27.5” front 26” rear - Wheelbuilding

General Discussion about electric bicycles.
markz   100 GW

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Re: 27.5” front 26” rear - Wheelbuilding

Post by markz » Apr 02 2021 4:30am

I’m sure the handling would change due to the smaller diameter wheel in the rear. Would be interesting to see and ride but I think it would throw off the handling. maybe a 20 inch wheel might be more doable but 12 inch would be pretty extreme
Very minimal roll over differences between a 26 vs 27.5 or 27.5 vs 29. It'd be stupid to go 12" but people have gone to 20" on 26" mtb's.

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Eastwood   100 W

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Re: 27.5” front 26” rear - Wheelbuilding

Post by Eastwood » Apr 20 2021 9:31am

So I received my mxus 3K along with all the other parts for this wheel build. I have a question about using these copper washers. Basically when I’m using the washer the angle of the spoke it’s not coming out at 90° from the hub, or even remotely straight. When I don’t use the washer the spoke comes out of the flange at 90°. I’m not sure if I should use a different washer or maybe no washer. I was able to bend the washer inside the oversize flange holes to help with the spoke angle but it’s still coming out way too far which would cause me to bend the spokes a lot just to get it to line up to the wheel Here’s a few pictures
Also I’m using 13 DT Swiss copper washers
Attachments
D6155F8F-E24F-4AD0-87BE-B65C8152D210.jpeg
This is with the DT Swiss washer
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B00EBA8B-2A41-4052-A633-31CA992912E8.jpeg
This is without the washer
B00EBA8B-2A41-4052-A633-31CA992912E8.jpeg (3.78 MiB) Viewed 345 times
Last edited by Eastwood on Apr 20 2021 9:41am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 27.5” front 26” rear - Wheelbuilding

Post by Ianhill » Apr 20 2021 9:41am

Eastwood wrote:
Apr 20 2021 9:31am
So I received my mxus 3K along with all the other parts for this wheel build. I have a question about using these copper washers. Basically when I’m using the washer the angle of the spoke it’s not coming out at 90° from the hub, or even remotely straight. When I don’t use the washer the spoke comes out of the flange at 90°. I’m not sure if I should use a different washer or maybe no washer. I was able to bend the washer inside the oversize flange holes to help with the spoke angle but it’s still coming out way too far which would cause me to bend the spokes a lot just to get it to line up to the wheel Here’s a few pictures
Also I’m using 13 DT Swiss copper washers
Get a close up pic of the seating surfaces im not sure but the bend on your spoke may be to early not long enough from bend to spoke head.

The flange thickness is wider than a standard bike hub i think that may be throwing the spoke out of alignment. If the spokes are meant for a standard wheel that is, off top off my head im sure i used about 6mm to bend

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Eastwood   100 W

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Re: 27.5” front 26” rear - Wheelbuilding

Post by Eastwood » Apr 20 2021 9:47am

Ianhill wrote:
Apr 20 2021 9:41am
Eastwood wrote:
Apr 20 2021 9:31am
So I received my mxus 3K along with all the other parts for this wheel build. I have a question about using these copper washers. Basically when I’m using the washer the angle of the spoke it’s not coming out at 90° from the hub, or even remotely straight. When I don’t use the washer the spoke comes out of the flange at 90°. I’m not sure if I should use a different washer or maybe no washer. I was able to bend the washer inside the oversize flange holes to help with the spoke angle but it’s still coming out way too far which would cause me to bend the spokes a lot just to get it to line up to the wheel Here’s a few pictures
Also I’m using 13 DT Swiss copper washers
Get a close up pic of the seating surfaces im not sure but the bend on your spoke may be to early not long enough from bend to spoke head.

The flange thickness is wider than a standard bike hub i think that may be throwing the spoke out of alignment. If the spokes are meant for a standard wheel that is, off top off my head im sure i used about 6mm to bend
I’m new to this but to me I don’t think the bend is too early it’s just that this washer maybe is slightly too big but Idk..
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Eastwood   100 W

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Re: 27.5” front 26” rear - Wheelbuilding

Post by Eastwood » Apr 20 2021 9:52am

Ianhill wrote:
Apr 20 2021 9:41am
Get a close up pic of the seating surfaces im not sure but the bend on your spoke may be to early not long enough from bend to spoke head.

