Pan & Tilt Security Cameras?

amberwolf

Administrator
Staff member
Joined
Aug 17, 2009
Messages
40,859
Location
Phoenix, AZ, USA, Earth, Sol, Local Bubble, Orion
So, I will be back in my house sometime this month most likely, but I expect to have continuing problems with looters and the like for a while, which means I'd like to have some way to monitor things localy and remotely and record on motion, etc. I'd also like the ability to monitor the house itself for the dog(s) to see what they're up to when I'm away, and stuff like that. Might even be able to capture funny videos. ;)


I've been poring over stuff at Amazon, Newegg, etc., and finding LOTS of different types of cameras, in price ranges from $20 on up to $500 or more. Completely conflicting reviews on many of them, and with my lack of knowledge on the subject I dunno which ones to believe applicable to me.


Features I need:
Remotely-controlled Pan/tilt (or else lots of cheaper fixed cameras I can set up to cover every angle and area, and software that can monitor all of them--might be more ideal that way, with a better-quality pan/tilt in certain areas for pointing at something that needs better imagery?).

Color, at least 640x480 *at* 30FPS--most of what I saw doesn't even do 1FPS at that res, and claims 30FPS but doesn't even get 7-8 even at 1/4 that res, according to some of the reviews). Higher res is better but seems to get expensive fast.

Night vision mode would be great--doesnt' have to have it's own IR LEDs as I cna make IR sources easy enough to light up areas better than what comes on these things.

Wifi would be the easiest but I can run wires everywhere since I have to run power to them anyway, and it seems to take quite a bit off the cost.

Outdoor-designed cameras would be great, but I am willing to use indoor ones out there since I don't have much rain to deal with year-round, just lots of heat, sometimes cold. I can put them wehre the rain won't get to them easily and do something to preven thte rest getting in there, as long as humidity during the rain isn't an issue.


Something to monitor the cameras--Gotcha! is the only program I have experience with, but I gather there are a number of good ones. Has to be able to record many cameras at once via network, wired or wifi, whichever I end up with, without compressing the video stream much or at all, to leave the probably already-poor-quality video usable for security purposes/police reports.

I already have a computer (from Bigmoose) that can probably be used to do the recording, if I add a big enough drive for doing that. If not, I'll have to buy or build a better PC eventually for doing all the stuff I used to do in 3D/music/etc, after I get back to being able to do that, and it could be used for camera monitoring while I'm not using it for anything else, which would be most of the time.


It *is* a requirement that the cameras be fully able to set up and monitor via simple webpage, so that I could do it from any internet connection on any device with a browser. If they HAVE to be set up or monitored from their own apps, they're not useful to me. :( I ran across quite a few that had some parts that had to be monitored from one app, set up with another, and options set in some other app or in a browser, and some of them even had to be set up partially using a specific type of smartphone, and then the rest had to be finished on a windows pc, etc. Those types aren't useful. I just want to do it like a router--set it all up on a webpage, and monitor that way *or* via any program that can access the cameras via IP.



Bottom line: There's too many choices and I'd like to know if any of you have experience with specific cameras (or brands or types) that work better given the above limitations. Price *is* an issue, but I'd like to hear all opinions good or bad about teh cameras and software, regardless of price, cuz if it's cheap and don't work it doesn't help me, so I will get something more expensive that will do the job if I have to. :)
 
I thought you people kept guns under your pillow. I there not a device that shoots a bullet downwards when a door on your property is opened? Maybe you need a turret tilt and turn semi automatic built into the camera. Just a thought? :)
 
brumbrum said:
I thought you people kept guns under your pillow. I there not a device that shoots a bullet downwards when a door on your property is opened? Maybe you need a turret tilt and turn semi automatic built into the camera. Just a thought? :)
You people?
Meaning a people who successfully rebelled against the King of England (with guns) and won their freedom?
If so, no need to keep our guns under the pillow, in our section of the USA we have a Constitution, Concealed Carry Weapon Laws, and a Castle Doctrine that allows us to fight back when the crack-heads and thugs attack our homes & family. :wink:

On simple legal devices to "signal" a perimeter breach. I like this type of miscreants' pants crapper ---->
12_ga_alarm_ezr2.jpg

Build your own, or purchase on-line in USA. http://www.pyrocreations.com/inc/sdetail/11971
That little device speaks with the voice of god when it is triggered :twisted: It is NOT ballistic (loaded), it merely speaks with a primer cap. NO lead, or shot, is in it. Sound and light ONLY !!!!
HV005.jpg


On the topic of security cameras. One is better than none.
A used Q-SEE system (or Swann) is often a value. It will usually have additional "alarm" inputs that can be very handy. Comes with basic IR cameras, software/firmware loaded, hard drives and tech support. Many times security cam companies have their own basic "hosting" (servers) of your images.
I like to start with 420TTL cams, and you can make your own "secret IR" illumination from IR LEDs in a bogus spotlight.
My advice to amberwolf, FIRST get at least 1 basic camera to work on a old dedicated computer to simply upload jpegs every few minutes and will also trigger an "alarm" assigned by you (email , etc). 1 camera is better than none. Even an old game camera can help you a lot. PTZ and multiple cams can follow later.
Also, all sorts of "notifieyers'" can be made with this driveway alarm devise and some basic electric-know-how (they are often on sale for about $13 USD) ---> http://www.harborfreight.com/wireless-driveway-alert-system-93068.html
 
