Building a cargo EBike for Landscaping Business

Hello Endless Sphere!
I run a sustainable landscape business on Vancouver Island BC. I am hoping to be able to serve my weekly lawn care clients with an ebike. I have a WIKE landsacping trailer that fits my tools. Currently i have a Surly with BBS02 and Nuvinci N171. Great bike for around town, but not sturdy enough for heavy hauling.

Through business incentives i can get a RadWagon for $500. I have test ridden one and like the frame and design, however the motor system is sub par for my needs.

I need the bike to be capable of pulling a max of 450lbs up a hill (me, the bike, trailer, tools). Top speed is less important but without the trailer i would like to hit around 35-40km on flat ground. No faster than 25-30 with the trailer.

I am looking at the leaf motor 1500w casette direct drive, heard it can run up to 3000w at 72v. I will add statorade and cooling fins to whatever motor i get. It will also get laced into a moped rim with DOT tires.
Wondering if people think i should size up to something rated at 3000w, however i like the idea of keeping the pedal power gear range with a casette.

I am considering the Phaserunner set up with a Cycle Analyst. However i read it may not have enough power at the low end when starting on a hill. Also considering the Sabvoton, and Nucular looks interesting.

As for batteries, i already have 6x LiFePO4 A123 36V 8.2ah batteries. I would like to put 3 on each side of the cargo rack down low and combine them in parallel for 72v. Any information about the wiring for this would be appreciated. I will charge them in 2x 36v strings so that i am able to use my cycle satiator.
So the batteries will absolutely not be a weak link for this system.

Other things i am thinking about:
Would like to have one throttle that acts as a variable regenerative brake, so controller needs to be compatible.
Would a torque sensing bb be a bad idea on a system of this power? i much prefer it to the magnet sensor rings.

Thank you so much to anyone willing to help me out!

Cam @ Habitat Landscapes

Considering the weight and geography I think that's asking a lot of the 1500w Leaf, though others with direct experience with that particular motor can chime in for confirmation. Personally I'd go for a beefier motor with more copper fill for those kinds of loads and hills. Probably a high turn count QS205 or MXUS V3, depending on what your dropouts will accommodate. You may be able to retain some gearing if you go with the MXUS because of the narrower stator.

As for the batteries and voltage, if you've already got them they'll work fine. That said, voltage equals speed, so depending on turn count and wheel size you may not need 72v to get up to the speeds you require. You may actually find that running a 36v system with all of the packs in parallel gives you adequate speed and significantly increased range. I run a 72v Raptor, weighed in at nearly 280, pulled a trailer and could break every speed limit in the city... I also have a 24v bike that will putt along at 25kmh. For a cargo bike somewhere in the middle of that voltage range seems sensible to me. If you didn't already have batteries I'd suggest 48-52v, but here we are. Your call.

As for controllers, pick your poison. I prefer Nucular but a phaserunner may suit your needs as well. There are others, of course, but I like to buy quality once. Any good controller should be capable of variable regen fwiw, just add another hall sensor based "throttle" or brake lever and you'll be good to go.

E-tilitarian said:

I need the bike to be capable of pulling a max of 450lbs up a hill (me, the bike, trailer, tools). Top speed is less important but without the trailer i would like to hit around 35-40km on flat ground. No faster than 25-30 with the trailer.

I am looking at the leaf motor 1500w casette direct drive, heard it can run up to 3000w at 72v. I will add statorade and cooling fins to whatever motor i get. It will also get laced into a moped rim with DOT tires.
Wondering if people think i should size up to something rated at 3000w, however i like the idea of keeping the pedal power gear range with a casette.

Click to expand...

You need the biggest direct drive rear hub you can fit -- see XOFO DD45 Std. Statorade is great but cooling fins are a hack.

E-tilitarian said:

I am considering the Phaserunner set up with a Cycle Analyst. However i read it may not have enough power at the low end when starting on a hill. Also considering the Sabvoton, and Nucular looks interesting.

Click to expand...

Phaserunner and CA would be plug-and-play with the DD45 above and very well supported, and should be sufficient.

E-tilitarian said:

As for batteries, i already have 6x LiFePO4 A123 36V 8.2ah batteries. I would like to put 3 on each side of the cargo rack down low and combine them in parallel for 72v. Any information about the wiring for this would be appreciated. I will charge them in 2x 36v strings so that i am able to use my cycle satiator.
So the batteries will absolutely not be a weak link for this system.

Click to expand...

Any info on these packs? Sounds interesting -- must be cylindrical cells.
To confirm, you mean 3 packs will be paralleled, then two of those connected in series: 3p2s.

E-tilitarian said:

Other things i am thinking about:
Would like to have one throttle that acts as a variable regenerative brake, so controller needs to be compatible.

Click to expand...

