IR Camera enough. Or thermal camera necessary?

E-driver_

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Hi

I wonder if a simple IR Camera is enough to measure the heat of one's motor? Or is the more expensive thermal camera necessary?

Would the IR Camera do a good enough job of measuring the motor temperature? Or is it necessary to buy the more expensive thermal camera?
 
You can't measure temperature with a near-IR camera. Thermal IR cameras are expensive, but you can get IR non-contact spot thermometers for pretty cheap. These work like the camera, but only a single pixel.
 
You can now actually get reasonably priced and even kinda cheap thermal cameras, the cell phone ones are I guess reasonably priced and there are some pretty cheap self contained units on aliexpress. From personal experience they don't have the greatest UI or resolution, and depending on which sensor some have crazy wide FoVs but they do work and are good enough for messing around, probably not good enough for any real work though. And honestly I think they are no replacement for a decent IR gun, also the IR guns with the laser field targeting are well worth it. Instead of a single point they shine a ring of dots that is approximately the size of the IR gun reading area so you can tell if you're measuring what you want or mostly background.
 
Do you need to know it's operating temperature while in-use?

If so, and you can open the motor, install a thermal sensor (usually a 10k NTC thermistor, often with beta of around 3900, like with the Cycle Analyst or various motor controllers that have thermal sensing built in). Or even an old BBQ grill sensor; take it apart and install the sensor inside the motor just under the windings somewhere (glued down with high-temperature epoxy, and tie down the wiring all the way to the exit). Install the display end on your handlebars. It's not terribly accurate but it will give you an idea of operational temperature ranges under various conditions.

There are also actual temperature monitors that you can install various sensors on, (you install the sensors into what you're monitoring, like your motor).



E-driver_ said:
I wonder if a simple IR Camera is enough to measure the heat of one's motor? Or is the more expensive thermal camera necessary?

Would the IR Camera do a good enough job of measuring the motor temperature? Or is it necessary to buy the more expensive thermal camera?
 
E-driver_ said:
Hi

I wonder if a simple IR Camera is enough to measure the heat of one's motor? Or is the more expensive thermal camera necessary?

Would the IR Camera do a good enough job of measuring the motor temperature? Or is it necessary to buy the more expensive thermal camera?

Based on measuring the temps of the motor housing compared to the internal temp, there's very little value in estimating the motor temp by the housing temps. The internal temps can rise way beyond the danger point before the external case temp catches up.
 
Will the thermal camera show you the *internal* stator-winding temperatures, thru the metal side casing that is blocking the heat from simply radiating away from those windings?

My guess is that it won't--you will probably at best see a delayed heat transfer "image" (how long a delay I don't know, but it might be significant enough to cause a problem with your testing, depending on what your goal is).
 
scianiac said:
You can now actually get reasonably priced and even kinda cheap thermal cameras, the cell phone ones are I guess reasonably priced and there are some pretty cheap self contained units on aliexpress. From personal experience they don't have the greatest UI or resolution, and depending on which sensor some have crazy wide FoVs but they do work and are good enough for messing around, probably not good enough for any real work though. And honestly I think they are no replacement for a decent IR gun, also the IR guns with the laser field targeting are well worth it. Instead of a single point they shine a ring of dots that is approximately the size of the IR gun reading area so you can tell if you're measuring what you want or mostly background.

Aa ok. Do you have one in mind that is good value for the money paid perhaps? Could buy on aliekspress, but a lot of them are at least 140 dollars.
 
E-HP said:
E-driver_ said:
Aha so you would go with the thermal camera then right?

Nope. I don't think either will see through the housing. You could use your hand, which is probably just as inaccurate measure of the internal temps as the camera.

Haha ok.

But seriously using your hand and some common sense would be quite good right?
 
I really like mine, would pay retail twice for it certainly. It is like having 20,000 ir pointers in one screen. Cost of mine was 799$ w/o accessories ( battery, case, current clamp).

There is a hellofadifference in ta 1000w hub motor running on 3kW vs a 3000w hub motor running on 3kW. Camera will show that. Lol. However, a thermal color changing sticker can tell you this too. For about 10 cents.

The tool tells me alot, alot more than a spot IR pointer. It teaches me things. I see the reflection of an amazing amount of technology, research and development that thermal cameras have accomplished..

My dad the superpowerindustry engineer of 50 years says its a trinket. A toy. Not very usefull. Nice, but not necessary, for any "real" engineering work... I even take pics of our boilers and the steam engines and try to tell him stuff.. and he is like " I knew that without the camera". Lol.

I am an amateur electrical enthusiast. I play with dangerous things. I sell my play as paid labor to my customers. People come to me cause it is known I " know " what I am doing. ( kinda do, analog electronics are easy.. ) .. Like today I am doing an IOTA charger/load center in a 2005 Sprinter by Mercedes. 12v system with shore power. Hooking up 120v and whatnot to a permanent installation on a deep cycle in a van, for the camping. 30A 120v main breaker, small plastic NEMA rated panel for the van... but in the initial test, I take a view of it under power and see hot spots, wires that are to small, hotspots easily and shows my error. Is the charger working? Is the load power ok with a 10g stranded on the 30A breaker? Is that spade terminal that I thought might not have crimped that good.. heating up dangerously>? Can I run a 12A vacuum on the circuit safely? How about a circular saw off the inverter?

It is also cool as a hunting tool. I can see a cat from 100 yards away in the absolute black of night.

However, you cannot hunt frogs with it. Doh!

It will for sure tell you if it is " just hot.. or way tooo hot".... I wont ever not have one for the rest of my life given how useful mine was/ is. Plus all the pics of the other things ( doggys, houses, cars, HVAC systems)

I couldn't imagine spending 1000$ on just a Thermal cam. ( the low resolution cheap cameras suck, so I wanted something with a good resolution) ... So I got the FLIR DM285, a datalogging multimeter of very good specs and is also just happens to be a thermal camera. So the incentive of a datalogging multimeter plus thermal camera made me spend the 1000$. A very good, 40,000 count meter that datalogs up to 3000A ( 3x a second). 9 FPS maximum ( as per U.S. laws, so we dont go making home made heat seeking missiles to go shoot around out back in the cow pen).


Some pics I have taken.
 

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