Do 100mph bikes exist??

General Discussion about electric bicycles.
2old   1 MW

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Re: Do 100mph bikes exist??

Post by 2old » Jan 21 2022 1:09am

calab wrote:
Jan 18 2022 6:07pm
That is cheating because she had little to no wind resistance, its the same cheating with setting a speed record going down a hill. I want to see leg power and leg power alone get up to speed but also breaking wind resistance.
2old wrote:
Jan 18 2022 2:09pm
May be of interest: the land speed record for a bicycle AFAIK was set by a lady on a specially-constructed KHS at 184 mph riding behind a dragster. She had set it at 150 or so in 2016 and was discussing it at Interbike that year.
That's why I said "might be of interest". One thing I know is she has a lot more balls than me. I'd never go that fast on a bicycle; 135 on my old Ducati 900SS was fast enough.

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Re: Do 100mph bikes exist??

Post by calab » Jan 21 2022 1:40am

So nothing so far except for under a handful, john in cr had a very high powered hub motor but he lived in a hilly area in costa rica and would easily hit 60mph for the countryside you could search his posts. Hubmonster was the term he coined his hub motor found on some scooters.
ebike11 wrote:
Jan 20 2022 3:36am
calab wrote:
Jan 19 2022 11:57pm
Bikes is a broad term do you want bicycles or motorbikes?
ebike11 wrote:
Jan 19 2022 4:43pm
I see lol
Any other builds over 100mph with a hub motor?
Basically with pedals like death bike or frames such as Enduro/vector...not sportbikes
I have seen any with rear hubs going over 100mph

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Re: Do 100mph bikes exist??

Post by ebike11 » Jan 21 2022 5:46am

calab wrote:
Jan 21 2022 1:40am
So nothing so far except for under a handful, john in cr had a very high powered hub motor but he lived in a hilly area in costa rica and would easily hit 60mph for the countryside you could search his posts. Hubmonster was the term he coined his hub motor found on some scooters.
ebike11 wrote:
Jan 20 2022 3:36am
calab wrote:
Jan 19 2022 11:57pm
Bikes is a broad term do you want bicycles or motorbikes?
ebike11 wrote:
Jan 19 2022 4:43pm
I see lol
Any other builds over 100mph with a hub motor?
Basically with pedals like death bike or frames such as Enduro/vector...not sportbikes
I have seen any with rear hubs going over 100mph
Yes Ive seen that one...just seeing if there are any other hub motors hitting 100mph...his motors arent for sale

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Re: Do 100mph bikes exist??

Post by DogDipstick » Jan 21 2022 9:19am

150mph on the stand. Tire was ... expanding dangerously. Cheapo china tire in a 19". Had to get off it.

273, 3T. 40H motor. Must have been a fluke. The customer changed his mind then. Put a 205 4T in a 17" in chrome then. That bike did 65mph about. Uphill, downhill, didnt matter. 280A peak off the line. 170A contin controller. 130lb in the bike. Never rode this bike with the 273 in it. Just sold the motor and put a 205 in there. Customer hated teh weight of the 273. .

I got another one too lemme find it. I'll try ink it here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U-bSoJoje4o
84v of Ironhorse XC.. :) :bolt: by Chevy :bolt: :D You call .. that.. a "glitch:" ? :twisted: (...No Mom. The formula is Kaw > 1(Hr) = Impounded. The math checks out. I'll be fine. ).. :? Broke20Horsies! 17,830w !! :x 1 (pound / second) Hp = 338.24 M^2 Kg^2 / Sec^4 ( :twisted: 1200v? :twisted: ) :| isn't 13" x 27".. Oh nvrmnd :roll: 4+25% = 5 ; 5-20% = 4... 5(1-20%) = 4.. so, to correct the incorrect reading, of 4 ... 4(1+25%) = 5 :confused: Fabricator @BSECo.

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Re: Do 100mph bikes exist??

Post by DanGT86 » Jan 21 2022 10:16am

Does not surprise me that Shaun James would be involved in something crazy like this. I raced against him in St. Louis a few years ago. He had some crashes that day and kept riding. Definitely passionate about ebikes.

