nutnspecial
10 MW
I'm sure noone meant any personal disrespect Dnmun
ice sheet losses in Greenland and Antarctica reach new highs
- Thread starter dnmun
- Start date
I'm sure you're a nice enough guy, nutspecial, but your posts are inflammatory to anyone of a technical, scientific or critical-thinking disposition.
I have often wondered if you are just trolling, but I don't think you are. However, I'm not going to engage you in the off-topic discussion you're trying to start.
I have often wondered if you are just trolling, but I don't think you are. However, I'm not going to engage you in the off-topic discussion you're trying to start.
Dauntless
100 TW
Calling him inflammatory fits in english usage, but it's more accurate to point out to him that his attempts to discuss the 'Issue' draws more attention to his own issues with erratic analysis. Kind of like insisting on discussing the old theories where they thought all rain started off falling as snow then melted in the warmer climates. Now that we KNOW that's not happening it's best left out, but he still wants to remind you that noone has physical proof, really.
Meanwhile, such people who only involve themselves in discussions because they TROLL for people to insult find him a delightful opportunity, no matter how much rage they feint.
Meanwhile, such people who only involve themselves in discussions because they TROLL for people to insult find him a delightful opportunity, no matter how much rage they feint.
nutnspecial
10 MW
So geoengineering and microbiology is off topic for global warming? You're kidding, right?
From what I understand, David Keith is the lead public face, and there's so much when you dig into the subject of geoengineering.
Keith on Colbert
[youtube]v7zvi60qxO4[/youtube]
Keith on BBC
[youtube]ceGJTCF5tyY[/youtube]
Feel free to enlighten me on how this is not relative.
From what I understand, David Keith is the lead public face, and there's so much when you dig into the subject of geoengineering.
Keith on Colbert
[youtube]v7zvi60qxO4[/youtube]
Keith on BBC
[youtube]ceGJTCF5tyY[/youtube]
Feel free to enlighten me on how this is not relative.
nutnspecial
10 MW
//edit
post irrelevant because comment it referred to is X
peace
post irrelevant because comment it referred to is X
peace
dnmun
1 PW
i was reading something else on the geologic history of ice and ran across this:
what is so interesting about the picture is that the early photo showed a large block positioned at the sea edge of the glacier. 2/3 way up. looks like a singularity?
in the later picture after the calving it appears that there are several large blocks like that. and the original is a little further out.
so it is as though a large mass of ice in the form of those blocks, had been holding a huge shelf in place, maybe floating but just the magnitude of the amount of ice released staggers the imagination if you have ever been out in the big open wilderness places like that . that is like 12.0 square miles at least.
it would be neat to see the land form under the ocean there now and see if there is some sort of fence on the bottom everything hangs up on. so now the flow will not hit this obstacle now that it has receded further above it. maybe it was a backwards sloping shelf.
http://neven1.typepad.com/blog/2015/08/jakobshavn-record-retreat.html#more
there is another picture of the glacier and historical data from the satellite picture. go look, jakobshaven glacier.
and i was reading this other article and they discuss how the high rate is related to the big gouge underneath the front edge of the glacier. 3400' deep so there is no rock, just 'haulin ice'. joke get it?
http://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/IOTD/view.php?id=83837&eocn=image&eoci=related_image
what is so interesting about the picture is that the early photo showed a large block positioned at the sea edge of the glacier. 2/3 way up. looks like a singularity?
in the later picture after the calving it appears that there are several large blocks like that. and the original is a little further out.
so it is as though a large mass of ice in the form of those blocks, had been holding a huge shelf in place, maybe floating but just the magnitude of the amount of ice released staggers the imagination if you have ever been out in the big open wilderness places like that . that is like 12.0 square miles at least.
it would be neat to see the land form under the ocean there now and see if there is some sort of fence on the bottom everything hangs up on. so now the flow will not hit this obstacle now that it has receded further above it. maybe it was a backwards sloping shelf.
http://neven1.typepad.com/blog/2015/08/jakobshavn-record-retreat.html#more
there is another picture of the glacier and historical data from the satellite picture. go look, jakobshaven glacier.
and i was reading this other article and they discuss how the high rate is related to the big gouge underneath the front edge of the glacier. 3400' deep so there is no rock, just 'haulin ice'. joke get it?
http://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/IOTD/view.php?id=83837&eocn=image&eoci=related_image
TheBeastie
1 MW
I saw this on local TV and thought I would share it because its pretty good.
Its created by the Australian ABC ( purely government funded ) science show Catalyst.
