2 Speed Xiongda hubmotor

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knutselmaaster   1 kW

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Re: 2 Speed Xiongda hubmotor

Post by knutselmaaster » Oct 30 2018 2:37am

Yes it does.

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Re: 2 Speed Xiongda hubmotor

Post by Ron Paul's Blimp » Oct 30 2018 3:54am

Is the best place to get a kit from their store on alibaba?

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Re: 2 Speed Xiongda hubmotor

Post by Ecyclist » Oct 30 2018 10:10am

Forget about CA3. It will be PITA to use, it is not aesthetically pleasing and you will spend $130 extra.
Order directly from Bonnie Xiongda <bonnie@xiongdamotor.com.cn>
Buy everything that comes with the kit. Parts are cheap.
You can get spokes from Xiongda as well. They are $8 extra. Go for 14G and if not 13G. For 550 mm ERD and 2 cross (for 26" wheel size recommended) you will need 233mm and 230mm.
Don't expect from life to be easy and then it will be.
My builds:
Avian with hypocycloidal drive https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 2#p1318056
2016 GNG extreme drive https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 28&t=82252

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Re: 2 Speed Xiongda hubmotor

Post by Alan B » Oct 30 2018 10:24am

This motor, as all hubmotors, works better with smaller wheels, especially with small motors. Smaller wheel lowers top speed slightly but gives better torque and less motor heating. Top speed can be regained by running higher voltage.

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Re: 2 Speed Xiongda hubmotor

Post by Ecyclist » Oct 30 2018 11:05am

Alan is right, but I say just follow Xiongda recommendations and you will be OK. They sell millions of these kits in China and they know the best.
BTW: Bonnie is easy to work with and provides top customer service. :thumb:
Don't expect from life to be easy and then it will be.
My builds:
Avian with hypocycloidal drive https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 2#p1318056
2016 GNG extreme drive https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 28&t=82252

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Re: 2 Speed Xiongda hubmotor

Post by tomtom50 » Nov 02 2018 10:45pm

I happened to be reading about this motor yesterday,.

http://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/threads ... ons.20266/

Has a ton of information, mostly a couple years old.

It discusses xiongda carrying both a lishui and a KT controller, each having some advantages. And yes, you need a special controller to reverse the motor and make the shift.

Apparently buying from xiongda is a lot less expensive than buying from Luna.

There are both 135mm and 145mm rear axles, the 135mm only from Xiongda.

fast and slow windings, with Xiongda preferring to sell the slower because some push the faster motor too hard.

Although the Xiongda tempts me, I'm liking the Aikema 128H better (sold by BMSbattery as a Q128H). Same weight as the Xiongda, it is a 201 rpm motor so it has about the same top speed as the Xiongda. It is 800W high reduction and develops so much torque that it is a climber with its single gear. A 20A controller drives it fine according to users. so I'm right now not seeing the advantages to offset the Xiongda dedicated controller, the finicky mechanism (see pedelec link), and (I think) higher price.

But I'm still considering. It interesting that a few years ago both the Q motors and the Xiongda had a lot more posts. It seems now direct drive hub (heavy in my book) and mid-drive are now hot.

I have a TSDZ2 and I think it is great, but I have caught the ebike bug I'm building a stealth hub motor bike too.

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Re: 2 Speed Xiongda hubmotor

Post by Alan B » Nov 02 2018 11:07pm

I think all that stuff was covered here in this thread earlier.

Consider that both Xiongda and Luna provide a different level of service than BMSBattery. Very different. Service and parts on small gearmotors is eventually necessary unless you plan to discard it when it needs parts.

Plus shipping costs were through the roof. Best plan I've seen is to get spare parts (gears and clutches) and extra motors with the initial purchase to save on shipping.

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Re: 2 Speed Xiongda hubmotor

Post by Ecyclist » Nov 03 2018 12:59am

@tomtom50
Q128H by BMSbattery = no freewheeling = no torque = no customer service = not a good choice.
But, hey it's your money.
My 2 cents.
Don't expect from life to be easy and then it will be.
My builds:
Avian with hypocycloidal drive https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 2#p1318056
2016 GNG extreme drive https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 28&t=82252

tomtom50   100 W

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Re: 2 Speed Xiongda hubmotor

Post by tomtom50 » Nov 03 2018 9:23am

Ecyclist wrote:
Nov 03 2018 12:59am
@tomtom50
Q128H by BMSbattery = no freewheeling = no torque = no customer service = not a good choice.
But, hey it's your money.
My 2 cents.
I've been trying to figure out freewheeling for both hubs. Does the Xiongda freewheel with low friction? Does anyone know for sure?

