Where to find brushed hub motors nowadays?

Botspot

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I've discovered that attaching brushless hub motors to the exterior of plastic kids cars makes for an awesome upgrade.
My latest build uses four brushless hoverboard motors. Originally each motor was 350W @ 36v, so now I'd estimate the total maximum power output is 2489W @ 64v. Currently its top speed is 72kph and I'm fairly sure that's a world record.
DSC_0241.JPG
As this build was a resounding success, the focus has shifted from "Does it work?", to "Let's make some more as cheaply as possible."

Hoverboard motors are hard to come by, and brushless controllers aren't cheap either. I realized that switching to brushed motors would reduce complexity, lower cost, and improve low-speed torque.
Only problem is: I can't find any such motors anywhere! There were a few threads from 2008 or so that discussed one specific ebike's brushed motor, but I haven't been able to find much info otherwise. And no leads as to where I'd find some for sale at a good price.

Any ideas or suggestions?
 
Some wheelchairs and powerchairs still use brushed motors, but few are available in hubmotors. The only one I found an ad for was this
https://www.peipeiscooter.com/22-inch-brushed-wheelchair-motor.html

Goldenmotor might still make some, too, though you'll need to go directly to their main website goldenmotor.com and contact them to find out.

If you can find any of the old wheels at powerchair repair places, there was a system called E-motion that used brushed motors in the wheels (with battery packs and controller also inside the motor).


I expect that in generaly brushed hubmotors will cost a *lot* more than common brushless types just because they are not that common anymore, and medical devices are one of the last holdouts. :/ It is most likely cheaper to get a brushless hubmotor *and* controller than it is to even get just a brushed hubmotor.


Nowadays, most of them use brushless for the in-wheel motors (though there are plenty of them using brushed motors with gearboxes to drive the wheels, even mounting the wheel directly to the output axle-shaft of the gearbox).



If you're willing to wait for them, and can find a seller that is likely to send you what you ordered ;) then Aliexpress has some deals on there for hoverboard-style motors and cheap brushless controllers, if you can find them. It's tough to find anything there quickly, and can take days of watching the "suggested items" popups to eventually run across what you're after (their search engine SUCKS and they don't care, just like Amazon, and google doesn't do a very good job of searching their site either).
 
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32911644784.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.1420567bWD6LvK&algo_pvid=5beec05e-7c78-41ff-ac2f-ac6b6cf94274&algo_expid=5beec05e-7c78-41ff-ac2f-ac6b6cf94274-8&btsid=0bb0623b16171058181587484e924e&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_,searchweb201603_

A quick look on ali express for something brushed and cheap turned up this, or other stuff like it. Hub motors do seem to be all brushless, but some of the kits including controller similar to what you just used are actually pretty cheap. Cheaper than buying a new hoverboard to scavenge.

Btw,, if brushed was better, we'd all still be using it.
 
High speed with plastic kid’s cars is not a good idea IMO, but as long as this choice is about your own skin and bones, I have nothing against. :mrgreen:
 
Better in what way, because they sure are cheap and simpler and mass marketed power tools use brushed motors, while the brushless tools are more complicated and expensive. It seemed a lot of the cheap department store ebikes use brushed motors, maybe they still do, and those cheap ebikes were using lead acid. Archiac technology thats cheap for greater profit margins.

dogman dan said:
Btw,, if brushed was better, we'd all still be using it.
 
Botspot said:
I've discovered that attaching brushless hub motors to the exterior of plastic kids cars makes for an awesome upgrade.
My latest build uses four brushless hoverboard motors. Originally each motor was 350W @ 36v, so now I'd estimate the total maximum power output is 2489W @ 64v. Currently its top speed is 72kph and I'm fairly sure that's a world record.
DSC_0241.JPG
As this build was a resounding success, the focus has shifted from "Does it work?", to "Let's make some more as cheaply as possible."