Talks about sea level rise in our planets history by showing how high its got in the past by looking at fossils on our coast line, also talks about the science behind how sea rising works and that is its not so much the ice melting as it is of the global sea water expanding.
Also because this is government instead of commercial TV its somewhat less baloney packed and more just about the science and more concise. The summary is they expect a 9 meter rise has happened in the past from a 2 degree temp average increase, so its still quite doomishly entertaining.
[youtube]2aWrZ7wuHGg[/youtube]
I guess to make it hard to see 'what side i am on' here is a link to a NASA article last year I read that stuck in my head.
http://www.nasa.gov/content/goddard/antarctic-sea-ice-reaches-new-record-maximum
Its created by the Australian ABC ( purely government funded ) science show Catalyst.
Talks about sea level rise in our planets history by showing how high its got in the past by looking at fossils on our coast line, also talks about the science behind how sea rising works and that is its not so much the ice melting as it is of the global sea water expanding.
Also because this is government instead of commercial TV its somewhat less baloney packed and more just about the science and more concise. The summary is they expect a 9 meter rise has happened in the past from a 2 degree temp average increase, so its still quite doomishly entertaining.
[youtube]2aWrZ7wuHGg[/youtube]
I guess to make it hard to see 'what side i am on' here is a link to a NASA article last year I read that stuck in my head.
http://www.nasa.gov/content/goddard/antarctic-sea-ice-reaches-new-record-maximum
dnmun
1 PW
we are already committed to a 4o C temp rise and the loss of the arctic sea ice and that will release about 50gT of methane which increase the arctic ocean temperature so the winds blowing onto the greenland glaciers will be 3-5o C warmer which will accelerate the melting and movement of glacier ice to the sea in greenland.
it is inevitable that we will have almost 7 meters of sea level rise by the end of the century. no matter which side you are on.
what is so amazing about these republicans who constantly trash reality from their positions of richness is that the most prominent republican there is, former treasury secretary Hank Paulsen, is desperately trying to stop this too.
it is inevitable that we will have almost 7 meters of sea level rise by the end of the century. no matter which side you are on.
what is so amazing about these republicans who constantly trash reality from their positions of richness is that the most prominent republican there is, former treasury secretary Hank Paulsen, is desperately trying to stop this too.
dnmun said:
If we knew that the ocean will rise 7 meters within 85 years, then NYC would be underwater, and hence NYC real estate would longer have any value. That would be a disaster of epic proportions. The value of the real estate would already be crashing now.
There is only one problem - your statement is ridiculous, even more so than Jimmy Carter saying the Earth will run out of all oil by now. But some people like to make alarmists claims to try to get other people to adopt their religion. Your religion is wrong on the benefit of organic foods also.
The sea is not going to rise more than one foot in the next 85 years, and we did not run out of oil by now as Jimmy Carter predicted. I have not heard his apology for being wrong and for harming us with his party's costly regulation based on that false prediction.
Gloop
10 W
Actually dnmun's statement is not so ridiculous.
We are at 0.8 C, global dimming is blocking about 1.5 C, so we are already past 2 C, and the earth will continue heating due to the 10-40 year time lag between emissions and warming effect. So even if we cut emissions to zero today, an impossible task, the world will continue heating and initiate its own positive feedbacks that will further accelerate warming. In other words, its too late and 4C is locked in, infact one you get to 4C feedbacks take you to 15C within 150 years according to Hans Schellnhuber and much sooner according to Malcolm Light, Sam Carana and Paul Beckwith.
What dnmun says is correct.
Paul Beckwith, professor at the University of Ottawa and member of the Arctic Methane Emergency Group, has predicted up to 7 metres by 2070 based on these feedbacks.
Natalia Shakhova, Igor Semiletov, and Peter Wadhams, scientists that have been in the field on ships and submarines for the past 20 years, predict a 50Gt pule of methane from the ESAS. There is 1700 Gt of methane in the ESAS alone. A release of 50Gt over a few years is not a low probability event. These scientists say it is a high probability event. These are the top scientists in their fields in the world.
Here is a good summary and update of all the positive feedbacks now in play.
http://guymcpherson.com/2014/01/climate-change-summary-and-update/
You are wrong rsilvers, and over the next 20 years you will watch it play out in front of your eyes. (Maybe not sea level but droughts and fires and floods, ice storms in eastern America, increasing refugees looking for food. In fact Syria's crisis has a strong link to climate change, as does the Arab Spring. Wildfires in Russia stopped grain imports to Egypt. Google it.)
As for organic foods, yes they produce less food per acre. Industrial agriculture is required to feed 7+ billion you are correct.
