Nucular Electronics owner's thread (setup infos, FW updates, links etc.)

[madin88]

I think that it is time to start a thread for owners of Nucular Electronics.

For those who do not know, Nucular Eletronics is the name of a new generation of high-end controller - display - BMS unit's (similar to Adaptto).
Some of the features are for instance the "on the fly" programming and adjustmets of settings via the included Display, Auto tune function (for motor, throttle/brake), PAS function, configurable Input's and Output's and many other things.

The first pages will be updated if there is some news like a new firmware, new functions or any other infos about new product etc.

At the moment there is 12F and a 6F controller available (i think so).
24F + BMS is in the works.

here the initial thread by VasiliSK which already contains alot of infos in the first post:

https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=75494

User setup guides + other informations incl. FW update (wikidot):

http://nucularelectronics.wikidot.com/en:start

wiring shematic V2.4:

display connections:

 

[madin88]

reserved

 

[SlowCo]

Not yet in need of a new controller but I'm interested in the Nucular controllers so I'll be following this thread. :thumb:

 

[madin88]

I could not hesitate to pull the board out of the case and take a look, so here my review about the hardware part:

The controller looks very well designed and assembled with care.

I could see the power stage has following features:

- high quality low ESR electrolyt capacitors
- ceramic caps near the FET's
- large copper bus bars (looks like a "sandwich" board with a thick copper plate between)
- a real shunt resistor (not just a copper bus bar)

The display top cover looks nice, however the bottom covers look 3D printed and reworked with hands. We should be aware that it is still beta and this will probably be fixed in future.

check out the pics:

If you wanna compare the size with Adaptto, the Nucular 12F would be the competitor of a Mini-E then, but WAY MORE powerful
Adaptto Midi, PV (Infineon) 12F, Nucular 12F side by side:

I wanted to have it plug and play with my actual wiring on the bike for an easy replacement, so installed an adaptto throttle/brake and hall sensor connector. On the supply wires i used 6mm bullet conenctors and also added the wiring needed for charging on the controller side.

The display as ALOT of IO ports which can be defined in the Display menu settings.
For instance i installed a button to scroll through the three power modes to IO1, Domino 5k throttle and variable hall sensor E-brake.
The autodect function detects the throttle and brake range and it worked flawless from the first time. No need to set limits or anything like this.It just works

It can be mounted to the bike by using GoPro steer tube holder (which was included):

here the screen when powered up and during charge:

the color of the four buttons on the display can be configured which is indeed a nice feature, and other things like brightness of the screen and buttons can be adjusted too.

 

[eee291]

I was a bit disappointed when I saw the max input Voltage of 90. Not gonna go with my 24S motorcycle battery

But I do have two MXUS 3000W laying around for a future e-bike project, and I was wondering how much charging current the motor can take before it overheats when charging a 20S battery.
I got some 48V 2000W PSUs similar to the flatpacks that I would like to use.

Anyone have any experience?

 

[VasiliSk]

Well, absolute limit for those is 95V, but i would recommend keep some V for regen or FW
Mxus 3K turbo may handle 1.5-2kW

 

[eee291]

Sounds good, thanks.

I'm guessing your 24Fet controller will be able to handle 24S since you're making a 24S BMS for it.
If so then sign me up when you get some prototypes ready 8)

 

[VasiliSk]

Well, it is just IC that can handle 24S in time, controller voltage will be same

 

[ElectricGod]

100v MAX or 90v continuous is OK for now, bu there's lots of people like me that want 150 volts max or 131 volts continuous.

12 fets done right can be really impressive. I've been modding for 4500-5000 watts in 12 fet controllers for a while now. However, I build at higher wattage than that...like what I can get from an 18 fet or 24 fet controller...aka 6-10kw or 12-20kw.

Madin88...thanks for posting pics!

 

[ElectricGod]

I could not hesitate to pull the board out of the case and take a look, so here my review about the hardware part:

The controller looks very well designed and assembled with care.

I could see the power stage has following features:

- high quality low ESR electrolyt capacitors
- ceramic caps near the FET's
- large copper bus bars (looks like a "sandwich" board with a thick copper plate between)
- a real shunt resistor (not just a copper bus bar)

Did you take pics of the board? If not, I'll have mine soon enough and take a peak inside the case.

 

[madin88]

I'm guessing your 24Fet controller will be able to handle 24S since you're making a 24S BMS for it.

Think about LiFe chemistry which has 3,6V max charge voltage :wink:

 

[csc]

Well, absolute limit for those is 95V, but i would recommend keep some V for regen or FW
Mxus 3K turbo may handle 1.5-2kW

Hi guys

I'm currently charging at 2kw through a 3k 3t and the nucular 12f (eltek flatpack 2000w)

Before the battery reaches 81v everything works fine, full 2kw, but over that voltage it seems like there's a "conflict" between the bms (programmed to balance at 4.12v per cell) and the 12f (programmed to stop charge at 4.2). Charge won't go to the end, first the charger stops and go, then nothing over 81.5v. I need a regular 84.2 charger to finish the job (bms still balancing at 4.12)

Where did I miss the good setting ?

 

[VasiliSk]

Take a screenshot from "battery" and "converter" sections

 

[csc]

View attachment 1

 

[VasiliSk]

Looks good. what is controller voltage (on display) when charging stops?