Hoverboard motors are hard to come by, and brushless controllers aren't cheap either. I realized that switching to brushed motors would reduce complexity, lower cost, and improve low-speed torque.
Only problem is: I can't find any such motors anywhere! There were a few threads from 2008 or so that discussed one specific ebike's brushed motor, but I haven't been able to find much info otherwise. And no leads as to where I'd find some for sale at a good price.

Any ideas or suggestions?

you can probably find old brushed motors on craigslist ads for older ebikes. But I don't see much logic in that. You put excess voltage into a brushed motor and the brushes will wear after a few hours use. That's what happened to me when I over volted a 36v brushed with 48v. And 36/48 brushless controllers start at $20 on ebay, so those controllers are not so pricey. And finding a brushed controller would be harder.
 
Brushless electric motors are running cooler, and silent. They can be fed much more power than their rated spec. There is a large variety, cheap and easy to get. I can't see why one would want to go back to brushed motors for building a vehicle, other than the need for very large motors that would have to be custom made if brushless was required.
 
I cooked a brushed ebike hub motor within a few rides. What did it in was a long slight gradient with a 330m kinda steep hill. The motor was a cooking so when I did the walk home after touching the hub and saying ouch, I noticed the brushes were toast. I cant remember what the color of the windings were. That was my first cook job :oops:

I found the brushes at a tool repair shop and when I opened up the aroma was shall we say a bit off :lol:

The ebike I bought used, it was a national department store chain ebike, came with lead acid, mid 2000's. I liked the frame because it had lots of space for lithium batteries.

That bike was fs and the rear suspension mount broke after a year, I was in the 330 lb range back then. Steel frame, very wide rear dropouts. Would have been perfect for a mxus 5kw with its 150mm axle flats width.

Keep in mind that there might be garage sales that will have the same type of department store bso ebike with dead batteries and you can low ball them on the price. I once bought a bmc v1 hub motor, geared, brushless for $20 from a used bicycle community store, it had bad gears, but that was the same place I bought the brushed department store bso ebike from with bad batteries.
 
markz said:
Better in what way, because they sure are cheap and simpler and mass marketed power tools use brushed motors, while the brushless tools are more complicated and expensive.

And don't burn out. And get more results out of a battery charge.

Cheap is good. But cheap stuff is mainly common because it's cheap.
 
I do agree, for the seller brushed may be better. Cheaper, easier to sell more if cheaper.

On the consumer end, less efficient, and more likely to overheat. Fine for screw guns, never burned out one of those. I burn out saws, and weedwhackers pretty regular. I consider those expendables, like drill bits. As for drills, I definitely go for the huge, heavy, corded drill for doing the big jobs. Mixing grout or sheetrock mud, or doing 20 holes in thick steel. The weak cordless drills still fine for intermittent use, like pilot holes for the screws to mount kitchen cabinets.

Brushed hub motors really overheat, since they lack the vent holes and fans you get in most brushed motors.
 
Yes but cheap can mean "better" to some, and common can mean better.
Others will prefer other factors to be "better" like better efficiency, still others will like "better" longer lasting.

Chalo said:
markz said:
Better in what way, because they sure are cheap and simpler and mass marketed power tools use brushed motors, while the brushless tools are more complicated and expensive.

And don't burn out. And get more results out of a battery charge.

Cheap is good. But cheap stuff is mainly common because it's cheap.
 
Well, actually it would be pretty difficult to find brushed hub motors that are readily available today. Heinzmann still makes one, and a good one for what matters, but it is more expansive than brushless hubs and they won’t sell them by the units. I don’t know the minimal order but I suspect you'd have to buy the controllers and displays, and fill a palette at the very least. The Chinese will have you waiting a long time because they are not in production anymore, unless you find a dealer who has some old stock, shitty hubs by today's standards.
 
That seemed to be his main problem, finding old hoverboards to scavenge. But on ali express there were similar brushless hub motors with controller that seemed pretty cheap. But likely not as cheap as junk hoverboards. At 50 a pop, looking at 200 bucks to make another car. Then he can race em against each other. Sounds worth it to me.
 
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