TSDZ2 mid drive with 860C, 850C or SW102 displays only -- Flexible OpenSource firmware (Casainho code only)

Heisenberg60 · Sep 16, 2020

dameri said:
jtsavola said:

dameri said:

jtsavola said:

See few pages backwards. No fix yet...

Click to expand...

Have you tried this? https://github.com/OpenSource-EBike-firmware/TSDZ2-Smart-EBike/issues/139#issuecomment-678766584

Click to expand...

Unfortunately my skills are very limited. I can follow step by step guide but that's it

Click to expand...

Here is a very good guide https://github.com/OpenSource-EBike-firmware/TSDZ2_wiki/wiki/Development (I think that is step by step ). It has quite a lot to do when you have to install many programs. The help was originally made for OSX, but should also work on Linux and Windows. Personally, I use Linux and I managed quite easily even though I have no experience with programming.

I try next week if I manage with Windows at work if I have spare time.

I will get a new light https://herrmans.eu/products/front-lights-4147/e-bike-10035/h-black-pro-e/hopefully next week and there may be a problem with the engine.

Then I can to test if the new hex file which I made works with TSDZ2.

I have now lights which came with the TSDZ2. The head light is very poor and tail light stop working at all. I think there is problem with internal connections. TSDZ2 works with these lights with no problem.

great that`s what i was looking for

i will give an update as soon as i mange to update my firmware (might take until next, i have a lot of stuf to do)

Did some one have the same problem as i do with the temperature sensor ?
My bike won`t start with the sensor intalled.

plpetrov · Sep 16, 2020

Heisenberg60 said:
dameri said:

jtsavola said:

dameri said:

Have you tried this? https://github.com/OpenSource-EBike-firmware/TSDZ2-Smart-EBike/issues/139#issuecomment-678766584

Click to expand...

Unfortunately my skills are very limited. I can follow step by step guide but that's it

Click to expand...

Here is a very good guide https://github.com/OpenSource-EBike-firmware/TSDZ2_wiki/wiki/Development (I think that is step by step ). It has quite a lot to do when you have to install many programs. The help was originally made for OSX, but should also work on Linux and Windows. Personally, I use Linux and I managed quite easily even though I have no experience with programming.

I try next week if I manage with Windows at work if I have spare time.

I will get a new light https://herrmans.eu/products/front-lights-4147/e-bike-10035/h-black-pro-e/hopefully next week and there may be a problem with the engine.

Then I can to test if the new hex file which I made works with TSDZ2.

I have now lights which came with the TSDZ2. The head light is very poor and tail light stop working at all. I think there is problem with internal connections. TSDZ2 works with these lights with no problem.

Click to expand...

great that`s what i was looking for
i will give an update as soon as i mange to update my firmware (might take until next, i have a lot of stuf to do)

Did some one have the same problem as i do with the temperature sensor ?
My bike won`t start with the sensor intalled.

Hi, what is the problem with your temperature sensor?

When I did my installation, I experienced some weird issues. Initially I was getting temperature about 200 degrees Celsius. The problem was a pull up resistor in my controller on the input. I checked several photos available on the internet and I realised that it was present only on my controller. I checked two solutions: 1. - use 12 volt power for the temperature sensor or 2. - remove the resistor. As I did not wanted to install 12 volt power supply, I finally removed the pull up resistor.

andyme · Sep 16, 2020

Thanks Plamen and Casainho !

I think it is most probably a problem with the controller..why this happened all of a sudden I have no idea, but: I have a spare Motor. I have flashed it successfully last night and connected it using my bikes cables. No problem here. On the other hand, it seems that I cannot flash the mounted Motor anymore ...

Also: I do have a spare controller from pre casainho times..it was for 36V ave then later I purchased a 750/48.

My question: can this controller be used for 48v and be flashed accordingly? I remember at the time I got it, I was told that a 36v controller cannot be programmed for 48v...but that does not mean this was correct...

plpetrov · Sep 16, 2020

andyme said:
Thanks Plamen and Casainho !