Haaaah! brilliant. A 'Pants crapper'. I could do with a few of them on my property! :D

I am all with you on the King of England. I live in Wales, we have many times rebelled against the Royal English Institute but have only once won our independence which unfortunately did not last that long. We did not have guns but we had Longbows.....
two-finger-salute.jpg
It is this gesture that originated from the Welsh Bow men.

Anyway, I digresss. Sorry for tilting the thread.
 
Eternal vigilance is the price of liberty.
Thus we also have an abundance of "You Loot We Shoot" signage left over from our catastrophes (Hurricane Katrina, etc)
levees.jpg

Off topic a bit , maybe not ....but if amberwolf has a sound "alarm" amplified that can bark and howl like many, many dogs ... and they all start to bark like they are 25-30 of them guarding his property ....?
This tactic is what our special forces call a "force multiplier" of deception.

OR---- disguise this tank toy like a small dog, and send it out to bark and play Mp3 the Ride of the Valkyries ?
"Put on psy-war-op, make it loud ... this is Romeo Foxtrot , shall we dance?
http://hobbyking.com/hobbyking/stor...h_Streaming_Video_and_Night_Vision_Wi_Fi.html
44601.jpg
 
You can buy a security system that mounts behind a painting or picture and it has a variety of configurations from 1 or more single shot shot-gun shells. That can remotely be triggered. In the USA state of Texas you can legally kill an intruder for protection of property, life and limb. Countless cases have been reported and no charges were laid on the homeowner. I would just go to a Spy Store and ask them what you are looking for, that is what I did for my needs.....trying to get on camera the license plates, facial picture of the driver who assault, commit attempted homicide or hit and runs upon innocent me riding my bike or others. Judges will always settle injury claims and damages upon the innocent bicycle rider who was doing nothing wrong, obeying every law on the books. Knowledge is power my friends.
 
I found some cameras on special, dx.com

You want to get IP cameras, dont get usb, well you can but its going to be more software running and through a computer. webcam that can do cat5 or wifi via a network
Also i got x6 waterproof sensor lights, Anyone comes to the front of my house, lights come on and my camera can see the entire length of one side, just using a 1.3mp seems to be ok but would prefer hd and IR sensor lights for stealth night vision,

I just hit a button on my phone and bam... live feed..
 
I use blueiris software with an assortment of ipcameras and wired cameras. Its 50$ for unlimited camera license.

I use cheap foscam pan,tilt ipcams. They work decent, about 10fps at 640x480 With a mic and speaker (fun to mess with pets)

The price just goes up and up for pan tilt zoom cams.
If it says HD 30 fps 200$ see if they have any magic beans for sale as well.

If you need a camera on or near your PC blueiris can use webcams as well. Not sure if pan tilt webcams work with the software.
 
I have a couple of foscam fi8918w? About $60 on Amazon

They are pan and tilt, IR illumination, wifi or wired, not very water proof, but under an awning is fine. Built in web page, I use an iPad and android app.

Decent for the price.
 
Have you thought about just using fake cams? We solved a problem at the condo's where I worked with them quite well. a few fake cams, and two signs saying real cams were watching did the trick. Ended the rocks through the windows and other stuff the punks walking the irrigation ditch were doing.

A cheap analog 4 cam monitoring system from harbor freight or such is all you will really need. It should be able to show you enough of the yard without panning to do the trick. You'd have to watch the tape later when you got home of course. But a sticker in the window that comes with the kit, and the not even functioning cams in plain sight will deter these guys I bet.

Goes without saying, you won't be a one dog household that long either. Cams visible up front and a dog on the property will be noticed by the looters right away.

No need for guns to protect the inside, if the dog is in there. That big face in the window is very scary.
 
Definitely go IP cams and the fostgate fi8918w appears to be a good value.

I don't think you're a Mac user but iCamSource - skjm.com is handy for OS X users.

Some of these links may be outdated as I copied them from an iCamSource thread but good suggestions for pan & tilt IP cams:

AirLink101 SkyIPCam1747W Wireless Night Vision Pan/Tilt Network Camera - http://airlink101.com/products/aicn1747w.php
Foscam FI8908W Wireless IP Camera - http://foscam.us/products/foscam-fi8908w-black-wireless-ip-camera-25.html
Foscam FI8918W Wireless IP Camera - http://foscam.us/wireless-ip-cameras/foscam-fi8918w-wireless-ip-camera.html
ipCam - Mobile IP Camera - http://skjm.com/ipcam/
TRENDnet TV-IP422W - http://www.trendnet.com/products/proddetail.asp?prod=155_TV-IP422W
Panasonic BL-C131A - http://shop.panasonic.com/shop/model/BL-C131A
Loftek CXS-2200 - http://www.loftek.us/Product_view.asp?CategoryId=42&id=148

One problem I found with USB is that they often conflict when using more than one on the USB bus.

