Direct Drive Genesis

Discussions related to motors other than hub motors.
This includes R/C motors, botttom bracket, roller and geared drives.
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skeetab5780   10 MW

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Re: LR Direct Drive Genesis

Post by skeetab5780 » Jun 13 2017 11:29am

Not using those heavy ass quad pegs. I plan to make a bracket similar to the LMX drop pegs and mount it to the frame. Ive been stalling on this though since I do not trust my welding skills even though I always get it done in the end...

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DanGT86   10 kW

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Re: LR Direct Drive Genesis

Post by DanGT86 » Jun 14 2017 9:17am

nutspecial wrote:
Dan do you have coverage of your bike somewhere?
This is my slowly progressing build thread.
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 28&t=87934

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Re: LR Direct Drive Genesis

Post by skeetab5780 » Jun 14 2017 9:47am

So my Statiator came in! This seems like one of the sketchiest buys I've ever dealt with so bear with me.

I ended up buying this from Amazon since grin is in CA and im in MA it saves on shipping. I never deal with Amazon since I use ebay/paypal mainly so I had to pay for this out of pocket, first thing I didn't like

also on Amazon it is advertised coming with an Anderson connector and here you see it has the XLR, not that I care I just lopped it off anyway
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Second thing I noticed was the box came in the mail with not even one piece of tape closing it or protecting it from the outside world...I could not believe this and it is an absolute first for me! Its not like I'm asking for a lot am I?
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After lopping off the XLR I quickly soldered a XT connector on it and forgot to put heat shrink on...Doh
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Then I go to get the instructions since I have no clue how to use this even though im sure I can figure it out with only two buttons. But what do I find in the box??? NO INSTRUCTIONS INCLUDED! Again I'm sure I can get them on the website...
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Took me about a minute to figure out how to create a custom profile for the 18s pack
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I completely forgot I soldered the XT connectors on my LR bike backwards...this could have been a bad thing! But I caught it before plugging it in backwards then quickly made a polarity reverse adaptor
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Started charging and notice the charger sitting on my seat, came back about 30minutes later and the charger is so damn hot I thought my seat was going to melt to it! obviously this thing is made as small as possible so its body is the heat sink...make sure this is on cement or metal only!
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The last thing that made me laugh is the sticker on the front that says for indoor use only... On Amazon they call this a weatherproof outdoor charger. Im not sure if this is because it has not passed UL testing in the USA or not? but that is odd
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Overall my review of the charger is that it is awesome! I feel like they could have put the power 120v input on the reverse side of the DC output instead of on the side, it makes it sort of akward. I feel this will be a solid long lasting charger, it has a 3 year warranty anyway...

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skeetab5780   10 MW

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Re: LR Direct Drive Genesis

Post by skeetab5780 » Jul 10 2017 8:42am

So I added a small project box and re terminated my wiring. I was sick of the open connections outside of the suspension linkage flopping around. was quick and easy and makes it look a bit cleaner.

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DanGT86   10 kW

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Re: LR Direct Drive Genesis

Post by DanGT86 » Jul 10 2017 9:10am

Awesome! What a great idea. I always worry about stuff getting hung up in my wiring and having to walk home. I even ride with a few paperclips in my bag so I can jump connections if any of the connectors get damaged. A small enclosure is a way more elegant solution.

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Re: LR Direct Drive Genesis

Post by skeetab5780 » Jul 11 2017 11:46am

I don't want to count my chickens before they hatch...

but I may have a new frame to build this bike out of! I am super excited and cannot wait to reveal it. Im pretty sure it is an ES first.

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Re: LR Direct Drive Genesis

Post by skeetab5780 » Jul 11 2017 2:27pm

skeetab5780 wrote:I FINALLY PULLED THE TRIGGER ON 3X 6S 12000MAH MULTI STAR!

I've been stalking them lately and just a week or so ago they were $76 each now today they were only $59.99 for some reason. I checked out with Paypal and feel pretty good about it.

Now I will have a battery worthy of testing my new toys!
This same battery is $103 right now!! OUCH wish I knew they were going to spike this crazy then

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DanGT86   10 kW

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Re: LR Direct Drive Genesis

Post by DanGT86 » Jul 11 2017 3:48pm

You just never know with HK. They might be $49.99 tomorrow.

