Bafang BBSHD, 1000W, 68mm-120mm BB

Discussions related to motors other than hub motors.
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leelorr   100 W

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Bafang BBSHD, 1000W, 68mm-120mm BB

Post by leelorr » Mar 27 2015 1:13pm

I just saw this news on the "Empowered Cycles" web site at:
http://www.empoweredcycles.com/blogs/ne ... oming-soon

[moderator edit: several threads were started at the same time on this new drive, and have been consolidated here. Plus posts from the very long BBS02 thread have been merged here. I am stating this so readers will understand the disjointed flow of the posts on these first few pages]

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ziltoid81   100 W

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Re: Announcement: New Bafang 1000w, 90-110mm BB mid drive co

Post by ziltoid81 » Mar 31 2015 4:30pm

Too good to be true.... :wink:

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Re: Announcement: New Bafang 1000w, 90-110mm BB mid drive co

Post by ziltoid81 » Mar 31 2015 6:55pm

Its all about competition, if no one else throw a bbs like 100mm middrive in the market, they can offer high prizes.

If they make minor changes, like only a longer axle and housing the prize should be the same, but i guess they present a whole new model.

Anyway......i guess the prize will be lower than a converted bbs02 from california ebike and thats the only real competition so far.

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Re: Announcement: New Bafang 1000w, 90-110mm BB mid drive co

Post by dumbass » Mar 31 2015 7:44pm

You can already get a Bafang mid-drive for Fat tire bikes (100mm). They are available from California Ebike. They offer a fully setup kit or conversion kit to use on your existing Bafang kit. They will even rent you the tools to make the modification. The even have an online video to help with the conversion.

I have one on order now (expect delivery on Monday 4/6). And Doug (the owner) is fantastic to work with. this will be my second Bafang kit from him.

Bob

http://california-ebike.com/product/baf ... rsion-kit/

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Re: Announcement: New Bafang 1000w, 90-110mm BB mid drive co

Post by leelorr » Mar 31 2015 10:22pm

My guess is $300 more than the 750 watt BBSO2...

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Re: Announcement: New Bafang 1000w, 90-110mm BB mid drive co

Post by EMPowered » Apr 01 2015 1:13am

The price is not a secret, Bafang has not released much information about it yet, and price will be based on what 8fun charges.
I don't think it will be much more money, I certainly hope not! I don't plan on charging 300$ extra for this. It's a simple change really, and one they needed to make in order to keep up with bike manufacturers switching to press fit BB and the growing popularity of Fat Tire Bikes.
Last edited by EMPowered on Apr 01 2015 5:48pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Announcement: New Bafang 1000w, 90-110mm BB mid drive co

Post by cwah » Apr 01 2015 2:15am

Want one
Help me find my stolen electric brompton: http://bit.ly/1a0vbBC and Bosch Sinus B3 http://bit.ly/1eV0WQz

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Re: Announcement: New Bafang 1000w, 90-110mm BB mid drive co

Post by Ade » Apr 01 2015 2:43am

Very interested in this! I have a California E-bike 100mm conversion and it's awesome but it won't last forever and it was damn expensive so an equivalent that's less expensive and available in Europe without the US shipping and local support in case of warranty issues would be great. I doubt if support could approach Doug's though - the guy's a legend.
Nakamura bigbob 4.0 Fatbike with (Luna) 120mm BBSHD and 14ah shark pack with QA cells.

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tomjasz   1.21 GW

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Re: Announcement: New Bafang 1000w, 90-110mm BB mid drive co

Post by tomjasz » Apr 01 2015 3:15am

Kiriakos GR wrote:
the motors will become available in May-June time frame
But the price is still a secret. :lol:
I bet that what ever compatibility with BB01 and BB02 will be lost, and a totally different offering will be presented for large wallets.
It's good to have large wallet.
Thanks Justin_le we're here thanks to you. All the best to the mods for their tireless work keeping it on an even keel.

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Re: Announcement: New Bafang 1000w, 90-110mm BB mid drive co

Post by tomjasz » Apr 01 2015 3:51am

Bafang hasn't done much to support anyone, much less their faithful USA dealers. The new kids will learn their lessons and the China dealers are getting smarter about support and shipping. Be prepared to bleed a little if you think you're gonna jump in a change the face of the business just because you have Bafangs latest first. We have a collective memory and loyalty to those that supported us.

