah, I know some people are fine with buying from certain Chinese vendors that won't offer any support if something fails, but something tells me I'm in a bit of a different tax bracket than most of those folks. My bike is by far the most expensive thing I own even without the motor lol).

casainho said:

For long rides, light bicycle and flexibility on battery and optimize range, TSDZ2 is very good when running our OpenSource firmware: https://github.com/OpenSource-EBike-firmware/TSDZ2_wiki/wiki
...
Do ANY of the TSDZ2 units display Wh/Mi? -- sure!! I was the one that implemented that feature on the 860C and SW102 displays. On 860C display, that variable can even be plotted on the graph!!
...
I use the same ebike daily on the city as also for long travels. Here as example the travel of yesterday, me and my wife, we rode to mountains far from home in total of 93 kms, +1280, battery of 500Wh with 5% left at the end of ride. Two ebikes with TSDZ2, no fails.
...
See this build example: https://github.com/OpenSource-EBike-firmware/TSDZ2_wiki/wiki/bikesnobyyc-adventure-touring-bike

Click to expand...

Hey, thank you so much for providing some clear & useful information on this unit. I think you're the first person to directly answer some of my most pressing questions. Your touring build is really impressive & is swaying my opinion again a bit...But I actually just ordered a BBSHD kit & battery from EM3ev earlier before I saw this. I actually had an easier time finding information on how some people program the BBSHD to be a bit underpowered at low PAS in order to retain the ability to pedal as much as possible. I decided to go that route instead since I figure running a very high powered & robust system at significantly less than it's capable of (at least the vast majority of the time...all bets are off when I come to those massive hills again lol) is probably a pretty safe bet when it comes to energy efficiency & motor longevity. I also kept finding people saying that heavy bikes loaded up with a lot of cargo are more likely to fry a TSDZ2 than a BBSHD, and that a dedicated touring/cargo bike should really have more power. I didn't really find anything about the TSDZ2 to contradict that until you showed me this.

However, maybe one day I'll get a TSDZ2 as well, when the OSF has been around for a bit longer & more people have used it & can share their experiences. I did really love everything I saw about that torque sensor & knowing that there is the potential to run an SW102 display with a Wh/Mi readout makes me happy. If I hadn't already placed an order for a BBSHD I might've still considered it. But then again, searching for info on how to use & set the BBSHD was not very difficult, while doing the same with the TSDZ2 kept leaving me feeling stuck & frustrated. Ultimately that's what ended up making the decision for me. I thought: "If my unit does break down & need servicing at some point...I'd rather not pull my hair out trying to find the resources I need to fix it."

I apologize if my tone about the difficulty of parsing through much of the information seems overly critical of the work that's been done to that end, much of which I know was performed by you personally. I actually really appreciate all the work that you've put into improving this unit & paving the road for others to get more use out of it as well.




Despite being a little disappointed that I ended up ordering a motor that doesn't have a torque sensor, I'm SUPER excited to have this project underway finally, and I'm feeling more confident now that I've found some pretty useful info on how to optimize the PAS settings for better efficiency & pedal-input. I saw someone's recommendation to set PAS1 as limited to 11% current, PAS2 at 22%, PAS3 33%, etc. with speed/cadence limited to 50% at PAS1, 60% PAS2, etc. & think I'm gonna try that first. That seems a lot better than the stock settings that have PAS1 providing 40 or 50% of the motor's power already...especially for someone my size lol.

EM3ev is probably gonna take a few weeks to get everything to me. Might not have my kit until about September. But that's OK- I've seen & heard so many great things about EM3ev & they were one of the quickest retailers to respond to my questions & they gave the most detailed & useful responses by far. Paul seems like a pretty cool guy & the engineering behind their batteries is just fantastic. I ordered a 14s7p / 1200wh rectangle battery that I'm gonna put in a frame bag in the triangle of my bike. I'm sure that'll get me pretty dang far on a single charge.

