Factory changes for the Q100C .
- Thread starter motomech
- Start date
motomech
10 MW
I spent a lot or time and money trying to make the sine wave controllers from BMS Battery work, both SO6S and the S12S.docnjoj said:
I wanted them to work, I really did.
But in the end, no go.
They just will not function correct with the Lipo chemistry. They won't properly read the initial Voltage and things go downhill from there.
Not BMS Battery's fault, they weren't designed to work with Lipo.
motomech
10 MW
It's simple really.chas58 said:
I used a 15A controller, which is more representive of what was/is used with the majority on Cute builds.
Remember, a 328 in a big wheel is current limited, not rpm limited.
Note that the red plot (power) extends past the no-load point before it takes a dive.
It is this rather tippy balance @ the no-load point that makes running a small, high-speed, motor in a big wheel attractive(highest top speed for motor size, ability of rider to add significant speed, as little as 100 Watts will take the top speed from 22.5 mph to 25 mph!). But the other edge of the sword is reduced efficiency, controller trying to run max. and greater ease of the motor falling into the dreaded >50% of max rpm on hills).
I'm not that fit rider on a road bike, so my attempt to use mini's with a reduction ratio that gives the highest road speed took a different tack.
Smaller wheels weighted the compromise a bit.
Larger, less prone to get very hot controllers acted as a "stop-gap" fix, not really getting at the root of the problem.
And finally, 2WD, which, once all the details were worked out, worked pretty well. More or less like a 290 rpm BPM on 30 Amps, just not as powerful and more complicated
Still, getting a mini powered(even two of them)Ebike on 12S up to 28 mph was rather intoxicating.
But after a while, the speed thrill wears off and that extra 3 or 4 mph just doesn't seem worth the trouble.
Right now, the 2WD is being converted to 201's to cruise the sandy roads around the beach area I'm at.
But I think my ultimate Q100 powered 2WD is going to be a 260H in frt. and a (yet to be built)260 CST rear.
That is my motivation of looking at the possibilites of Q100 parts interchangeability
dakh
100 W
motomech said:
Thanks for your persistence in figuring this stuff out! I'm not sure I understand the rest of the musings here, was this decided one way or another?
motomech
10 MW
I think so, both the H and CST models fall into the group of the 8T motor shaft, so the gears should swap.dakh said:
I am just hesitent to say yes because I have not physically ckéd.
My 260 H is my daily transpo.
dakh
100 W
motomech said:
I don't mind giving it a try. So I order the 260 H and whatever CST to see if that works out right?
motomech
10 MW
Yes, What you order depends on what you want the other motor to be.
options;
201 H, frt.--201 gears in 260 H, frt
or
201 H, rear--201 gears in 260 H, rear(free wheel type)
or
328 H, frt--328 gears in 260 H, frt.
or
328 H, rear--328 gears in 260 H, rear (free wheel type).
Remember, 201 gears in wheels 24"or larger
328 gears in 24 "wheels and smaller.
You will need a hand-held impact driver and a quality #2 Phillips bit.
Let us know how it works out.
options;
201 H, frt.--201 gears in 260 H, frt
or
201 H, rear--201 gears in 260 H, rear(free wheel type)
or
328 H, frt--328 gears in 260 H, frt.
or
328 H, rear--328 gears in 260 H, rear (free wheel type).
Remember, 201 gears in wheels 24"or larger
328 gears in 24 "wheels and smaller.
You will need a hand-held impact driver and a quality #2 Phillips bit.
Let us know how it works out.
dakh
100 W
Um, I don't think I understand. I thought the idea is to get whatever gearing in CST rear hub body and swap 260 gearing from a front H hub, no? If that's the case I'd probably go for a 201 CST rear (since 201 works well enough for me after all, I could just use that hub in another build if gear swap doesn't work out).
Thanks again for the hand-holding!
Thanks again for the hand-holding!
motomech
10 MW
Well, correct if I'm wrong, but what you have now is is the standard Q100 201(from which, nothing can be used).
Nobody sells 260 gears, so you need to buy a 260 H motor.
And you need a CST motor, which you will go with a 201 CST.
So, if all goes to plan, you will simply swap the two gear-set(Including the ring gears).
And you will have a 260 CST and a 201 H Frt.
A 201 H frt. is what I would choose too, as it would be the most useful, or easiest to sell.
