Icharger 3010B 1000W output review

[Doctorbass]

This is the first video of my review of this charger i received last week.

From now i have to say i'm 95% satisfied with it.

This is a video where i show it charging at 990W a limn pack at 24A 41V.

The balancing is very accurate and better than the 10mV accuraci specified. I charged 12 lipo packs with it and out of 12 pack of 6s, the bigger unbalance was 6mV... not bad!

The 5% unsatisfied is about the external discharging resistor load regulation.... you'll see on teh next video.

First video of the review: charging at 990W with a single RC charger

[youtube]ZwS95pEALHg[/youtube]

 

[Doctorbass]

External resistor connection in serie to increase the discharge load capacity.

I got this great 1000W charger this week.
There is only a little thing that i dont understand about the external load resistance. If i connect the calculated resistor for the load i want to have, the charger dont use it and begin using the internal load of max 80W. I had 6s lipo ( 22.2vnominal) that i want to discharge at around 20A.. so that's a 1ohm resistor... but when it start discarging, it only show 4amp...

but when i connect more parallel resistor in parallel while it is already discharging, the current rise... its like the mosfet current regulation thru the software have a problem... or the resistor ohm choice is very narrow...

ex;
22.2V to discharge at 20A need a resistor of around 1.1 ohm and at least 500W. so i've used a 1.3 ohm.. and normally that charger should just allow a maximum current a little under 20A... but in fact.. it just do 4A and use the internal discharge load....

I followed perfecty the way to connect and i understand it... it,s like the discharger is used as a current regulator ...


[youtube]hXP4mJXHsUA[/youtube]

 

[Philistine]

I was amazed to see the power output on this charger. But did you notice that on the HK website review part there were about five different buyers who said that on the first or second charge it burst into flames (one guy said it was 15cm flames). Does it get noticibly hot under use?

 

[Doctorbass]

I was amazed to see the power output on this charger. But did you notice that on the HK website review part there were about five different buyers who said that on the first or second charge it burst into flames (one guy said it was 15cm flames). Does it get noticibly hot under use?

No it dont become hot unless you disable the internal fan in the setting.... not recommended!!

15cm flame is probably due to bad capacitors that puffed..

Here is some pictures of the inside...Yes.. i dissassembled it already....to take a look

 

[karma]

nice gotta love how they think the pcb can apply the proper pressure to cool the ic's doc work your magic :wink:

i liked the charger. but now that i see the inside im not so sure. needs work.

 

[regmeister]

deleted

 

[Doctorbass]

....

.......

...... Dc Input now Shorted!!!

Yes.. It blown.. but no fire.. just my 1500W meanwell that shuted down due to overcurrent of the shorted input of the Icharger...

It happened when i attempted to dishcarge my 10s(37V) LiMn pack with external resistance.

Since the discharge current level did not want to go higher than 80W and still want to use the internal load.. I needed to play with the resistor value that we placein serie with the positive of the charger and the positive of the load.

1 ohm was too high and the load was still 80W.. I tried 2.3 ohm.. and it worked.. but just 17A instead of the 30A i expected......
When i added another 2.3 ohm in parallel... "Tic"..... and it stopped working.. no display, no sound.. nothing....

Yes the pack was at 41V full.. and yes a 1.15 ohm equivalent would make currernt higher than the max 30A.. but i thought it react be fast enough and readjust to the max allowed limit of 30A.. but apparently not.. so now... it's teh input that is shorted.

That make me think that people that say their 3010B bursted in flames... probably had no current limit on the power supply... just like using a 12V car battery... and it bursted in flames instead of cuting and protecting the charger....

Yes that charger dont have ANY fuse!!! no at input.. no at output.. and YES.. i should have added some!.. but i was too tempted to make some torture test and did not pay attention enough!

It remain that this charger SHOULD still be able to draw the current it should on exterrnal dishcharge mode!!!.. I had 41V and 2.3 ohm... and.. it's around 20A right!... but that cahrger still stayed in internal load mod....

This is a problem to solve on that charger!