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Re: 2 Speed Xiongda hubmotor

Post by docw009 » Nov 03 2018 9:30am

The Q128H definitely freewheels and BMSbattery probably has no customer service, but I've been lucky and never needed it.

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Re: 2 Speed Xiongda hubmotor

Post by tomtom50 » Nov 03 2018 10:04am

Alan B wrote:
Nov 02 2018 11:07pm
Consider that both Xiongda and Luna provide a different level of service than BMSBattery. Very different. Service and parts on small gearmotors is eventually necessary unless you plan to discard it when it needs parts.
Good point on parts. I emailed Luna because I need a 135mm hub. No dice, they only sell 145mm. I emailed Xiongda to get a quote and no response, I can try again. Does anyone know current rough price and shipping for a xiongda motor+controller+display kit?

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Re: 2 Speed Xiongda hubmotor

Post by tomtom50 » Nov 03 2018 10:08am

docw009 wrote:
Nov 03 2018 9:30am
The Q128H definitely freewheels and BMSbattery probably has no customer service, but I've been lucky and never needed it.
Thanks. Sounds like you have a Q128H. Have you tried a xiongda 2-speed? Have you seen any comparisons?

Looking at posts D8veh had and liked both but I never saw a direct comparison.

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Re: 2 Speed Xiongda hubmotor

Post by Alan B » Nov 03 2018 12:46pm

tomtom50 wrote:
Nov 03 2018 9:23am
Ecyclist wrote:
Nov 03 2018 12:59am
@tomtom50
Q128H by BMSbattery = no freewheeling = no torque = no customer service = not a good choice.
But, hey it's your money.
My 2 cents.
I've been trying to figure out freewheeling for both hubs. Does the Xiongda freewheel with low friction? Does anyone know for sure?
My Luna 2 speed freewheels with very low friction.

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Alan B   100 GW

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Re: 2 Speed Xiongda hubmotor

Post by Alan B » Nov 03 2018 12:51pm

tomtom50 wrote:
Nov 03 2018 10:04am
Alan B wrote:
Nov 02 2018 11:07pm
Consider that both Xiongda and Luna provide a different level of service than BMSBattery. Very different. Service and parts on small gearmotors is eventually necessary unless you plan to discard it when it needs parts.
Good point on parts. I emailed Luna because I need a 135mm hub. No dice, they only sell 145mm. I emailed Xiongda to get a quote and no response, I can try again. Does anyone know current rough price and shipping for a xiongda motor+controller+display kit?
China has a lot of business holidays and email is not always swift or reliable. Finding the correct email address is also sometimes a challenge.

If you look at the Xiongda drawings, they show the widths of the various motor configurations. If I recall correctly the only way to get 135mm was to use rim brakes, the disc brake model was wider.

knutselmaaster   1 kW

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Re: 2 Speed Xiongda hubmotor

Post by knutselmaaster » Nov 03 2018 1:13pm

With rim brakes it still is a bit more than 135, but not a problem to install. One can mount a freewheel with 1 less cog to gain some space if it is used with a disc brake. Lead the derailleur cable around the other side of the screw on the derailleur to compensate the difference in travel between 7 and 8 or 8 and 9 speed freewheels.

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Re: 2 Speed Xiongda hubmotor

Post by tomtom50 » Nov 03 2018 1:44pm

Alan B wrote:
Nov 03 2018 12:51pm
tomtom50 wrote:
Nov 03 2018 10:04am
Alan B wrote:
Nov 02 2018 11:07pm
Consider that both Xiongda and Luna provide a different level of service than BMSBattery. Very different. Service and parts on small gearmotors is eventually necessary unless you plan to discard it when it needs parts.
Good point on parts. I emailed Luna because I need a 135mm hub. No dice, they only sell 145mm. I emailed Xiongda to get a quote and no response, I can try again. Does anyone know current rough price and shipping for a xiongda motor+controller+display kit?
China has a lot of business holidays and email is not always swift or reliable. Finding the correct email address is also sometimes a challenge.