I think it is most probably a problem with the controller..why this happened all of a sudden I have no idea, but: I have a spare Motor. I have flashed it successfully last night and connected it using my bikes cables. No problem here. On the other hand, it seems that I cannot flash the mounted Motor anymore ...

Also: I do have a spare controller from pre casainho times..it was for 36V ave then later I purchased a 750/48.

My question: can this controller be used for 48v and be flashed accordingly? I remember at the time I got it, I was told that a 36v controller cannot be programmed for 48v...but that does not mean this was correct...

Hi Andy,

As far as I am aware all controllers, at least from the first generation, are one and the same from hardware point of view with the exception of the connector to the display - 6 or 8 pins. The difference is only in the firmware.

I remember also other people reporting a similar problem to yours. In their case it was due to a corruption of the option bytes. The Casainho's software is normally setting them but as it was discussed here may be not all of them. The solution is to read the option bytes from a working controller and write them to the damaged one. I don't know if it will work in your case but you may try.

dameri · Sep 16, 2020

plpetrov said:
andyme said:

Thanks Plamen and Casainho !

I think it is most probably a problem with the controller..why this happened all of a sudden I have no idea, but: I have a spare Motor. I have flashed it successfully last night and connected it using my bikes cables. No problem here. On the other hand, it seems that I cannot flash the mounted Motor anymore ...

Also: I do have a spare controller from pre casainho times..it was for 36V ave then later I purchased a 750/48.

My question: can this controller be used for 48v and be flashed accordingly? I remember at the time I got it, I was told that a 36v controller cannot be programmed for 48v...but that does not mean this was correct...

Click to expand...

Hi Andy,

As far as I am aware all controllers, at least from the first generation, are one and the same from hardware point of view with the exception of the connector to the display - 6 or 8 pins. The difference is only in the firmware.

I remember also other people reporting a similar problem to yours. In their case it was due to a corruption of the option bytes. The Casainho's software is normally setting them but as it was discussed here may be not all of them. The solution is to read the option bytes from a working controller and write them to the damaged one. I don't know if it will work in your case but you may try.

I don't know what is true but for example PSWPower sells 36V and 48V controllers. http://www.pswpower.com/ven.php?cargo.2016-7n-kxr0

plpetrov · Sep 16, 2020

dameri said:
plpetrov said:

andyme said:

Thanks Plamen and Casainho !

I think it is most probably a problem with the controller..why this happened all of a sudden I have no idea, but: I have a spare Motor. I have flashed it successfully last night and connected it using my bikes cables. No problem here. On the other hand, it seems that I cannot flash the mounted Motor anymore ...

Also: I do have a spare controller from pre casainho times..it was for 36V ave then later I purchased a 750/48.

My question: can this controller be used for 48v and be flashed accordingly? I remember at the time I got it, I was told that a 36v controller cannot be programmed for 48v...but that does not mean this was correct...

Click to expand...

Hi Andy,

As far as I am aware all controllers, at least from the first generation, are one and the same from hardware point of view with the exception of the connector to the display - 6 or 8 pins. The difference is only in the firmware.

I remember also other people reporting a similar problem to yours. In their case it was due to a corruption of the option bytes. The Casainho's software is normally setting them but as it was discussed here may be not all of them. The solution is to read the option bytes from a working controller and write them to the damaged one. I don't know if it will work in your case but you may try.

Click to expand...

I don't know what is true but for example PSWPower sells 36V and 48V controllers. http://www.pswpower.com/ven.php?cargo.2016-7n-kxr0

You can always use Google. Just search "TSDZ2 controller differences".