Sorry about the audio in this vid but I shot this while trying to catch Shaun on the racetrack. He's the guy in the tee shirt on a hardtail! I believe he was running a QS205 and Kelly. I remember him talking about 100v projects he was working on.


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Re: Do 100mph bikes exist??

Post by calab » Jan 21 2022 12:16pm

Its not his motors but his motors are for sale you just have to know what to look for john just happened to know where to buy a bunch in part or full.
ebike11 wrote:
Jan 21 2022 5:46am
Yes Ive seen that one...just seeing if there are any other hub motors hitting 100mph...his motors arent for sale

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Re: Do 100mph bikes exist??

Post by ebike11 » Jan 21 2022 7:49pm

calab wrote:
Jan 21 2022 12:16pm
Its not his motors but his motors are for sale you just have to know what to look for john just happened to know where to buy a bunch in part or full.
ebike11 wrote:
Jan 21 2022 5:46am
Yes Ive seen that one...just seeing if there are any other hub motors hitting 100mph...his motors arent for sale
I meant he isnt selling the ones he has. I rhink has a bunch of them
Where else can you get them?

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Re: Do 100mph bikes exist??

Post by MadRhino » Jan 21 2022 8:28pm

This is nit a matter of motor. There is an awful lot of motors that can do it. Bicycles are another story, for very few are safe to build such a fast bike, and even those would need mods ans at least some motorcycle components.

Controllers and batteries are going to be big and heavy, no matter those that you choose.

There is no meaning to build speed that you can’t safely ride. Plan a bike that is suitable to do it.
Make it fool-proof, and I will make a better fool.

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Re: Do 100mph bikes exist??

Post by calab » Jan 21 2022 11:28pm

I know, I twisted the words to be vague on purpose. Seriously, its not like its a mystical motor I saw a motor for sale on a popular ev parts selling website trying to think of when that was 2 years ago but I hardly frequent ev shit. Its not hard at all to figure out (Found a few posts on the model pretty quickly actually) but remember its a long gone product so you have to buy whole or parted out and used now and its also not hard to figure what it came from. I cant remember did those motors have two sets of phase windings, six total? Its peaked my interest now for reminiscing reasons only and how much did those 2 hub motors weigh, one was called hubmonster and the other was midmonster
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=65024&p=982555&hili ... er#p982464





ebike11 wrote:
Jan 21 2022 7:49pm
calab wrote:
Jan 21 2022 12:16pm
Its not his motors but his motors are for sale you just have to know what to look for john just happened to know where to buy a bunch in part or full.
ebike11 wrote:
Jan 21 2022 5:46am
Yes Ive seen that one...just seeing if there are any other hub motors hitting 100mph...his motors arent for sale
I meant he isnt selling the ones he has. I rhink has a bunch of them
Where else can you get them?

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Re: Do 100mph bikes exist??

Post by DogDipstick » Jan 22 2022 12:53pm

I am thinking about doing thi.

I ahve everything I need. Except a heated garage. Dammn its cold in here. 14*.

I kinda think I would blow up the Lyen.

Not all bicycle though, the 18" rims are moped rims. 23" final rolling dia. Everything else would be bicycle ( Banshee, Raceface, Shimano, Hammersmidt, Ect). The throttle is a Hirshman or a Mag, I forget what i got int he box. Got the contactors sitting ver there and the cells too. The datalloggging CA3 new version too.

....just gotta build it. I am 100% confident my battery can do 40-80kW, and 100% confident that with carful rim choice I can push a 205 4T hub up to 90mph+ ( its only 132v on an 18" in the 13kV choice)... (1300RPMish).. but I have very little confidence int he controllers I have.

4T 205QS, Lyen HV controller. 18" moped. Bridgestone or Metzeller, or something. I havnt bought the tires yet. Gotta rebuild my other bike first. its gettign bad nearing 10,000 mile. Its gonna fall apart. I have built a 4T before on some good chevy cells and they did 60mph about @ 72Vn. 165A controller. Peaked @ 280A. Literally DESTROYED the load. Pulled within 10% of unloaded RPM. Uphill. Almost 20kW. Bake the tires kind of power off the line.That was a heavy bike too, almost 140lb. So double the voltage (almost doubled) and hit it with 132V? You dont see many QS hubbies over 24s.. and I am sure there are others with experience already.. Thosg.. with better controller than the ones I have...

