Bafang BBSxx - fault finding and fixes

[bono]

I have not called them. Paul mentioned not the call them. I have sent him an email, but he is responding with certain delay.

 

[tomjasz]

Well you certainly have had a bum run. I'd be insistent on a replacement when they return from their break. Two trips to the warranty service is one to many. I'm certain they're disappointed, but that's little consolation for you and your trouble.

 

[astmacca]

Hi Guys,

I had a problem with some strange noises coming from my BBS02.

Had a look at the video you posted, and then at the video posted in the OP of this thread waaaaaaaay back on page 1.

Sound a bit similar to me. Maybe you have a similar issue? I havent read all that stuff for a long time, but it came down to some lose screws and a fixable problem with a bearing in the motor i think.

 

[jpo]

Hi All
I'm having a minor problem with my bbs02.
It occasionally cuts out for couple seconds. This often happens after the ebrakes cut power. Instead of the power coming back on quickly there is a 2-3 second delay. After a couple of pedal rotations the power comes back on. There is no error code and I have in checked and double checked the brake switch. This problem happens on 2 of my bikes. One of them I am using stock haul sensor ebrake switches and the other I am using an after market reed switch.
Any ideas?

 

[Wimme]

I have the same setup and the same problem. Anyone who has solved this or knows the cause?

Hi,

I opened up the engine and everything looked nice. No sign of any burning.

Then i dragged out the multimeter and followed this guide:

Use your multimeter in the ohm (resistance) setting. Check the resistance amoung the 3 wires from the motor (in pairs). The ohms should be about the same between any 2 wires. If you have one set with much lower resistance, you have an open coil in the motor. If you have a set with much higher ohm reading, you have a shorted coil (motor should smell burned).
If the motor checks out, do the same on the 3 wires to the ESC. Again, you should get about the same readings between any pair of wires. If you have a much lower ohm reading, one or more FET transistors are open in the ESC. You should never have a short in the ESC without significant circuit damage. That would be obvious.
These are crude tests but they should get you close enough to figuring out if it is the motor or ESC


When checking the motor side everything was fine. When i checked the controller side i couldn't get consistent results. So I lean against that the controller is blown. I also get the same error message when the motor is disconnected, which i guess indicate that the motor isn't the problem. Does it sound correct or could it be something else?

Any other way that i can check the controller?

I tride this guide but couldn't understand what B- is:

circuit wrote:
A faint click on startup attempt sounds like a shorted phase. Most common reson is shorted mosfet, most likely low side. That is easy to check:
1. Take a multimeter and switch it to diode (-<|-) mode.
2. Connect red wire to B-.
3. Connect black wire to each phase. You should see redings around 300-700. If you see something like 002, then you have a blown mosfet. Replace it or bring the unit to electronics workshop to do the job.
4. Repeat steps 2 and 3, but with B+ and switch black with red.

 

[ebikedelight]

This BBS02 seems to have alot of problems. I may just stick to my reliable brushless hub motor setup .

 

[kampua]

Hi,

After 6 months and 712km, my Bafang BBS02 developed a clicking noise, see the link below.

http://youtu.be/NaLaI0zo9CQ

is this a problem, what can I do?

 

[Fastest1]

The curious me wants to know how you are going about that?

Thanks!

Use a plasma cutter to cutoff enough of the bottom bracket, on each side, to allow the BBS02 to fit . It can only be done on certain fat bikes where the chain stays are not welded to the absoloute outside of each side of the B.B.

Any good bike shop should have a BB hand milling tool. Easy to use.

 

[astmacca]

This BBS02 seems to have alot of problems. I may just stick to my reliable brushless hub motor setup .

Well, you have to remember that this is where people with problems come for info and advice. People who dont have issues simplly wont post here so i think you can get a pretty skewed impression.

Also, a lot of the people who come to ES seem to be "enthusiasts" and "tinkerers" who may in some cases be pushing things out to limits.

With mine, i have done 2900km in 5 months, and no probs to date. I am going to order some spares later this month and i am planning at running it out to 3500 - 4000km before i strip it down, check bearings and re-lube.

Seems to me that these units are great for commuting and light off road. They EAT hills and i have been real;ly please with the range i get out oi the 11AH battery.