For the factory firmware the voltage is set in the firmware. You can also easily change it by reprogramming. For the open source firmware the battery voltage does not matter, as far as it is below the maximum voltage of the capacitors, that is 63 volts.

andyme · Sep 16, 2020

.
[/quote]
I remember also other people reporting a similar problem to yours. In their case it was due to a corruption of the option bytes. The Casainho's software is normally setting them but as it was discussed here may be not all of them. The solution is to read the option bytes from a working controller and write them to the damaged one. I don't know if it will work in your case but you may try.
[/quote]

Problem is: StVp does not recognize the Controller..i think i will have to change it...or is there another way?

plpetrov · Sep 16, 2020

andyme said:
I remember also other people reporting a similar problem to yours. In their case it was due to a corruption of the option bytes. The Casainho's software is normally setting them but as it was discussed here may be not all of them. The solution is to read the option bytes from a working controller and write them to the damaged one. I don't know if it will work in your case but you may try.

Problem is: StVp does not recognize the Controller..i think i will have to change it...or is there another way?

You mean you can neither read nor write any of the 3 tabs in the ST Visual Programmer? Program memory, data memory or option byte?
If this is the case you can change the microcontroller or the whole controller.

My suggestion is:
1. Read the option byte from the working controller.
2. Try to write the option byte from step 1 to the bad controller.
3. In case you succeed in step 2, try to program the bad controller as usual.

You might be lucky ...

andyme · Sep 16, 2020

plpetrov said:
andyme said:

I remember also other people reporting a similar problem to yours. In their case it was due to a corruption of the option bytes. The Casainho's software is normally setting them but as it was discussed here may be not all of them. The solution is to read the option bytes from a working controller and write them to the damaged one. I don't know if it will work in your case but you may try.

Problem is: StVp does not recognize the Controller..i think i will have to change it...or is there another way?

Click to expand...

You mean you can neither read nor write any of the 3 tabs in the ST Visual Programmer? Program memory, data memory or option byte?
If this is the case you can change the microcontroller or the whole controller.

My suggestion is:
1. Read the option byte from the working controller.
2. Try to write the option byte from step 1 to the bad controller.
3. In case you succeed in step 2, try to program the bad controller as usual.

You might be lucky ...

the old controller must have died somehow...ST-LINK was not able to detect it as a device. I have swapped controllers now and everything seems to be fine again. at least i am not getting an error message so far ...

thanks for your help, gentlemen!

Bojan · Sep 17, 2020

Hi I am new to this forum so sorry if my question has already been answered.
have heard good things about this project, so I decided may be I should try and port the code to my own controller design.I am an electronics engineer by profession so I don't mind modifying circuitry around the processor. I however have some questions on the code and would appreciate any help.

In the code snippet below (copied from calc_foc_angle(void))
Phase current seems to be calculated basically as ... Battery Current / duty cycle.
I would have thought phase current in each winding should be less than or equal to battery current. But for duty cycles of less than 1 (256 decimal), the calculated phase current will be greater than battery current.
I am not sure I undrestand this and I hope somebody could enlighten me, thanks.

// calc I phase current
if (ui8_g_duty_cycle > 10)
{
ui16_temp = ((uint16_t) ui16_g_adc_battery_current_filtered) * ADC10BITS_BATTERY_CURRENT_PER_ADC_STEP_X512;
ui32_i_phase_current_x2 = ui16_temp / ui8_g_duty_cycle;
}

nesdon · Sep 17, 2020

Never mind.

electroriderIT · Sep 18, 2020

.... Anyone that wish to help oh this? :mrgreen:

electroriderIT said:
Regarding my previous doubts.....
Here in the picture the parameters that I would like to put in relations from mbrusa release and fantastic Casainho one ...

Can you help me understand precisely what they correspond on Casainho firmware? I'm uncertain ...

ALSO:

"Current Ramp" on Casainho how relates on that?

