Amberwolf's Bolt-Together Semi-Recumbent Cargo Bike

General Discussion about electric bicycles.
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Re: Amberwolf's Bolt-Together Semi-Recumbent Cargo Bike

Post by Xrain » Apr 09 2011 9:58pm

amberwolf wrote: As for losing hope, well, I took a good look at the welder, and despite verifying contacts (and even recrimping and then soldering several high-current connections), it still just stutters much of the time. Too much to weld this frame with, cuz I just keep burning holes.

The only thing I haven't done, which I will once I get done feeding the dogs in a bit, is to bypass both the power switch and the thermal cutoff on the transformer, in case one of those has an internal problem causing high-resistance or something. Since it does it for both positions of the Hi/Lo rocker switch, I don't think that one is a problem, or it would likely only happen in Lo, as I have only used the Hi a very few times. If it comes down to it I'll bypass that one, too, in "permanent" Lo mode.
Since its the electricity itself that is cutting out, my best guess would be the thermal cutoff on your transformer is worn out.

All welders have duty cycle, which is the amount of time the welder can run before the thermal cutoff stops the machine.

So it could certainty be your thermal cutoff, I've hit the duty cycle on welders before while TIG welding, and it didn't stutter it just shut the machine off, granted this was a miller, and not a Harbor Freight...
But it could just be that its malfunctioning, so definitely try to bypass it and see if that is the problem, but if it is that, becareful how much you weld as without that you could easily cause the welder to burst into flames. :shock:

But your bike is looking excellent!, and I cant wait to see it drive. I'll try to pick my brain a bit more and see if I can think about anything else for your welder, if I do I'll let you know.

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Re: Amberwolf's Bolt-Together Semi-Recumbent Cargo Bike

Post by amberwolf » Apr 10 2011 1:15am

katou wrote:There must be custom bike builders in your area. If you could get them interested in what you are trying to do, they would probably accede to doing a weld or two for you, heck, any fabricator would do.
If I knew any that had time, that'd be easy. But every person I know that has a welder or access to one is always too busy. A few of them have been saying for years they'd weld up whatever I bring them, if I just tack it or clamp it together the way I want it, but I could never get hold of any of them when it came down to taking them up on it. That's why I had to buy the welder I have now, and relearn it myself. ;)


Xrain wrote:So it could certainty be your thermal cutoff, I've hit the duty cycle on welders before while TIG welding, and it didn't stutter it just shut the machine off, granted this was a miller, and not a Harbor Freight...
But it could just be that its malfunctioning, so definitely try to bypass it and see if that is the problem, but if it is that, becareful how much you weld as without that you could easily cause the welder to burst into flames. :shock:
Well, I am never welding enough to trigger it at all (it's a 1 minute on, 9 minutes off cycle according to the labels, for Hi, and 2/5 for Lo). I'd guess that when it's working right the longest I draw an arc is 15-30 seconds, since just about everything I do is small joints on thin-ish stuff. it's just a typical thermal breaker, so it should just cut out completely until it cools down if it is working right, so the stuttering could be a symptom of wierdness inside.

So bypassing it shouldn't hurt anything, and I'll try that next, tomorrow if I can. Tonight ended up being Grand Central Station, with phone calls coming in and a friend coming over to bring me some tools to use till I can replace the ones I lost.
But your bike is looking excellent!, and I cant wait to see it drive.
Me either. :)
I'll try to pick my brain a bit more and see if I can think about anything else for your welder, if I do I'll let you know.
Thanks! I appreciate any help or advice at all, even if I end up ignoring it and blowing myself up. :lol:

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Re: Amberwolf's Bolt-Together Semi-Recumbent Cargo Bike

Post by Xanda2260 » Apr 10 2011 2:30am

I know very liitle about welders but it occurs to me that the arc would generate a fair amount of EM interference. I therefore presume that the feed electronics are shielded in some way? Could that be failing causing the stuttering? Just a random thought.
Nice build by the way!

