Two Passenger Delta Trike

Joined
Jan 5, 2012
Messages
73
Hi

This starts the build log of my next e-bike.
Objectives
  • 2 passenger sociable tandem
  • 20 mile range (33km)
  • 20 mph top speed (33km/h)
  • Looks like a bike
  • Street legal

Features
  • 3 wheels, delta
  • Full suspension w shocks
  • Dual bafang fat hub motors for drive, choose model w wide flanges for good lateral strength
  • Electronics designed specifically for bike
  • On board charger (i.e. has 120V cord for charger wherever)
  • Solar assist charging (expect 10% range extension unless parked in sun while at pub)
  • Backup supply for lighting
 
Here is first stab at block diagram of electrical
EBIkeBlock Diagram June 2019.gif

With key in off position

  • Lights and audio, and user display panel is off
  • charger is alive
  • battery can be charged
  • Fuel gauge keeps track of SOC
 
Forks
Have thought a lot about this. As I am thinking about 3.5" to 4" tires, figure at least 135mm OLD for front forks, which really limits selection!

Requirements
  • Suspension, do not need or want huge travel though
  • Ability to mount large diameter rotor
  • Strong, strong, strong! Prefer triple tube, afraid to use single crown

Off the shelf candidates

DIY Candidates

  • Use triple tree non suspension fork, and build dual A frame suspension at steering tube
  • Monarch style (doubt anywhere near strong enough, and no dampening)
  • Other suggestions?
 
"Sociable tandem" and "looks like a bike" are somewhat in conflict. A tandem arrangement would be a lot more bike like.

I am not a fan of delta trikes for high(er) speed designs, due to the lack of stability during hard stops. But they can work if the design is long enough.
 
Hi Bill
Previous bike was 4 passenger delta, rear 2 riders faced backwards, and center line of rear "axle" was slightly behind the center line of the 2 front and 2 rear passengers.

This proved much more stable than expected. Key speed limitation was inadequate braking, as 2 rear hubs are coaster brakes. Intention is cruiser, not speed demon. Key shortcomings of this bike were:
  • Inadequate braking
  • Single speed low gearing (good to help climbing hill a bit, but not cruising speed assist)
  • 4 passengers really stressed components beyond reliable operation
  • Direct drive front motor, Magic Pie 3, would overheat if tasked with long slow climb

trixie.jpg
 
On the fork, "triple clamp" / triple-whatever ;) is definitely stronger. I just went with that on SB Cruiser a few weeks ago, and it's much much stiffer (less flexy) than anything I've used before. I built mine from clamps Chalo sent, and some old bike frame tubes and some steel lowers off a cheap suspension fork (until I can build the dropout modules I want, that have specific stuff that doesn't come on anything existing).

What I built so far
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Mockup of something like what I will end up with
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Mine are nonsuspension, but they work just fine on SB Cruiser, riding on typical roads at 20MPH; even the average potholes are ok with them, though it's naturally bumpier than with suspension, it's not that much different than any of the cheap suspension forks I've ever had. I didn't expect to be able to deal with the ride, but it's really not enough different from before to worry about on most of the roads I ride on (there's a few places I wish for suspension). I may add suspension at some point, or I may not. The *rear* of the trike needs the suspension a lot more than the front, given the loads of a St Bernard or two, or a bunch of big dog food bags, or a full mounded-over cart of groceries....).

If you want strong, off the shelf, but no suspension, then you can use pedicab forks. That's essentially what I have, though I used my own tubing/dropouts. Places like this https://precisionpedicab.com/ sell most of the stuff you'd need to build and/or motorize a pedicab, so you could probably use the same stuff for yours. You'd have to poke around to find the places that have all the bits you want (or ask Chalo; he could probably tell you).


I'm using the Avid BB7 disc brakes, cable operated, AVid speed dial lever, 200mm rotor, whatever pads came with it, and they work fine--more than enough power to skid the front wheel. Rear brakes are just regen on the DD hubmotors; adequate but not presently adjustable--is just full braking or none.


I do recommend a long trike for 20MPH; SB Cruiser handles pretty well, though I have stuff I'd change if I were to build a Mk II. IIRC it's around 11 feet long ATM, not including the trailer hitch.

It's not all that wide; yours will be wider as a sociable, which will make it more stable in turns if the seats and other mass is low enough. I am not sure if it is the width-to-length that makes SB Cruiser stable, or just the length.
 
Yes, stance is a bit wider. Note chain routing on driver side, passenger side has a 6" jack shaft.

For this bike's use, short wheel base has advantage of turning around on sidewalk.

And yes, I have noticed Chalo as purveyor of all things HD and pedicab, he seems like a great source.

Thanks for the link!
 
The Speaker Guy said:
For this bike's use, short wheel base has advantage of turning around on sidewalk.
Keep in mind that the shorter it is, the twitchier it can be (also depends on steering setup / angles), so riding at higher than around 10MPH on shorter trikes can be potentially dangerous if a sudden steering change has to be made; the trike can tip and roll over. (been there, done that; it's one reason why SB Cruiser is so long).

To actually turn around *on* the sidewalk, unless they are *really* wide sidewalks, I'd expect taht it would have to be very short and narrow, with steering that can go basically sideways, or would be easy to accidentally have a wheel slip off the edge.

Even my Delta Tripper couldn't turn around on a sidewalk, and it was so short it could tip over trying to turn at a few MPH; had to practically come to a stop to enter driveways and such.
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=22720
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SB Cruiser, before I switched from a single-crown fork (which allowed me to turn the front wheel "sideways", or even "backwards" to some degree), I could turn the trike around inside a typical parking space. Now that it has the triple-clamp fork, the radius is much larger, because the fork tubes between the clamps hit the frame behind the headtube.
https://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=67833

file.php

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