Fake cams are a GREAT idea but best used in conjunction with a well hidden real cam or two or three, etc.

In the $500 range a stand-alone DVR multi-camera wired system might be worth a look? Frees up your computer among other things. While many of these multi-channel security DVR's offer web streaming they don't require internet to still function as a recorder.

Good luck!
 
use a pan and tilt shotgun.

put a laser pointer on it and have a voice recording that is activated by a motion detector that says something like "don't move so i can shoot you".

add forceful speech about thieves, etc and make the shotgun pan and tilt so it can follow the motion of the perp through the yard.
 
You're probably not going to find everything in your wishlist. Setup and run from a webpage, not a chance.

I run 4 weatherized (for excess heat) CCTV cameras from a Linux computer with Zonealarm motion detection software. The cameras are located at the corners of my house, most with wide angle lenses. The learning curve for surveillance is quite steep (especially if you're not a Linux user) but motion detecting and recording software for free is the reward. You'll pay some bucks for commercial grade motion detection on the other OS's. The hobby grade Costco/eBay type stuff will be a big dispointment.

Does the Phoenix police department allow the use of amatuer recordings in an investigation the of a break in? You might have some pretty images but they will not help you recover your ripped off possessions without police help. I can identify the UPS guy and the postman, but facial recognition is not possible at my CCTV level and would be quite useless to the police. (please don't tell the crooks) Facial recognition cameras start at $1,500. My used CCTV from eBay are $20 each.

I believe surveillances' primary objective is to discourage burglary. When the cameras are visable (day and night) it creates a deterent. It does not prevent crime! It simply moves it down the street to an unsurveilled location. Kinda a crummy thing to do to your neighbors, but hey, they should get their own cameras.

Good luck and the best part of my surveillance system is I can keep track of my cats.
 
Its better to have a recording that says the police have been called and are on their way.
 
I appreciate the replies...but I think some of you aren't reading what I wrote. '

As much as I would like to set them up, too, I'm not looking for traps (which are illegal here and would result in MY arrest instead of the criminals'), or deterrents (which the dog(s) will probably do pretty well), I'm looking for cameras to monitor what's happening both inside and outside the house.

And that's not just for the looting that will probably continue for a while, but also just to monitor the dogs themselves, for when I have situations like mulitple dogs that don't get along, and have to be kept separate, ensuring that they stay that way or that I know about one getting out in time to get back there and do something about it (or call someone to do it). Or new dogs that have to be watched to see what they do when I'm not there for behavior issues, or figuring out which of the dogs is the one causing some particular problem so I can fix it with retraining.

I know that there are cameras out there that do what I want, cuz I've already found a few, with reviews that discuss the features enough for me to know they have them. So far, though, haven't found one that is affordable and does what I want and is known to be reliable/etc. (well, I did find some but some reviews have said they were, but others said not, etc.)

So I'm asking here for personal experiences and hard data on specific models I might still be able to find for sale--like Yopappamon's direct image from his camera--that tells me the kind he has should work ok (not quite as good as i'd like, but tolerable), as far as quality of still image goes, at least, for example.

Ykick's list is also helpful, though I am not wanting anything I can't monitor via network connection, simply because I want the ability to tap into it remotely for dog monitoring--computers are cheap enough--before the fire I had a bunch of them that mostly sat unused as spares, that didn't do what I needed for my primary applications but would have served well enough in this role, even as old as they were. I don't know if I still have any of those, though. Even if I don't, I could probably get more old ones easy enough and cheap enough just by posting a wanted on Craigslist and/or Freecycle, or asking friends what old stuff they have laying around they don't use anymore.

Stinkler's and Nechaus's info is also helpful.
 
Sorry I misunderstood so bad, but your first sentence made a bunch of us think your primary need was deterrence of looters, and keeping an eye on the dogs would just be icing on the cake.

But since you did have a lot of folks into your stuff for a long time, some fake or cheap cams on the house right now is still not a bad idea.
 
If you want to get somebody's face that is on the move you will need very careful positioning. Most break-in's are through the most concealed door, which they will probably check even if they don't gain access that way. A camera hidden in a porch light or hanging plant basket might be the best thing in this instance.

After seeing camera's they will simply cover their face. It is a big investment to do pointlessly. Warning camera's are not a good idea unless the crook is exceedingly stupid. Also be prepared to have your pc stolen if they do think they are on camera. Some footage must be uploaded as it is taken to assure you keep it.
 
amberwolf said:
like Yopappamon's direct image from his camera--that tells me the kind he has should work ok (not quite as good as i'd like, but tolerable), as far as quality of still image goes, at least

Yeah, unless they are mounted at eye level and within 10-15 feet of a person your probably not going to be able tell who it is.
 
Back
Top