I already have a lot of ideas for how I'm going to set up my bike. I ordered a set of in-line brake sensors on AliExpress awhile ago so that they'll hopefully get to me by the time everything else does. Those will be useful for keeping my drop bar setup, and I'm planning to cut some PVC to size to make my own custom handlebar accessory mount. I think I might make that build thread, just to share some of my ideas/designs with folks here, who I'm sure also have a lot of useful info & ideas.

Jaded said:

Elinx said:

You are absolute right about the tsdz2. It is far from perfect, so it need a lot of changes to get it as you want.
But because the acces to hardware and software is so easy, means that there is a (too) lot of information.
Besides the Endless Spere topics and Youtube, the TDSZ2 wiki is the place where most of the information is collected and indeed, it is overwhelming if you look there for the first time.
There are people that cycles thousends of miles without a problem, but there are also people that has problems after some hundreds of miles. That is because the hardware has Chinese tolerances with unpredictable results. (but mostly blue gear and csk30P inside main gear)

For that reason some flash OSF, replacing bearings and insert heat improvements at once they have the motor, before build. Other try first everyting stock. On both cases there is no guarantee everthing goes well.

Click to expand...

Yeah, I did go through a bunch of the topics here on this forum, as well as several YouTube videos & the wiki that you linked to. I just found it REALLY difficult to locate specific information that I was looking for on any of those sources. I found bits here & there buried in a lot of other info that I didn't quite know what to do with, and honestly some of it was kind of hard to wrap my head around without images or videos or any kind of visual to show what some of the texts were trying to convey when it came to things like display functionality. The tables comparing the displays were also pretty hard to understand, and I couldn't find anything about how to actually get things to work, like displaying Wh/Mi & adjusting the settings to user preference. It all seemed about 100x more complicated than anything I was reading in regards to setting up the BBSxx units.

I totally understand things like the nylon gear being a weak point & needing to do some maintenance on the unit here & there (like greasing everything up every so often). But like you said there's a lot of inconsistencies in terms of different people's experiences with the unit's longevity, and that made me kinda worried. I don't mind doing my own work & maintenance on my bike, but whenever something fails just too often I always replace it. I'm not quite prepared for that to be the case with a $450-600+ investment at the moment...and I was also underwhelmed by most of the warranties I saw companies offering for the TSDZ2 (90 days? Really? Does not instill one with much confidence... and yeah, I know some people are fine with buying from certain Chinese vendors that won't offer any support if something fails, but something tells me I'm in a bit of a different tax bracket than most of those folks. My bike is by far the most expensive thing I own even without the motor lol).

casainho said:

For long rides, light bicycle and flexibility on battery and optimize range, TSDZ2 is very good when running our OpenSource firmware: https://github.com/OpenSource-EBike-firmware/TSDZ2_wiki/wiki
...
Do ANY of the TSDZ2 units display Wh/Mi? -- sure!! I was the one that implemented that feature on the 860C and SW102 displays. On 860C display, that variable can even be plotted on the graph!!
...
I use the same ebike daily on the city as also for long travels. Here as example the travel of yesterday, me and my wife, we rode to mountains far from home in total of 93 kms, +1280, battery of 500Wh with 5% left at the end of ride. Two ebikes with TSDZ2, no fails.
...
See this build example: https://github.com/OpenSource-EBike-firmware/TSDZ2_wiki/wiki/bikesnobyyc-adventure-touring-bike

Click to expand...

Hey, thank you so much for providing some clear & useful information on this unit. I think you're the first person to directly answer some of my most pressing questions. Your touring build is really impressive & is swaying my opinion again a bit...But I actually just ordered a BBSHD kit & battery from EM3ev earlier before I saw this. I actually had an easier time finding information on how some people program the BBSHD to be a bit underpowered at low PAS in order to retain the ability to pedal as much as possible. I decided to go that route instead since I figure running a very high powered & robust system at significantly less than it's capable of (at least the vast majority of the time...all bets are off when I come to those massive hills again lol) is probably a pretty safe bet when it comes to energy efficiency & motor longevity. I also kept finding people saying that heavy bikes loaded up with a lot of cargo are more likely to fry a TSDZ2 than a BBSHD, and that a dedicated touring/cargo bike should really have more power. I didn't really find anything about the TSDZ2 to contradict that until you showed me this.