The flange thickness is wider than a standard bike hub i think that may be throwing the spoke out of alignment. If the spokes are meant for a standard wheel that is, off top off my head im sure i used about 6mm to bend
Yeah true the flange is much thicker than a standard bicycle hub. That seems to be the problem but I don’t know way around this with using these washers. Maybe I should use no washers?

I’m using Wheelsmith spokes 13 G around the spoke head and bend and 14 G on the straight

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Re: 27.5” front 26” rear - Wheelbuilding

Post by markz » Apr 20 2021 1:56pm

I've come across this once where the washer on the hub motor flange was to big and would hit the cover plate. It was easy to find a smaller washer with the appropriate OD and the appropriate ID. You won't find those washers at no Home Depot or Lowes, but you will at a real fastener store.
Eastwood wrote:
Apr 20 2021 9:47am
washer maybe is slightly too big but Idk..

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Re: 27.5” front 26” rear - Wheelbuilding

Post by Eastwood » Apr 21 2021 3:49pm

markz wrote:
Apr 20 2021 1:56pm
I've come across this once where the washer on the hub motor flange was to big and would hit the cover plate. It was easy to find a smaller washer with the appropriate OD and the appropriate ID. You won't find those washers at no Home Depot or Lowes, but you will at a real fastener store.
Eastwood wrote:
Apr 20 2021 9:47am
washer maybe is slightly too big but Idk..
Yeah I think I’ll just stick with these washers because I was able to bend the washer more to get the spokes to come out closer to a 90° angle.

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Re: 27.5” front 26” rear - Wheelbuilding

Post by Eastwood » Apr 21 2021 3:55pm

So I attempted to lace half of the wheel last night well I started on one side and was having trouble getting the spokes to reach the holes after I did a few crosses. I couldn’t figure out for the life of me what was wrong and I started to think maybe I ordered the wrong length spokes but no that was not the problem! I noticed on my wheel the sticker says 36 holes but the company actually mailed me a 32 hole wheel :shock:
So yeah I spent hours last night thinking I was doing something wrong but the seller sent me the wrong Wheel even though the sticker was labeled as 36 holes. Thankfully the seller is shipping me the new wheel but it will take another 10 days of waiting :confused:


I was able to test the motor in the bike frame and everything works great! I was able to fix the brake caliper mounting issue with just using some spacers. Had to put some spacers behind the rotor as well and everything lines up perfect now! All I need now is my dang wheel! Lol

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Re: 27.5” front 26” rear - Wheelbuilding

Post by Eastwood » Apr 21 2021 4:02pm

I’ve seen on here people change the combo of the phase wires with this Mxus 3k. Is this something I should look into? I’ve also read the wrong combo can blow the controller so I definitely don’t wanna go down that road. The motor seems to be working great but maybe there’s a better combo for more power? I’m using a Sabvoton controller 80amps.

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Eastwood   100 W

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Re: 27.5” front 26” rear - Wheelbuilding

Post by Eastwood » Apr 21 2021 4:16pm

Here’s a short clip of the motor test, speedometer says it’s hitting 75 mph with no load. I do have the flux weakening enabled. With no flux the top speed shows 60 mph under no load.
https://youtube.com/shorts/o4ySnCmoSxw?feature=share
Edit: I just realized I recorded the video vertical haha

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Re: 27.5” front 26” rear wheel

Post by Chalo » Apr 22 2021 9:50am

E-HP wrote:
Mar 20 2021 4:05pm
has nothing to do with the freewheel. it's how the axle flats are cut.
If you don't have enough room between the freewheel thread root and the axle shoulder, you can't use a multi-speed freewheel.
This is to express my gratitude to Justin of Grin Technologies for his extraordinary measures to save this forum for the benefit of all.

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Eastwood   100 W

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Re: 27.5” front 26” rear wheel

Post by Eastwood » Apr 22 2021 11:45am

    Chalo wrote:
    Apr 22 2021 9:50am
    If you don't have enough room between the freewheel thread root and the axle shoulder, you can't use a multi-speed freewheel.
    Yes there’s enough room for a 6s freewheel. That being said I’m using a 5s freewheel. 14 to 34

    Also I don’t know if you seen my last few replies to this thread but the seller mailed me a 32 whole wheel and not a 36. So I returned that wheel and now I purchased from a new seller last night and it supposed to be here Saturday.