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Re: Amberwolf's Bolt-Together Semi-Recumbent Cargo Bike

Post by amberwolf » Apr 10 2011 3:04am

The electronics are just a rectifier and cap, and a voltage regulator controlled by the pot on the front, to drive the tiny brushed feed motor. Not really anything to be interfered with by the RF in this case (although it is of course possible for the semiconductors to be damaged by the spikes, it's not that likely that this is causing the stuttering, as that stuttering is coming from something prior to that point).


A bit of update to the frame; a friend brought over the leaf springs and also some tools for me to use till I replace what I lost (and a few he definitely doesn't want back). :)

Leaf spring in approximately the position I would most like to use it in. Note the shock/coilspring is in the pic but would not be present in the leafspring design.
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The red vertical above the rear dropouts would push against the spring's end, upward, causing the spring to react back downward against it's forward mount. I'd have to modify or remove the top half of the swingframe. Probably by cutting the forward post by several inches in the middle, and bending the top down to nearly meet the bottom, and weld the post back together at that point.

To make the spring tougher or react harder, I could also add a brace directly in front of the leaf's center curve, so that it is only bending over half it's length. If I have that brace far enough forward so that it doesn't contact the spring until there's a heavy load on it, or it really hits a big bump, then it'll be softer ride under normal conditions. At least, in theory. :)

Turns out they're a bit shorter than I thought, more like 23" instead of 24", which is a good thing, as it makes them easier to deal with, by just a little bit. And theoretically stiffer, which is good for me. The two-leaf version is on the bike, the three leaf is on the floor.

Dunno if i have time to build a bracket for it to hold it, so using it may have to wait till after the race. Probably have to go with the shock/coil for now, if I use rear suspension at all (don't need it for the race, really).

Tools brought over:
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Re: Amberwolf's Bolt-Together Semi-Recumbent Cargo Bike

Post by AussieJester » Apr 10 2011 6:20am

I would go with the shocky and coil over AW....the spring isn't designed to bend the way your using it you will also have no dampening using the spring on its own...

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Re: Amberwolf's Bolt-Together Semi-Recumbent Cargo Bike

Post by Harold in CR » Apr 10 2011 8:03am

AJ is correct. Use the coil-shock.

That leaf is way too short. Just for fun, can you drop the swing frame down, and see how much give that leaf has ?? IF it could be configured better, you can shift the shorter leaves toward the bike frame, and have a progressive spring system. I doubt you would need more than 3-4 inches of flex, total, maybe less once you pre load it with the bike ready to ride.
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Re: Amberwolf's Bolt-Together Semi-Recumbent Cargo Bike

Post by amberwolf » Apr 10 2011 2:16pm

AussieJester wrote:I would go with the shocky and coil over AW....the spring isn't designed to bend the way your using it you will also have no dampening using the spring on its own...
Damping I'd take care of with one of the separate dampers off the powerchairs, most likely. I know the spring isn't made to work that way, but it can be done, and I'm still curious to see if it would work at all. :)

For now, I have to go with teh coil-over anyway, as I don't have time to figure out a strong enough mount for the leaf to react against so it doenst' bend the frame. :) But eventually, I want to try the leaf, just to try it.

The coil-over has one problem,t hough: I'm not sure the MTB spring is enough, and I cant' quite fit two of the MTB springs on there in series. I might be able to fit one of the original softer larger springs over the outside of the MTB spring, but I doubt it will even do anything, and it weighs several times what the MTB spring does. The yellow springs are pointless, so they're coming off.

Harold in CR wrote: That leaf is way too short. Just for fun, can you drop the swing frame down, and see how much give that leaf has ?? IF it could be configured better, you can shift the shorter leaves toward the bike frame, and have a progressive spring system. I doubt you would need more than 3-4 inches of flex, total, maybe less once you pre load it with the bike ready to ride.
How would you configure it? Could you mark up one of the pics and post it?

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Re: Amberwolf's Bolt-Together Semi-Recumbent Cargo Bike

Post by katou » Apr 10 2011 6:20pm

I would sooo bug the CRAP out of the people who said they'd help...

I mean, WTF? Promise then bail?
Call them back, call 2-3 places, total minutes lost 10-15. If it doesn't get you anywhere, oh well. But if one says they'll do it...

