Small and big block rickshaw motors on Amazon.

Ecyclist

1 kW
Joined
Apr 1, 2016
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480
Location
San Diego, California
StinkyGoalieGuy said:
Nice find! What's that black section between the core and the output shaft? Planetary gearbox?

Answering my own question. If I expand out the listing, it mentions "Gear ratio: 6:1", so that must be a gearbox. I wonder if it would be easy to remove the gear reduction and that blue cover on the back which I assume is a fan. Otherwise, this would be too wide to fit in between the cranks.
 
Yes, you can take it all out. This is exactly the same motor that LR is selling for $250/$350 and that without a controller.
And you better be nice or he will not sell it to you. :shock:
 
Just bought mine thanks!
 
Bigger than Cyclone 3kW and 2-4kW, with a lot less torque and a fraction of the power? What am I missing? Is the controller just a place holder for the real thing?
 
Chalo said:
Bigger than Cyclone 3kW and 2-4kW, with a lot less torque and a fraction of the power? What am I missing?

If they are anything like the ones I bought for a similar price from aliexpress, there is a lot of empty space inside.

The stator height is the same as the cyclone 3k at 30mm. Air gap diameter is also the same. 10 magnets. From memory the phase to phase winding resistance is about 65 mohm.

This is what it looks like inside.

eLUQ7zB.jpg


ge3KZKv.jpg
 
Chalo said:
Bigger than Cyclone 3kW and 2-4kW, with a lot less torque and a fraction of the power? What am I missing? Is the controller just a place holder for the real thing?
Price and compactness. Both are very important for a light e-bike build. Now if you planning to build e-tractor Cyclone is a way to go. :)
 
SwampDonkey said:
Its a clone of the cyclone (Denzel D4500) motors.

http://www.eastgem.net/d4500.html
Chinese motors are all clones. With these motors it is impassible to tell which one is better because Chinese will cut corners every time they make something. Still for $100 with controller they might be worth the risk.
 
SwampDonkey said:
Its a clone of the cyclone (Denzel D4500) motors.
or the cyclones are clones of something else, or both.

there are so many clones, and clones of the clones, etc. etc., of just about anything you can imagine, that unless you actually *know* "for sure" and/or have the original product, it's difficult to tell which is what and who is where and when. ;)
 
In China there is no way to tell what came first the egg or the chicken, unless it is a fake egg. These definitely come first and chickens are not part of the process. Check that out :shock: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QvEBN8Jd5DE
 
So... who's used one of these motors, and how did it go?

They still have a few of the small "500W" ones left, though they're sold out of the big ones.
 
You can buy now on Amazon the 750W with controller for $99.00 shipping included.
I know, I know it's a Chinese junk, but so is everything else.
https://www.amazon.com/Electric-Brushless-Tricycle-Controller-Reduction/dp/B07XNXC6VV/ref=asc_df_B07XNXC6VV/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=398612344534&hvpos=1o2&hvnetw=g&hvrand=1094165617907504911&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9061208&hvtargid=pla-843929992078&psc=1&tag=&ref=&adgrpid=84812084855&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvadid=398612344534&hvpos=1o2&hvnetw=g&hvrand=1094165617907504911&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9061208&hvtargid=pla-843929992078
 
Here's another version:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07WVTHS8F?psc=1&pf_rd_p=d920f245-16d7-4d66-8ff3-66ebfa3d00fd&pf_rd_r=X65G8FSYZ0WENARF4DTJ
This one says it's 600RPM output from the built-in gearbox. Don't know if the ratio in it's specs is that of it's gearbox, or the recommended ratio for it's output sprocket to the input sprocket of the system it's driving? Has no torque output rating listing.
Voltage: 48V DC
Output: 750W
Rated Current: 20A
Rated Speed: 600RPM
Gear Ratio: 6:1


The one linked in the rpevious posts says it's around 2800RPM (3100 unloaded), no gearbox (if there is one, it doesn't say that explicitly, and it's high rpm implies that the "gear ratio" given below is a recommended one for it's output sprocket ot a system input sprocket?).
Rated voltage: 48V DC
Output: 750W
Rated current: 15A
No load current: ≤3.0A
Rated speed: 2800RPM
No load speed: 3100RPM
Gear ratio: 5.6 : 1
Drive sprocket: 420-14T
Rated torque: 2.56 N.m



Looks like these use 14T 420 chain output sprockets, so plenty of relatively cheap chain and sprocket options for the other end of things.

I wonder if one of these might be able to run the SB Cruiser trike, thru a 3-speed IGH, for up to 20MPH? (which takes around 900-1000w to maintain, depending on wind/etc.)

And if so, I wonder if any of them would be able to provide enough torque (without destroying the IGH, presently an old Sachs Torpedo 3speed) to get the trike quickly started up from a stop.

Presently it takes around 4kW battery power into two big heavy 450x MXUS hubmotors in 20" (22"-ish actual) wheels to get the heavy trike from 0-20MPH in under 5 seconds.


I poked around at the simulator here
https://www.ebikes.ca/tools/simulator.html?add=true&blue=Lbs&motor=MX4503&motor_b=MX4504&batt=cust_52_0.45_40&batt_b=cust_52_0.45_40&cont=C35&cont_b=C35&wheel=22i&wheel_b=22i&mass=227&hp=0&bopen=true&hp_b=0&mass_b=227&axis=mph
which shows at startup I am probably getting around 125Lbs of thrust*. At 20MPH it's about 10Lbs, once throttled down to just maintain speed.

Assuming Lbs thrust is the same as Lb-ft, then that's 169.5Nm, and 13.6Nm.

The non-geared motor above says it's 2.56Nm output. If I use a sprocket ratio from 14to get around 100RPM max on the input of the IGH, from the ~2800RPM motor speed, that's 28:1 reduction? So 28 x 2.56 is 71.68Nm. That's only a bit less than half the startup torque needed to match my present acceleration rate, right?

I could change the gearing on the output of the IGH (or input at the wheel) for more torque, but I wouldn't get enough speed that way. (there isn't room for a shiftable drivetrain like a derailer at the wheel, and it probably wouldn't survive very long if I did have one).

However...if the motor itself doesn't have a gearbox, and it's shaft and gear can handle the torque, I can probably put bursts of 1500w thru it which may well make enough torque output to come close to what I already get?

I expect the IGH itself is probably not going to survive this long, either...I'd probably have to put two in parallel. Most likley it's better to use a bigger motor capable of more torque at the higher speed, and put it in the drivetrain past the IGH.

But...these things are a bit appealing in that there's a lot less DIY than using some other motor (hubmotor outside a wheel, powerchair motor, etc etc).

* the simulator appears to have a bug? It will not allow choosing anything ohter than Lbs thrust when using the Add mode and two motors. Not sure if convert Lbs thrust to Newton-meters same as Lb-ft (which is Lb-ft x 1.3558? )
 
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