Super 3K Build

asvybre

1 mW
Joined
Apr 19, 2019
Messages
18
Location
Portugal, Porto
Hi everyone!

I've been working on a 3000W e-bike build for the past months and I found lots of useful information and tips here on ES.
So, I decided to share my build so far and get some tips hopefully :D

Using a chinese copy of an ebb frame that I got here in Portugal for 200€ + rear shock (crazy price, the guy was desperate) and MXUS 3K-Turbo.

Frame and shock.
8gOrW6Nh.jpg

MXUS 3K-Turbo.
pxTpVrCl.jpg

Display that came with the motor kit on full throttle
ozHnXXWl.jpg


Right now I'm trying to figure out which winding the motor has, because there is no visible markings on the motor it self.
On 82V the motor seams to run at about 590RPM, that concluded from my calculations using the iPhones slow-mo :lol:
It pulls about 1A at that voltage which unfortunately seams to point that it is a 5T winding, I was looking for a 3-4T :cry:
What wheel would you suggest? (19"?)

The battery I will be making myself since I have good experience on that ground.
20S10P is what I am looking for and if possible VTC6 cells or other high current cells.
Also, a BMS that is relatively affordable and trustworthy is what I'm trying to find!

Front suspension as of now is an unknown part of the build since I would like to keet it balanced and also not break the bank.
If you have a suggestion, please share it with me.


PS: I also did a 3D drawing of the frame I have (not all dimensions are as they should) on Solidworks.
g2ooSAXl.jpg
 
asvybre said:
MXUS 3K-Turbo.

<snip>
MXUS 3K-Turbo.
<snip>

Right now I'm trying to figure out which winding the motor has, because there is no visible markings on the motor it self.
On 82V the motor seams to run at about 590RPM, that concluded from my calculations using the iPhones slow-mo :lol:
It pulls about 1A at that voltage which unfortunately seams to point that it is a 5T winding, I was looking for a 3-4T :cry:
was it purchased new or used?

if new, you should have been able to specify which winding you wanted, or it should have said which one it was. (if you were looking for a specific winding, and it didn't say, and the seller couldn't tell you, then i do kinda wonder "why buy it?")


anyway, you can try to compare your test results with those from http://ebikes.ca/simulator using the same setup, to see if it matches any of the windings listed there. they are under mxus 4503 4504 4505 4506.


alternately, you can open the motor and see what the marking is on the stator--often they are marked with their winding (not always though).

the good news is that the faster windings are sometimes available used here on es in the for sale used section.
 
amberwolf said:
was it purchased new or used?

if new, you should have been able to specify which winding you wanted, or it should have said which one it was. (if you were looking for a specific winding, and it didn't say, and the seller couldn't tell you, then i do kinda wonder "why buy it?")


anyway, you can try to compare your test results with those from http://ebikes.ca/simulator using the same setup, to see if it matches any of the windings listed there. they are under mxus 4503 4504 4505 4506.


alternately, you can open the motor and see what the marking is on the stator--often they are marked with their winding (not always though).

the good news is that the faster windings are sometimes available used here on es in the for sale used section.

A friend of mine bought 5 ebike motors to save on customs here to portugal, honestly I was ignorant at the time and didn't even know these could come in different windings..

I have looked on that simulator and it seams to be the 5T.

Since I wanted to help my friend by taking that motor I will test it on the build. I'm not sure if there is anyone looking for 5T here, but I will be looking for a 3T or 4T soon.

Thanks for the advice!
 
the good news is that if you just want the bike to be faster, you can put it in a larger diameter wheel to help make up for the speed...but this will reduce the torque you get out of it.

or, you can get a higher voltage battery and controller that can handle it, to make up for the speed. just use a voltage that's proportionally higher to make up for the winding difference; you can determine that with the simulator using the system a / b compare mode.
 
Yes, that's what I am going to do. The frame I believe won't take a wheel bigger than 19" with 2.75" tire..

As for the battery, I was planning on staying on the 20s for space reasons, in my cad file the 20s10p will be tight and maybe a 24s that would be very good is too much for the space and motor.
I have seen people go around 100V but will the motor keep healthy?
With that voltage I can get the 70kmh that I want!

Thanks for the help! :thumb:
 
the motor can probably do 200v+.

its' teh phase current you have to watch for; i don't know what it will take but there are threads about that motor that might say.

keep in mind that higher speeds require much more power than lower ones.

also keep in mind that the 450x series of motors is not really a 3000w (continuous) motor, unless you're using it in a wheel with a tire diameter same or smaller than 20" (rim diameter same or smaller than 16"), according to various info in threads about it.

you can use the simulator to see how that all works, paying attention to the "overheat in" section under the graphs.
 
wow, that's nice!
And now I get why people love 3T's...

The simulator has been a really helpful tool!

1500W at cruising speed seams a good idea. In full acceleration 11min (50A phase) to overheat is a good threshold or do you recommend less?

Thanks a log amberwolf, you've been a great help!
 
Today I bought the rear rim.
It's a 19" by 1.40 aluminum rim made here in Portugal and was about 60€
zM4UBMsl.jpg


Will get the spokes tomorrow, still deciding on a one or two cross pattern...
 
since that rim has angled nipple holes, the cross pattern is determined by the angle the nipples will come out of them at.

if you don't follow that angle, the spokes are going to be bent where they enter the nipples, and since that part is prestressed by the threading, they'll eventually start breaking there.

if you have a spare nipple laying around of the right gauge for that rim, you can eyeball what the angle is going to be; even better if you also have a spoke (even if it's not the right length) to "draw a line" from the nipple thru the flange hole.


there's a number of sites with spoke calculators, but this particular motor is already in the database at http://ebikes.ca in their spoke calculator. the rim wont' be, so you will have to follow the instructions on the site to measure the specific dimensions the calculator will need from you to give you the right spoke length.
 