Anyway, good luck bud.

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Re: Amberwolf's Bolt-Together Semi-Recumbent Cargo Bike

Post by AussieJester » Apr 10 2011 6:36pm

Theres been various custom builds on RatRods forums AW using leaf springs for suspension soz no links troll through the 'Bike Builds' & 'Built from Scratch' threads maybe? Seen alot of front suspension
custom forks with the ol leaf springs, back around ~1930-40 was it? Some motorcycle manufacturers used leafrs on their front suspension setups. Might be good for some ideas anywayz AW....i think going with the coil over is still your best option buddy ;-) Best of luck...

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Re: Amberwolf's Bolt-Together Semi-Recumbent Cargo Bike

Post by Harold in CR » Apr 10 2011 6:38pm

How would you configure it? Could you mark up one of the pics and post it?
I have no idea how to mark up your photo. When you return from the DR, we can have a go at it. You coach me, and, I will try to give you an accurate design.

I have Photoshop, but, not a newer version. I am NOT very computer literate. :oops: :oops:
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Re: Amberwolf's Bolt-Together Semi-Recumbent Cargo Bike

Post by AussieJester » Apr 10 2011 7:28pm

Harold in CR wrote:
How would you configure it? Could you mark up one of the pics and post it?
I have no idea how to mark up your photo. When you return from the DR, we can have a go at it. You coach me, and, I will try to give you an accurate design.

I have Photoshop, but, not a newer version. I am NOT very computer literate. :oops: :oops:

Got digital camera? (and/ or scanner even) if so....draw a rough pic of your design with pencil and paper (etc) and take a pic of it, post the pic so we are all on the same page with your design idea :)

Remember this pic Harold? was drawn on paper and pic taken with digital camera, not brilliant but works well enough imo
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Re: Amberwolf's Bolt-Together Semi-Recumbent Cargo Bike

Post by Harold in CR » Apr 10 2011 9:29pm

DOH :oops: :oops: :oops: :oops: I have done that many times. Guess I just read too much and don't think enough, anymore. :oops: :oops:

Thanks AJ :)
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Re: Amberwolf's Bolt-Together Semi-Recumbent Cargo Bike

Post by amberwolf » Apr 11 2011 12:54am

katou wrote:I would sooo bug the CRAP out of the people who said they'd help...
I have, though not in a while. Most I don't have phone #s for, one of the ones I did has either changed his number or somebody else is now answering it for him and has no clue. :( The other one hasn't returned a call of mine in quite some time. The rest I have bugged when I've seen them, but that's not very often.

AussieJester wrote:Theres been various custom builds on RatRods forums AW using leaf springs for suspension soz no links troll through the 'Bike Builds' & 'Built from Scratch' threads maybe?
Ooooh, there's some nice builds on there. :) I spent most of my dinnertime just now browsing thru there on a search for "leaf" and variants, and found a few references to builds with them (most for forks) but very few have any pics or seem to have gotten past the talk stage, of the ones I looked at so far.

One has an intersting idea to use the leaf itself as the chainstay,
http://www.ratrodbikes.com/forum/viewto ... 146#p77146
with no seatstay, AFAICT, with the bow downwards and the axle in the pivoting end of the leaf, with the sliding end fixed in place at the back of the main frame. So it would just bow upwards at the back under load and bumps, across the whole length of the spring. But it is just a drawing, with no actual implementation, and the build seems to have died at partial frame construction some time ago. :(

Another uses the leaf as the seat support:
http://www.ratrodbikes.com/forum/viewto ... 49#p209249
and apparently does that on all his bikes. Interesting, and something I might consider trying someday for the heckuvit.