E. Lyen states its good for 120Vn but the Fairchild transistors are good for 180v max. IDK. Mebbe I should shunt mod it. Lol.
124mph unloaded. SHould near 100mph? No? @ a full charge on a 32s. ( 132.8v MAX). No BMS, an inch thick shunt to datalog it. Maybe downhill? Lol. Or will I just hit 60mph and the wall there ( 70Amax on the lYen),.... ? I think I need a better HV controller ( tht can output 30-40kW).
Should I do this? Whaddya guys think? Its kinda been a goal of mine. See if it is possible with some good mechanical design and tooling. 100mph+ on a hubbie. I D K. I got everything sitting in a pile over inthe corner so to speak.
Attachments
4TQS205.Lyen134vn.ChevroletLipos.PNG
4TQS205.Lyen134vn.ChevroletLipos.PNG (107.62 KiB) Viewed 709 times
84v of Ironhorse XC.. :) :bolt: by Chevy :bolt: :D You call .. that.. a "glitch:" ? :twisted: (...No Mom. The formula is Kaw > 1(Hr) = Impounded. The math checks out. I'll be fine. ).. :? Broke20Horsies! 17,830w !! :x 1 (pound / second) Hp = 338.24 M^2 Kg^2 / Sec^4 ( :twisted: 1200v? :twisted: ) :| isn't 13" x 27".. Oh nvrmnd :roll: 4+25% = 5 ; 5-20% = 4... 5(1-20%) = 4.. so, to correct the incorrect reading, of 4 ... 4(1+25%) = 5 :confused: Fabricator @BSECo.

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Re: Do 100mph bikes exist??

Post by ebike11 » Jan 23 2022 11:27pm

DogDipstick wrote:
Jan 22 2022 12:53pm
I am thinking about doing thi.

I ahve everything I need. Except a heated garage. Dammn its cold in here. 14*.

I kinda think I would blow up the Lyen.

Not all bicycle though, the 18" rims are moped rims. 23" final rolling dia. Everything else would be bicycle ( Banshee, Raceface, Shimano, Hammersmidt, Ect). The throttle is a Hirshman or a Mag, I forget what i got int he box. Got the contactors sitting ver there and the cells too. The datalloggging CA3 new version too.

....just gotta build it. I am 100% confident my battery can do 40-80kW, and 100% confident that with carful rim choice I can push a 205 4T hub up to 90mph+ ( its only 132v on an 18" in the 13kV choice)... (1300RPMish).. but I have very little confidence int he controllers I have.

4T 205QS, Lyen HV controller. 18" moped. Bridgestone or Metzeller, or something. I havnt bought the tires yet. Gotta rebuild my other bike first. its gettign bad nearing 10,000 mile. Its gonna fall apart. I have built a 4T before on some good chevy cells and they did 60mph about @ 72Vn. 165A controller. Peaked @ 280A. Literally DESTROYED the load. Pulled within 10% of unloaded RPM. Uphill. Almost 20kW. Bake the tires kind of power off the line.That was a heavy bike too, almost 140lb. So double the voltage (almost doubled) and hit it with 132V? You dont see many QS hubbies over 24s.. and I am sure there are others with experience already.. Thosg.. with better controller than the ones I have...

E. Lyen states its good for 120Vn but the Fairchild transistors are good for 180v max. IDK. Mebbe I should shunt mod it. Lol.
124mph unloaded. SHould near 100mph? No? @ a full charge on a 32s. ( 132.8v MAX). No BMS, an inch thick shunt to datalog it. Maybe downhill? Lol. Or will I just hit 60mph and the wall there ( 70Amax on the lYen),.... ? I think I need a better HV controller ( tht can output 30-40kW).
Should I do this? Whaddya guys think? Its kinda been a goal of mine. See if it is possible with some good mechanical design and tooling. 100mph+ on a hubbie. I D K. I got everything sitting in a pile over inthe corner so to speak.
In the photo you attached it shows Cromo 5004. Is this motor closest to the QS205? Also how do you enter the "T" rating into the program?

