BIONX motor controller revealed

[anwerj]

Hi everybody,

I'm new to the forums but was having troubles with dismantling my Bionix motor. I have removed half the casing only but cannot remove the other half until I can remove the mounting point that is pressed onto the shaft (the end where the flat on the shaft allows the wires to pass through). Any tips, idea or input on how to get the damn thing off would be so helpful. I have tried all manners of trying to remove it but will not try too hard as I do not want to damage anything on the motor assembly permenently. If there's anything else you all need to know please ask, but anything you post will be helpful as i'm out of ideas!!

thanks
anwerj

 

[WeWerk]

Hi everybody,

I'm new to the forums but was having troubles with dismantling my Bionix motor. I have removed half the casing only but cannot remove the other half until I can remove the mounting point that is pressed onto the shaft (the end where the flat on the shaft allows the wires to pass through). Any tips, idea or input on how to get the damn thing off would be so helpful. I have tried all manners of trying to remove it but will not try too hard as I do not want to damage anything on the motor assembly permenently. If there's anything else you all need to know please ask, but anything you post will be helpful as i'm out of ideas!!

thanks
anwerj

Hi anwerj,
Use the puller as that damn thing must be removed before you split both casings.
You have to also get rid of black shrink tubes for smooth dissasembling.
Truly, my other half casing was released when I pulled the shaft ( axle ) from the stator.

 

[cormode]

I'm looking for advise or suggestions on repairing my P250 motor.

I have a 2004 P250 bionx motor that started acting erratic after riding in a very heavy rainstorm.

I pulled it apart and found standing water inside. It probably came in through the axle.

I've been trying to repair it using a Bionx controller I bought from eBay. However I have some issues.

My battery packs both power the controller electronics via a line in the communications cable labeled "vctrl" which is essentially the battery voltage (~24 volts or ~40 volts depending on the pack). The new controller gets power via a wire labeled "12v." Additionally the old controller electronics would work if just the communications cable was connected. The new controller will not pass any current over the communications cable ground wire, so the thick power cable must be connected as well.

Because of this I assumed that the new controller was Canbus. I was wrong. The new controller is I2C but it will only work when powered by 12v and grounded via the power cable. After I worked this out, it put in in the motor and put it together. I clamped the motor on the bench and ran it. It worked normally until I tried regen mode, the motor made a funny vibration and will no longer run. If put into regen mode it will continue to make a small vibration even if the motor is not spinning.

I have an arduino and a cable with which I can either replace the console and give commands to the battery pack and motor or masquerade as either the motor or battery pack. By experimenting with all three configurations I worked out most of the communication protocols in I2C. This work is reported in another thread. The new controller still communicates with the I2C. It reports strain gauge and RPM fine. However upon reading the register I suspect is a self diagnostic, it gives a "255" When I make my arduino pretend to be a motor to my I2C console, the console will never give the instruction for power if the register in question reads 255.

Clearly the new controller is broken, but I bought a two pack. What caused the controller to break? Two things come to mind. The original motor was wound in delta, I understand the newer ones, even before 2009 were wound in wye. Could this have killed the controller? Secondly its not clear to me how the motor decides what voltage to generate during regen. Is this strictly a function of motor speed or does the battery pack modulate the voltage over the power lines somehow?

Any thoughts or comments would be appreciated.

 

[kosio86]

Sadly, it seems that this thread is no longer active and it help me a lot to understand at least a bit for these Bionx motors. I need some clarification, so I will post my info and questions here, but I am not sure if anyone watches this thread. However someone might have similar ones and I can save him some trouble. I had the following issue: My motor was running smoothly but was randomly shutting down for a long and non-predictable period and later starting again. The problem became more and more often to a point it get unusable . My version is CANBUS 36v lipo and had inspected the battery and it is fine. 3772 menu always showed me errors 40 and 55 (problem in the connection between console and battery and problem in the connection between the console and motor). So I changed the console, later changed the battery bracket including the cable loom and nothing changed. I decided that there is a problem with the cables inside the motor and opened it, using this thread for info source and help. After I opened it I didn't find any noticeable damage to the MOSFETS. It looked as if no one had opened it before BUT I noticed something really strange- I had PCB version 3.2 2008-07 as others pics posted here, but I had 12 MOSFETS, where 6 were with one leg soldered and one cut and 6 with 2 legs soldered and I had the windings in delta. Before I found time to measure anything I noticed that on the backside of the PCB 3 CAPS were completely fallen and 4 were almost fallen (probably because of vibrations or potholes). In order to get to the back of the motor I had to de-solder the motor phase wires and the strain gauge wires only. So, I decided that this is my problem and re-soldered all ( I had to solder new legs to each CAP as the old ones were broken). I glued each capacitor with hot glue (not sure if a good idea taking in account that there is heat inside the motor, but...). After the re-assembly I started the motor and VOALA no errors were shown in the 3772 menu. I started riding and the bike was assisting/breaking with heavy stuttering in the motor. I decided I broke the strain gauge, somehow, or that I haven't tighten the nuts properly and it shows bad numbers, as while riding and watching the 3772 menu first 2 digits for the strain gauge signal were floating senselessly). Then I noticed that the speedometer shows 00 when stopped but when I start moving it starts to move like crazy, changing so fast that I wasn't able to read the numbers.
Later the same errors 40 and 55 appeared and I was pissed. Now I am about to open the motor again (which costs me as I don't have the tools), but I want to make it working really hard.