HOW MANY assist levels do you use? I feel that 20 are too many for me.... I'm more use to 4 to 9 but I can get used to them ...ANYWAY if I set the assist levels to 5.....should I also change the scale or it sets automatically with the new levels numbers?

for example if in 20 levels I have 100% of power on the 20th level, I I put 5..will I have 100% on the fifth ? I hope that makes sense

Thank you for helping!

electroriderIT said:

dear Casainho ...I MADE IT!!! thank you! successfully flashed the 850C and the motor .
I solved the problem connecting to the lcd by building a boot loader myself! everything is good!
MY QUESTION
A si said I come from the java graphic configurator porting of the Opensource firmware and I'm setting now the parameters directly from 850C lcd (thanx to Casainho!)....BUT some parameters I cannot find...for example this was my configuration (52v battery):

Schermata 2020-08-10 alle 16.12.33.png

is there a "parallelism guide" to match settings from that firmware to this, so the motor will response as I already experimented on the configurator?

THANX!!!

casainho said:

electroriderIT said:

a little update after some tests.
- with display connected to tsdz2 the display powers on, no problem.
- nothing has changed the way the software does not recognize the programmer.

-I checked all 5 wires soldered on the display and they seem to be ok. I also desoldered GND cable from display and checked all other 4 pins with the multimeter to find some problems. the other 4 pins with cables soldered are NOT shortened each other..should be good that way.... When I solder back the GND cable if I test GND with other pins, some are in continuity , but also that should be good due to the connections of the display board (right?)

- so everything "connection side" seems fine but I get these errors ( depending on the combination that I use to workaround , in the software jtag, swd, hard reset etc..al the options in stm32 st link software)
Schermata 2020-08-31 alle 13.06.41.png
Schermata 2020-08-31 alle 13.06.17.png
- A curious detail: downloaded the firmware st link update software and it recognize and updates the firmware...BUT then in the stm32 st link software NOTHING!
Schermata 2020-08-31 alle 13.05.41.png
Schermata 2020-08-31 alle 18.48.49.png

Click to expand...

Is possible your display is not working anymore, it could be damaged for some reason in the process, this kind of things happen.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

mctubster · Sep 18, 2020

AZUR said:
#
#
Situation - I feel some delay in the engine's response.

When I cycle on sloped roads, with at least 6% slope, what I feel is that in certain situations, if I stop pedaling 1 or 2 seconds and then start again, the engine only responds after I have been awhile push and rotate the pedals, 1 or 2 seconds. The engine response is neither effective nor immediate as soon as I start pedaling. I feel some delay in the engine's response.

Hi, just got around to reading your post and watching your videos. I have a theory for you. Unfortunately I don't have time to test.

I believe in firmware v1.0 there is a bug in the Boost setting. It is reversed. If Boost is displayed as enabled, it is disabled and vice versa. Previously I found Boost activation to be unreliable and the symptom you are showing could potentially be related to the Boost code. Try "Enabling" in the settings (which means it is disabled) and see if you get the same behavior.

I have only been running v1.0 for a week and am struggling with the lack of power at low rpm (compared to v0.20 on KT-LCD3). Even with "Torque" mode enabled I find the motor is not behaving as I would expect (I put out high torque, and the motor does not try to match - unlike v0.20 which does Torque mode as you would expect) and feels like there is a hard coded ramp or maybe Boost is misbehaving for me too.

I will let you know if I discover more

Regards

mctubster · Sep 18, 2020

Goody5 said:
Hi

Loaded the 1.0.0 with 860C display and all the torque calibration setting etc. Everything works great except sufficient power from a standing start.

There seems to be a significant difference in the start up power from the stock firmware and 1.0.0.

I live on a hill and with the stock firmware can start up comfortably in 4th gear in power level 2 but with 1.0.0 it is a real struggle even if I set the assist level to maximum.

I have seen a few posts regarding this and tried a few suggested setting but with no luck. Haven’t got my head around whether I have got some settings wrong or there is some other issue.