However, maybe one day I'll get a TSDZ2 as well, when the OSF has been around for a bit longer & more people have used it & can share their experiences. I did really love everything I saw about that torque sensor & knowing that there is the potential to run an SW102 display with a Wh/Mi readout makes me happy. If I hadn't already placed an order for a BBSHD I might've still considered it. But then again, searching for info on how to use & set the BBSHD was not very difficult, while doing the same with the TSDZ2 kept leaving me feeling stuck & frustrated. Ultimately that's what ended up making the decision for me. I thought: "If my unit does break down & need servicing at some point...I'd rather not pull my hair out trying to find the resources I need to fix it."

I apologize if my tone about the difficulty of parsing through much of the information seems overly critical of the work that's been done to that end, much of which I know was performed by you personally. I actually really appreciate all the work that you've put into improving this unit & paving the road for others to get more use out of it as well.




Despite being a little disappointed that I ended up ordering a motor that doesn't have a torque sensor, I'm SUPER excited to have this project underway finally, and I'm feeling more confident now that I've found some pretty useful info on how to optimize the PAS settings for better efficiency & pedal-input. I saw someone's recommendation to set PAS1 as limited to 11% current, PAS2 at 22%, PAS3 33%, etc. with speed/cadence limited to 50% at PAS1, 60% PAS2, etc. & think I'm gonna try that first. That seems a lot better than the stock settings that have PAS1 providing 40 or 50% of the motor's power already...especially for someone my size lol.

EM3ev is probably gonna take a few weeks to get everything to me. Might not have my kit until about September. But that's OK- I've seen & heard so many great things about EM3ev & they were one of the quickest retailers to respond to my questions & they gave the most detailed & useful responses by far. Paul seems like a pretty cool guy & the engineering behind their batteries is just fantastic. I ordered a 14s7p / 1200wh rectangle battery that I'm gonna put in a frame bag in the triangle of my bike. I'm sure that'll get me pretty dang far on a single charge.

I already have a lot of ideas for how I'm going to set up my bike. I ordered a set of in-line brake sensors on AliExpress awhile ago so that they'll hopefully get to me by the time everything else does. Those will be useful for keeping my drop bar setup, and I'm planning to cut some PVC to size to make my own custom handlebar accessory mount. I think I might make that build thread, just to share some of my ideas/designs with folks here, who I'm sure also have a lot of useful info & ideas.

Click to expand...

As for the occasional primary and secondary gear regreasing on TSDZ2 which is said to be needed after every 1000km. That's like once a month for average commuter.
There are also no recommendations for internal BLDC motor puller in the original service manual, since some of them come off easily by hand and some are required to be removed by using wooden block and a hammer. As a result of this last time when trying to regrease mine I might have used the hammer a bit too strongly on one side. Some users reported broken motor axle after manipulations such as these in less than a 1km. After 150km still no signs of broken axle, might have forgotten to properly check the external motor axle bearing for any damage though.

With Bafang having introduced what may be the DIY killing "complete" kits with proprietary communication and battery, th4 TSDZ2 improved version, may be a more sustainable choice. Already my pre 2016 BBSxx motors are not repairable as replacement parts have pretty much dried up.

No on seems clear on Bafangs intent. But BBS01B and 02B were a total surprise and no one was forewarned. I prefer the BBSxx series, but it's looking like the newest TSDZ2 versions are in for the win. They certainly have some great support here and resellers.