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skeetab5780   10 MW

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Re: LR Direct Drive Genesis

Post by skeetab5780 » Jul 12 2017 7:31am

skeetab5780 wrote:I don't want to count my chickens before they hatch...

but I may have a new frame to build this bike out of! I am super excited and cannot wait to reveal it. Im pretty sure it is an ES first.
I officially have a tracking# I am so pumped to see this thing in person 4 more days!

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Re: LR Direct Drive Genesis

Post by DanGT86 » Jul 16 2017 9:20am

Where have you found long enough axles for this swing arm? I got the longest 10mm threaded axle I could find and its still shorter than I would really like.

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Re: LR Direct Drive Genesis

Post by skeetab5780 » Jul 17 2017 5:34am

DanGT86 wrote:Where have you found long enough axles for this swing arm? I got the longest 10mm threaded axle I could find and its still shorter than I would really like.
I've always used the Voloci electric bike thru axles. This is the second one I've owned, I probably shouldn't have gotten rid of the Voloci I have a feeling i'll never see one again in life.

FYI bought them from stevilkenvil on the forums but he may be out its been a long time

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DanGT86   10 kW

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Re: LR Direct Drive Genesis

Post by DanGT86 » Jul 17 2017 9:15am

I remember that sale thread. Those have to be the longest axles on earth. I got one from wheels mfg. that only sticks out about 3/16 on each side. Its a fine thread so its probably ok but I am reluctant to do any 3-5kw testing until I think of a solution. I also cant use washers under the nuts which I don't like at all. These genesis swing arms were obviously designed for hub motors so I hadn't considered the dropout thickness being a problem. I'll probably weld up another with thin dropouts to correct for that.

I did a bunch of internetting over the weekend looking for a solution and the best I could come up with is a 12mm axle for 150mm dropouts. It is 203mm long between the nuts. My thinking is that I could machine 1mm flats on them similar to the flats on a hub motor axle. Then a 135mm wide hub could be used leaving 20mm worth of spacer room to adjust chainline and brake clearance. It could probably be done with a grinder easily too.

The other solution would be to use one of the DNM dual brake flange front hubs and a 20mm shaft with flats milled to fit in the dropouts. This might be fun because it would allow custom freewheel adapters to be attached to the pedal drive side but that is a lot of work and I'm pretty sure I am moving on from the Genesis platform. Speaking of which there will probably be a couple of genesis frames for sale soon along with a mid-drive swing-arm or 2.

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Re: LR Direct Drive Genesis

Post by skeetab5780 » Jul 17 2017 9:43am

Before I got my second Voloci thru axle from him I did all my testing with a piece of 3/8" threaded rod, if you can find stainless it will be stronger.

It worked fine for my hubs not sure which you have, but mine is solid thru the center some arent

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skeetab5780   10 MW

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Re: LR Direct Drive Genesis

Post by skeetab5780 » Aug 11 2017 3:33pm

So its a sad day for the genesis bike, but I love this bike and I feel this change is for the better. Not only for my health but so the bike stays in use after my new build is complete!

Since I am spending thousands of dollars on my next secret build. I have decided to use a few vital parts from the LR Genesis direct drive bike... including the rear wheel and LR HD motor.

otherwise the bike will stay the same.

I HAVE ORDERED A 26" HUB MOTOR for this bike as I would like to have a bike with a pedal drive train so I can assist it for long trips and get my left knee back into good health. I thought about this long an hard for a few weeks since I have a few extra motors I could have used for a mid drive setup, but I would rather a nice quiet hub motor with 26" wheel making it easy to swap over and use the same 55amps controller that's mounted and program it down to 35amps.

Every since I started dabbling into the direct/mid mount motors I've enjoyed the amazing power output but have also missed being able to pedal along and take a nice long "road trip" I've noticed how lazy it has made me and I would like a bike that has nice components that I can get out and ride when I want some exercise. Also since I crashed this bike 6 months ago I have been unable to put pressure on my left leg while pedaling a normal bike and I think it needs a lot of rehab to get back to standard.