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    E-HP   100 MW

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    Re: 27.5” front 26” rear wheel

    Post by E-HP » Apr 22 2021 9:09pm

    Chalo wrote:
    Apr 22 2021 9:50am
    E-HP wrote:
    Mar 20 2021 4:05pm
    has nothing to do with the freewheel. it's how the axle flats are cut.
    If you don't have enough room between the freewheel thread root and the axle shoulder, you can't use a multi-speed freewheel.
    Agreed. But the context of the quote is how the width is measured for 134.5mm vs. 142mm. Based on the axle cuts.

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    Eastwood   100 W

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    Re: 27.5” front 26” rear - Wheelbuilding

    Post by Eastwood » Apr 24 2021 10:16pm

    laced up my first wheel boys!
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    markz   100 GW

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    Re: 27.5” front 26” rear - Wheelbuilding

    Post by markz » Apr 24 2021 10:25pm

    What size/width/brand of tire?

    The mxus 3kw motor has some big holes on the flange.
    Thing is with washers on the spoke J-bend sitting on the motor flange the washer can bend when the spoke pushes it.
    Keep tightening and straighten the wheel.

    I've done the flaring for washers for the nipple on the rim side, worked fine for larger rim holes using smaller spoke/nipple gauge.
    Also remember that some nipples have a larger head on them for larger holes. Holmes used to have them.
    https://www.princessauto.com/en/double- ... 0008895369

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    Eastwood   100 W

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    Re: 27.5” front 26” rear - Wheelbuilding

    Post by Eastwood » Apr 24 2021 11:02pm

    markz wrote:
    Apr 24 2021 10:25pm
    What size/width/brand of tire?
    27.5” 2.8 Schwalbe Super Moto

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    Eastwood   100 W

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    Re: 27.5” front 26” rear - Wheelbuilding

    Post by Eastwood » Apr 24 2021 11:05pm

    markz wrote:
    Apr 24 2021 10:25pm

    The mxus 3kw motor has some big holes on the flange.
    Thing is with washers on the spoke J-bend sitting on the motor flange the washer can bend when the spoke pushes it.
    Keep tightening and straighten the wheel.
    Yes sir, i’ll keep tightening it up and keep a close eye on it. I did some test riding and it runs smooth!

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    Re: 27.5” front 26” rear - Wheelbuilding

    Post by markz » Apr 24 2021 11:18pm

    I prefer the 3.0 size tires over the 4.0
    I was looking at 2.60 which seems to be a popular size and I may try out for the front 2.60 and rear is 26x3.0 Vee tire I got last year. The front I will actually be 29x2.60 as the 700 40C is pretty close to in diameter.
    Eastwood wrote:
    Apr 24 2021 11:02pm
    markz wrote:
    Apr 24 2021 10:25pm
    What size/width/brand of tire?
    27.5” 2.8 Schwalbe Super Moto

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    Eastwood   100 W

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    Re: 27.5” front 26” rear - Wheelbuilding

    Post by Eastwood » Apr 24 2021 11:28pm

    markz wrote:
    Apr 24 2021 11:18pm
    I prefer the 3.0 size tires over the 4.0
    I was looking at 2.60 which seems to be a popular size and I may try out for the front 2.60 and rear is 26x3.0 Vee tire I got last year. The front I will actually be 29x2.60 as the 700 40C is pretty close to in diameter.
    What type of riding? Urban or off-road?

    Yeah agreed I prefer the 3.0 vs 4” tire.

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    Re: 27.5” front 26” rear - Wheelbuilding

    Post by markz » Apr 24 2021 11:46pm

    Its a rigid fat bike cruiser 1x7 with 26x4.0 just casual pathway, road riding.
    I have a 19 motorcycle rim but its to small. Even 23" motorcycle rim fully inflated moped tire 2.75 is 27.7" diameter but its harder to find tires, I found 23x1.40 rim which is easy to find but the tires are harder to find and more expensive when you do find them.
    I plan to go 29" x 2.60 front bicycle rim/tire, 26x3.0 rear.

