1-track-mind
1 W
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- Jan 8, 2010
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If you were planning on buying a new ebike and then modifying it to climb long hills, what would you buy ?
Total budget for bike and mods=2,000.
Total budget for bike and mods=2,000.
Modifying a new ebike into a climber
- Thread starter 1-track-mind
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Rassy
1 MW
Thats easy for me, but remember that I'll be 70 in March, so one answer doesn't fit everybody. I'd start with a tadpole trike for comfort and add a BOB trailer for the batteries and motor.
Good luck on whatever you decide to do.
Good luck on whatever you decide to do.
dogman dan
1 PW
Long hills or long steep hills. The crystalyte 5300 series motors do well with heat, which is the problem with long steep hills. But the problem with the 5300 motors is the cost of a battery that supplies that much power. The BMC 600 watt is another known hill climber, with 600 watts and internal gears. Again though, long and steep can really heat up a motor.
Most of the other smaller motors still climb ok by my standards. 7% grades or less are doable by most at either 36v or 48v. One of the better climbing direct drive motors is the 9 continent, or Ebikekit 9x7. But you aren't going to haull buns up those hills on the smaller motors. Some people get the idea that the motor does 30 mph means 30 mph up a steep hill and get dissapointed.
Long anything implies lots of battery and lots of money. Sure you don't want to make it $3000? But what do you call long? My ride is 15 miles uphill to get home, climbing 1000 feet of vertical. That's pretty long, but the steep hill part is only about 2 miles. Not so hard to do that, just about any hubmotor and a 15- 20 ah ping. Slow way down and you can do a lot more too, by pedaling more.
Most of the other smaller motors still climb ok by my standards. 7% grades or less are doable by most at either 36v or 48v. One of the better climbing direct drive motors is the 9 continent, or Ebikekit 9x7. But you aren't going to haull buns up those hills on the smaller motors. Some people get the idea that the motor does 30 mph means 30 mph up a steep hill and get dissapointed.
Long anything implies lots of battery and lots of money. Sure you don't want to make it $3000? But what do you call long? My ride is 15 miles uphill to get home, climbing 1000 feet of vertical. That's pretty long, but the steep hill part is only about 2 miles. Not so hard to do that, just about any hubmotor and a 15- 20 ah ping. Slow way down and you can do a lot more too, by pedaling more.
I'd do similar to Rassy, except that I'd have the power on the trike, as front wheel drive (which is how ARTOO is being designed right now).
I don't know if there *is* a trike already on the market that would do what I wanted it to do, but I would guess that it would cost at least double your budget even in unpowered form, and to do it with new parts the way I want to do it would probably double that again.
Mine'll be built out of junk, so that keeps the cost down, but it's not something everyone would want to do.
I don't know if there *is* a trike already on the market that would do what I wanted it to do, but I would guess that it would cost at least double your budget even in unpowered form, and to do it with new parts the way I want to do it would probably double that again.
Mine'll be built out of junk, so that keeps the cost down, but it's not something everyone would want to do.
I'd get a rear version of a 9C 2086 in a 20" rim, power it with a 48V 30A controller and a 48V 30Ah ping battery, and call it good. Depending on the motor temp I'd get in practice (I'd test it and measure it), I might be tempted to drill holes in the motor cover. For long distance(i.e., 25 miles), I'd probably plan on help pedaling up the steeper parts.
This should remain within a $2000 budget.
You could also look at 530x whatever, but that'll require more batteries due to its greater inefficiency, which would increase the price with both the motor and batteries.
Note, this assumes you already have a bike you're looking to convert.
Also, yes, by going slower up the steeper bits, your pedaling contributes to a greater amount of the energy to go up the hill, and so your range is extended.
This should remain within a $2000 budget.
You could also look at 530x whatever, but that'll require more batteries due to its greater inefficiency, which would increase the price with both the motor and batteries.
Note, this assumes you already have a bike you're looking to convert.
Also, yes, by going slower up the steeper bits, your pedaling contributes to a greater amount of the energy to go up the hill, and so your range is extended.
hillbilly
10 W
"If you were planning on buying a new ebike and then modifying it to climb long hills, what would you buy ? Total budget for bike and mods=2,000."
I'd probably buy my bike (though it isn't for sale ) Let me explain:
There are far more hills than level ground where I live, so hill climbing ebikes is my favorite ES topic. I am in awe of the technical info other members offer here on hillclimbing possibilities, with formulas for calculating torque, gearing, watts-per-RPM-per-mile-per-dollar. Just wish I understood it....
I've got under 200 miles on my eTrek conversion, about half of that on gravel logging roads, which means about 100 miles of long steep upgrades, plus most of another 100 miles of paved hills.
Today, for example, I rode 20 miles, including a logging road that ascended quite steeply for close to 2 miles. Based on other hills I've actually measured, I'd say this was easily 8% all the way.