Interested to know whether others who are using 1.0.0 noticed a difference in standing start power between stock and 1.0.0

I have a 36V motor

Yes for sure. I went for my first big ride today on my Cargo bike with v1.0 and launching on a hill has become an exercise in excitement for me. Even though I have maxed out the current ramp, max current to 20A (believe that is the hardcoded limit) and with torque mode enabled on high levels of assist the motor seems to have a nap for several pedal revolutions. I am not a C coder unfortunately and reading the change notes suggest a lot of fundamental changes in the motor code compared to earlier versions which bring on the power faster and smoother.

I love the 860c display and the graphing, but am seriously considering switching back to the KT-LCD3 display which is a lot more responsive in my circumstance at least. I vaguely remember a branch months back where a v0.20 style torque mode assist was created. I'm off to find that version to see if there is a binary for the 860c and if so will have a go with that

dameri · Sep 19, 2020

Is it possible to make the v.20 version work on the 860C display.

HughF · Sep 19, 2020

mctubster said:
Goody5 said:

Hi

Loaded the 1.0.0 with 860C display and all the torque calibration setting etc. Everything works great except sufficient power from a standing start.

There seems to be a significant difference in the start up power from the stock firmware and 1.0.0.

I live on a hill and with the stock firmware can start up comfortably in 4th gear in power level 2 but with 1.0.0 it is a real struggle even if I set the assist level to maximum.

I have seen a few posts regarding this and tried a few suggested setting but with no luck. Haven’t got my head around whether I have got some settings wrong or there is some other issue.

Interested to know whether others who are using 1.0.0 noticed a difference in standing start power between stock and 1.0.0

I have a 36V motor

Click to expand...

Yes for sure. I went for my first big ride today on my Cargo bike with v1.0 and launching on a hill has become an exercise in excitement for me. Even though I have maxed out the current ramp, max current to 20A (believe that is the hardcoded limit) and with torque mode enabled on high levels of assist the motor seems to have a nap for several pedal revolutions. I am not a C coder unfortunately and reading the change notes suggest a lot of fundamental changes in the motor code compared to earlier versions which bring on the power faster and smoother.

I love the 860c display and the graphing, but am seriously considering switching back to the KT-LCD3 display which is a lot more responsive in my circumstance at least. I vaguely remember a branch months back where a v0.20 style torque mode assist was created. I'm off to find that version to see if there is a binary for the 860c and if so will have a go with that

You are looking for the r0mko 'torque mode fork', I made a specific thread for the discussion of that fork. I have switched to the standard 1.0.0 now and don't find it to be any less responsive at all when compared to the r0mko version.

If you want good performance 'out of the blocks' you must have startup boost disabled (which seems to enable it) and you must use assist without pedal rotation.

Without these two, the motor is crap off the line.

commutebybicycle.com · Sep 19, 2020

Hi,

I hope I'm posting correctly, I had a few questions about the ebike OSF with the 860C:

1. Is there a known battery glitch? I noticed it reset to 100% after it was down to 85%?

2. Is there any plan or interest to add average and summary stats or even memory to the computer? Once you turn it off, is everything gone? It would be great to have average speed, average power, average cadence, etc. It would also be great to be able to stop the elapsed time (and show seconds) as well. Just curious if there is any work or interest in these areas.

mctubster · Sep 19, 2020

HughF said:
You are looking for the r0mko 'torque mode fork', I made a specific thread for the discussion of that fork. I have switched to the standard 1.0.0 now and don't find it to be any less responsive at all when compared to the r0mko version.

If you want good performance 'out of the blocks' you must have startup boost disabled (which seems to enable it) and you must use assist without pedal rotation.

Without these two, the motor is crap off the line.

Thanks for the info. Will try those settings now and play around with the boost factors. TBH still confused over the way Torque mode responds in v1.0 ... it seems to just be power mode?

HughF · Sep 20, 2020

mctubster said:
HughF said:

You are looking for the r0mko 'torque mode fork', I made a specific thread for the discussion of that fork. I have switched to the standard 1.0.0 now and don't find it to be any less responsive at all when compared to the r0mko version.