As for Jimmy Carter, if you listened to the top scientist of the day, M King Hubbert, you would know he predicted the world to peak, ie maximum oil production, around year 2000. He has proven correct although he never accounted for shale oils and tarsands which weren't developed at the time because they weren't economically viable at the time.
In fact i doubt that was ever a serious prediction based on the data at the time..look at Exxon Mobil data, they were at peak discovery in the 1960s. They had to have known how long peak production would trail behind peak discovery.
Now if Jimmy was talking about USA oil production..yes they hit peak in the 1970s and if Saudi's and the rest of the world didn't start exporting oil to the USA the USA would be in real trouble producing its own oil today.
Look at that, we discovered, and will soon burn, all the oil in the world. That has to be some sort of accomplishment. Hopefully that Arctic ice melts soon so we can start drilling in the Arctic. Drill baby drill.
We are at 0.8 C, global dimming is blocking about 1.5 C, so we are already past 2 C, and the earth will continue heating due to the 10-40 year time lag between emissions and warming effect. So even if we cut emissions to zero today, an impossible task, the world will continue heating and initiate its own positive feedbacks that will further accelerate warming. In other words, its too late and 4C is locked in, infact one you get to 4C feedbacks take you to 15C within 150 years according to Hans Schellnhuber and much sooner according to Malcolm Light, Sam Carana and Paul Beckwith.
What dnmun says is correct.
Paul Beckwith, professor at the University of Ottawa and member of the Arctic Methane Emergency Group, has predicted up to 7 metres by 2070 based on these feedbacks.
Natalia Shakhova, Igor Semiletov, and Peter Wadhams, scientists that have been in the field on ships and submarines for the past 20 years, predict a 50Gt pule of methane from the ESAS. There is 1700 Gt of methane in the ESAS alone. A release of 50Gt over a few years is not a low probability event. These scientists say it is a high probability event. These are the top scientists in their fields in the world.
Here is a good summary and update of all the positive feedbacks now in play.
http://guymcpherson.com/2014/01/climate-change-summary-and-update/
You are wrong rsilvers, and over the next 20 years you will watch it play out in front of your eyes. (Maybe not sea level but droughts and fires and floods, ice storms in eastern America, increasing refugees looking for food. In fact Syria's crisis has a strong link to climate change, as does the Arab Spring. Wildfires in Russia stopped grain imports to Egypt. Google it.)
As for organic foods, yes they produce less food per acre. Industrial agriculture is required to feed 7+ billion you are correct.
As for Jimmy Carter, if you listened to the top scientist of the day, M King Hubbert, you would know he predicted the world to peak, ie maximum oil production, around year 2000. He has proven correct although he never accounted for shale oils and tarsands which weren't developed at the time because they weren't economically viable at the time.
In fact i doubt that was ever a serious prediction based on the data at the time..look at Exxon Mobil data, they were at peak discovery in the 1960s. They had to have known how long peak production would trail behind peak discovery.
Now if Jimmy was talking about USA oil production..yes they hit peak in the 1970s and if Saudi's and the rest of the world didn't start exporting oil to the USA the USA would be in real trouble producing its own oil today.
Look at that, we discovered, and will soon burn, all the oil in the world. That has to be some sort of accomplishment. Hopefully that Arctic ice melts soon so we can start drilling in the Arctic. Drill baby drill.
nutnspecial
10 MW
Do people realize how much of our understanding is based on theory?
And yet, people claim proof every generation of this crap, while the world goes to hell.
markz
100 TW
Reminds of a saying about the theory Electricity back in the 1930's.
dnmun
1 PW
what do you people think you are doing by coming onto our thread and insulting us?
i cannot insult you like you insult me because now the insiders are threatening me for trying to get you people off of our thread.
this place is totally corrupt. all the insiders stick together and once neptronix demanded he had the right to trash my thread because his personality demands that he acts like that to other people, then he got to ban arkmundi because he was upset with neptronix trashing our thread.
so now all of the insiders are gonna use this place i created for ourselves to discuss this stuff to frock me over by allowing these people with no knowledge of anything to just trash it just like neptronix did. once neptronix demanded the right to trash our thread because he is an insider then all these other people devoted to supporting the republicans decided they could trash me and arkmundi too.
yep, the insiders are gonna remove me so i won't be seeing you guys here anymore.
i never went onto neptronix's 'tutorial' and pointed out how he knew nothing about lithium ion cells and their chemistry. once he said they should be charged to 4.15V then that became the law and everybody had to parrot it even though there is no basis for it. just 'battery university' or some other reference with no basis in science. so now everyone who comes to this board is misinformed and anyone who tries to point out that it is wrong just doesn't deserve to be here.
