Finalizing my build, a couple questions.

Ok, so I've got the bike:


now ive gotta figure out the build. im leaning towards getting the 1500w waterproof kit from ebikeling. ive currently got the 1200, and wish it was a bit faster, especially in wind etc, but according to the website the 1200 provides 30 nm torque, whereas the 1500 provides 40 nm torque. so i would think it would fare a bit better. im not looking to double my speed or anything, just need it a bit better. i did have some issues with spokes breaking on the 1200w kit, but once i replaced a few spokes with thicker ones from my old kit, that stopped happening, so i should be able to do that again if needed.

unless someone knows a better similar option?


im also debating a bit where on the bike to mount the battery (shark type or similar). if you look close, theres the brackets that the brake and other cables fit into that stick out slightly past the underside on the downtube. which prevents the battery from being mounted flush with the underside of the downtube except in between them, where it does fit. i tested the suspension with an empty case velcroed there, and theres probably about 1/2 to 1 cm clearance when fully compressed, but i dont think it would bottom out with normal riding, im not doing 20 foot jumps or anything. i found a bracket on grin's site, https://www.ebikes.ca/shop/electric-bicycle-parts/battery-accessories/double-bob.html, which should give it clearance over those brackets to mount it lower down on the downtube, but im waiting on an answer from them on whether it can be screwed into cage mounts or not. i live in brooklyn, ny, and leave my bike unattended while shopping etc, so i dont want it to be attached only by hose clamps, thats too easy to undo. (i know, the battery could be kicked off if someone really wanted it, but thats more obvious and less likely imo.)

another thought was to attach to the underside of the top tube. would that work? or is it not sloped enough?


as far as the battery itself, i was thinking to upgrade to a 52v battery. this should also give me a bit more speed and range, and still be compatible without any special controller, correct? i was initially thinking to get the 52v 13.5 ah shark from luna, but the controller on the 1500w kit is rated for 35 amps and that battery is rated for only 30 amps. this would be a problem, correct? i found a similar 52v 14.5 ah from grin in canada which is rated for 40 amps. this would be good, right? of course, once i was looking around there, i saw the 52v 20 ah battery with similar shape, but taller. (i was also looking at the dire wolf on luna, but it doesnt look like it locks and i dont think the shape would work as well on that frame.) one thought, though, was that if im mounting it on the underside of one of the tubes, will the plastic tabs that hold the battery in place be strong enough for such a large battery? or should i stick to the smaller hailong 1 type if mounting on the underside? if i got the bracket and mounted it lower down on the downtube (or under the top tube) then i think clearance wouldnt be an issue. im just worried about the larger battery falling off since its not as well suppoorted upside down.

thanks.

Looks like a good bike. You spoke issue seems a bit odd. Normally a well tensioned spoke can take most abuse from a hub motor setup, even if it is 14 guage etc...

I can't confirm but I'm actually surprise to read that the 1500W is "Motor Wheel Weight 15.3lbs" and the 1200W is "Motor Wheel Weight 12.9lbs". I would have expected them to use the same motor but with different controllers. That said, you could keep the 1200W motor and use it at 35A (1500W). The motor would generate a bit more heat but an increase of 300W isn't much unless you are climbing steep, long hills.

Take a look at RivNuts for mounting a shark pack etc... Hook an loop straps (aka Velcro) also work wonders for extra pack grip too.

Grin Tech is great. Can't go wrong with them. You may want to take a look at em3ev.com as well. I've purchased a few of their battery packs over the years and they are top notch. Go with the highest capacity, best performing pack you can afford and it.

pwd said:

Looks like a good bike. You spoke issue seems a bit odd. Normally a well tensioned spoke can take most abuse from a hub motor setup, even if it is 14 guage etc...

I can't confirm but I'm actually surprise to read that the 1500W is "Motor Wheel Weight 15.3lbs" and the 1200W is "Motor Wheel Weight 12.9lbs". I would have expected them to use the same motor but with different controllers. That said, you could keep the 1200W motor and use it at 35A (1500W). The motor would generate a bit more heat but an increase of 300W isn't much unless you are climbing steep, long hills.

Take a look at RivNuts for mounting a shark pack etc... Hook an loop straps (aka Velcro) also work wonders for extra pack grip too.

Grin Tech is great. Can't go wrong with them. You may want to take a look at em3ev.com as well. I've purchased a few of their battery packs over the years and they are top notch. Go with the highest capacity, best performing pack you can afford and it.

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i think part of the problem is they didnt come tensioned properly, although i took it to a local shop and they tensioned them, and a few more still broke after that. the included spokes i think were only 16g tho, whereas on my previous kit they were 14.

i do climb some steep hills sometimes.

yeah, im familiar with getting rivnuts installed, i had that done on one bike. will be getting some installed for this, the question is where. is hanging from the top tube a good place? i usually see them on or under the downtube when in the triangle but theres more space and no issue of clearance up there. a velcro strap for extra security is a great idea tho. i wouldnt rely on only that, but as a backup to support the weight thats great.

i saw em3ev, but theyre in australia arent they? isnt shipping from there going to take a long time, especially for the battery?


thanks.

ok, so actually i think im gonna order from em3ev in the end. MUCH cheaper than grin. surprisingly so. i mean, i expected it to be cheaper from china than canada, but its almost half the price for a 52v 17ah from them vs a 52v 20ah from grin. im not so sure the 20ah battery would fit anyway, but im preeetty sure i can fit the jumbo shark from em3ev under the downtube. the big problem now is ordering, i want to order two chargers (one to keep at work) but i cant figure out how to do that on their site, and they havent responded to my email yet. i dont see chargers available on their own, only as an add-on to a battery. anyone know how to add a second one on there?