If you want good performance 'out of the blocks' you must have startup boost disabled (which seems to enable it) and you must use assist without pedal rotation.

Without these two, the motor is crap off the line.

Click to expand...

Thanks for the info. Will try those settings now and play around with the boost factors. TBH still confused over the way Torque mode responds in v1.0 ... it seems to just be power mode?

Have you calibrated the torque sensor? Torque mode for me is very very different to power mode. But perhaps that is because I have AWOP enabled and I always use assist level 10 as a minimum. At this assist level, even the weight of the pedal crank arm is enough to get the assistance going, I regularly have to hold the bike on the brakes.

No, I don't use brake sensors for cutoff.

mctubster · Sep 20, 2020

HughF said:
Have you calibrated the torque sensor? Torque mode for me is very very different to power mode. But perhaps that is because I have AWOP enabled and I always use assist level 10 as a minimum. At this assist level, even the weight of the pedal crank arm is enough to get the assistance going, I regularly have to hold the bike on the brakes.

No, I don't use brake sensors for cutoff.

Yes calibrated the torque sensor. Having assist without pedal rotation helps and boost seems to be kicking in from what I can tell - but still seem to be lacking power when I expect it.

For example I was climbing an approx 1:10 hill, about 150KG gross weight on Cargo bike, I was pedaling at 50RPM and having to lever against the handle bars - I weigh 80kg, so I would estimate at least 50kg on each pedal through the stroke if not more ... but the screen was only indicating around 250W of human power ... I would expect easily 400W, if not 500-600W (I can only do this for 30sec)

I'm going to go back and check with weights re the torque sensor.

Any thoughts on how the assist calculation works when using torque mode? eg 0.2x what exactly. If its torque 50x9.81x0.17 = 83Nm ... so 83*.2 = 16.6A? It ain't doing that for sure.

Not finding this current calculation stuff very intuitive tbh, compared to the previous simple double or triple my power / torque output scale.

Cheers

AZUR · Sep 20, 2020

mctubster said:
AZUR said:

#
#
Situation - I feel some delay in the engine's response.

When I cycle on sloped roads, with at least 6% slope, what I feel is that in certain situations, if I stop pedaling 1 or 2 seconds and then start again, the engine only responds after I have been awhile push and rotate the pedals, 1 or 2 seconds. The engine response is neither effective nor immediate as soon as I start pedaling. I feel some delay in the engine's response.

Click to expand...

Hi, just got around to reading your post and watching your videos. I have a theory for you. Unfortunately I don't have time to test.

I believe in firmware v1.0 there is a bug in the Boost setting. It is reversed. If Boost is displayed as enabled, it is disabled and vice versa. Previously I found Boost activation to be unreliable and the symptom you are showing could potentially be related to the Boost code. Try "Enabling" in the settings (which means it is disabled) and see if you get the same behavior.

I have only been running v1.0 for a week and am struggling with the lack of power at low rpm (compared to v0.20 on KT-LCD3). Even with "Torque" mode enabled I find the motor is not behaving as I would expect (I put out high torque, and the motor does not try to match - unlike v0.20 which does Torque mode as you would expect) and feels like there is a hard coded ramp or maybe Boost is misbehaving for me too.

I will let you know if I discover more

Regards

Thanks Mctubster for your help.

What Casainho says is that Startup Boost is not working. Therefore, we must always have "Disable". I've done some tests and it doesn't even work in reverse.

About Torque mode I don't understand why it exists. It must be for a specific application that I am not aware of.

However, I have been doing MTB for over 20 years and what I do is that to start uphill, I put a lighter gear. I have an 11-50 cassette and a 42 chainring.

"Motorless bicycles" only work in Power mode.

Human power = Cadence x Torque (Force applied to the pedal x Crank length)

In Firmware and TSDZ1 we have:

The more current we apply to the motor, the more power we extract from the motor.

Power mode

Motor Current = Assist Level x Human power

With a higher cadence more power is obtained from the motor.