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Re: Do 100mph bikes exist??

Post by DogDipstick » Jan 24 2022 12:56am

ebike11 wrote:
Jan 23 2022 11:27pm

Its the closest to the QS 50H V3 205mm stator motor on that list. You must choose " SHOW ALL" on the motor drop down list. It is a aluminum core 50 H motor to the best of my knowledge, from learning here from the last ten years of posts. :wink: :)

You adjust the kV by a slider when you click " Show advanced" . Choose the motor, adjust the slider to your motors kV, input wheel dia.

I know a 205, 50H V3 in 3T, is ( 15kV, RPM/V) or 4T, ( 13kV RPM/V), 5T, (9 RPM/V)... ECT. ( numbers are approx from what I remember).
84v of Ironhorse XC.. :) :bolt: by Chevy :bolt: :D You call .. that.. a "glitch:" ? :twisted: (...No Mom. The formula is Kaw > 1(Hr) = Impounded. The math checks out. I'll be fine. ).. :? Broke20Horsies! 17,830w !! :x 1 (pound / second) Hp = 338.24 M^2 Kg^2 / Sec^4 ( :twisted: 1200v? :twisted: ) :| isn't 13" x 27".. Oh nvrmnd :roll: 4+25% = 5 ; 5-20% = 4... 5(1-20%) = 4.. so, to correct the incorrect reading, of 4 ... 4(1+25%) = 5 :confused: Fabricator @BSECo.

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Re: Do 100mph bikes exist??

Post by socrace » Apr 02 2022 9:56pm

DogDipstick wrote:
Jan 22 2022 12:53pm
....just gotta build it.
Image

Ran across this post today, and need to say this 98mph Grin simulation just can't work!

The Grin page probably needs the "simulate" button pressed, in which case the 8.1kw motor power will yield about 60mph (where load and power lines cross), not 98mph.

60mph is what my 24s build does (although not quite while sitting upright).
Aluminum 700c Schwinn, ebikeling 1.5kw dd, rclipo 24s, ebay 120v controller, CA3.1, other stuff

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Re: Do 100mph bikes exist??

Post by dogman dan » Apr 03 2022 6:00am

Ya'all got some balls, you bet. I got scared enough at 100 mph on a big bmw. Mostly scared of the road surface itself though, in some spots 120 was not scary at all.

Tires are definitely a problem. You want something sturdier than a bicycle tire. This was the primary reason I went f it, and bought the big bmw for go fast thrills. I wore out all my tires fast, eating the softer compound sides up first. Bike tires would not stand the mountain roads I rode.

I'm not preaching don't do it, its dangerous. But I know Luke, and he's very calculated about risk. He isn't going out and riding stupid through a city like a lot of guys I see on crotch rockets. Taking it to the track is a good thing if you can.

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Re: Do 100mph bikes exist??

Post by nicobie » Apr 03 2022 3:36pm

dogman dan wrote:
Apr 03 2022 6:00am

I'm not preaching don't do it, its dangerous. But I know Luke, and he's very calculated about risk. He isn't going out and riding stupid through a city like a lot of guys I see on crotch rockets. Taking it to the track is a good thing if you can.
Ditto
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Re: Do 100mph bikes exist??

Post by socrace » Apr 03 2022 10:51pm

Yeah, sold my goldwing bobber last year and switched to this safer alternative. Oh well. Next high speed run I do will probably be on a dynojet. Kinda expensive, but cheaper than an er visit.
Aluminum 700c Schwinn, ebikeling 1.5kw dd, rclipo 24s, ebay 120v controller, CA3.1, other stuff

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Re: Do 100mph bikes exist??

Post by calab » Apr 04 2022 12:47am

Tires are rated for speed and weight.

Bicycle frames can not withstand the forces because they were not engineered for that speed.

Motorcycle frame is what you need.
2t or 3t 55h @ 75-100v and 75a perhaps probably gotta go into the 100's a bit.