The good news is, if it's a Bafang product, Doug will have it too and the legend continues. Kind of sad to read a newcomer knd of gloating about an EBike supporters potential loss due to China reacting late to a trend. Doug has done more to support his customers in a year than many will do in a lifetime.

And we'll all ride on.
Thanks Justin_le we're here thanks to you. All the best to the mods for their tireless work keeping it on an even keel.

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ziltoid81   100 W

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Re: Announcement: New Bafang 1000w, 90-110mm BB mid drive co

Post by ziltoid81 » Apr 01 2015 5:35am

I dont think a 1000w (2000w peak according to the 750w rated bbs02?) model is neccessary.
The stress on the whole drivetrain will get to a new level.

My 350w bbs01 did the job very well, same chain for 6500km so far.
With a bbs02 there is noticeable more stress, some change their chains after 1000km.

I would love to mount exact this unit on my qulbix raptor, but it has a 83mm bb.

For me a normal bbs01 with just a longer housing and axle will be perfect, no higher power.
But 1299 plus taxes plus shipping is overkill for me....its somewhere about 1600 in the end...i mean its still a bbs02.

Cant wait to get a "real" announcement......not only rumors.

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tomjasz   1.21 GW

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Re: Announcement: New Bafang 1000w, 90-110mm BB mid drive co

Post by tomjasz » Apr 01 2015 9:55am

I dunno about anyone else but I grow weary of middle aged blokes, that probably still live with their mums, from countries the size of a small state, prattling on about American riding styles and market. Jeebus STFU already. Go for a ride. You add no value or insight.
Thanks Justin_le we're here thanks to you. All the best to the mods for their tireless work keeping it on an even keel.

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Re: Announcement: New Bafang 1000w, 90-110mm BB mid drive co

Post by dumbass » Apr 01 2015 1:53pm

tomjasz wrote:Bafang hasn't done much to support anyone, much less their faithful USA dealers. The new kids will learn their lessons and the China dealers are getting smarter about support and shipping. Be prepared to bleed a little if you think you're gonna jump in a change the face of the business just because you have Bafangs latest first. We have a collective memory and loyalty to those that supported us.

The good news is, if it's a Bafang product, Doug will have it too and the legend continues. Kind of sad to read a newcomer knd of gloating about an EBike supporters potential loss due to China reacting late to a trend. Doug has done more to support his customers in a year than many will do in a lifetime.

And we'll all ride on.
I have to agree. Bafang has done nothing to support it's customers. The only true support gotten for the Bafang mid-drive has been from dealers like Doug and Paul and of course from many people here on ES.

There's no question Bafang may try to get a peace of the fat bike action. But if it's "so called" 1000w unit fairs as well as it's 750w units did (do) then then it's a case of "Here we go again!!".

I personally think the unit is maxed out at the 750w level. Going to 1000w unless they do significant mods is going to be a disaster.

As for added stress caused by Doug's design mods to convert a standard 750w into a 100mm 750w....In my opinion the design is quite solid and very straight forward. In reality he is simply moving the outer bearing out about 30mm and making a longer drive shaft. Lets face it the problems with the mid-drive units haven't been the main bears or drive shafts. It's been the crappy controllers and in some cases the nylon gear. And lets us not forget the stupid programing. Nor should we forget that even when they stopped producing the 750w so as to correct the controller problems the new 25a controllers are still being reported with the same old problems. And some suppliers are recommending they downgrade the 25a to a lower setting as low as 18a. Hell you may as well buy the 500w if you did that.

Bottom line; I'll trust Doug's design before I will Bafang's. At least I know Doug will support it. I do agree I with they didn't cost so much though.

Bob

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Re: Announcement: New Bafang 1000w, 90-110mm BB mid drive co

Post by dumbass » Apr 02 2015 4:58pm

Kiriakos GR wrote:My only unknown detail about Bafang Mid-drive history, is who copied whom first.

Bafang copied the complexity of Bosch Mid-drive ? Or the other way around?
Ether way I think Bosch likely did the better job......but at a cost.

Bob

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Re: Announcement: New Bafang 1000w, 90-110mm BB mid drive co

Post by tahustvedt » Apr 02 2015 9:21pm

Kiriakos GR wrote:My only unknown detail about Bafang Mid-drive history, is who copied whom first.