Torque Mode

Motor Current = Assist Level * Torque

In Torque mode you can pedal at a higher cadence that doesn't get more power from the engine.

I always use Power mode. .

I hope this information helps.
Try to increase the Current ramp and use the Power Mode.
Always use a light gear when starting. You save the motor , the chain and the cassette.

Sets the motor current to 30 Amp and the battery current to 20Amp.

What is the maximum current your battery can supply? Do you know?

AZUR · Sep 20, 2020

=

Power Delay Issue on a Flat Road

In the Video that I present below it is possible to verify the existence of the problem even in flat roads.

I would also like to mention that when I made this video I did not detect the problem. Perhaps due to kinetic energy. It was when I saw the video that I noticed. But on steep roads the effect and the lack of power are quite felt due to the delay.

The following can be seen:

- At (minute: s, ms) 1: 14,397 I stopped pedaling
- At (minute: s, ms) 1: 20,307 I started pedaling again.
6s877ms later.
- 100 ms later the motor current starts to increase.
- only 1m485ms later the PWM starts to increase.

If PWM = 0 the motor power is zero.

Power Delay Issue it is more visible, on youtube, if the video is being presented with a playback speed of 0.25.

The video was recorded at a speed of 30 frames per second.

With the free Windows VideoPad program that you can download here https://www.nchsoftware.com/videopad/index.html, you can see the evolution of video frame by frame.

[youtube]LvnlBgy8ulo[/youtube]

As I showed in a previous post, the Power Delay Issue is more evident and critical on steep roads, or unpaved paths.

It is also shown that the delay is greater with the highest assistance levels.

However, even at assistance level 9 you can see the delay in the video.

Above Level 9, I do not recommend using these levels on MTB circuits.

In the various Videos I made, and the tests I did, what I was able to verify is that all levels of assistance can be used.
Up to level 20, it can be used without any problems and instability.

It also seems to me that the torque sensor is not a problem.

I hope that this information will help to solve this issue, if there is a solution to the problem.

jeff.page.rides · Sep 20, 2020

AZUR said:
=

Power Delay Issue on a Flat Road

In the Video that I present below it is possible to verify the existence of the problem even in flat roads.

I would also like to mention that when I made this video I did not detect the problem. Perhaps due to kinetic energy. It was when I saw the video that I noticed. But on steep roads the effect and the lack of power are quite felt due to the delay.

The following can be seen:

- At (minute: s, ms) 1: 14,397 I stopped pedaling
- At (minute: s, ms) 1: 20,307 I started pedaling again.
6s877ms later.
- 100 ms later the motor current starts to increase.
- only 1m485ms later the PWM starts to increase.

If PWM = 0 the motor power is zero.

Power Delay Issue it is more visible, on youtube, if the video is being presented with a playback speed of 0.25.

The video was recorded at a speed of 30 frames per second.

With the free Windows VideoPad program that you can download here https://www.nchsoftware.com/videopad/index.html, you can see the evolution of video frame by frame.

[youtube]LvnlBgy8ulo[/youtube]

As I showed in a previous post, the Power Delay Issue is more evident and critical on steep roads, or unpaved paths.

It is also shown that the delay is greater with the highest assistance levels.

However, even at assistance level 9 you can see the delay in the video.

Above Level 9, I do not recommend using these levels on MTB circuits.

In the various Videos I made, and the tests I did, what I was able to verify is that all levels of assistance can be used.
Up to level 20, it can be used without any problems and instability.

It also seems to me that the torque sensor is not a problem.

I hope that this information will help to solve this issue, if there is a solution to the problem.