 

[Aushiker]

I am getting an Error 21 this morning which I know is the speed sensor. Initially the sensor light was lighting up, so I know it was getting power from the motor and magnet is very close and it would in hte first couple of attempts at resolving the problem fire up the sensor but then on about the third fail it failed failed, i.e., would not come back to life.

I am still getting assist but not no functioning display.

I disconnected and reconnected the sensor and check the run of wire to the motor and no obvious issues there.

Any other suggestions or should I simply replace the sensor?

Thanks
Andrew

 

[astmacca]

I am getting an Error 21 this morning which I know is the speed sensor.

http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=65281

This thread any use??

 

[Aushiker]

I am getting an Error 21 this morning which I know is the speed sensor.

http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=65281

This thread any use??

Thanks. I suspect I have the same issues then. I have a wired speedo or two around the place I Might try those.

Andrew

 

[queenkong]

Sorry if this sounds like not ready through before posting. I did but I couldn't get it as my foundation in fixing electric motors is not strong!

My problem is that the motor start to have gear clicking sound after only 30km of use. Its the same sound as backward spin or on freewheel. I've disassembled the motor but not yet removed the stator.

When I hand spin, there will be no such sound but when motor spin, then the sound will appear. It's also no that loud, probably equally loud as when backward spin or on freewheel too. It's almost insignificant when on PAS lvl 3.

What could be the problem? Wanted to avoid taking apart so many things because my foundation is really not strong!

Thank you for the help guys... So sad that my set is having problems so early!

 

[aniken]

BIKE FIXED
For those who may have similar issues... I was suffering cutting out and low voltage warning issues. I thought I had ruled out bad power connections as I had run the bike on the stand with the throttle wired open so I could manipulate all the problem areas with both hands to make it do the fault. I failed to find anything that would make it cut out so moved onto the battery.

I hooked up a voltmeter across the battery connection terminals that poke into the battery. The battery is the type that slides onto the terminals. When riding sure enough it seemed to randomly suffer from low voltage conditions. I tried manipulating the battery whilst riding along to try to make it do the fault, also swerving the handlebars, bunnyhopping the bike etc. None seemed to give any consistent results regarding a set of conditions that was causing it. I also looked at the throttle, brake switches to no avail.

Now the motor, when working, seemed to pull strongly. I tried the same battery on another bike and it seemed to work fine, although this bike has a far smaller motor and lower amperage controller. I also loaded the motor up whilst riding by reaching down to the front wheel and applying the brake by hand so the cutout switch didn't operate. Mostly the bike kept pulling for ages even though it must have been pulling major amps! Eventually after a whole morning of frustrating test riding I realised that road bumps loosely correlated with the problem about 50% of the time

Eventually I settled on the loose connection diagnosis, had another go fault finding and realised if I pulled the battery hard in one particular direction it cut out!

I bent one of the connection terminals slightly so it might make a better contact inside the battery (as you can't exactly see what's going on in there), and its fixed.

What I want to convey is the way the bbs01 deals with what must have been a momentary loss of power due to vibration. Imagine power being cut for a 10th of a second and then restored. On the voltmeter whilst riding this was virtually unoticeable. What the motor saw was a low voltage condition and it seems to begin a process that lasts maybe 6 or 7 seconds as a result. The motor would stop, it would show a 06 warning code for a while etc. Basically it made a very small problem seem like a much larger one. One less thing to worry about and looks like my ancient battery may live to ride for another day!

 

[watermouse]

Long time reader, first time poster...

I have had my BBS02 750w on my bike for a few days now but a problem arose within the first few hundred metres of use.
The setup is on an older 26" SantaCruz Blur full suspension mtb. 14s (2 x 7s) 4000mah Lipo. 965 display with the three button remote. No brake cutouts yet as I am using hydraulic brakes. (That power run-on is a bit disconcerting!)
It was purchased through Aliexpress and the vendor is stone cold quiet, which is not surprising.

The initial ride had the display setting with only 3 levels of PAS. I am still not sure if this meant is was limited to Level 3 PAS or just coarser level adjustment.

All seemed to be very quiet and smooth for the first ride. Level 3 was giving satisfying amounts of assist then I gave it a good throttle-only run up to 50kph. Awesome.