Nothing using one as the rear suspension yet, but I'll have another look later when there's more time.
i think going with the coil over is still your best option buddy ;-)
At least for now, I will, just cuz I'm pressed for time. Later I still wanna try the leaf just to see if it could work. :)

Harold in CR wrote: I have no idea how to mark up your photo. When you return from the DR, we can have a go at it. You coach me, and, I will try to give you an accurate design.
Oh, even just a Paint scribble would do. :)

The easy thing to do is save the file off the forum post above to your desktop or wherever you usually put them.
Then open Paint, in Windows that's Start - Programs (or All Programs) - Accessories - Paint.
Then open the file to be edited either by dragging the icon for it from your desktop onto the Paint window, or using File - Open in Paint and browsing for wherever you saved it to.
Once it's open, I usually just use the Line tool on the little toolbar to draw stuff with, changing colors by clicking on them in the color boxes toolbar as needed, and changing line thicknesses by clicking on one of the several lines below the toolbox icons. Red and Green stand out pretty well on most of the pictures so I usually use those to mark them up with. :)
Then File - Save As a new file somewhere and upload that to the thread.
I have Photoshop, but, not a newer version. I am NOT very computer literate. :oops: :oops:
I usually just use Paint, and if I need to do anything fancy I use the free GIMP program, of which I might be using 0.0001% of it's capabilites. ;) I haven't had any Photoshop versions for a really really really long time. :lol:

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Re: Amberwolf's Bolt-Together Semi-Recumbent Cargo Bike

Post by amberwolf » Apr 12 2011 1:24am

I think I fixed the welder, just before I had to go to work. Most of the problem appears to have indeed been the thermal cutoff, but i still had problems after a few minutes of intermittently welding, as things warmed up the main power switch turned out to also have a problem.

So I bypassed that too, and now it's just always on if it's plugged in.

To help me remember that is the case, and to help cool it down faster, I installed a 115VAC Boxer fan out of some old computer terminal chassis, blowing on the transformer. I'll mount that permanently later; right now it is just sitting to the side of the open case while I do the rest of the work on the bike, so I am not wasting more time fixing up stuff and can spend it on the bike itself.

I got some welds done on the bike, but it still burns holes sometimes in the ultra-thin Trek tubing. Gonna have to just build that up to fill the holes, probalby by holding a steel rod in the hole and weld on the rod itself so it melts and fills it up. Not sure that will work, but it is better than burning huge holes in the tubing and further compromising it's strength. :(

If I had the option for brazing I'd much rather have done that, but at this point every joint is already screwed up by holes and crap, so it doesn't matter anymore. Maybe next time, if I have a brazing setup by then, and have re-learned how.


I'm resting at the moment after work, dinner, and dog-care, then will go back to cutting and shaping more bits for the frame to mount things with, then weld them together. Probably have to wait for some of it till tomorrow, since it's almost midnight, but I know I won't be able to sleep much if I don't do some work on it.

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Re: Amberwolf's Bolt-Together Semi-Recumbent Cargo Bike

Post by Gordo » Apr 12 2011 1:39am

AW;
If you can borrow another pair of eyes, put you multimeter across the mains at the welder and watch for a voltage drop when you start the arc. I screwed around with my suitcase for a long time, changing to different brands of wire, cursing the ground clamp, etc. Once I plugged the welder into a #4 wire extension cord on a 50amp circuit, it was a whole new ball game.
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Re: Amberwolf's Bolt-Together Semi-Recumbent Cargo Bike

Post by amberwolf » Apr 13 2011 12:38am

Actualy, at this point, I think I need to use a SMALLER cord to it to kinda limit voltage/current, so it doesnt' burn thru the thin tubing. It's already on it's lowest setting, and I still can't keep from burning thru the super-thin cromoly on the Trek in places. :( I know I'm crappy at welding, but it shouldn't be quite this hard even with my poor skills at it. :(

Anyway, at least it is working consistently now. I have to finish cutting and preparing the rest of the parts to weld, then get them all on the frame. Once that's done I can start bolting parts on, verify chainlines all clear during suspension action, etc., and then start electrifying it once the pedals can move it.