Bafang copied the complexity of Bosch Mid-drive ? Or the other way around?
Bosch internals:
https://www.e-bikeshop.co.uk/blog/wp-co ... e-2014.jpg

Bafang internals:
https://www.electricbike.com/wp-content ... Bs01PR.png
https://www.electricbike.com/wp-content ... ondary.jpg

Spitting image of each other both in complexity and design. It's uncanny. ;)

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tomjasz   1.21 GW

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Re: Announcement: New Bafang 1000w, 90-110mm BB mid drive co

Post by tomjasz » Apr 02 2015 10:09pm

<snicker>
Thanks Justin_le we're here thanks to you. All the best to the mods for their tireless work keeping it on an even keel.

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Re: Announcement: New Bafang 1000w, 90-110mm BB mid drive co

Post by DaDo.Bzz » Apr 03 2015 5:11am

But then it wont be allowed on roads in America. You have 750W limit there no?

In EU we have 250W, but Bosch is on Turbo going 275% Can somebody explain this?
LMX 81, 16S6P 60A
BBS02 on Cannondale Rz 120
BBSHD on CTM Scroll, XTR Di2, 700Wh 52V
Slovakia, Bratislava

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Re: Announcement: New Bafang 1000w, 90-110mm BB mid drive co

Post by tomjasz » Apr 03 2015 1:21pm

Yikes! Oh to be 25 again! Nice nice nice. Great video. I would have saved my nickels and owned such a bike in my youth. No doubt.
Thanks Justin_le we're here thanks to you. All the best to the mods for their tireless work keeping it on an even keel.

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Re: Announcement: New Bafang 1000w, 90-110mm BB mid drive co

Post by cbzen » Apr 05 2015 5:40pm

Other than a short blog post, does anyone have any official information from Bafang regarding a 90 - 110mm BB mid drive?

I find it interesting that this mid-drive would be available one month from now, but it was not announced at Bafang's booth at the Tapaei International Cycle Show last month. They seem to be quite focused on promoting their Max Drive system.
Charles Bartlett
California Ebike

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Re: Announcement: New Bafang 1000w, 90-110mm BB mid drive co

Post by leelorr » Apr 06 2015 4:13pm

The 750watt BBS02 100mm kit at Lectric cycles appears to cost $1200 on the web site.
Of course you are entitled to charge what you want, but this is $700 more than EM3EV sells the standard 68-73mm BBS02 kit for.

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Re: Announcement: New Bafang 1000w, 90-110mm BB mid drive co

Post by ziltoid81 » Apr 06 2015 5:05pm

leelorr wrote:The 750watt BBS02 100mm kit at Lectric cycles appears to cost $1200 on the web site.
Of course you are entitled to charge what you want, but this is $700 more than EM3EV sells the standard 68-73mm BBS02 kit for.
What do you charge for your 100mm middrive kit? :wink:

Everyone has the right to write down a prize for his product.......no one is forced to buy it.

If you think the conversion is not worthy 700 then do it cheaper.

Dont miss understand. .......it is clearly too expensive, but now the only option, so they can charge that.
A longer housing and axle will add nearly nothing to the prize in mass production. .........

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Re: Announcement: New Bafang 1000w, 90-110mm BB mid drive co

Post by Avitt » Apr 18 2015 5:02pm

Just noticed that the new BBS "XL100" is being offered by Alcedo Italia. Seems to be about a 300 Euro premium for the wide version.

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Re: Announcement: New Bafang 1000w, 90-110mm BB mid drive co

Post by garrickk » Apr 18 2015 5:33pm

Avitt wrote:Just noticed that the new BBS "XL100" is being offered by Alcedo Italia. Seems to be about a 300 Euro premium for the wide version.
Interesting. It looks to me that it's a BBS02 with a modified axle by Alcedo or someone else, not a new system by Bafang.

I asked Paul at EM3EV about the 100mm kit rumor. He said that he was told it was a possibility 2 months ago, that they were considering it, but it's not a done deal and he doesn't expect it any time soon. Of course, maybe they just are keeping it quite for now.

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Re: Announcement: New Bafang 1000w, 90-110mm BB mid drive co

Post by Avitt » Apr 18 2015 6:20pm

Yeah, reading more about it, it does appear to be an aftermarket kit.

Sorry about the false alarm.

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Re: Announcement: New Bafang 1000w, 90-110mm BB mid drive co

Post by dumbass » Apr 19 2015 8:16pm

Avitt wrote:Yeah, reading more about it, it does appear to be an aftermarket kit.

Sorry about the false alarm.
It's more then likely an imported unit of Doug's at Ca. Ebike. He is selling/shipping his conversions internationally now.

Bob

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