LightningRods mid drive kit

I agree that on the narrower BB sheets there isn't a big leveling effect. A couple of people have insisted that there is but I doubt it. The big advantage of two adjuster screws is splitting the load of supporting the drive in half. With two locked adjuster bolts it's half as apt to move.

I'm not going to stop improving this kit. There is no 2014 model year. It changes month to month, even week to week. I'm not General Motors. As soon as I'm able to make something better, I'm going to.

Maybe this is how David finally ends up slaying Goliath.
 
c'mon everyone if we'll push now at the same time we might be able to get L-R to add another bolt :lol:

i can't agree with this either, i really hate pemanent changes, espcially if i want change reduction sizes. if any drilling is to be done i'll probably do it on the chain size to add another bolt myself. and i'm even nervous about that. i'm for versioning myself but the entire kit. mostly because eventually different people are gonna get different versions of the same part, and it's gonna be hard to tell which version went to which one. i even thought of part number scheme like STD-UPS-092014 (Standard UPper Sheet 09/2014 edition) , or BIG-LOS-112014 (BIG block lower sheet, etc...)

as software developer i know it helps to know the software version you client use to quickly figure what bugs you fixed by then.

as for the pas sensor i don't think it mounts on the dohickey thing, think the magnet ring mounts on it which is then mounted on the chainring. i think there are two of them, one for each bcd, that's why i thought to replace the plastic with the adapter plate.
 
Good job jdevo2004. Nice simple solution. Should work for a lot of people.

Some not bad idea's emaayan, as to pushing though, patience is a virtue, pushing makes you an AH.
There are few good idea's that Mike hasn't incorproated, but its his design. If he doesn't feel right about a mod yet there's usually a good reason and motivation for him to wait before implementing every little thing is I believe because it could be better.

The thing about the GNG kit is that it was a good base from which to start. The thing about Mike's kit is its a GREAT base from which to start where many of the initial issues have been resolved or at least improved.
Making a kit that fits all bikes is very very difficult, that's why turn key solutions are expensive and should be, a lot of work goes into it. There will ALWAYS be changes needed to the kit for each specific application.

I bought the kit because I LIKE to fettle (English term, I think I'm using it in the right context). There will be fettling with this kit to make it work for me on my chosen bike. There's a tonne more fettling required to make my battery fit and for the cover I'd like for that. I'm looking forward to it :)
 
I'm going to try to improve the lower adjuster situation in three ways: (1) I'm going to install larger and better grade hardware in the adjuster slides so that the side plates can be clamped more securely without fear of breaking a bolt (2) I'm going to install two adjuster bolts to double the support that the adjuster provides and (3) the improved upper bracket, in addition to preventing twist in the upper sheets, will also hold the entire motor assembly and reduce it's weight on the lower bracket. If you think about it, the distance between the drive sprocket and driven sprocket can't change without the upper mount moving.

Everything should be sufficiently overkill after this next round of revisions. A torque brace between the upper mount and some solid spot on the frame should make the structure completely rigid. If the torque brace directly counters the pull of the secondary chain line it should also make it impossible for the driver sprocket to move or the chain to become loose.
 
i wonder how much will it cost to order improve the upper ,lower ,sheets ,brace and pulley... i may need to fragment the packages.
 
Hello,

Sorry to interrupt in the middle of a discussion,

Lately I have some clicking noise from the drive system and I wanted to check if it’s coming from the motor magnet, I removed the belt and let the motor spin at max throttle for a few minutes but the motor is working smooth (72V).
The question is if this test should revealed the broken\rubbing magnet issue or should I perform additional test?

Thank you
Rotem
 
Rotems said:
Hello,

Sorry to interrupt in the middle of a discussion,

Lately I have some clicking noise from the drive system and I wanted to check if it’s coming from the motor magnet, I removed the belt and let the motor spin at max throttle for a few minutes but the motor is working smooth (72V).
The question is if this test should revealed the broken\rubbing magnet issue or should I perform additional test?

Thank you
Rotem
Click to expand...

if you referring to jdevo's borken magnets, then it has been revealed he's been running it with wrong wiring matches against the controller check a few posts back.
 
Hi Rotem,

It sounds like it's probably something else. Hook the drive back up and see if you can isolate the noise. There are quite a few moving parts and if something got out of alignment it may be rubbing. There are five bolt heads on the back of the large primary pulley that run close to the adjuster plate behind it. You may even be able to hear the ticking by rotating parts by hand.

This motor is not prone to breaking magnets. Jdevo was having unusual problems because of incorrect phase wiring.
 
i.e if the bolts are THIS close in the belt pulley . not so good.
IMG_20141007_130436.jpg
 
I can hear the clicking only when the motor spins at high speeds or on heavy load, that way I thought it may be the motor.