I've still got 3 days or so (two of which I'll have off of work), plus whatever time before me and Evoforce meet up to go down there, on Saturday itself. I'm sure I can build a complete bike from the ground up in two weeks, right? :lol:

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Re: Amberwolf's Bolt-Together Semi-Recumbent Cargo Bike

Post by amberwolf » Apr 13 2011 4:21am

I didn't get much done, what with figuring out how to do certain things with just parts I already have laying around. Particularly the final "jackshaft" that is a combination swingframe pivot axle and the axle for the final sprocket to the rear IGH input sprocket.
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Unfortunately I realized after figuring out a solution that I can't actually do it without cutting the swingarm's chainstays off and replacing them with straight ones. :roll:
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But, just for the record, it's made like this:

The swingframe's pivot point is too large a diameter for any of the axles, bolts, etc that I have, and the original clamping bolt that goes in it is of course far too narrow to fit the BMX dropouts, especially widened as they are now.

So, to the rescue come some brass or bronze bushings out of the arms of an exercycle/rower. But, they are too small, so I had to shim them with a bit of flashing saved from the trash bin after they redid the house roof:
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Since I still don't have anything that directly fits on the bushing's inner diameter tightly, I used cone nuts off a rear axle (the same axle in the pics), which will center the axle in the bushings and provide a way to continue clamping down on them later even if the bushings get compressed or worn, since I don't have bearings that will fit in there. I could make a bearing race to fit, out of stuff in a rear hub, but I don't have time to figure it out, so this will do for now.
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Just like on a rear hub, tension is set and locked with the end nuts.
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I don't have time to make a proper free-rolling sprocket adapter with bearings to ride on the axle, so again I'll use a cone nut (facing the other way from the one on the bushing), along with bearings from a rear hub, and the freewheel side of that rear hub, along with freewheel.
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On the other side is another cone nut, but no bearing, since it does not have to roll, it only has to be supported straight on the axle. The only reason for the bearing on the inside is that it is the easiest way to support that end.
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With the freewheel facing "backwards" on this side of the axle, it will then freewheel in the drive direction, so that it only acts as a jackshaft for the sprockets. If I had time I'd take the pawls out, and use it fully this way, but again, no time to figure out how to get the thing apart without damaging anything (or making a tool to do it right).

Two identical sprockets will be on that freewheel, one for the rear chain and one for the chain to the jackshaft combining pedals and motor, wherever that ends up (probably a bit below the pivot point).


So now I just have to pick a frame to cut the chainstays from and use to replace the ones on this swingframe. Just what I needed: more unplanned work. :(

Ah, well, it puts me one step closer to a custom swingarm design. :lol:

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Re: Amberwolf's Bolt-Together Semi-Recumbent Cargo Bike

Post by Harold in CR » Apr 13 2011 12:43pm

Here is my piss poor attempt at drawing using Paint. I would build a small Pocket to mount under the frame, like the drawing shows. Place the end of the spring in there and fasten it. Springs CAN be drilled, you know. Just sharpen the bit, then "Relieve it", then GO SLOW speed as possible, and, lots of pressure.
( I cut leaves with a new hacksaw blade, when I built Spanish Inquisition Sport Muskets. They are just a smaller version of the Musket, with matchlock firing mechanism. I used the pieces of the springs for the trigger mechanism.)

Then, fasten the other end like you have shown, only further back, so the curvature of the spring follows the tire curve. I would remove the extra leaves and try it with just the main leaf, first. That should give you flex over a longer part of the spring. If not, add a short leaf at the bottom end, from INSIDE the socket, so it forces the main leaf to flex further out from the Bike frame.

The socket on the bottom of the bike frame, needs to go further back, under the swingarm pivot a little, to avoid interference with the swingarm.

It's MUCH easier for me to DO this, rather than write about it. :roll: :roll: :) Let me figure out how to post the image. :oops:

[img]
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[/img]
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Re: Amberwolf's Bolt-Together Semi-Recumbent Cargo Bike

Post by amberwolf » Apr 14 2011 6:35pm

I think I get what you mean; I'll draw it up (or lay it out with the parts on the floor) and post a pic, once I have time.

I've been beating my head about a bunch of things on the bike that should have been easy but aren't, either because the parts I have arent' quite what I need (too big, too small, etc) or bcause I didn't think some detail thru very well. :(

The main thing that is a problem is the jackshaft/rear wheel drive setup. When I work things out so they align and don't interfere with the frame, then they are no longer centered in the frame, and I end up with the rear wheel over to the left by an inch or more. I'm sure I could ride it that way, but it would not be the best way to do it.
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So for now, just to see if I can finish it for the race, I think I am going to end up with a hubmotor in front (thus no disc brake :( just rim brake) and pedal drive at the rear via the 3spd IGH, and rear drum brake plus rim brake if I can work it out. This greatly simplifies my drivetrain, but I'll still have to work out the whole thru-the-gears setup later, including frame modifications, probably.

