CYCLONE MOTOR OVERHEATING

Hi everyone,
I purchased a 1680w 48v mid mount motor and kelly controller from cyclone about 6 months ago and set it up on my bike. ever since i put it on the bike it has always overheated very quickly and cut out.(i might get a couple of km out of it if i go easy on it before it cuts out) i cut the wires and hard wired it when i initially put it on the bike. i am using a em3ev battery which is 16.4AH 50v high power type (20R Cell) if the type of battery makes any difference. i contacted cyclone about the problem and they told me i needed to program the controller to 70% but i could not connect the controller to the computer for some reason so they sent me a cyclone 40a controller. i wired that up and it was a lot slower and it still overheated.. cyclone thought that the motor was stuffed from being used at 100% so they sent me another motor which i have just wired up and tried out to find that it makes absolutely no difference. :x has anyone else had this problem or have any idea why it might be doing it because i'm almost over it...

You could buy a heatsink from AFT, presumably they use them for the same reasons. But at the end of the day you most likely just need to adjust your riding style. If you are lugging the motor- ie: taking off in top gear instead of granny. I know from rc cars that using too tall gearing overheats the motor and speed controller every time. Use your gears more and see what difference it makes.

If you are already using your gears a lot eg: changing up gears every time you slow down, changing up up hills instead of just going full speed everywhere, then check for other things like too tight chain or brakes causing constant drag.

I use the 1680w motor and kelly controller and em3ev 20ah 58v pack and ive never had the motor or esc overheat, not even close. I use easy gears at all times to avoid straining the system too much though- it not only helps wear and tear on gears and chains but gives heaps better mileage out of your battery. I have had 100km range out of the 20ah. All depends how hard you strain/lug that motor. Ya might just have to slow down a bit

50kmh up hill in 10th gear = overheat, 25kmh up hill in 5th gear = warm, 10kmh up hill in first gear = cold
Remember its still less power than a 50cc minibike. Where a small petrol motor will just bog down and you would have to change gear, an electric will keep pulling because of the torque, but it puts massive strain on the electrics and produces huge killer heat.
Use higher (lower? closer to granny) gears, accelerate smoothly, listen for the change in motor noise as it starts straining on hills and change up through the gears to keep the motor buzzing along happily and easily, and see if its any better.

What gearing and speeds are you using? And you weight?

I have same motor with the AFT upgrades and 25r cells. Was using lipos prior. Below is link to screenshots from my Kelly controller. Maybe you can setup the same. It might help. Would certainly help to get the cooling fins. As others mentions, how you ride makes a difference. I've been riding my hard though and it's only cut out once in past year.

http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=57337#p865010

Hi Hennez,
I know almost nothing about the Cyclone motors or kits, but if I am right they use brushless motors. If so, and if they have Hall Effect sensors, it is possible that you have an incorrect wiring combination on your hall sensors. That can allow the motor to run but with incorrect timing information it draws high current and runs inefficiently.
You say you hard-wired the kit, so it is possible the wiring combination got swapped round.

Another possibility is a damaged Hall sensor or wiring.

If you have access to a multimeter or other ammeter, or have an ammeter on your installation, you could measure the battery current draw unloaded with the back wheel in the air. If this is higher than expected, that would indicate a wiring or damage problem (or excessive mechanical friction, but that is unlikely). Sorry, I do not know what the current should be.. others on the forum might be able to help.

I am NOT an expert in brushless motors.. just throwing ideas around that might help identify the problem.

Good luck with resolving the problem.
Drum

You could also try just running it unloaded for a couple of minutes, just spinning it with the wheel off the ground, everything should stay cold. If you get heat from motor or controller it could definitely be a wiring thing.
I just guessed you were pushing it too hard as thats the only time mines ever gotten remotely hot.
Check for hot wiring joints which could suggest a bad connection, if its all good try and get a wiring diagram and make sure its wired right.

hennez said:

Hi everyone,
has anyone else had this problem or have any idea why it might be doing it because i'm almost over it...

Click to expand...

There is only one simple way to solve this problem completely
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=56666&p=845919

Thanks for all the replys!

i have tried both types of cooling fins from cyclone and neither made any noticable difference..
gearing: 14t on motor 32&44t on front and 6 th gear on back on 10 speed bike. rider weight 95kg
I cannot connect the kelly controller to the computer.. i have got the right lead and have installed the interface and tried it with the motor on and off and the switch on and off and it just wont connect. it says there is no controller connected or detected or something.. if anyone could help me out on that it would be great!
i checked the ampmeter on the bike with the motor going flatout with the back wheel in the air and it is drawing 6.8A.. if thats normal or not i wouldnt have a clue.
i have put a new motor on so the hall sensors should be fine. i wired it all up off a diagram from cyclone so im assuming it is correct. and i only cut and joint one wire at a time so im almost sure the wiring is right..
i ran it flatout for a few minutes with the back wheel off the ground after 2-3 minuites it started to get warmish and after about 10minutes it was quite hot. is this abnormal?
any other suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

I connected my kelly just with an old monitor cable i had lying around after the ebay adapter didnt work and the older style cable worked perfectly. If youve got any old pc cables maybe give it a try? Or ask at a computer shop for an old one.
It sounds like it might need to be programmed back a bit from 100%, i cant remember exactly what the AFT stock setup was, but follow Drew's parameters and ya should be sweet.
If you've done everything else right, which it sounds like you have, it must just be getting too much juice! Pretty sure mines only set at about 80% motor and battery power or something like that.