    Here is confirmation for future reference to anyone.
    https://www.denniskirk.com/bridgestone/ ... 651746.sku
    Front Trail Wing 9 3.00-23 Tire - 142948
    Deepest Tread Depth 9/32 in
    Inflated Diameter 27.70 in.
    Inflated Width 3.50 in.
    Tire Size 3.00/100-23
    :shock: Weight 7.62 lbs :shock:


    Eastwood wrote:
    Apr 24 2021 11:28pm
    What type of riding? Urban or off-road?
    Yeah agreed I prefer the 3.0 vs 4” tire.

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    Eastwood   100 W

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    Re: 27.5” front 26” rear - Wheelbuilding

    Post by Eastwood » Apr 25 2021 10:17am

    markz wrote:
    Apr 24 2021 11:46pm
    I plan to go 29" x 2.60 front bicycle rim/tire, 26x3.0 rear.
    Have you considered 27” front 26” rear?

    I almost went that route but wanted to keep it 27.5 just for mountain bike trail use. (Little better rollover resistance) I mainly do urban riding so that’s why I went with a slick-ish tire. I’m actually quite surprised how well these tires grip on mountain bike trails, well dry conditions only.

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    MadRhino   100 GW

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    Re: 27.5” front 26” rear - Wheelbuilding

    Post by MadRhino » Apr 25 2021 1:02pm

    Eastwood wrote:
    Apr 25 2021 10:17am
    ... I mainly do urban riding so that’s why I went with a slick-ish tire. I’m actually quite surprised how well these tires grip on mountain bike trails, well dry conditions only.
    On dry hard pack, slicks are fast and fun. But, some trail sections are taking longer to dry, wood bridges notably, and keeping soapy for a few days after the rain. I’ve had some of my worst crashes washing out on slicks in the mountain. I still do it sometimes, mostly as a short cut to catch the streets on the other side of the mountain, but I am very careful then.
    Make it fool-proof, and I will make a better fool.

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    Re: 27.5” front 26” rear - Wheelbuilding

    Post by Eastwood » Apr 25 2021 7:16pm

    MadRhino wrote:
    Apr 25 2021 1:02pm
    On dry hard pack, slicks are fast and fun.
    Yeah for sure, they’re definitely fun! These tires are my first experience with slick-ish tires on mountain bike trails. I’m used to running more aggressive tires off rode.

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    Re: 27.5” front 26” rear - Wheelbuilding

    Post by markz » Apr 26 2021 3:23pm

    Been meaning to post but I wanted to post with some wheel/tire heights and rim widths.
    I just want to even out the bike, having 26x4 or 26x3 standard rear wheel and a 26x2 rear 135mm hub motor on the front of the fat bike 135mm is still low. Even if I get longer handlebars.

    All I have to compare are wheels with inflated tires: 26x4, 26x3, 26x2, 700x40C, rim only 19" motorcycle but can probably find inflated diameter I never measured mine when I had it.
    Eastwood wrote:
    Apr 25 2021 10:17am
    markz wrote:
    Apr 24 2021 11:46pm
    I plan to go 29" x 2.60 front bicycle rim/tire, 26x3.0 rear.
    Have you considered 27” front 26” rear?

    I almost went that route but wanted to keep it 27.5 just for mountain bike trail use. (Little better rollover resistance) I mainly do urban riding so that’s why I went with a slick-ish tire. I’m actually quite surprised how well these tires grip on mountain bike trails, well dry conditions only.

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    Eastwood   100 W

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    Re: 27.5” front 26” rear - Wheelbuilding

    Post by Eastwood » Apr 26 2021 7:39pm

    This mxus 5T has some serious acceleration! Definitely impressed with the torque. Trying to give it full throttle from a start without standing it up past the balancing point takes gentleness on the throttle :D Well while leaning forward I can hit full throttle but have to be extremely careful at slow speeds it just wants to stand up :lol: :lol: love it!

    The motor is getting a little warm after a decent run time so I’m wondering if I should swap the phase and hall wires? Been reading on this topic a lot trying to figure out the best combination. Can someone please give me their input on this??
    I was wondering if maybe there’s a standard for mxus 3k with sabvoton controllers? I found the thread on here that explained how to test the different options and it sounds like I should maybe put a small fuse on the battery cable to protect the controller and motor, does that sound right? Or maybe I can just get away with doing the light throttle test, I’m just not sure yet I would love some help with this.

    As of now I have wired as green to green, Blue to blue, yellow to yellow
    Also my Sabvoton is made by Risunmotor.

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