Thus I don't need (for now) the double-sprocket on the swingframe pivot, and I can re-center it:
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I may also weld a retaining pin or bolt across the rear lips of those dropouts, so that even a loose nut or something can't allow the swingframe pivot axle to come out, drop the bike down and dig into the ground. :)


If I didn't have to have working pedals on it, I'd just run the motor to the rear wheel instead of the pedals, since that would actually be easier than running the pedals. But if it doesnt' have operable pedals, it ain't a bicycle, and A) I can't ride it on the roads here and B) it probably wouldn't qualify for the Death Race. ;)

I did get the shock worked out,
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and it's ready to have it's front mounts welded onto the back of the BMX seattube, to put the full shock forces in line with the bike's toptube.
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It's just using the single 850lb spring, with enough washers to put it under just a couple of mm of compression before mounting it on the bike. The rubber stop for the shock itself is still on there at the front end,
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so that will probably squish more during normal riding, with the spring taking up most of the shock loads. I dont' know how well it will operate with just the bike weight or my own on there, much less under bumps on the street, but it will have to do as it is for now.

It turns out that the original spring for these shocks is not going to fit over the outside of the smaller one, but it is very close. It would actually fit over it but only if I wiggle it on, which means they'll rub and wear each other, probably causing failure at some point. Better just to not do it.


At the moment I'm resting a bit, munching lunch, and trying to ignore the throbbing of my badly-pinched fingertip (blood blister on it a centimeter across and half that the shorter dimension). :( I'm way too clumsy to do a lot of what I do without screwing up a fair bit. :oops:

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Re: Amberwolf's Bolt-Together Semi-Recumbent Cargo Bike

Post by amberwolf » Apr 14 2011 11:28pm

Still going very slowly, though now that I am not worrying about chaindrive motor and all, it is easier to figure stuff out.

I was pondering the steering, which originally was to have a headtube off another bike welded onto a seatpost, then installed into the Trek seattube. A steerer tube off the same bike's fork would've gone in that, with it's bottom end where the crown used to be having a plate pointing to the left for the tie-rod to bolt to.

I was digging thru my stuff for suitable seatposts and whatnot, when I found some really long ones that have a clamp on the top end that looks just like the ones for handlebar stems...so I thought, why not use that in the seattube with some thin tough plastic (nylon or teflon) around it to act as a bushing,
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and just clamp the bars in it. Simplifies things a lot, at least for now. The plastic itself is from one of those retail-store product "clip strips", in thsi case from some 3M/Scotch pet-hair-pickup-rollers.
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With this in place, the bike now looks kinda like this from the side, where the long angled rod in the front represents the steering tie-rod.
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and this is from over the seat from behind:
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Using the stem I had intended for the bars themselves as the pusher/mount for the tie-rod simplifies that, too.
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It's not ideal nor permanent, but it is a quick fix till I have time for the permanent steering solution, and lets me experiment a bit.


Originally I was going to use some 10spd dropbars in the front as a place to mount stuff to, and put a big curved number plate across.
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It also might help keep some stuff from getting trashed if I slide out again this year. :lol: But it's kinda big, so I'm not sure I'll do it. I might instead do this:
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where the stem in front no longer has the bars in it, and instead has a single arm off some old steel caliper brakes bolted into it at the arm's pivot hole. The bushing in the tie-rod will bolt to the end of the arm where the pad used to bolt on.
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In other news, I was taking some chains off junk bikes I'm disassembling for parts, so I can get enough reasonably-matching chain to make the very long pedal chain I'll have on this, and broke the pin on the Sunrise breaker the second link I used it on. :(
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I'm not sure if it's just me using it wrong (there are no instructions anywhere, not even on the web that I can find) or if it's really just not made well. It has one more normal pin/screw left, but that one might be larger diameter than the bike chain pins (it is meant for many sizes of chain), so I ahve to check before I try it. Then it also has a spring-loaded pin but that one barely sticks out at all, and coudl not be used to take a chain apart, even the tiny types of chain. Not sure what it is meant for. :(