Then it stopped. (Expletives started)

Not during the run but after releasing the throttle and turning around, there was no response, throttle or PAS. The display was functioning and reading speed but no errors.
Turning off the system and restarting, nothing. No clicking or surging.
Then after mucking about with it a bit it started again. But this time noticeably rough and noisy. Particularly under starting loads it would stutter and sometimes cut out.
It would work until the throttle or PAS was stopped then dead again.

What I discovered was that after each "death" I could restart it again (most of the time) by rotating the drive chainring backwards (hence rotating the motor) about 1/4 turn.

I have had subsequent runs up to 50kph in PAS but always with noticeable vibration through the cranks at speed and always rough to start and under low speed/high load and always ending up unresponsive after stopping pedalling about 30% of the time.

I have read through lots of issues but none I have found on this forum describe what I am experiencing. I am hoping that the gurus on here might be able to help me diagnose what might be the problem before I open it up.

My initial thought was a blown controller FET(s) dropping out one phase, (rough running) but I would imagine that would render the motor permanently dead. Is it possible to lose a phase and still get rotation?
Then I though maybe a dead Hall sensor on account of being able to "reset" by rotating the motor. I am not entirely clued up on how the controllers use Hall sensor signals.

Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

 

[dusan]

Original 48V Li ion battery is 13s, not sure if controller can handle over 53V. Ppl run it successfully on 12s as well.

 

[Kepler]

Sounds like a blown fet to me. Did you get it locally or OS? If from OS, cut your loses and get a new controller. 14S Lipo could have been the problem problem. 14S voltage is Ok but under full power at around 56V, you would have been pulling around 1400W. That is starting to push the boundaries.

 

[tomjasz]

Kepler,

Can't protection be set in programming if using 14S. Which is what EM3ev sells. How does he compensate? In programing?

Tom

 

[Kepler]

Absolutely. As you know I run 14S 18650 Cells so the voltage is very similar to Lipo. I set the main current limit to 18A. I then set the designated assist for PAS at 2 and designated assist for throttle at 6. This gives me 250W max on PAS and around 750W on Throttle. I am sure these conservative settings have been a major contributor to the longevity of My drive. (8000 km and still going strong and smooth) Just replaced the chain ring, chain, and rear cluster as it was starting to skip under power occasionally.

 

[watermouse]

Absolutely. As you know I run 14S 18650 Cells so the voltage is very similar to Lipo. I set the main current limit to 18A. I then set the designated assist for PAS at 2 and designated assist for throttle at 6. This gives me 250W max on PAS and around 750W on Throttle. I am sure these conservative settings have been a major contributor to the longevity of My drive. (8000 km and still going strong and smooth)

Good to know. It was your early issues, Kepler, with the 15s packs overcharging that made me settle on the 14s setup. I will try and fix the controller if I can find the problem before replacing it (in the spirit of DIY) and manage it better with the 14s pack. Maybe even dial back the charge-per-cell voltage.

I haven't yet tried programing the controller but will make that a priority once this is running right. Plenty of reading to do there.

Yet, since my first post, I have ridden the bike with the drive operating. Longest distance of continuous running is 5km, before backing off for a corner, then stopped. A backwards spin of the chainwheel with my right foot and I am off again. Didn't even have to dismount. :|

 

[speedmd]

Getting a error 30. Anyone know what this is exactly. Can get into display program, and PAS works at full steam so the drive side of controller is functioning. Connections all good. Sad little system when not working.

 

[tahustvedt]

Getting a error 30. Anyone know what this is exactly. Can get into display program, and PAS works at full steam so the drive side of controller is functioning. Connections all good. Sad little system when not working.

This happens when the data connection between the controller and display is lost, I think. That's what happened to me. I have a custom harness with different connectors, and the ones on the display became semi-connected and I got the same error. I just pushed it back into place. The manual says error 30 means "communication has problem".

 

[speedmd]

Thanks. Double checked all the connections and cycled the power. Will see when I hook up the programming cable if it shows proper connection. Hoping it just a dropped or corrupted program issue that can be re-flashed.

 

[tomjasz]

http://endless-sphere.com/forums/download/file.php?id=149514

30 = communication abnormality in the system

 

[speedmd]

Com cable to the display got pinched while the system was hot. Hate when that happens. I think something in the controller data link got toasted. Not having a good go with this kit so far. Anyone have a controller they want to part with?