this is like how the russians corrupted science, lysenkoism, just the insiders know best or you are dead meat. this place is totally corrupt. only for the guys with fancy ebikes that go 100mph or have their own utube channels, just corrupt.
the only good thread in this entire place is the original BMS build thread that richard did or the diagnosis of the slowness of the oscillator on the geared motor controllers that he did.
this subject was stuff i like to discuss but instead the insiders just will use it to frock me over by using all of these proxies for neptronix to trash my stuff. just corrupt, sexist, racist bigoted narrow minded anti scientific group of self congratulatory children with more power than anyone else.
i cannot insult you like you insult me because now the insiders are threatening me for trying to get you people off of our thread.
this place is totally corrupt. all the insiders stick together and once neptronix demanded he had the right to trash my thread because his personality demands that he acts like that to other people, then he got to ban arkmundi because he was upset with neptronix trashing our thread.
so now all of the insiders are gonna use this place i created for ourselves to discuss this stuff to frock me over by allowing these people with no knowledge of anything to just trash it just like neptronix did. once neptronix demanded the right to trash our thread because he is an insider then all these other people devoted to supporting the republicans decided they could trash me and arkmundi too.
yep, the insiders are gonna remove me so i won't be seeing you guys here anymore.
i never went onto neptronix's 'tutorial' and pointed out how he knew nothing about lithium ion cells and their chemistry. once he said they should be charged to 4.15V then that became the law and everybody had to parrot it even though there is no basis for it. just 'battery university' or some other reference with no basis in science. so now everyone who comes to this board is misinformed and anyone who tries to point out that it is wrong just doesn't deserve to be here.
this is like how the russians corrupted science, lysenkoism, just the insiders know best or you are dead meat. this place is totally corrupt. only for the guys with fancy ebikes that go 100mph or have their own utube channels, just corrupt.
the only good thread in this entire place is the original BMS build thread that richard did or the diagnosis of the slowness of the oscillator on the geared motor controllers that he did.
this subject was stuff i like to discuss but instead the insiders just will use it to frock me over by using all of these proxies for neptronix to trash my stuff. just corrupt, sexist, racist bigoted narrow minded anti scientific group of self congratulatory children with more power than anyone else.
nutnspecial
10 MW
Why and how are you insulted by my comments? I even said above that I would gladly request movage of any of my posts that don't meet your criteria, should you offer some. That's more than fair imo, when people generally have the right to say their piece, provided they aren't nasty about it.
Interesting comments on other users (to say the least). I think everyone is pretty cool, but I don't know anything more about others than I've seen writen/said publically on this forum. I respect their views, as I do yours, and my own. Fyi, don't treat people like shite and be respectful, add a touch of rationality, and you won't have any problems. From what I've read on this thread, no one is out to get you, and although some people have voiced disagreement, I still think you've been respected as a person. I'm truly sorry if you feel singled out.
Pointing out perceived flaws is an excellent opportunity, as is having potential ones pointed out TO you. A reasonable and openminded person is the most likely to be open to expand and ammend/correct ideas. If you maintain a level of rationality and civility, why not attempt to correct ideas on-say safe charging limits of lipo, or dare-I-say 'other topics'?
If you're thinking a topic creator should have the right to eliminate all opposing comments/commentors (especially strictly on the grounds they are disliked)- that is a valid idea, but not the way this thing is setup. I cannot disagree it would be really cool to try, where thread creators moderate their own threads under a set of guidelines and higher moderated control, but we have this setting, like it or not. I'm doubtful an unpaid self moderating forum would work so well with the majority of peoples' mindsets.
I mean no disrespect to you, and applaud your efforts. For many, data on climate change is just the tip of the iceberg and could lead to evaluation and attempted understanding of much more.
Interesting comments on other users (to say the least). I think everyone is pretty cool, but I don't know anything more about others than I've seen writen/said publically on this forum. I respect their views, as I do yours, and my own. Fyi, don't treat people like shite and be respectful, add a touch of rationality, and you won't have any problems. From what I've read on this thread, no one is out to get you, and although some people have voiced disagreement, I still think you've been respected as a person. I'm truly sorry if you feel singled out.
Pointing out perceived flaws is an excellent opportunity, as is having potential ones pointed out TO you. A reasonable and openminded person is the most likely to be open to expand and ammend/correct ideas. If you maintain a level of rationality and civility, why not attempt to correct ideas on-say safe charging limits of lipo, or dare-I-say 'other topics'?