Unfortunately my really good chaintool was lost wtih my toolbag, and that's another piece I can't afford to replace yet. Maybe 2nd paycheck after this one (since this one will be short due to taking days off for the race and stuff). So hopefully I'll figure out how to use this one correctly, or I won't be able to even put a chain on here at all (unless I just use a hammer and torx bit to take pins out, and vise-grips to put them in, which sometimes works without damaging the links).


Now that I probably have to use a hubmotor instead of disc brakes, I think I have a way to add the disc-brake caliper mount to the back of the Manitou fork:
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The leg on the left is off a wrecked RST Omni 191 fork that had the right leg trashed in whatever wreck destroyed the bike it was from. If I cut the back 1/4 of the leg off, I have essentially a flat (slightly curved) plate with the disc caliper mounts on it. If I then weld that to a thicker flat plate of steel, I can drill holes in it that match the ones on the Manitou fork (on the right in the pic).

The hard part will be aligning it all so the caliper can work on the brake disc, while still fitting between the holes on the back of teh fork. If I bolt the caliper to the adapter, then clamp the caliper on the disc with the wheel mounted, I can play with mounting options and positions to see which one will work, hopefully.


Anyway, that's for later, as I don't have a disc large enough to just bolt to the side cover of the 9C hub (currently on CrazyBike2), as it would have to have the braking surface completely outside the 9C itself, about even with the spoke flanges. (since it isn't designed for disc, and I'd be just bolting directly to the side cover, maybe with some spacers, there's not enough room for the calipers to clear and still ahve the disc also clear the forks, AFAICS).

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Re: Amberwolf's Bolt-Together Semi-Recumbent Cargo Bike

Post by amberwolf » Apr 15 2011 7:13pm

A break for food and rest, so might as well post what I've got so far.

First thing I did today though was to go get some things I had to have, like a spoke wrench and chain tool, because I simply can't get the other chaintool above to work right. I must be stupid or something, or else it requires more hands than I have. :( Fortunately, my older sister (not the crazy one) sent me an early birthday present of a little bit of money to spend on bike stuff (or whatever).

So it was off to Build-A-Bike over at 43rd Ave & Bethany, after a stop at the bank and grocery store and a couple of thrift stores, because BAB tends to have good usable stuff on their junk shelf for really cheap, often low enough for me to afford, and they have the lowest price on the tools I needed, even including the exact models I already had (the chain tool was a lot less than it originally cost me, less than half!).

The above stuff was on their junk shelf, for more than I wanted to spend but worth it AFAICT:
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26" Suntour M2000 steel fork, appears to be 80mm travel (might be less, I can't squish it all the way by hand but it's more than 40, AFAICT), uncut 1-1/8" threadless steerer. Has just canti/vbrake bosses, no disc, but I can fix that since it's steel. ;) There were also two forks that had both disc and bosses, one steel and one alloy, but the alloy one was jammed and would need repair, and the steel one was MadeInChina brand and twice as heavy as the Suntour (which isn't very light). All the same price, so I bought the Suntour.
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Avid "single-finger 5" vbrake arms, with bolts/washers and not-very-worn pads.

Tektro vbrake arms with bolts/washers and slightly less-worn pads.

Shimano combo trigger-shifter (7/3) / brake levers, for vbrakes. In great condition and appear to work fine (though cant' tell for sure till they're hooked up). Mostly got them for the brake levers, but on the off chance I need the shifters tehy'll be there (if I stick them on CB2, for instance, which still uses a rear cluster/derailer for pedalling).

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Three fenders, 26" set in really good shape and one 24" rear in decent shape. Since I crumpled the last set of fenders on CB2 when the rear one's supports got caught in spokes (no idea how), I have had soaked-butt-syndrome every time I have to ride in the rain. :lol: So this will fix that, finally, for whichever bike they end up on.