I'm big into touring eBikes. Looking forward to your adventures.

tomjasz said:

With Bafang having introduced what may be the DIY killing "complete" kits with proprietary communication and battery, th4 TSDZ2 improved version, may be a more sustainable choice. Already my pre 2016 BBSxx motors are not repairable as replacement parts have pretty much dried up.

No on seems clear on Bafangs intent. But BBS01B and 02B were a total surprise and no one was forewarned. I prefer the BBSxx series, but it's looking like the newest TSDZ2 versions are in for the win. They certainly have some great support here and resellers.

Click to expand...

How can the th4 TSDZ2 improved version be identified? I only know second version with helical gears and third one with four screws on the secondary gear plastic cover with flat aluminium back plate instead of wider surrounding edge.

The TSDZ2 would make a perfect touring bike setup... smooth, quiet, plenty powerful enough, *torque sensor*... assuming you have the cooling mods. You'll need that for extended climbing and such. You can purchase kits that come with this already done and pre-flashed to a good version of the OSF from Eco-bikes. Easy peasey.

https://www.eco-ebike.com/

raylo32 said:

The TSDZ2 would make a perfect touring bike setup... smooth, quiet, plenty powerful enough, *torque sensor*... assuming you have the cooling mods. You'll need that for extended climbing and such. You can purchase kits that come with this already done and pre-flashed to a good version of the OSF from Eco-bikes. Easy peasey.

https://www.eco-ebike.com/

Click to expand...

Couldn't find anything about cooling mods already being done in that link.

LOL... That was the company's home page. You do have exercise your finger to click on the "shop" and TSDZ2 links. Here you go.

https://www.eco-ebike.com/collections/tongsheng-tsdz2/products/tsdz2-w-850c-torque-sensing-pedal-assist-with-throttle-and-e-brakes-36v-48v-52v-10-18a-250-750w

sysrq said:

raylo32 said:

The TSDZ2 would make a perfect touring bike setup... smooth, quiet, plenty powerful enough, *torque sensor*... assuming you have the cooling mods. You'll need that for extended climbing and such. You can purchase kits that come with this already done and pre-flashed to a good version of the OSF from Eco-bikes. Easy peasey.

https://www.eco-ebike.com/

Click to expand...

Couldn't find anything about cooling mods already being done in that link.

Click to expand...

I've toured a bit and the reason I would go with a BBSHD is because you get days with strong headwinds which make cycling a nightmare. It's like you're on a treadmill going nowhere and a lot of times you have to get to your destination regardless of the obstacles.
PAS is adjustable and once you hit your cadence I don't see a need for torque sensing. At least the way I ride TS is only a benefit when my output is changing faster than I can adjust the PAS.
In my experience reliability with the BBSHD comes down to 2 things; water proofing and heat. If you don't properly waterproof the controller you're going to have a problem. I've now gone 15000km and haven't had an issue since I started making my own gaskets for the controller. Heat can deteriorate the nylon gear but it seems to only be an issue when pushing more amps to the motor or not properly shifting. I just don't see this as an issue with an unmodded controller and using PAS. Save possibly for climbing through the mountains where you might be pushing the motor for over 15 minutes, maybe 30. That's something you want to watch by either knowing your motor and keeping an eye on the temps or by adding a thermocouple. The thing is, if you have problems with a BBSHD they're only going to be worse with a BBS02, BBS01, and the TSDZ2.
If I was going long distance with the intention of pedaling a considerable amount I'd also upgrade the crank arms. The stock crank arms are pretty soft. I had one bend in a crash and I don't think that would have happened with something like a Race Face or Shimano crankset. There's something to be said for the crank arms bending instead of the axle. I don't know if the Lekkie arms are strong enough to bend the axle in a crash. But I've worked on and seen square taper cranks come loose and strip, become a general problem. I'd personally want harder arms for durability and fitment to the square.

I'd only recommend touring with these motors if you have good knees. The TSDZ2 is NOT fit for touring due to quality issues. I wrote a post about it if you're interested.