Yes, that was my guess in the beginning.

As a matter of fact I do have a 3mm spoke and nipple that was given to me kindly by the shop owner and I will do that!

I was using Sapim Spoke Calculator which is for bike wheels but would be close enough. I did not know about the spoke calculator on ebikes.ca, thank you!

I will be posting an update soon with the wheel hopefully! :D
 
With all the difficulties due to the virus, progress as been going slow but fortunately I've been able to do some work.
Here is the back tire for now, it was really cheap but will do for now.
19" x 2.75
s68NCTkl.jpg


And right now I am truing the wheel, I've got the lacing well done but need a way to consistently tension the spokes correctly.
GavE1Hrl.jpg
 
The rear wheel is complete! After a lot of effort putting the tire on and scratching the rim :cry: I was able to assemble it complete.
Here's how it looks:
xMxffABl.jpg
mpXgHJ8l.jpg


Also, the bead would not seat properly after mounting, I used soapy water and inflated the tire almost up to 7 bar (100 psi) and it wouldn't pop. After lots of tries of inflating and deflating I just let it sit in 7 bar for 15 min and when I came back it was almost perfectly seated... :lol:
 
Hi everyone!

There has been progress on the build, after the rear wheel was assembled I mounted it in the frame, got an old fork and wheel from a bike and the rest of the components from the transmission and also bought a cheap shimano hidraulic brake kit for now.

I could not stop my self from trying to run the bike so I basically got 2x 36V 10ah ebike batteries, run them in series and went on with it. I can't twist the throttle too quickly or the bms's cut the battery but it is good for test riding as of now.

1xwrlSul.jpg


Right now I am waiting on the cells to make the battery. I ordered 200 samsung 30Q which fit perfectly.
I will post soon the that :bigthumb:
 
asvybre said:
Here is the back tire for now, it was really cheap but will do for now.
19" x 2.75

Those look great. There's a lot to be said for cheap tires, which are often pretty good while they're new. I like new tires, if they're cheap and I can replace them instead of wringing as much as I can out of the more expensive, man, give me the cheap tires.

And the cheap bike, too. Mine have a way of getting stolen. Looks great.
 
Thank you very much! I am yet to test them on different terrains 8)
They where 25€, I am planning on doing lots of km's on these so yeah they will go quickly :lol:
 
Hi everyone!

It has been a while but the build continues, the battery is done and I will soon show you the full details. As of now here is a small timelapse of building it!

 
Last edited:
Hello again!

After a good break because of my masters degree I am back on this project.

Last weekend I got a dirt bike suspension, front wheel and brakes for 150€.
It's gonna need some adaptation but in my opinion is way better brakes and suspension than I could get new for the value.

ngBIQpq.jpg

xGOdhYR.jpg


Ps: Excel Rim, almost as much new as what I paid for the whole package :D
 
Hi how's it going? I have the same frame :)


I had to modify that little section underneath to allow space for my controller (100a sabvoton)
Currently waiting on my rear wheel (motor) then it will be just about finished :)

Are you sure a 26" wheel won't fit in the swing arm? as the advert stated it would
 
Mrjmiddleton said:
Hi how's it going? I have the same frame :)


I had to modify that little section underneath to allow space for my controller (100a sabvoton)
Currently waiting on my rear wheel (motor) then it will be just about finished :)

Are you sure a 26" wheel won't fit in the swing arm? as the advert stated it would

Nice controller! :flame:
It does fit but I am using motorcicle wheels on my bike.
My rear wheel is a 19'' x 1.40 with 2.5'' tyres
My front is 21''x1.40 with 2''
 
It's been a long time, I have been away but here's what I have done.

In this video, I show you how I built a battery pack for this project.

72V 30Ah with 200 Samsung 30Q cells.

[youtube]W5h3YKE5aWM[/youtube]
 
Hey everyone,
In this video, join us as we create a high-speed e-bike without breaking the bank. We take you step by step through the entire process of building a 5000 W, 80+ km/h with 60 km range e-bike and show how simplicity can lead to incredible results.
Get ready to dive into Ebike engineering as we break down the key components that make this project possible, like the centerpiece of our creation, a 72V 30Ah battery we built on the last video.

Components:
Chassis EBB Frame Used - 200 €
Rear Shock DNM RCP-3 220mm - Included
Hub Motor MXUS 3K 5 turns - 280 €
Front Forks Marzocchi 888 Bomber Used - 200 €
Handlebar Tharsis + Shimano BLMT501 - 100 €
Throttle Surron - 30 €
Controller Sabvoton SVMC 72150 - 400 €
BMS Programmable 20s 200A Bluetooth BMS QUCC Store - 100 €
Battery 72V 30Ah Samsung 30Q Cells - 600 €
Wheels & Accessories - 80€

 
If you are going 80+k/hr with the 5T motor I don't think a 3 or 4T would be better. Probably worse overheating on hills.
I don't think I could get the 3 or 4T motor to go 70+ km/h tho.
This one does get hot on hills with 100Kg load. Will have to upgrade to a 5kw or more soon!
 
I don't think I could get the 3 or 4T motor to go 70+ km/h tho

Lower turn count = higher kV = higher motor RPM for the same system.

Higher kV = lower kT = lower motor torque for the same system.
 
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