Well I'm thinking that if you're not happy at 1200w, you'll barely notice a step up to 1500W.

Not that 2000w will be miraculous, but at about the same price as the inadequate 1500w. . . .

https://leafbike.com/products/beach-snow-fat-bike-kit/26-inch-60v-2000w-rear-hub-motor-beach-snow-fat-tire-bike-conversion-kit-1231.html

Dauntless said:

Well I'm thinking that if you're not happy at 1200w, you'll barely notice a step up to 1500W.

Not that 2000w will be miraculous, but at about the same price as the inadequate 1500w. . . .

https://leafbike.com/products/beach-snow-fat-bike-kit/26-inch-60v-2000w-rear-hub-motor-beach-snow-fat-tire-bike-conversion-kit-1231.html

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i did have that thought as well, but its still 25% more, and gives 33% more torque. i dont need a huge increase, although full on electric motorcycle would, of course, be awesome. but i think the moderate increase would be enough. and i dont want to go to a 72v battery, that would be larger and more expensive. this is a nice bike for converting overall, but battery placement is proving to be a bit of a challenge on it. i cutout some cardboard to approximate size and shape and taped it under the downtube and the front wheel did hit it slightly when compressed. it wasnt exact, though, so im hoping the battery will be slightly more sloped back or ill be able to mount it slightly lower. i can only test that once i have it tho. worse come to worst, ill mount it under the top tube.

not sure a fat tire would fit this frame, either...

The fat rear hub is too wide for your frame.

Note that your seatpost is bent, and the next thing that happens is it breaks off at an inopportune time.

Decent quality thin spokes, 2.0mm or thinner, are the kind that stay tight and don't break. If you're entertained by fixing your wheels, by all means continue with thick spokes. But if you want them reliable, 2.0/1.8mm double butted is about optimal.

Balmorhea said:

The fat rear hub is too wide for your frame.

Note that your seatpost is bent, and the next thing that happens is it breaks off at an inopportune time.

Decent quality thin spokes, 2.0mm or thinner, are the kind that stay tight and don't break. If you're entertained by fixing your wheels, by all means continue with thick spokes. But if you want them reliable, 2.0/1.8mm double butted is about optimal.

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im not sure if maybe the seatpost is meant to be bent back like that, ive seen some like that, but im planning on replacing it with a suspension post anyway.

im not sure exact thicknesses of the spokes, i have, i was guessing, but definitely the ones that came on the ebikeling kit were a bit thinner than the ones on my previous kit.

Returnformer said:

im not sure exact thicknesses of the spokes, i have, i was guessing, but definitely the ones that came on the ebikeling kit were a bit thinner than the ones on my previous kit.

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The spokes that come with most hub motor kits are cheap, shoddy Chinese garbage, and most of them are way too thick.

There are a few trustworthy makers of quality spokes: DT Swiss, Sapim, Wheelsmith, and Union/Marwi. Outside of those, assume they're trouble. You can get 12 gauge spokes from some of these companies, but if you aren't using motorcycle rims, it's a bad idea to use thicker than 14ga.

Balmorhea said:

Returnformer said:

im not sure exact thicknesses of the spokes, i have, i was guessing, but definitely the ones that came on the ebikeling kit were a bit thinner than the ones on my previous kit.

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The spokes that come with most hub motor kits are cheap, shoddy Chinese garbage, and most of them are way too thick.

There are a few trustworthy makers of quality spokes: DT Swiss, Sapim, Wheelsmith, and Union/Marwi. Outside of those, assume they're trouble. You can get 12 gauge spokes from some of these companies, but if you aren't using motorcycle rims, it's a bad idea to use thicker than 14ga.

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interesting, i wouldve thought thicker is better for spokes. why not?

Yeah, that seatpost is likely set too high. Won't break at the bend, but the frame itself may crack at the top, if not enough post is inside the frame.

Mount that shark battery under the top tube. Perfect center weight, doesn't matter if its not on the downtube, just put that weight in the center. So buy something that will fit there.

Returnformer said:

Balmorhea said:

[There are a few trustworthy makers of quality spokes: DT Swiss, Sapim, Wheelsmith, and Union/Marwi. Outside of those, assume they're trouble. You can get 12 gauge spokes from some of these companies, but if you aren't using motorcycle rims, it's a bad idea to use thicker than 14ga.

Click to expand...

interesting, i wouldve thought thicker is better for spokes. why not?

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Spokes have to stay tight to support the rim, and thick spokes aren’t good at that. The rim flexes a little bit when put under load, but a thick spoke isn’t stretchy enough to stay taut when that happens. So it gradually unscrews, or it frets at the spoke holes, or both. The wheel repeatedly loosens, spokes break, rim holes crack, hub holes tear out. If you try to tighten them in proportion to their size, like a motorcycle wheel, you’ll pucker, crack, or buckle the rim. A thick heavy spoke is to be used with a thick heavy rim, which deflects less and can withstand higher spoke tension.

For a strong bicycle wheel, you want the rim to be stiff and sturdy. The spokes should be thin, so they have enough compliance to stay with the rim as it moves under load. Cheap Chinese motor kits come with thick spokes because they can be made more cheaply, from inferior materials, and the inevitable problems occur some time after the kit has been sold.