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Re: Do 100mph bikes exist??

Post by dogman dan » Apr 04 2022 6:06am

And if you are doing a lot of hard cornering. That's what melted all the cord off my bike tires, while the outside looked fine. Changing the tire after the races, I had an inner tube, a rubber shell, and a hand full of string. I was quite amazed it did not blow on the track. Melted the 9c type hub motor though. Bet that saved my ass.

This may have been a special case though, I ran a few laps on a very low tire before the motor stopped me.

But the learning point here is, that tire looked fine from the outside, yet it completely failed on the inside. Not something to want to do 100 mph on, thinking its all hunky dory. Moped tires at least if you are running above 50 mph.

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Re: Do 100mph bikes exist??

Post by DogDipstick » Apr 04 2022 8:34am

Meh I got tires on my bike rated to 71mph. Tires rated for 100mph+ are available.

Frame? Speed is not what is unsafe. Impacts are, at speed. A smooth drag strip does not " impact load" the frame. Impact loadign at 25mph ( jumps, bumps) is very well more stress on the frame than riding along a flat track at 125mph+. Certainly. Yes, "impact loadign " plus "very high speed" is not good, and is worse. However, a racetrack or drag strip are designed smooth, with banks, and do not impact load frames ( unless you are in a crash).

You would certainty want a high end suspension. Purpose built... for " smooth" and " fast". Pay careful attention to the rakes, and the ground trail, spring rates, wheelbase. A steering damper might also be a good idea with this level of force on the steering head. If you begin to have a floppy oscillation of the front end. Flop is easy to figure the calculation for. Bicycle frames are certainly flexy flexy flexy, but hey all bikes flex. Some in different ways than others. Some are stout, some are not.. but they all flex.

I would need 40s. 40s, on my motor. 144v, nominal. 168v charged. This would put me right at 100mph loaded, in theory. 40 cells is alot to put on a bike. Every cell I add would add 2.5mph to the top end speed. I mean, I have the cells, sitting here, that would output this power.. but... they wont all fit on my bike. Nooope.

( ok maybe they would, fit... but it would be bulky and no longer "look " like a bicycle, nosiree. )

The QS 205 V3 is said to saturate at ~32kW. I would need 400A+, I think, to get near this, gross power.

Damn vicious motor. By all definition. FoSHo.

Most I got on hand is 132v Lyen ( 7 kW?). Lots of 10, 14, even 20kW controllers out there, but not a 30kW + controller that i know of readily. Adapto, Nuclear, BAC, ect. Maybe a Kelly KHB. Or a Sevcon, maybe, but who puts a Sevcon on a hub motor.
84v of Ironhorse XC.. :) :bolt: by Chevy :bolt: :D You call .. that.. a "glitch:" ? :twisted: (...No Mom. The formula is Kaw > 1(Hr) = Impounded. The math checks out. I'll be fine. ).. :? Broke20Horsies! 17,830w !! :x 1 (pound / second) Hp = 338.24 M^2 Kg^2 / Sec^4 ( :twisted: 1200v? :twisted: ) :| isn't 13" x 27".. Oh nvrmnd :roll: 4+25% = 5 ; 5-20% = 4... 5(1-20%) = 4.. so, to correct the incorrect reading, of 4 ... 4(1+25%) = 5 :confused: Fabricator @BSECo.

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Re: Do 100mph bikes exist??

Post by neptronix » Apr 04 2022 12:12pm

I used a high end extra large sized downhill bike to build my 60mph bike. It was pretty solid as a vehicle, except the bicycle-sized wheelbase created too twitchy of handling above 50mph. Extra large was not large enough.

Do 100mph and you are going to want something like a cargo bike's wheelbase. or the wheelbase of a motorcycle capable of that speed, at least. Because you start really butting heads with physics on a regular bike frame as the power level goes up.
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Re: Do 100mph bikes exist??

Post by liveforphysics » Apr 04 2022 1:26pm

DogDipstick wrote:
Apr 04 2022 8:34am


The QS 205 V3 is said to saturate at ~32kW.