After everything i succceded to do with this charger I still think this 3010B charger is a very great tool and have alot of usefull function for ebikers battery work and is also very accurate ( i tested with fluke equipment too)


Doc

 

[liveforphysics]

Do not use the external resistor discharge. It sucks on every charger.

Use the regenerative discharge, it totally rocks, and you can use that energy again.

 

[Doctorbass]

But Dont worrie!

i'll find a solution to save it !!

I Wrote to Junsi and read the 200+ pages of the thread about these Icharger on Rcgroups to find a solution but i'm stock now... :|

Fortunatly i have some skill in electronic and also have acces to High end equippment at work!

I decided to check where is exactly the short!

THERMAL IMAGING !!!

At work we build high perfomances IR thermal Bolometric camera for some aerospace and military projects.

I decided to put some limited current to the input and watch the PCB components and traces to see WHERE THE HEAT IS PRODUCED!!!.. helping finding the short!

See the images i took:

 

[karma]

i worked on a another unit where they like to put the full pack voltage threw this little transformer anything over it rated voltage and it shorts :wink: in your case it looks like the n-channel or not

 

[Doctorbass]

tn2 sequence tried with 3A limited power supply

These sequences are 10 sec interval.

we clarely see one of the mosfet becoming hother thqan other and two near the H-bridge hot too but less than the first.

I quick tested the mosfet that is hotest and it have no sing of short :?.. but two others seem to be shorted ( the one that are less hot)

I guess that tyhe les hot are probably short like near supraconductor.. so they dont become as hot as the first..

but what happen with the first!.. it seem no shorted but become hot alot!!

Half shorted.. damaged?

i'll see and if i can replace them with the IRLP3036 i'll do!!! 1.9miliohm!!

 

[Doctorbass]

Do not use the external resistor discharge. It sucks on every charger.

Use the regenerative discharge, it totally rocks, and you can use that energy again.

Yes.. I know.. I already tested that and it work like a charm.. but when all your kWh battery are full and you still want to dishscharge at high power.. what to do!!!!????

Power supply can't be recharged as well...


All my SLA for the home power backup are full....!.. nothing to regen charge!

Doc

 

[karma]

so doc whats up with the charger is it fixable? because i really wanted one :wink:

i spared no expense picked up a $20 charger then modded it :wink:


[youtube]jmgDs9VNwoQ[/youtube]


only pulls 2 amps but it will last. lol youtube damaged my file

 

[Doctorbass]

so doc whats up with the charger is it fixable? because i really wanted one :wink:

i spared no expense picked up a $20 charger then modded it :wink:


[youtube]jmgDs9VNwoQ[/youtube]


only pulls 2 amps but it will last. lol youtube damaged my file

I have put that on hold from now. i'm working on the 36 fets controller

I already replaced one of the shorted mosfet and it power up now. What i dont like is that the mosfet legs are so close to the pcb and the holes and traces are so big than my powerfull solder iron just can't heat enough the legs to unsolser the other blown mosfets...

I plan on repairing it in the next month.. when i'll need it...

now.. I'm working on:

-the 36 fets controller
-the my DYNO for ebike ( up to 20hp)
-and for the future trike ( probably the thyphoon
- the upgrade cor the giant to reack 140kmh this summer.

So .. alot of work to do!

BTW.. big thanks to you for the last Konion video :wink:

Doc

Doc

 

[Spacey]

I'm trying to get my head around using external resistors for discharge, would be nice to have say 4amp discharge rate on my i1010B+ at the moment I am stuck with 0.4amp with a 8Cell pack.

I did buy a multi pack of random 5W resisters but they range from 8R to 150KR so probably not much use.

 

[MitchJi]

Hi Doc,

....
Since the discharge current level did not want to go higher than 80W and still want to use the internal load.. I needed to play with the resistor value that we place in serie with the positive of the charger and the positive of the load.

1 ohm was too high and the load was still 80W.. I tried 2.3 ohm.. and it worked.. but just 17A instead of the 30A i expected......
When i added another 2.3 ohm in parallel... "Tic"..... and it stopped working.. no display, no sound.. nothing....