Does anyone knows: 1) could it be the strain gauge causing the stuttering 2) Could it be a hall sensor glued too deep in the gap ( I had to unglue them from the motor rather than de-solder them from the PCB) causing the stuttering. 3)Could it be a wire causing the 40 and 55 errors and the stuttering - my first suspect 4)If I decide to scrap the controller and use external brushless, sensored controller can I use the existing hall sensors ( in case they are working after I measure them). 5) If "4)" is TRUE can I use any 36V >250W Sensored, brushless controller, or I have to pick a special one because of the Delta wires winding.

 

[eee291]

Sadly, it seems that this thread is no longer active and it help me a lot to understand at least a bit for these Bionx motors. I need some clarification, so I will post my info and questions here, but I am not sure if anyone watches this thread. However someone might have similar ones and I can save him some trouble. I had the following issue: My motor was running smoothly but was randomly shutting down for a long and non-predictable period and later starting again. The problem became more and more often to a point it get unusable . My version is CANBUS 36v lipo and had inspected the battery and it is fine. 3772 menu always showed me errors 40 and 55 (problem in the connection between console and battery and problem in the connection between the console and motor). So I changed the console, later changed the battery bracket including the cable loom and nothing changed. I decided that there is a problem with the cables inside the motor and opened it, using this thread for info source and help. After I opened it I didn't find any noticeable damage to the MOSFETS. It looked as if no one had opened it before BUT I noticed something really strange- I had PCB version 3.2 2008-07 as others pics posted here, but I had 12 MOSFETS, where 6 were with one leg soldered and one cut and 6 with 2 legs soldered and I had the windings in delta. Before I found time to measure anything I noticed that on the backside of the PCB 3 CAPS were completely fallen and 4 were almost fallen (probably because of vibrations or potholes). In order to get to the back of the motor I had to de-solder the motor phase wires and the strain gauge wires only. So, I decided that this is my problem and re-soldered all ( I had to solder new legs to each CAP as the old ones were broken). I glued each capacitor with hot glue (not sure if a good idea taking in account that there is heat inside the motor, but...). After the re-assembly I started the motor and VOALA no errors were shown in the 3772 menu. I started riding and the bike was assisting/breaking with heavy stuttering in the motor. I decided I broke the strain gauge, somehow, or that I haven't tighten the nuts properly and it shows bad numbers, as while riding and watching the 3772 menu first 2 digits for the strain gauge signal were floating senselessly). Then I noticed that the speedometer shows 00 when stopped but when I start moving it starts to move like crazy, changing so fast that I wasn't able to read the numbers.
Later the same errors 40 and 55 appeared and I was pissed. Now I am about to open the motor again (which costs me as I don't have the tools), but I want to make it working really hard.

Does anyone knows: 1) could it be the strain gauge causing the stuttering 2) Could it be a hall sensor glued too deep in the gap ( I had to unglue them from the motor rather than de-solder them from the PCB) causing the stuttering. 3)Could it be a wire causing the 40 and 55 errors and the stuttering - my first suspect 4)If I decide to scrap the controller and use external brushless, sensored controller can I use the existing hall sensors ( in case they are working after I measure them). 5) If "4)" is TRUE can I use any 36V >250W Sensored, brushless controller, or I have to pick a special one because of the Delta wires winding.

Well my friend looks like I can help!

Look two pages back and doctor bass already confirmed your questions.

1) the controller doesn't care what winding pattern that motor has so yeah any brushless controller

2) I WILL buy a controller that can go sensored and sensor less. Why? Because I just bought a Bionx with a dead controller and want my wife to drive it sensored until the sensors die and she can keep on going

3) the motor as doctorbass says is underrated you can pump 1kw in that thing easy just be careful when climbing loong and steep hills.