By the time I got home, I'd finally made the decision: there simply isn't time to finish this enough to be safely rideable before the race. Just too many little things to make work right. :( Maybe someday I'll start a project far enough ahead of time to finish it before it needs to be, instead of after. :lol: :oops:

So, I am going to fix up CrazyBike2's little things instead, which are much simpler, as I already know what they are and what the fixes must be. ;)

More here:
http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/vi ... 42#p390342

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Re: Amberwolf's Bolt-Together Semi-Recumbent Cargo Bike

Post by amberwolf » Apr 23 2011 9:19pm

With my ankle/leg injury from the race, and stuff like rearranging the house to make it possible to do day-to-day things in my condition for the next month or two, I haven't gotten back to this bike yet, but it's not forgotten.

As a side note, I used the Avid single-digit 5 brake arms/pads on CrazyBike2, with the Suntour fork, and while they didn't suck as bad as the cantilevers I had on the crappy fork, they still only slowed me down, not actualy stopping me from any kind of speed (10-15MPH or more). :roll: If I adjust them down even so that they are already rubbing on the rim a bit, I still can't squeeze the lever hard enough to lockup the wheel above those speeds. Even below those speeds it doesnt' really lockup, and still takes some time to stop.

On a trip to Goodwill with a friend today, I found these that should make good rear tail and side lights, as well as turn signals:
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They don't have any bulb holders, so I'll ahve to fashion those out of some that are somewhat different out of the 85 Ford LTD parts car in teh driveway, if I use incandescents, or whatever I build for LED lights. Not sure which I'll use, as I don't have enough red LEDs that are bright enough to make much of a light.
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Amber LEDs I have a bunch of, and those i'll probably use in the former backup-light section of these, since they're clear lenses. Probably will use as many as will physically fit in the surface area of the lens, as a "sheet". Those will be the rear-facing turn signals.

Since these also have sidemarker bulb holes, I'll likely wire those up to be always on *except* during turn signals, and then they'll be off whenever the amber signal is on, so that they alternate in flashing, making it even more visible. They'll be red, rather than amber, but that's ok.

If I put them on the body of the bike, at the tail point, I can place them together like this:
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Otherwise, they can just go on the corners of the cargo pods or rails or something.


Either way, they have a lot more surface area, plus some reflective surface, too, than any of the other lights I might otherwise use here. Plus they're more "stylish", shoudl I decide to try to add a partial fairing to the bike, to then make it "flow" more in it's looks.


ALso,, while I was digging out my crutches on Monday, I found another coilover spring the same size as the 850lbs/in MTB one, but this one is so hard that I cannot compress it at all with my weight on it. So if I end up needing a stiffer spring, I can use this.

I also found several more of those silver-gray square-tubing rails I forgot I had, so now I do likely have enough square tubing to join together to make the cargo rails from. But I may still do it out of bike tubing, if I can figure out a way to make the welder not blow holes in the joints.

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Re: Amberwolf's Bolt-Together Semi-Recumbent Cargo Bike

Post by Green Machine » Apr 26 2011 6:34am

Hey amberwolf are you sure you want to install those turn signals? :wink: :D

Looking like things are really coming together.

Did you decide what color your going to paint her yet?

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Re: Amberwolf's Bolt-Together Semi-Recumbent Cargo Bike

Post by amberwolf » Apr 28 2011 1:23am

Had a thougth while talking to someone about this project:
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Since the frame is pretty high off the ground at the bottom, I could easily add at least that much more frame space down below the existing frame, for battery or whatever. Marked in red in the pic. Green is the cargo framework.

Might not be able to have the red go quite so far down in the back, as the rear wheel won't really be that high off teh ground, but you get the idea.

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Re: Amberwolf's Bolt-Together Semi-Recumbent Cargo Bike

Post by Green Machine » Apr 28 2011 1:33am

Really like that addition Amwolf...makes it look monstrous..mad max looking.

I vote for the addition...the more frame the better in this case...make it over the top.

As for color i would vote black...

Everything black except the turn signals....you know..go ahead and paint those black too :P :D

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