If you're thinking a topic creator should have the right to eliminate all opposing comments/commentors (especially strictly on the grounds they are disliked)- that is a valid idea, but not the way this thing is setup. I cannot disagree it would be really cool to try, where thread creators moderate their own threads under a set of guidelines and higher moderated control, but we have this setting, like it or not. I'm doubtful an unpaid self moderating forum would work so well with the majority of peoples' mindsets.
I mean no disrespect to you, and applaud your efforts. For many, data on climate change is just the tip of the iceberg and could lead to evaluation and attempted understanding of much more.
Dauntless
100 TW
http://www.amazon.com/More-Beautiful-Question-Inquiry-Breakthrough/dp/1620401452/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1442290989&sr=8-1&keywords=A+more+beautiful+question
e.e. cummings said:
So I looked up the exact quote online, up it popped starting with a capital 'A.' Did e.e. cummings use capitals? no. little n, little o, no. But if you would like to ask the beautiful question of just which of his poems that is from, I believe it's not a from a poem at all, but the last line of his introduction to one of his collections. Not really a beautiful answer if I'm not sure, eh? (Sigh.) I don't even remember if he used upper case letters in writing that introduction.
Always an amazing moment when someone who loves to question is confronted by one who hates questions. Imagine what my mother had to deal with, now THERE is one who hates questions. She'd have been in for a shock if she'd met up with Fran Peavey, eh? http://www.gettysburg.edu/dotAsset/6b2841ef-2185-4924-888f-bbe0349338ca.pdf
I'll just tell you, Nut that you are, people around here are MOSTLY tolerant of your UNstrategic questioning, in hopes that you'll get the hang of it in awhile. Well, sure is taking a looooong while, isn't it? The only one who is trying to silence you is acting in agreement with Peavey's thought that " Strategic questions are tools of rebellion." Everyone is rebelling against him, eh?
But you don't scream about corruption, threats, getting trashed by "Proxies," "Insiders," etc. because you're not looking to talk that way. I don't actually know if the moderators are ever giving you any warnings, but I doubt it. I could see how they might make suggestions on how to sort out your discussions. But isn't it amazing to hear 'The Dark One' screaming that he is so oppressed, when he is actually cut far too much slack for his oppression of others.
Let me offer up another of the bad things around here. http://www.rightquestion.org The Right Question Institute. (A catalyst for microdemocracy.) These are the people who brought you the question formulation technique. To sum it up quickly they try to teach kids to ask FOCUSED questions and how to tell for themselves if they are.
So the book 'A More Beautiful Question' starts off with a guy waking up in the hospital with no memory of how he lost his foot. (Skiing accident.) He keep asking for a better artificial limb, asking why noone ever offers anything better. Until he realizes that artificial feet were not produced by people who actually used them, and noone thought of amputees as a market waiting for someone to go after it. A few decades later, an Olympic athlete was wearing one of his designs to compete.
What I got out of that chapter was about how demanding he was as he asked and asked and asked of people he already knew had no answers for him. Yet he kept demanding. The difference between the good question and the bad question. I'm afraid I can't give you the really beautiful answer, because I just don't have it. My own thought is that they're innocuous, they'll just suddenly pop up. Oh, the guy made a fortune on his designs.
And dang, I'm no insider, but if I was ready to put up a Youtube channel, I'd have one. No insider requirement. Having a 100mph bike would make it more interesting, nothing corrupt about that. But indeed, if the man with the 100mph bike saw another 100mph build in a manner in which he would NEVER. . . . Well, he might try to explain his misgivings, but mostly he'd congratulate his rival on his success.
Oh, hey, if the whole of Manhattan is so afraid they'll be the last owners, I'm sure I could get some beads together to trade. . . .
Gloop
10 W
funny how climate change became a toxic discussion... :x
If you allow egotistical morons and trolls to post nonsense as facts in a scientific thread that will generally happen.
The internet is turning out to be the ultimate tool for propaganda such is the ever weakening signal to noise ratio.
The internet is turning out to be the ultimate tool for propaganda such is the ever weakening signal to noise ratio.
markz
100 TW
Been like that for a very long time!
Gloop
10 W
They should have started their own thread, "The Climate Change Denial Thread" or something...
r3volved
100 kW
New today from the Nye
[youtube]crOxXrFYTec[/youtube]
[youtube]crOxXrFYTec[/youtube]
LockH
1 PW
LockH
1 PW
Warned of climate catastrophe, Exxon blocks 30 yrs of action:
http://www.theweathernetwork.com/ne...strophe-exxon-blocks-decades-of-action/57311/
http://www.theweathernetwork.com/ne...strophe-exxon-blocks-decades-of-action/57311/