I should have the motor by the end of next week and it will only take me about 2 hours to get it ready and rolling!

Edit: looks like tracking says it will be here Monday!

Hacking the old motor bracket off
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Last edited by skeetab5780 on Aug 24 2017 2:23pm, edited 1 time in total.

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skeetab5780   10 MW

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Re: LR Direct Drive Genesis

Post by skeetab5780 » Aug 16 2017 7:12am

There is a lot of 17" steel VOLOCI wheel sets(front/rear) on EBay for a great price of $100 a set free shipping! This is not my sale, just spreading the word!
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Set-of-Voloci-e ... 1438.l2649

This rear wheel used the same famous 135mm dual disc hub used by me and many other ES members, with beast thru axle included! It is worth it alone to buy the set for the rear hub. The front wheel is a QR so you will likely have to re lace it to a 20mm thru axle but it is simple an I've done it easily with no experience.
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Note these wheels are bomb proof and are steel! They add a decent amount of weight to the build but can handle 20kw no problem

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Re: LR Direct Drive Genesis

Post by Warren » Aug 16 2017 9:31am

Did you know that by chopping off the XLR, you can't use the USB cable for over the air updates, or set up custom charge profiles from your computer? You could buy a second charge cable with the XLR, however.

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skeetab5780   10 MW

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Re: LR Direct Drive Genesis

Post by skeetab5780 » Aug 16 2017 11:10am

Warren wrote:Did you know that by chopping off the XLR, you can't use the USB cable for over the air updates, or set up custom charge profiles from your computer? You could buy a second charge cable with the XLR, however.
I did not know that but I don't feel like i'm missing out on much. I guess next time they should send what I actually order heh

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Re: LR Direct Drive Genesis

Post by StinkyGoalieGuy » Aug 17 2017 7:42pm

skeetab5780 wrote:There is a lot of 17" steel VOLOCI wheel sets(front/rear) on EBay for a great price of $100 a set free shipping! This is not my sale, just spreading the word!
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Set-of-Voloci-e ... 1438.l2649

This rear wheel used the same famous 135mm dual disc hub used by me and many other ES members, with beast thru axle included! It is worth it alone to buy the set for the rear hub. The front wheel is a QR so you will likely have to re lace it to a 20mm thru axle but it is simple an I've done it easily with no experience.
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Note these wheels are bomb proof and are steel! They add a decent amount of weight to the build but can handle 20kw no problem
Thanks for the tip. Got a recommendation for a knobby moto tire to fit those wheels?

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skeetab5780   10 MW

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Re: LR Direct Drive Genesis

Post by skeetab5780 » Aug 18 2017 5:51am

I've always used Michelin Gazelle tires they are sort of like a dual sport enduro tire good for packed trail/road use

one they get into mud and sand they aren't the best

I think Shinko might make one more aggressive

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skeetab5780   10 MW

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Re: Direct Drive Genesis

Post by skeetab5780 » Aug 21 2017 10:36am

So its a sad day but its all for a good cause... Was able to get the bike up and running with the hub motor this weekend and got out for a nice long 25 mile ride while pedal assisting the entire ride. I wanted to try and kill the batteries all day but while also assisting to try for max range... This was all well and good until about 20 miles in when my ass hurt so bad from pedaling that I cut the trip short. I did just upgrade to the new cloud 9 seat and I do like it, but I think it had more to do with the shorts I chose to wear.

This is just a cheap 28mm hub off Ebay for $149 I seem to buy one of these every year now and sell it in the winter haha...
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Its not nearly as strong as the LR motor, the torque from a stop is laughable in comparison, but it is extremely quiet and lets me pedal with the bike and get exercise!
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I will have to sort out the rear brakes sooner than later
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Im getting pretty good with these Kelly controllers I guesses the hall/phase combo first try!
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Took off the old trusty rusty LR motor bracket :(
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My bicycle chain is not long enough, and im definitely not riding this pig with no pedal power~!
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Ended up putting a few links from another chain in the mix to fix things. Ended up taking another 4 links out after this pic was taken to tighten it up
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Using the derailur as a chain tensioner at the moment and do not have any gears, I was scared climbing one large hill out of a 25 mile ride but it climbed it decent...
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Tackled the rear brake caliper before heading out for the day, im glad I did I really hate riding with no rear brake
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Ended up using a 160mm spacer with tons of washers here and there...
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This is about 15miles into the ride at Brooks pond
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Lake shot
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All in all it was a great day and I used 9ah out of the 12ah pack I had brought along, the LVC buzzer did not sound and I did not hit controller LVC. I did however program the controller down to only 50% output since this motor is tiny and id rather not fry it with 55amps. Everything went well.