 

[csc]

When I use the eltek through the 12f and phase, then unplug it when charge automatically stopped : around 81.5v.

When the eltek "stops/starts/stop etc in the las part of the charge, I see very very briefly (less than a quarter of second) values over 85v on the display

When the battery is connected to a normal 84.2v 4a charger the bms works fine and i reach my 82.4v after balancing (4.12 per cell). The feeling that I have is that the bms is somehow saturated by the eltek/phase/12f power when the balance begins.

 

[VasiliSk]

try to lower charging current at the end, maybe some cells get too high

 

[csc]

Ok thanks I'll try that

Really happy on the road these days ! I feel that could reach a 140km+ range under 40 kmh. Right now I reach 100kmh on regular basis and a 75km trip is achieved finger in the nose

 

[icherouveim]

Ok thanks I'll try that

Really happy on the road these days ! I feel that could reach a 140km+ range under 40 kmh. Right now I reach 100kmh on regular basis and a 75km trip is achieved finger in the nose

Do you get this range with your wife on board or alone ?
it's really impressive! as I remember you had lot of overheating issues with your motors before.

 

[csc]

These values are without wife onboard !

It's quite simple : range increased by 30%. Motors won't go over 70° even with continuous 80/100 amps (front mxus 3k 3t, rear qs273 4000 4t) on steep hills and long distances. If needed WOT delivers a total of 180a battery / 400 phase bursts that are included in the 70°c motor temp mentionned above. Big acceleration ! Vasiliy tried the "bike", he knows what I mean.

The big rear motor with a slower winding is a very important step : accelerations, even in city with a start/stop/start/hill/etc scenario won't overheat it at all. Then around 80kmh the field weakening kicks in and pushes to 100kmh

Apparently the front 3k 3t, combined with a slower FW than the rear, is just perfect : being around 15% faster than the qs273, at high speed, when the weight comes back to the front after the acceleration, it reduces the rear motor consumption (I guess)

Then the 2 x 12F finish the job with an incredible eficiency. Note that I've put these controllers INSIDE of the aluminium rear battery box, so they overheated until the 70°c limit. I had to install a 120mm 12v fan on top of them (fed by the separate 12v battery that I use for the lights). Result : never more than 45° (in winter, though).

 

[ecross]

These values are without wife onboard !

It's quite simple : range increased by 30%. Motors won't go over 70° even with continuous 80/100 amps (front mxus 3k 3t, rear qs273 4000 4t) on steep hills and long distances. If needed WOT delivers a total of 180a battery / 400 phase bursts that are included in the 70°c motor temp mentionned above. Big acceleration ! Vasiliy tried the "bike", he knows what I mean.

The big rear motor with a slower winding is a very important step : accelerations, even in city with a start/stop/start/hill/etc scenario won't overheat it at all. Then around 80kmh the field weakening kicks in and pushes to 100kmh

Apparently the front 3k 3t, combined with a slower FW than the rear, is just perfect : being around 15% faster than the qs273, at high speed, when the weight comes back to the front after the acceleration, it reduces the rear motor consumption (I guess)

Then the 2 x 12F finish the job with an incredible eficiency. Note that I've put these controllers INSIDE of the aluminium rear battery box, so they overheated until the 70°c limit. I had to install a 120mm 12v fan on top of them (fed by the separate 12v battery that I use for the lights). Result : never more than 45° (in winter, though).

Hi,

very interesting setup, so please take some more pics. from your Bike and your controller box. I have also a mxus 3k 3t and with some older 18 + 24 FET controller, but with high currents +100Abatt I have more and more brrrr from 0rpm! How is the low speed acceleration with your new 12FET controller?

 

[csc]

Hi Ecross

Acceleration is super silent at low speed, and super precise (I use 100% torque mode) (other options : speed and speed + torque). Very easy to stay at 1kmh for example

I'll post images or a video in the few next days

Vasiliy : charge is working better since I tweaked the bms values (set the max voltage to 84.2 while keeping the balance at 4.12 per cell). Your controller seems to be NOT guilty !

 

[madin88]

It's quite simple : range increased by 30%. Motors won't go over 70° even with continuous 80/100 amps (front mxus 3k 3t, rear qs273 4000 4t) on steep hills and long distances. If needed WOT delivers a total of 180a battery / 400 phase bursts that are included in the 70°c motor temp mentionned above. Big acceleration ! Vasiliy tried the "bike", he knows what I mean.

An increase of 30% in range (despite the different rear motor) sounds impressive and crazy at the same time if you imagine the main part of this comes just from the controller(s).

I can very well imagine that you could see such big improvement if you were running adaptto controllers before which were not setup correct manually. It can be very time consuming to find the optimal settings and the whole thing seems to buggy.

Not so with the Nucular controller:
after the auto setup the motor already works optimal. There is no need to do "manual tuning" on the road and things like trying out different settings on same riding conditions again and again. I am glad there are no "ind" and "pwr" timings on Nucular controller

 

[csc]

Exactly. This thing just works. Bye bye ind timing headache

 

[icherouveim]

OK then if this is the case can someone say to adaptto to remove ind timing settings in order to match Nucular electronics efficiency??