I think your numbers are bit optimistic. I dyno'ed the 35mm width variant of the 205v3 motor and its completely saturated outputting 11hp, and feeding it 15kW, 20kW, 25kW, 30kW, 35kW, and 40kW all output 11rwhp to the rear wheel, just different rates of heating the phase windings, but no difference in mechanical power output. I haven't dyno'd the 50mm width version yet, but we both know its not going to be more than ~1.43x more output (50mm/35mm), or around 15.7rwhp.

My next ebike will have the HP to run 150-175mph, but I will gear it shorter to be optimized around 1/4mile trap speeds at redline (~140mph).
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Re: Do 100mph bikes exist??

Post by DogDipstick » Apr 04 2022 1:50pm

The number was stuck in my head by the long time poster and experienced ebiker that Mad Rhino is. This post.

See below. I really don't know. Also, I was talking about gross power, input power, not output.. ( the 30kW refereed to in the Grin simulation screengrab above)... yeah thanksyou IDK the real number. I am pretty sure I have to build my own power stage to really get the experience I want.
liveforphysics wrote:
Apr 04 2022 1:26pm
DogDipstick wrote:
Apr 04 2022 8:34am

I think your numbers are bit optimistic. I dyno'ed the ...(~140mph).
I quote his post from 2021.
MadRhino wrote:
Jan 06 2021 8:55pm
‘’Only rated 408 Amps’’ what voltage? A QS 205 h50 does saturate around 32 kw. Feeding a motor close to saturation is playing dices. It could take it 10 sec, or only 1. I find 25 kw acceleration limit power is a reliable setting.

Anyway, If you find 400 A are not enough you should build a motorcycle and forget about hub motors. It won’t ride good if built on a bicycle frame, and the weight of motorcycle frames will be built much better with a motorcycle drivetrain mid drive.

The power that is not usable practically is... useless.

I got all motivated to make my bike longer... and did a bunch of work... and played with the suspension and built custom dropouts that moved the axle... and... and.. I measured, I was still only at 1290mm. I am still downright scared to wack the throttle. I can lean it and steer it around these lil twisty roads around here just great.... Suburbia... but... it is still very restricted by that short length.
neptronix wrote:
Apr 04 2022 12:12pm
wheelbase.
84v of Ironhorse XC.. :) :bolt: by Chevy :bolt: :D You call .. that.. a "glitch:" ? :twisted: (...No Mom. The formula is Kaw > 1(Hr) = Impounded. The math checks out. I'll be fine. ).. :? Broke20Horsies! 17,830w !! :x 1 (pound / second) Hp = 338.24 M^2 Kg^2 / Sec^4 ( :twisted: 1200v? :twisted: ) :| isn't 13" x 27".. Oh nvrmnd :roll: 4+25% = 5 ; 5-20% = 4... 5(1-20%) = 4.. so, to correct the incorrect reading, of 4 ... 4(1+25%) = 5 :confused: Fabricator @BSECo.

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Re: Do 100mph bikes exist??

Post by speedmd » Apr 04 2022 2:39pm

My next ebike will have the HP to run 150-175mph, but I will gear it shorter to be optimized around 1/4mile trap speeds at redline (~140mph).
:D 8)

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Re: Do 100mph bikes exist??

Post by dogman dan » Apr 05 2022 6:36am

Wheelbase length is a definite factor with a normal MTB wheelbase. One reason I bought the xt 250 yamaha last year was to have the shorter, lower frame. Easier to turn around in a tight spot, handles short radius turns on singletrack better than slightly longer dirt bikes.

But on the highway, that thing twiches, starting at about 60 mph. Not bad wobble, but compared to the bmw its bad.

I lowered its gearing, so now its top speed matches the frame better. Did not like it at 70 mph. And it climbs a steeper hill now too. Its about as long as a slightly lengthened MTB. My gut instinct is to make a bike frame much longer for 100 mph.

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Re: Do 100mph bikes exist??

Post by skeetab5780 » Apr 05 2022 6:49am

I once put my Ebike in the back of my truck and I was able to hit 100mph on the highway, but my bike fenders were wobbling pretty good from the wind!

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