I have to check my regen settings since it doesn't seem to coast down hills to well, I know the auto regen when throttle is off is not enabled so I think that's just how it is...its been a while since I've coasted a heavy DD hub motor bike.
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Re: Direct Drive Genesis

Post by skeetab5780 » Aug 23 2017 11:02am

I forgot to add that I cut my left knee pretty bad about 10 miles into the ride by hitting it on my LIPO batteries while pedaling. Now that this bike is set back up for pedal I am going to rethink the battery location and possible go down to 48v eventually. You cannot even pedal at 48v top speed as it is nevermind 18s

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Re: Direct Drive Genesis

Post by RageNR » Sep 04 2017 5:53am

Havn't had a chance to read through your entire thread, but have read several pages so far.

Quick note: You said this is your 1st time buying on Amazon. I would go back and look at your purchase and see who the seller for your charger was. Amazon does not sell everything direct, as many 3rd party sellers list items for sale on the site. It is likely you bought your charger from a 3rd party seller, unknowingly.
So I would not blame Amazon for the issues with the order, UNLESS your purchase says "Fulfilled by Amazon". This means that the 3rd party seller shipped their item for sale to Amazon, and Amazon holds the item in their warehouse and ships to buyer directly when you order.
Even if you bought the item directly from a 3rd party seller, Amazon's customer service is top notch. Just call them up and let them know you had an issue with the order, and they usually do everything in their power to satisfy the customer.
Just thought I would give you some insight since this is your 1st experience with them. :D


Anyhow, I actually intended to ask a question instead of giving a lecture. :roll: :mrgreen:
I was wondering where you purchased your RockShox fork? I am still on the hunt for a good fork to replace the loose noodle on my Mantra. 150mm is way too long though, I think. 120mm is what I feel will fit the bike and fit the type of riding I am building the bike for.
It's got a straight steerer, so I am having a hard time finding something suitable. And if I am going to be spending $300 on a fork, it better be top notch.
MOVE IT YOU BI-PEDALING OBSTRUCTIONS!!!!!!! RAAAAGGGGGEEEEEEEEE
My Klein Mantra mid-drive Cyclone build thread: https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 28&t=81052

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skeetab5780   10 MW

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Re: Direct Drive Genesis

Post by skeetab5780 » Sep 04 2017 7:52am

Ya you are correct amazon had nothing to do with the sale i think it was a subsidiary of ebikes.ca

Here is a link to the fork i bought
https://www.niagaracycle.com/categories ... lack-1-1-8
Unfortunately they say out of stock and price is $10.03 higher. I paid $379 shipped and then i also had to buy a 15mm front wheel and downhill tire which i sourced off ebay

It is a really nice fork and makes the entire bike look better :) people might actually try to steal it now!

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skeetab5780   10 MW

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Re: Direct Drive Genesis

Post by skeetab5780 » Sep 12 2017 8:54am

So I got my 36v 4.4ah packs in the mail that everyone seems to be raving about! Im going to use two or three on the genesis commuter bike now!

Problem is I soldered my xt connector on my first Kelly controller backwards so now I have to change all my terminations one and for all to make them right! It wasn't a problem until I got a totally different battery system now both using the satiator bulk charger to charge.
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I used one in this sweet razor scooter build I did for a friends kid and it worked very well!
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DanGT86   10 kW

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Re: Direct Drive Genesis

Post by DanGT86 » Sep 13 2017 9:14am

I missed the raving. Where did those packs come from?

Nice work on the scooter. I picked up the same one at a garage sale and rode it at 36v using that greenworks pack I got from you. Its actually kinda fun at 36v. The start is a bit abrupt because you have to be rolling first so it's a bit of a surprise when it kicks in.

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