Yes the pack was at 41V full.. and yes a 1.15 ohm equivalent would make currernt higher than the max 30A.. but i thought it react be fast enough and readjust to the max allowed limit of 30A.. but apparently not.. so now... it's teh input that is shorted.

It remain that this charger SHOULD still be able to draw the current it should on exterrnal dishcharge mode!!!.. I had 41V and 2.3 ohm... and.. it's around 20A right!... but that cahrger still stayed in internal load mod....

This is a problem to solve on that charger!

Did you use resistor values consistent with the recommendations given in these tables, or is Luke correct, that its not reliable?:
Comment on a related thread:

Edit: BTW - thanks for doing this. The Discharge+ feature is one of the primary reasons I bought an iCharger. Knowing the correct & safe way to use it will be extremely useful.

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=839657

iCharger 1010B+, 106B+, 208B, 206B, 306B and 3010B

iCharger Expanded Discharge tool--Spreadsheet posted by Trug, see the Attachment below.
Another table posted by Kgfly to help with designing simple resistor arrays for (nearly) optimal discharge rates, you can play with the resistor power rating to find the best fit. See details in Attachment:

(13.8 KB, 1869 views) Spreadsheet to calculate optimal resistor values for D+ operation and to analyse near-optimal resistor arrays for power dissipation (ExtendedChargeResistorValues.zip)

And here is Trug's blog with an updated version: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=737144

Truglodite's Blog
iCharger Expanded Discharge Spreadsheet - (updated)
iChargerD+1.9.1.zip (97.0 KB, 393 views) iCharger Extended Discharge Tool

 

[MitchJi]

Hi Doc,

Do not use the external resistor discharge. It sucks on every charger.

Use the regenerative discharge, it totally rocks, and you can use that energy again.

Yes.. I know.. I already tested that and it work like a charm.. but when all your kWh battery are full and you still want to dishscharge at high power.. what to do!!!!????

Power supply can't be recharged as well...

All my SLA for the home power backup are full....!.. nothing to regen charge!

Maybe the information (combination of PS and 12V), in the email below, from FMA tech support for Cycling 6s 6.5AH Civic and Insight sticks using this charger will help :
http://www.revolectrix.com/pl8_description_tab.htm

We would really like to, run from a Power Supply, charge at 20A and discharge to an external load at a rate of at least 20A.
40A would be better. In the future discharging 8s Lithium at a rate of at least 10A would be great.

*** You will be cycling 47Wh packs. These are actually pretty small for the PL8.
There are two possible solutions for doing high power cycling.

*** 1) Connect an optima AGM battery to a 12.000V power supply. The 12.000V will keep the optima battery at 50% state of charge. Regenerative discharging/charging will only slightly change the state of charge. You will be able to do full 40A cycling.

*** 2) Connect an 80A 12V power supply to 40A worth of lamp load. This will burn off the regenerative energy in the lamps, while allowing the charger to pull 40A during the charge cycle. The best lamps to use are the basic 6055 dual/high beam lights. They pull 6.5 amps when low and high beam are wired together.

*** I recommend setup #1. Only an Optima AGM style lead acid battery will
work. Setup #2 uses quite a bit more electricity.

 

[bjosta]

ok, I've played around with the external load discharge spreadsheet from above, can someone confirm that I'm not going to burn something down by doing this:
take 4 100w 2.5ohm resistors, put them 2 in parallel 2 in series, giving me a total R of 2.5ohm. This will be used to discharge a 6s lipo at 9.5A
Sounds about right?

 

[Doctorbass]

ok, I've played around with the external load discharge spreadsheet from above, can someone confirm that I'm not going to burn something down by doing this:
take 4 100w 2.5ohm resistors, put them 2 in parallel 2 in series, giving me a total R of 2.5ohm. This will be used to discharge a 6s lipo at 9.5A
Sounds about right?

Sound good :wink:

Doc

 

[bjosta]

Sound good :wink:
Doc

Thank you for the quick reply!