Version 1 has so much Less low end torque than version 20 it's a real bummer.
And like you said when you stop peddling and start peddling again with V1 there's a big dead spot.
If V20 would work on the 850C and 860C I would switch back to V20.
V1 does have a few things I like better, but these 2 problems above and that V1 is so complicated to set it up correctly is what makes V1 such a pain.
Listed below are some of the previous post I discussed the same problems you're dealing with.
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=93818&p=1577655&hilit=jeff.page.rides#p1577655
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=93818&p=1577574&hilit=jeff.page.rides#p1577537
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=93818&p=1575117&hilit=jeff.page.rides#p1575199
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=93818&p=1574958&hilit=jeff.page.rides#p1574958

Goody5 · Sep 20, 2020

jeff.page.rides said:
AZUR said:

=

Power Delay Issue on a Flat Road

In the Video that I present below it is possible to verify the existence of the problem even in flat roads.

I would also like to mention that when I made this video I did not detect the problem. Perhaps due to kinetic energy. It was when I saw the video that I noticed. But on steep roads the effect and the lack of power are quite felt due to the delay.

The following can be seen:

- At (minute: s, ms) 1: 14,397 I stopped pedaling
- At (minute: s, ms) 1: 20,307 I started pedaling again.
6s877ms later.
- 100 ms later the motor current starts to increase.
- only 1m485ms later the PWM starts to increase.

If PWM = 0 the motor power is zero.

Power Delay Issue it is more visible, on youtube, if the video is being presented with a playback speed of 0.25.

The video was recorded at a speed of 30 frames per second.

With the free Windows VideoPad program that you can download here https://www.nchsoftware.com/videopad/index.html, you can see the evolution of video frame by frame.

[youtube]LvnlBgy8ulo[/youtube]

As I showed in a previous post, the Power Delay Issue is more evident and critical on steep roads, or unpaved paths.

It is also shown that the delay is greater with the highest assistance levels.

However, even at assistance level 9 you can see the delay in the video.

Above Level 9, I do not recommend using these levels on MTB circuits.

In the various Videos I made, and the tests I did, what I was able to verify is that all levels of assistance can be used.
Up to level 20, it can be used without any problems and instability.

It also seems to me that the torque sensor is not a problem.

I hope that this information will help to solve this issue, if there is a solution to the problem.

Click to expand...

Version 1 has so much Less low end torque than version 20 it's a real bummer.
And like you said when you stop peddling and start peddling again with V1 there's a big dead spot.
If V20 would work on the 850C and 860C I would switch back to V20.
V1 does have a few things I like better, but these 2 problems above and that V1 is so complicated to set it up correctly is what makes V1 such a pain.
Listed below are some of the previous post I discussed the same problems you're dealing with.
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=93818&p=1577655&hilit=jeff.page.rides#p1577655
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=93818&p=1577574&hilit=jeff.page.rides#p1577537
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=93818&p=1575117&hilit=jeff.page.rides#p1575199
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=93818&p=1574958&hilit=jeff.page.rides#p1574958

Having a similar issue.

I was using the Emmebrusa firmware with the VLCD5 which is really nice, but wanted to get the 860C display onto my bike. I had an issue with the start power (Ver 1) which was mostly resolved by enabling assist without pedal rotation (noted by mctubster) but I do find it really flat on power when you accelerate for the first few seconds, then it takes off.

Not sure if it is an issue with the cadence settings or it is just damping down the power due to the larger current draw on the initial acceleration. I did all the torque sensor calibrations so hoping it is just a setting issue as the 860C display is very nice.

HughF · Sep 21, 2020

Awop + torque mode + disabled startup boost

Those three things should see you getting off the line with plenty of power. Mine absolutely rips with those settings. I am able to outrun 50cc scooters from the traffic lights it has that much acceleration.

TSDZ2 mid drive with 860C, 850C or SW102 displays only -- Flexible OpenSource firmware (Casainho code only)

1 mW

100 W

100 W

100 W

100 W

100 W

100 W

100 W

100 W

1 µW

10 mW

10 mW

1 kW

1 kW

100 W

100 W

1 µW

1 kW

100 W

1 kW

100 W

100 W

100 W

1 mW

100 W

Similar threads