Nobody sells 260 gears, so you need to buy a 260 H motor.
And you need a CST motor, which you will go with a 201 CST.
So, if all goes to plan, you will simply swap the two gear-set(Including the ring gears).
And you will have a 260 CST and a 201 H Frt.
A 201 H frt. is what I would choose too, as it would be the most useful, or easiest to sell.
dakh
100 W
Ah ok so I got it right, just got lost in all the options. I'll also get a 260 Q100H rear drive (not CST) while I'm at it, just in case.
dakh
100 W
Well, made orders with bmsbattery and elifebike over the weekend and haven't heard a peep from them yet. Maybe they're shipped, maybe not.
You often don't get acknowledgements. For BMSB, login and have a look at "my orders" you can see what's happening there. If you ordered a battery or motor wheel/kit, expect about ten days before it changes to QC. Shipping happens very soon after. Controllers on their own and stuff like that is much quicker.
dakh
100 W
Ok thanks d8veh, I guess I got lucky it's in QC already at BMSB and elifebike already shipped!
dakh
100 W
Well well well. First FedEx messed up and had my bmsbattery order stuck somewhere for a week, now I finally got the order and instead of 260RPM motors they shipped 201RPM. So I can't report what gearing they got until this gets resolved
dakh
100 W
Haha, "Jack" from BMSB was responding to chat but his only response is "email to jack@bmsb". We'll see where this goes but not great so far.
dakh
100 W
Anyone else got experience dealing with these guys? They are very apologetic but all they offered me is some undisclosed discount on future orders. So I just spent $500 and got one motor that I actually wanted and a bunch more I done't have any use for. Telling them that basically made them stop responding.
motomech
10 MW
Contest the order with Pay Pal.
dakh
100 W
motomech said:
Totally forgot about that part, thank you!
dakh
100 W
They're offering a whopping 8% discount for me to go ahead and purchase AGAIN the stuff that I already paid for to begin with. Looked it up and PayPal will have me pay for return shipping of those 2 motors back to them so returning won't make much sense.
Bottom line is looks like I'll just have to find another place to buy those motors from, sell 201RPM motors in classifieds here and move on.
Bottom line is looks like I'll just have to find another place to buy those motors from, sell 201RPM motors in classifieds here and move on.
Alan B
100 GW
Where are all the places these motors can be purchased? It would be good to have a list somewhere.
knutselmaaster
1 kW
Yes an alternative for bmsbattery.com would be great.
Their service is terrible.
I believe we all have similar experiences with them
Their service is terrible.
I believe we all have similar experiences with them
motomech
10 MW
Elifebike and Greenbikekit are the other two sources.
Each vendor uses different nomenclature and offers a slightly different line-up of available versions
I will do up a cross-reference list and post it in a new thread.
I was under the impression that BMS Battery has been providing decent service for the last couple of months, but they seem to have really started to back-slide.
Time to black-list them here.
Each vendor uses different nomenclature and offers a slightly different line-up of available versions
I will do up a cross-reference list and post it in a new thread.
I was under the impression that BMS Battery has been providing decent service for the last couple of months, but they seem to have really started to back-slide.
Time to black-list them here.
dakh
100 W
Need some feedback on bmsb deal. They tried hard to get me to buy a couple more motors but after a few iterations I simply told them they're offering to fix their mistake at my expense and that's not going to work, I'll just take my business elsewhere. Their next message is, quote They are the same motors ,just the different from RPM 201 and 260,but do not affect the use. Can you tell me how do you want to deal with?. What's the common industry practice? I'm about to ask them to eat shipping on one extra 260RPM motor, which is still not going to "make me whole" but at least it's something. On the other hand the whole bickering back and force deal makes me want to just flip the bozo bit on them and move on.
motomech
10 MW
How 'bout an update.
What do you have now, what is coming and what do you want to end up with?
The difference between the 201 and 260 on a given battery is about 2 mph.
What do you have now, what is coming and what do you want to end up with?
The difference between the 201 and 260 on a given battery is about 2 mph.
dakh
100 W
motomech said:
Oh yea, sorry. I ordered 201RPM CST, and two 260RPM (one front, one non-CST rear). They sent all 3 being 201RPM. I want at least one 260 just so I can get the first hand experience of the difference and also confirm (or not) that one can swap parts between them.