If you look at the Xiongda drawings, they show the widths of the various motor configurations. If I recall correctly the only way to get 135mm was to use rim brakes, the disc brake model was wider.
I will try emailing again using bonnie@xiongdamotor.com.cn.

I recall the same, 135mm is rim brake only. Which is fine with me. But Luna does not sell.

Does Xiongda have drawings or specs on a website? I only find the alibaba site that does not closely describe what is available.

http://www.xiongdamotor.com.cn/product/ ... 38882xqQIG

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Re: 2 Speed Xiongda hubmotor

Post by tomtom50 » Nov 03 2018 2:07pm

135mm motor dimensions I could find
double speed hinten neu.gif
Xiongda2speed135mm.jpg
Xiongda2speed135mm.jpg (88.14 KiB) Viewed 1863 times

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Re: 2 Speed Xiongda hubmotor

Post by Alan B » Nov 03 2018 2:20pm

tomtom50 wrote:
Nov 03 2018 1:44pm
Alan B wrote:
Nov 03 2018 12:51pm
tomtom50 wrote:
Nov 03 2018 10:04am
Alan B wrote:
Nov 02 2018 11:07pm
Consider that both Xiongda and Luna provide a different level of service than BMSBattery. Very different. Service and parts on small gearmotors is eventually necessary unless you plan to discard it when it needs parts.
Good point on parts. I emailed Luna because I need a 135mm hub. No dice, they only sell 145mm. I emailed Xiongda to get a quote and no response, I can try again. Does anyone know current rough price and shipping for a xiongda motor+controller+display kit?
China has a lot of business holidays and email is not always swift or reliable. Finding the correct email address is also sometimes a challenge.

If you look at the Xiongda drawings, they show the widths of the various motor configurations. If I recall correctly the only way to get 135mm was to use rim brakes, the disc brake model was wider.
I will try emailing again using bonnie@xiongdamotor.com.cn.

I recall the same, 135mm is rim brake only. Which is fine with me. But Luna does not sell.

Does Xiongda have drawings or specs on a website? I only find the alibaba site that does not closely describe what is available.

http://www.xiongdamotor.com.cn/product/ ... 38882xqQIG
That email address looks strange, is it correct?

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Re: 2 Speed Xiongda hubmotor

Post by tomtom50 » Nov 03 2018 2:47pm

Hill climbing torque comparison. I live in Seattle so this is a a big deal for me, I want to make a stealthy light ebike that can still climb hills.

50N-m is ample torque for even steep hills, and in low gear the Xiongda motor has it. Overheating is indicated by efficiency.
48V Xiongda Motor Chart at low speed, 50N-m marked (how Luna advertises it)
Low speed motor chart 50N-m.jpg
Torque: 50N-m
rpm: 90
Efficiency 64%

For comparison (I am trying to decide between them)

36V Q128H, where is it when efficiency drops to 64%?
q128h pedelecs uk 63N-m.png
Torque: 63N-m
rpm: 100
Efficiency 64%

This is why I am considering the two.

About same weight
Both good hill climbers

I think it is true that I could get repair parts from Xiongda, so that counts in favor of Xiongda.

On the other hand from the forums it seems quite a few Xiongdas need repair, perhaps because of the more complex mechanism.

I'm not finding another hub motor that fits the bill without being quite a lot heavier.

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Re: 2 Speed Xiongda hubmotor

Post by Ecyclist » Nov 03 2018 7:04pm

tomtom50 wrote:
Nov 03 2018 10:04am
Alan B wrote:
Nov 02 2018 11:07pm
Consider that both Xiongda and Luna provide a different level of service than BMSBattery. Very different. Service and parts on small gearmotors is eventually necessary unless you plan to discard it when it needs parts.
Good point on parts. I emailed Luna because I need a 135mm hub. No dice, they only sell 145mm. I emailed Xiongda to get a quote and no response, I can try again. Does anyone know current rough price and shipping for a xiongda motor+controller+display kit?
On Dec 11, 2017 I paid.
Deliver cost----------------------65USD(one kit to California via Fedex)
1. 48V Double-speed motor v-brake+thread-on type freewheels 135 mm ----------120 $US
1. Double-speed controller-------20 $US
1. LCD display--------------------25 $US
1. PAS--------------------------------3 $US
1. Throttle--------------------------5 $US
1. Brake lever--------------------5 $US
Don't expect from life to be easy and then it will be.
My builds:
Avian with hypocycloidal drive https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 2#p1318056
2016 GNG extreme drive https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 28&t=82252