The only separate ebike throttle that does this (there is an e-scooter) is not yet available here: https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/Wuxing-newest-half-twist-throttle-2_62067628818.html?spm=a2700.7724857.normal_offer.d_title.10417880bJhLV3
We currently have to use two separate throttles for this.

Using the cycle analyst and either the Phaserunner or the Grinfineon present series of controllers, your regular throttle can be the braking and the motoring control. When you hold the brake lever (or whatever switch you like to engage this mode), it changes the mode of the throttle from motor power control to variable regen brake control.


If you want it to work like say, the Vectrix, where you roll the throttle one way from the center detent it increases motor power, and if you roll the other way it increases braking, I think you're entering higher end controller territory, where you have a lot of programming and setup to get a working system. (Sevcon, ASI, etc). There might be others that would do it that I don't know about.

There are also things you could design and build to translate that "dual-mode" throttle into the dual throttle outputs needed for most of the controllers that already have a variable regen braking input and a throttle input.

E-tilitarian said:

I am looking at the leaf motor 1500w casette direct drive, heard it can run up to 3000w at 72v.

Click to expand...

Don't get the cassette version. The freewheel version has a larger and better axle, with better provision for a torque arm on the drive side. Also, freewheels are more robust and easier/cheaper to replace.

If your intention is to run it at 72v, be sure to get a special winding of the motor that will run efficiently at your desired speed.

Sounds to me like a good plan might be to add some more power with a front wheel motor. I mean keep the mid drive, but add wattage with a front motor too. Control both with the same throttle, or PAS. Possibly a switch to engage or disengage the throttle to the front motors controller. This front motor need not be gigantic, but it could be if you like.

Since you want regen, a dd front hub might do er. I never ran regen very long, but the setup I liked for it was no brake handle switches, but a pushbutton switch on my left hand. That way I got normal brakes when I wanted them, regen only when I wanted it, and could get both easily too.

Well it would be nice to know where on the island you are going to be using your cargo ebike. A city like Victoria is quite large compared to most of the other towns on the island which are small space wise.


Victora is 5miles x 8miles, Nainamo is 2miles x 2miles then landfills are outside the city. Nainamo is a few miles out of the city and is highway riding. Victoria, its an extra 5 miles outside city limits which is 5 miles of highway riding.

markz said:

Well it would be nice to know where on the island you are going to be using your cargo ebike. A city like Victoria is quite large compared to most of the other towns on the island which are small space wise.


Victora is 5miles x 8miles, Nainamo is 2miles x 2miles then landfills are outside the city. Nainamo is a few miles out of the city and is highway riding. Victoria, its an extra 5 miles outside city limits which is 5 miles of highway riding.


Screenshot from 2021-03-14 06-00-40.png

Click to expand...

I will be using it primarily in Comox, sometime riding into Courtenay which is still quite close. I am also targetting specific areas based around hills and accessibility. I live in the center of Comox so it is pretty well situated.
I will be using the city's green bins for lawn clippings at each property, and i also have a cargo van for bigger jobs and transporting waste.
The cargo bike is really for convenient jobs where a 6.0 V8 is way overkill

Chalo said:

E-tilitarian said:

I am looking at the leaf motor 1500w casette direct drive, heard it can run up to 3000w at 72v.

Click to expand...

Don't get the cassette version. The freewheel version has a larger and better axle, with better provision for a torque arm on the drive side. Also, freewheels are more robust and easier/cheaper to replace.

If your intention is to run it at 72v, be sure to get a special winding of the motor that will run efficiently at your desired speed.

Click to expand...

That is great information, really appreciate that. In that case i am a lot more open with my choice of DD motors. Although i would like something that can fit a 6spd freewheel or similar as i do enjoy pedaling.
Any motors that jump at you for that purpose? Will look more at QS, Leaf, 9C to see who can generate the most torque at low speeds while having room for a freewheel cluster.

dogman dan said:

Sounds to me like a good plan might be to add some more power with a front wheel motor. I mean keep the mid drive, but add wattage with a front motor too. Control both with the same throttle, or PAS. Possibly a switch to engage or disengage the throttle to the front motors controller. This front motor need not be gigantic, but it could be if you like.

Since you want regen, a dd front hub might do er. I never ran regen very long, but the setup I liked for it was no brake handle switches, but a pushbutton switch on my left hand. That way I got normal brakes when I wanted them, regen only when I wanted it, and could get both easily too.

Click to expand...

Sorry if i wasnt clear, i will be selling the BBS02 equiped bike and going with the radwagon, so no mid drive. Am hoping to keep it simple and sizing up an appropriately powered DD hub to power all my needs.
I wasn't a big fan of the BBS02 as it made pedalling without power not very fun. Not that my heavy cargo bike would be fun either..