While turning the belt pulley by hand its turn smoothly so I don’t know what the noise source (as LR said, there are quite a few moving parts).
I will do additional checking and update you.

One thing is good, I don’t need to remove and open the motor again.

Just for update, I’m riding with the bike to work and back (about 22km) and it’s great.
I did few mountain trips as well and it’s totally different feeling of riding.

Although my building thread is not up to date, you can see the building and problems solving process.

I can hear the clicking only when the motor spins at high speeds or on heavy load, that way I thought it may be the motor.
While turning the belt pulley by hand its turn smoothly so I don’t know what the noise source (as LR said, there are quite a few moving parts).
I will do additional checking and update you.
One thing is good, I don’t need to remove and open the motor again.
Just for update, I’m riding with the bike to work and back (about 22km) and it’s great.
I did few mountain trips as well and it’s totally different feeling of riding.
Although my building thread is not up to date, you can see the building and problems solving process.

http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=62142
 
Keep us posted. One old mechanic's trick is to put a screwdriver, socket extension, wood dowel or some other solid object on different parts that may be making noise when bench testing. You're making a stethoscope of sorts to hear inside of the case.
 
it might be possible if the chain is skipping or the belt is skipping.
 
Mike,

Maybe you can design new upper sheets that will make the motor as close as possible to the bike down tube?
Now there is a gap of a few centimeters between the motor to the down tube.
 
Rotems said:
Mike,

Maybe you can design new upper sheets that will make the motor as close as possible to the bike down tube?
Now there is a gap of a few centimeters between the motor to the down tube.
Click to expand...

which downtube? :) there are so many..
 
Hey Mike, I know you are always complaining that you dont have enough work to do so I came up with this plan to give you something to keep you occupied. You keep on saying that it doesnt cost much to throw in an extra design to your metal shop with big orders. Well maybe you could make a design that covers the mid drive like in my picture, of course I am sure you can design something way cooler looking than mine. I think something like this would really make it look more professional, appealing and refined. You can use the same holes that you use for the belt guards on both sides and use off the shelf standoffs (big strong ones) so we can mount and remove the cover easily. I would certainly be interested in buying something like this from you. Maybe other people as well.

25p3k74.png

2vtw0p4.png

m3-x-16mm-f-f-pcb-standoff-10-off.jpg
 
another suggestion regarding the belt pulley, could you include a an external lip preventing the belt from slipping outwards on not just inwards?
 
There are two problems with an external flange. It would have to be cast as a separate part and attached afterward since a double flange wouldn't come out of the mould. Second, the flange would just make it possible for users to run the drive with the sprocket badly misaligned and rubbing the flange.

The reason that the large pulley has an inside flange and the small driver pulley has an outside flange is that they provide limits for each other.

In addition to having a better finish the new large pulley I'm having made (right Joe, you are making it for us aren't you?) will be a couple of millimeters wider to give the belt a bit more 'wandering' room.
 
still sticking with the tractor i see , you know that might eat me up as well when trying to import this to israel.
 
damon said:
Throwing it on the machine tonight... everyone pray to the 3D printing gods that everything goes smoooooth.
Click to expand...

Awesome! I'll say a prayer to the 3D printing gods as well. Do they appreciate human sacrifice?

Oh Emaaaaaayaaaaan.......
 
LightningRods said:
damon said:
Throwing it on the machine tonight... everyone pray to the 3D printing gods that everything goes smoooooth.
Click to expand...

Awesome! I'll say a prayer to the 3D printing gods as well. Do they appreciate human sacrifice?

Oh Emaaaaaayaaaaan.......
Click to expand...

no need for that.. i mean what could POSSIBLY go wrong? :twisted:
 
What Joe is probably concerned about are random voids that sometime appear in 3D prints. A model can print all night and be ruined by a void caused by a booger getting stuck in some part of the printer.

The last model we made a few months back had perfect finish but because the printer uses an optical process and my pulley was at the limit of the build envelope the optics in the printer distorted the pulley from a circle to an oval. It still looks beautiful but when I put it on the lathe and spin it, it looks like the lobe of a camshaft. That wouldn't work so well for running a belt.

This time around we're printing the pulley drum in four pieces and the hub separately. The hub will be trued on the lathe and then the drum assembled onto the hub. Because the smaller drum sections print in the center of the build envelope they should be pretty much perfect.

As long as we don't have a booger.
 
Don't underestimate the Booger....

embed may not work right so here's a link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kDdbg_Q-LMI

One of the best scenes in a movie ever comedy wise :)

Hopefully a little humor injection in this thread doesn't detract too much...if there's objections I'll remove!
 
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