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Re: 2 Speed Xiongda hubmotor

Post by Ecyclist » Nov 03 2018 11:06pm

docw009 wrote:
Nov 03 2018 9:30am
The Q128H definitely freewheels and BMSbattery probably has no customer service, but I've been lucky and never needed it.
I was under impression that Q128H is direct a drive with planetary reduction motor and no clutch. Was I wrong?
Don't expect from life to be easy and then it will be.
My builds:
Avian with hypocycloidal drive https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 2#p1318056
2016 GNG extreme drive https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 28&t=82252

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Re: 2 Speed Xiongda hubmotor

Post by tomtom50 » Nov 04 2018 1:37am

Ecyclist wrote:
Nov 03 2018 7:04pm
tomtom50 wrote:
Nov 03 2018 10:04am
Alan B wrote:
Nov 02 2018 11:07pm
Consider that both Xiongda and Luna provide a different level of service than BMSBattery. Very different. Service and parts on small gearmotors is eventually necessary unless you plan to discard it when it needs parts.
Good point on parts. I emailed Luna because I need a 135mm hub. No dice, they only sell 145mm. I emailed Xiongda to get a quote and no response, I can try again. Does anyone know current rough price and shipping for a xiongda motor+controller+display kit?
On Dec 11, 2017 I paid.
Deliver cost----------------------65USD(one kit to California via Fedex)
1. 48V Double-speed motor v-brake+thread-on type freewheels 135 mm ----------120 $US
1. Double-speed controller-------20 $US
1. LCD display--------------------25 $US
1. PAS--------------------------------3 $US
1. Throttle--------------------------5 $US
1. Brake lever--------------------5 $US
Thanks, very reasonable.

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Re: 2 Speed Xiongda hubmotor

Post by Ecyclist » Nov 04 2018 2:20am

Unfortunately you will need to buy a battery and that will cost you pretty penny.
For my first build I bought the battery from Luna and my plan was to buy a second, the same battery from them. (Carbon shark pack)
They didn't have it in stock so I bought it directly from China. Exactly the same thing for $115 less.
Final price including shipping for Samsung lithium battery 48v 10.4ah $342.16 USD.
Now you have a whole scoop. :)
Have fan with that. 8)
Don't expect from life to be easy and then it will be.
My builds:
Avian with hypocycloidal drive https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 2#p1318056
2016 GNG extreme drive https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 28&t=82252

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Re: 2 Speed Xiongda hubmotor

Post by tomtom50 » Nov 04 2018 3:22pm

Ecyclist wrote:
Nov 04 2018 2:20am
Unfortunately you will need to buy a battery and that will cost you pretty penny.
For my first build I bought the battery from Luna and my plan was to buy a second, the same battery from them. (Carbon shark pack)
They didn't have it in stock so I bought it directly from China. Exactly the same thing for $115 less.
Final price including shipping for Samsung lithium battery 48v 10.4ah $342.16 USD.
Now you have a whole scoop. :)
Have fan with that. 8)
My other ebike has a 12.8Ah 56 cell 52V pack in a Hailong case. I have never drawn it down more than halfway in a ride, so it is bigger than I need. I am trying for a light and inconspicuous ebike this time, so I think I will try a 7Ah 13S2P pack (48V 26 cells). It will weight 3 pounds and dimensions are about 140 x 70 x 70mm. The cells are GA rated for 10A discharge so the pack should be OK up to 20A.

Luna sells a similar 52V pack for $299.
https://lunacycle.com/52v-mighty-mini-c ... -3-pounds/

It uses 15A 30Q cells, (earlier they used 10A GA), but are 52V. I'm not sure why 2P packs are not more popular, maybe too many people damage them drawing too many amps. I am getting one custom-made (both topbikekit and DSAIKL have quoted, they are easy to work with so far).

The idea is that both the battery and controller will fit in a small under-seat saddlebag.

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Re: 2 Speed Xiongda hubmotor

Post by tomtom50 » Nov 04 2018 3:23pm

Terrific old D8veh post about hub motor options

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=83886&p=1231020&hil ... h#p1231020

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