Bafang BBS02 with torque sensor

HDMW

1 mW
Joined
Feb 24, 2015
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16
Hello List :
Eric's remarks in his review of the Bionx hub at Electricbike describes the riding experience I'm looking for.
https://www.electricbike.com/bionx/

"The BionX has the torque sensor integrated into the motor axle. The BionX patented torque sensor is known to be one of the best in the industry. Also the BionX software is spot on. This all equates to a really fine pedal assist experience. The BionX does a terrific job of blending electric assist with your pedaling power".

The Bafang sensor page shows a combined torque and speed sensor.
http://www.szbaf.com/en/components/sensor.html

Would this go some way towards offering the sort of riding experience described above?

Having to cut power to change gear which some describe or control the motor with a throttle both are not appealing.

Best Wishes : Hubert Wagner
France
 
Note that both the BionX and Neo systems use rear hub motors. Since the power is being directly input into the rear wheel, the pedal/drive cranks are left free to be used for sensing human power input. The BBS02 mid drive system motor drives the front chain wheel to drive the bike, which would make it hard for any normal BB torque sensor to function. I am definitely not a physicist like others here, but it it seems to me like a torque sensor for a BBS02 mid drive system would have to sense human power being input to the pedal cranks or pedals themselves, and not through the BB. Another possibly may be to have a torque sensor in the rear hub that subtracts the power input that is being provided from the motor so that the level contributed by the human can be determined. I wonder if the Bafang torque sensor you linked is only for use with their hub motors?

I am sure that the real technical people on this forum will have interesting ideas about this.
(Typo edit)
 
I'm guessing that the torque sensor is for their new Bosch-like mid-drive which isn't compatible with a normal BB.

Although after actually reading the page it seems I need to eat my words as it says, "The BAFANG torque sensor makes for a reliable torque measurement. The BAFANG speed sensor measures the speed with the highest precision. Both sensors are ideally matched to all BAFANG drive systems. They make for a smooth support of the overall systems – no matter for which application. "

But how would it be possible to fit this to a BBS02?
 
Bafang has already done what you're asking for in their Bafang MAX mid drive system, which has an integrated torque sensor. But I believe that this system is like Bosch, in that it requires a custom frame, and is targeted towards the OEM market.

So the technology is there...It's just a matter of whether or not Bafang wants to package it for the retrofit market.
 
Obviously not.

which is shame, since decent e-bikes with good components and integrated engines are way too expensive if you ask me.

Avitt said:
Bafang has already done what you're asking for in their Bafang MAX mid drive system, which has an integrated torque sensor. But I believe that this system is like Bosch, in that it requires a custom frame, and is targeted towards the OEM market.

So the technology is there...It's just a matter of whether or not Bafang wants to package it for the retrofit market.
 
Exactly. It is a real shame Bafang don't have a torque sensor option for the BBSHD. They have lost at least one customer. If Tongsheng can do it for a universal mid drive and have it ride so well you'd think Bafang could also do it.

lokz said:
Obviously not.

which is shame, since decent e-bikes with good components and integrated engines are way too expensive if you ask me.

Avitt said:
Bafang has already done what you're asking for in their Bafang MAX mid drive system, which has an integrated torque sensor. But I believe that this system is like Bosch, in that it requires a custom frame, and is targeted towards the OEM market.

So the technology is there...It's just a matter of whether or not Bafang wants to package it for the retrofit market.
 
raylo32 said:
It is a real shame Bafang don't have a torque sensor option for the BBSHD. They have lost at least one customer. If Tongsheng can do it for a universal mid drive and have it ride so well you'd think Bafang could also do it.

Is it a shame that the BBSHD doesn't allow your bike to fly into the air over traffic? That it doesn't make coffee? It's only designed to do what it does. If you know how to integrate a torque sensor into the BBSHD, say so. Heck, tell Bafang how to do it.

TSDZ2 features a torque sensor, but it's also an unreliable, poorly designed, breaky sucky piece of crap. If that's the cost of integrating torque sensing at that price point, please count me out.
 
And I an not a Tonsheng (or anything else) fanboy. It could have more power... it could handle heat a lot better... and I hope the torque sensor holds up (never had a problem with mine) but it doesn't look too $$ or difficult to replace if it does fail. But it does ride like a real bike, especially with the OSF. To me the ideal combo for this class bike would be the excellent BBSHD motor with a torque sensing BB. Bafang make one for their integrated motors. It shouldn't be hard for them to adapt that tech to the BBSHD.

Chalo said:
Is it a shame that the BBSHD doesn't allow your bike to fly into the air over traffic? That it doesn't make coffee? It's only designed to do what it does. If you know how to integrate a torque sensor into the BBSHD, say so. Heck, tell Bafang how to do it.

TSDZ2 features a torque sensor, but it's also an unreliable, poorly designed, breaky sucky piece of crap. If that's the cost of integrating torque sensing at that price point, please count me out.
 
Chalo said:
TSDZ2 features a torque sensor, but it's also an unreliable, poorly designed, breaky sucky piece of crap. If that's the cost of integrating torque sensing at that price point, please count me out.


Im a BMW/Land Rover guy at heart, so i don't mind these trade offs. Just got a new tacoma for work but its funny because i find all these things that i know your typical BMW buyer would bring it to the dealer for that I let slide cause its a toyota. In general though i prefer ride quality over reliability
 
I work at a shop that sells Trek and Specialized and we have a demo model Trek Rail 7. Quality torque sensing capability is a worthy pursuit as they deliver a pretty awesome performance and intuitive response. That said, I thought the BBSHD I installed in my long travel mountain bike was going to be mediocre at best, especially for decently serious off road use. After a few rides and programming inputs, I'm pleasantly surprised how good this thing is. Other MTB guys at the shop are shocked how good it is and how it compares to the Bosch torque sensing Trek.

Out of the box and without brake sensors, I found the BBSHD to be extremely "raw" in the sense of herky-jerky power delivery on acceleration and shut-off into and out of trail corners or over technical terrain. However, on pavement or smooth dirt roads it was more than adequate in those situations as delivered. It was only in technical off road conditions that it kind of sucked. I don't think most people are using these for really aggressive mountain biking, so torque sensing probably isn't that critical. The reprogramming, however, can deliver some amazing parallels to torque sensing if you pursue that. To be honest, I can't see why people who aren't doing technical off road wouldn't be totally happy with a properly programmed BBSHD as far as power delivery is concerned.

Still, quality torque sensing is the holy grail of power delivery, and I admit that I would prefer a Bafang Ultra...or whatever other numbers those models go by...nestled up into my frame for the power it provides, the higher profile clearance issue, and the torque sensing. That said, I am more than just pleased with how the BBSHD is working out even for actual mountain biking.
 
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