The Swizzbee (aka Dolphin) ebike - help !

U

UKebiker

10 mW
Joined
Mar 8, 2013
Messages
29
Hi All,

I’ve recently acquired a Swizzbee ebike in amazing condition. They are extremely rare in the UK and rather unique in the way they function (and in my opinion great looking machines. I’m afraid I’ll need to give the information I have before getting to the question. Apols if this seems rambling....I’ll keep succinct as I can 

So

• They were produced in Switzerland about ten years the brain child of one Michael Futter (http://www.escooter.de/Z_Kategorien/speedx/swizzbee/powerbike.html)
• He moved to USA where the same concept was marketed under the Dolphin name
• The bike uses a 270w heinzmann mid mounted motor and a unique drive system. The motor is connected to a differential hub via a belt drive on the left. The gears/chain are connected to the hub on the right. The hub/differential melds the power (I’m not an engineer so this is my laymans terminology - details here http://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/biblio?CC=US&NR=5242335&KC=&FT=E&locale=en_EP)
• Battery is a LG 10ah lithium pack in mine (early versions had NiMh). The charger is, unusually, integrated.
• The electrics are complex. There is a 3 press personalised code to unlock the bike – get it wrong 10 times and you need a 10 press secondary code from the dealer. There aren’t any anymore.....at least not that I’m aware of so I guess the bike would be bricked if this happened !

So, my bike has the original battery which is quite degraded. Its good for about 10/12miles on the flat. The sag under load is horrible.

I’m pretty good with batteries – I’ve built a few bikes up including the packs (cranks and hub). I tend to use Samsung 18650 cells these days and also Lipo bricks (usually HK multistar). I’ve repaired quite a few bikes also for others. So I have a reasonable level of knowledge

The Question then

I want to replace the battery BUT I don’t want to brick my bike. Does anyone have any knowledge of these bikes? Or can point me in the direction of anyone who might know ?

I’m very comfortable in replacing the cell pack and hooking up the BMS......but I’m terrified that I’ll be asked for that dealer code at that point


Any help much appreciated

Thanks
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Well, this might not be so helpful, but you can't brick the motor I'd think. But you can brick the controller.
worst case, you strip it down to just the motor, and start over with new controller and throttle.
 
wineboyrider said:
http://www.izipusa.com/prior-year-models-electric-bikes-2014-pavement-express

This bike looks extremely similar just different paint scheme. Says it has 36v 20ah battery. Pretty good for off the shelf ebike 8)
Click to expand...

Thanks for that, looks like izip may be able to answer this one then. The hub differential is definitely the same. Who knows about the rest of the electrics. Maybe the same , maybe not

I'll try them and see if they can help
 
It's a strange beast, like no other ebike I've ever ridden.

Very fast acceleration on my version but not a high top speed . Decent at about 22mph but it's the time from 0 to about 15mph that surprises

Not a great hill climber either. And the brushed motor sucks power
 
dogman dan said:
Well, this might not be so helpful, but you can't brick the motor I'd think. But you can brick the controller.
worst case, you strip it down to just the motor, and start over with new controller and throttle.
Click to expand...

Thanks but ib think it would ruin the ride. The controller and software are, I think, as unique as the hardware (hub differential)
 
dogman dan said:
Well, this might not be so helpful, but you can't brick the motor I'd think. But you can brick the controller.
worst case, you strip it down to just the motor, and start over with new controller and throttle.
Click to expand...
No throttle on mine btw
 
I'd be spending my time getting one of those codes. An old dealer, the internet, manufacturer so on. It seems to be the only issue you have with the bike and you overall seem to really like it.

Once you have it, dissassemble battery and replace with fresh cells.

Done.
 
Did you ever get anywhere with this?

I was one of the original (mechanical) engineers who designed it, now nearly 20 years ago!!
I might rebuild an old Swizzbee / dolphin that I have as I my car may be about to self destruct.. the insulation is falling away from the electrical harness in my car.. its starting to catch fire from time to time..

The pack should be able to be removed and replaced without locking out the controller.. at least on the originals. The power switch killed all power from the batteries. No idea how the BMS worked on the Li packs, as I wasn't involved with that.
The code is stored in an eeprom on the controller iirc. The eeprom also contains the custom code which matches the motor speed to your cadence. So you won't easily be able to use another controller (at least without several leg injuries while learning how)
 
He posts regularly on the UK forum under the name Nealh. AFAIK, it's all sorted now. I'm sure he'd be happy to make dialogue with you.
http://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/electric-bicycles/
 
d8veh said:
He posts regularly on the UK forum under the name Nealh. AFAIK, it's all sorted now. I'm sure he'd be happy to make dialogue with you.
http://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/electric-bicycles/
Click to expand...

Sorry, I've not been on ES for a long time but plan to be here a lot more

Actually I'm meeting Nealh soon and can also confirm he has a second swizzbee now ! One lithium and one NiMh (from memory) it's all on pedelecs though


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Check out this thread on a German forum.

I also know a place in Switzerland, where you can still get spare parts. Also In germany / switzerland, you can easily source the complete bike. Just 2 month ago, I got an offer for 2 models ...

At that time, I contemplated upgrading one of those, but I think there are too many flaws in the design. Biggest nogo would be the max allowed rear tire size (around 40-42mm) because of the very low rear bridge which makes riding this bike at higher speeds a real pain. Also, the belt / sprockets are way too thin, and you have to change it quite often (depending on how you ride). And finally the battery / case: lot of space wasted if you ask me, and almost 2Kg of useless plastic + metal holder. I've got one here that I wanted to mod for another bike, but it's just not efficient - not even waterproof!

On the plus sides, the hub and axle reinforcements are just awesome on this bike (and should be copied more often!) and overall, the simple config of a central motor with a small sprocket driving a large rear sprocket ist just an amazing smart way to solve many ebike issues. No gears, no drivetrain wear, no grease, no noisy 2nd chain. Clean and efficient. I guess that's why this design keeps popping up from time to time amongst diy ebikers.

Also, AFAIK Sutter never moved to the US. He died of cancer in Basel, CH, where he lived during most of his life, after filing for bankruptcy because of the poor record of his ebikes; the dolphin never made it past the first big series though locally he remains quite a legend, and helped pave the way for ebike giants like stromer or flyer.
 
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