Having issues with Aikema motors + KT controllers

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fishbait   1 µW

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Having issues with Aikema motors + KT controllers

Post by fishbait » Jan 20 2022 6:27am

Hi

I'm having issues with new kit. Have tried all I can think of and no idea what to do next.
Motor akm-13.0 250W and 36V in an 16" wheel.
Controller KT36ZWSRMT-XW01DL 350W 36V with LCD4
Battery is also almost new 36V 10s5p with about 12Ah. Actually have tried with 3 different batteries too.
Damn thing won't run with KT controller. Acts as if LVC kicks in about second or two as soon, as I touch throttle.
Starts to pull, then motor makes kind of a click and some strange whining and power down. Display is still working, nothing is switched off. When I let go of throttle, I can try again.
If I get it to move and pick up some speed, then from some point all works, scooter speeds up and all is ok until next stop and go.
Suspected faulty controller, got a new one, same model and acts exactly the same.
When I connect a Focan 500W 36V display-less controller, it runs and works fine. Range around 30-40km.
If I connect another controller I have, nameless small 250W 36V thing, it also runs as it is supposed to. As expected a little less speed.
I've tried all C and P parameters in KT I can think of. Decreasing voltage (I think C12) makes some effect but still not able to normally start from standstill.
With Focan it takes off quite well, a lot of torque and speed. Only thing is, that the unit is so big, it won't fit in the slot left for it.
To me it sounds as LVC kicking in far too early but there is no way to change it (without going in with soldering iron and even then I would not know what to change).
As there are two controllers acting the same, it seems to be not just one boggy unit thing.
Also tried same controllers on different Aikema motors and same result with other motors too. Can get them to click and whine while holding them in hand with pliers.

Anyone has any ideas how to fix such thing?
Or is such combo a no go under any circumstances?
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AHicks   10 kW

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Re: Having issues with Aikema motors + KT controllers

Post by AHicks » Jan 20 2022 9:36am

I'm not REAL sure I'm following your question, but I'm left wondering about your phase and hall sensor wiring. Many times the motor side and the controller side wiring colors match, but unfortunately there is NO assurance that will work out well for you as there is NO color standardization. The firing order required by the motor MUST match that of the controller.

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E-HP   1.21 GW

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Re: Having issues with Aikema motors + KT controllers

Post by E-HP » Jan 20 2022 10:50am

fishbait wrote:
Jan 20 2022 6:27am

I've tried all C and P parameters in KT I can think of. Decreasing voltage (I think C12) makes some effect but still not able to normally start from standstill.
Can you provide your P and C settings?

Comrade   100 W

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Re: Having issues with Aikema motors + KT controllers

Post by Comrade » Jan 20 2022 12:37pm

fishbait wrote:
Jan 20 2022 6:27am
To me it sounds as LVC kicking in far too early but there is no way to change it
But there is a way to test for it. Why not measure your voltage during the fault condition?

docw009   1 MW

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Re: Having issues with Aikema motors + KT controllers

Post by docw009 » Jan 20 2022 8:14pm

Could be as Ahicks suggests. You might have a false positive on the phase wires. The other day I was testing a new 20A KT controller I had just received, and swapped blue and green. The motor spun up, but was very weak even though I had no load on it.

fishbait   1 µW

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Re: Having issues with Aikema motors + KT controllers

Post by fishbait » Jan 21 2022 1:46am

Hi

Thanks for all answers and helping hands.
Question mainly is trying to figure out the logic and reason behind this. I can run it with this big Focan controller alright but I cannot understand why others does not work. Also as Focan has no display or buttons, switching on/off both motor and headlights need a different setup.

This potential phase issue was one of my thoughts too, so I tested out all possible connections.
Used the http://lyen.com/Manual/Lyen's_Brushless ... eet_v2.pdf table to help me with it.
There were two setups where motor behaved normally and one had colors matching and rotating in correctly, the other had all colors shifted in same manner and rotated in opposite direction. I did that few months ago and I do not seem to have the paper anymore.
At moment there is fourth version of controller connected - this one https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005001 ... 4c4djAxWyM - the 350W box with S6-61 display
Still having the exact same issues...

Measuring can technically be done but would be a bit difficult to do from within controller while both throttling and giving wheel enough restriction to create power drop situation. When motor has no restriction - wheel is lifted from ground - it all works and runs.
Did measure from battery - all is as expected, on takeoff voltage drops as it should but stays well above 30V. The BMS in battery has 50A, battery cells are Panasonic ncr18650pf - 10amps each.

I'm thinking I should be able to figure something out from all this time and energy I've put into this bloody scooter.
So far have built 6 bicycles, 2 scooters and one 3kW thing but no...
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aroundqube   10 kW

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Re: Having issues with Aikema motors + KT controllers

Post by aroundqube » Jan 21 2022 5:29pm

" acts as if LVC is kicking in " works on Focan controller with max 30A output. Does not work on KT controller which is smaller with 22 A output. I am wondering if this is over current protection ? A false positive hall/phase combo will draw high current. Need to use a watt meter , and volt meter.

fishbait   1 µW

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Re: Having issues with Aikema motors + KT controllers

Post by fishbait » Jan 22 2022 7:51am

When I had KT controller connected, then the C5 setting (max current value (A)) to 03 - "Max current value /2" and C12 (minimum voltage (V)) to 0 - "Default value -2V" did have small effect.
But what most baffles me is exactly the same thing - works with 500W Focan and not working with 350W KT.
Could Focan have "slower fuse"? Like in home fuses - there are curve ratings from A to C defining how fast fuse will act.

I've tried to find a way to bring set LVC down a bit or maybe even disable at all for testing but not much success.
Cannot find similar controller done by anyone else either.
From searching I've found that it should be a resistor with value over 1000 and one end connected to VCC. There is one at 1502 but no direct connection to VCC...
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fishbait   1 µW

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Re: Having issues with Aikema motors + KT controllers

Post by fishbait » Jan 22 2022 10:26am

As said, I don't have it connected to scooter at moment, so cannot check.
I did read a lot and went through all I could but I seem to have thrown away all the notes I had also.
Seller recommendation was this and I know I did test that among others.
P1: 88 (100 for 500W-engine)
P2: 1
P3: 1
P4: 1
P5: 0

C1: 6 or 2
C2: 0
C3: 2
C4: 1
C5: 10
C6: 3
C7: 0
C8: 0
C9: 0
C10: n
C11: 0
C12: 4 -> in your case test this with 0
C13: 0
C14: 2

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