ive actually got it connected to a 40a cyclone controller at the moment which is a lot less powerfull than the kelly controller. doesnt even do monos any more
im assuming the small wires that come out of the motor are the hall sensor wires.. they are not hard wired as they are still connected with the plug. ive checked the three main wires from the motor and they are all correct. the throttle and the bike computer are both hard wired but are both working fine. is there any possibility of the wiring being wrong as it seems like that could be the only thing that is wrong with it. The wires going from the battery are a lot larger than the wires on the motor and are also quite long as they go to my backpack if theres any chance that this could be causing the problem

Long wires shouldnt have any adverse effect other than very very slight power loss over shorter leads.
Does the motor seem to run smoothly? Ive experienced a hub motor with a dud hall sensor and it was "rough" under acceleration. If yours pulls smoothly and everything works as it should the wiring is probably right. The only other suggestion i have is to double check the plugs, make sure none of the pins have been pushed back out of the plug or anything, which can sometimes happen with certain plugs, so they get bad contact.
If it all looks good, experiment with short shifting and keeping the rpm lower on the motor and check temps. If you cant program the cyclone controller ya might just have to ride it gentler if its still overheating.

it overheats no matter how easy i go on it unless i just dont ride it :x

If you're out of ideas you could try pulling it apart and replacing the grease in the gearbox with a little light gear oil, but it sounds like something else is wrong. Maybe get the kelly to program and drop the power, but if it cooks even taking it slow that might do no good.
Send it back and get an AFT version.

i have asked for a refund but if i send it back they probably wont even give me a refund...

ihave been using cyclone 1600 watt motors for about three years.... using 40 to 46v 20amp batteries... sped between 40 to 50kph.. my weifgt 150lbs... head heat probs until i used thr cyclone heat sinks... no further problems.. used nuvinci and DD drives

hello
try to reduce the maximum speed over the controller- normaly it should not get warmer than 80°

Hi
The other thing that may help is the heat transfer paste or heat sink paste.
This stuff works.

I know this is an old topic....

I have built several Cyclone 650-1680W eBikes and had major heat issues with a couple using the EM3ev 960W 48V triangle battery and light weight Kelly 24-60V programmable controller.

This one eats those now discontinued no refund/repair -101 Kelly controllers.



It suffered from overheating as well.
Shut it off for a bit, turn it back and go for a bit.

Granted a heavy bike rode hard but when running 1/2 the rated power of the controller and motor a joke it should even if this Phoenix in the summer.

This one isn't near as heavy and used up North in cooler temps, but he pulls a trailer with his kids in it up alot of hills and it overheats all the time even pedaling.



Anyone know of some motor HEAT SINKS beside the ones Cyclone sells?

I can't seem to find anything and though I can easily program the controller, I don't want to nutter the either more than 1/2 it is Supposed to take ya know?

Anyone know of some motor HEAT SINKS beside the ones Cyclone sells?

Click to expand...

AFT makes some large cooling fins see here:

http://www.aft-ebike.com/upgrades.html

Also they have lots of other upgrades for the cyclone stuff like hardened or plastic gears etc.

I have been considering trying some non conductive liquid inside the motor to conduct the heat from the stator
to the housing more efficiently. i thing the heat sinks would do a much better job if the hot bits were in "contact" if you
know what i mean. Anyone tried this sort of thing before?

Fredorbea said:

I have been considering trying some non conductive liquid inside the motor to conduct the heat from the stator
to the housing more efficiently. i thing the heat sinks would do a much better job if the hot bits were in "contact" if you
know what i mean. Anyone tried this sort of thing before?

Click to expand...

I am sure that there are threads about that on this forum. Just search around bud
And as far I know it only really works good when used in a low rpm motor

Yeah I have read about people doing it to hub motors but you're right they are a lot lower rpm than a mid. Ego say that they run a special gel to get 3000w out of their motors. Just a thought at the moment.

Im running a similar setup 51V 40A, but the big difference is gearing, I have 14T to 48T and would only ever get the motor to 4th or 5th gear at a max speed of 55km/h. Most of the time I am riding in 2nd and 3rd. The way to tell if you are in the right gear is if the motor is spinning fast, basically start in 1st or 2nd, once you've out of revs then switch down. If I were to ride in 6th gear mine would overheat too, the efficiency is super low so more then half the power will be ending up as heat, so its not long before the motor will over heat.

i have 36v 960w cyclone (nuvinci)i think yours is same motor (48v & not helping it seems a lot for a small motor).yes one must keep the revs up especialy going up hill , never replace gear box with ordinary grease or oil as i did as thats the one i wore out quickest(has a glue like grease), at least br paco has changed motors for you he wont change controllers for me , my cyclone (smaller motor one 500w ) controller the lVC cuts motor out as soon as battery lowers in volts . Sold it cheap to me because its rubbish .Thinking all cylone is but am stuck with 24v LiFePo4 battery.

Hi,
I solved my overheating problems by using the correct gear (for the engine, not for my legs). Now I run cyclone 1680w at 2100w with no problem.

Check it out, maybe my solution can help you
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=73027