The air temperature was in the 40's, the controller never got above 110F and the motor was barely warm to the touch. Perhaps for the first time I felt that I might be pedaling in what others here call "the sweet spot". I was pedaling fairly strong, but not risking a coronary, and maintaining an uphill speed of about 7-9 mph. (I'm 65 and reasonably fit, weigh 180.) Anything faster than that and I'd shake my teeth out on the washboard surface.
On the paved hill, which is about a mile long and maybe 6%, I easily maintain 12-14 mph.
I'm not an experienced cyclist so I've been conservative in testing this bike against the hills. What my personal experience is telling me so far is that this bike is a lot more capable than I expected.
So, there you have it... but strictly FWIW.
My total investment, by the way, is about $2k, which includes the Trek.
I'd probably buy my bike (though it isn't for sale
) Let me explain:There are far more hills than level ground where I live, so hill climbing ebikes is my favorite ES topic. I am in awe of the technical info other members offer here on hillclimbing possibilities, with formulas for calculating torque, gearing, watts-per-RPM-per-mile-per-dollar. Just wish I understood it....
I've got under 200 miles on my eTrek conversion, about half of that on gravel logging roads, which means about 100 miles of long steep upgrades, plus most of another 100 miles of paved hills.
Today, for example, I rode 20 miles, including a logging road that ascended quite steeply for close to 2 miles. Based on other hills I've actually measured, I'd say this was easily 8% all the way.
The air temperature was in the 40's, the controller never got above 110F and the motor was barely warm to the touch. Perhaps for the first time I felt that I might be pedaling in what others here call "the sweet spot". I was pedaling fairly strong, but not risking a coronary, and maintaining an uphill speed of about 7-9 mph. (I'm 65 and reasonably fit, weigh 180.) Anything faster than that and I'd shake my teeth out on the washboard surface.
On the paved hill, which is about a mile long and maybe 6%, I easily maintain 12-14 mph.
I'm not an experienced cyclist so I've been conservative in testing this bike against the hills. What my personal experience is telling me so far is that this bike is a lot more capable than I expected.
So, there you have it... but strictly FWIW.
My total investment, by the way, is about $2k, which includes the Trek.
docnjoj
1 GW
Agree on the tadpole trike. Americruiser or KMX is about a grand. Use a BMC geared and Ping 20 Ah 48 volts. Total about 2200. Takes a 220 lb guy up any hill up to about 7% or so. Otherwise check out the alloy homebuilt trikes with Superior Aircraft channels and bolts. No TIG necessary. IMHO!
otherDoc
otherDoc
1-track-mind
1 W
- Joined
- Jan 8, 2010
- Messages
- 52
I just wish I understood it too !hillbilly said:"If you were planning on buying a new ebike and then modifying it to climb long hills, what would you buy ? Total budget for bike and mods=2,000."
I'd probably buy my bike (though it isn't for sale
There are far more hills than level ground where I live, so hill climbing ebikes is my favorite ES topic. I am in awe of the technical info other members offer here on hillclimbing possibilities, with formulas for calculating torque, gearing, watts-per-RPM-per-mile-per-dollar. Just wish I understood it....
I've got under 200 miles on my eTrek conversion, about half of that on gravel logging roads, which means about 100 miles of long steep upgrades, plus most of another 100 miles of paved hills.
Today, for example, I rode 20 miles, including a logging road that ascended quite steeply for close to 2 miles. Based on other hills I've actually measured, I'd say this was easily 8% all the way.
The air temperature was in the 40's, the controller never got above 110F and the motor was barely warm to the touch. Perhaps for the first time I felt that I might be pedaling in what others here call "the sweet spot". I was pedaling fairly strong, but not risking a coronary, and maintaining an uphill speed of about 7-9 mph. (I'm 65 and reasonably fit, weigh 180.) Anything faster than that and I'd shake my teeth out on the washboard surface.
On the paved hill, which is about a mile long and maybe 6%, I easily maintain 12-14 mph.
I'm not an experienced cyclist so I've been conservative in testing this bike against the hills. What my personal experience is telling me so far is that this bike is a lot more capable than I expected.
So, there you have it... but strictly FWIW.
My total investment, by the way, is about $2k, which includes the Trek.
There's another guy, NWMTB doing the same thing, riding logging roads around Glacier.
He went with a $279.00 currie electro-drive kit on a MTB. It's probably the cheapest complete kit out there, and he tells me that he has no over-heating issues.
LI-ghtcycle
10 MW
1-track-mind said:
Since you say your modifying a new E-Bike, I guess it really depends on what kind of E-Bike your modding.
Personally, I would start with a bicycle you like and add a geared kit, I prefer the rear wheel kit (especially for hill climbing as the front wheel will tend to get lighter the steeper the hill and thus loose some traction) Amped Bikes, Bafang, BMC and Ezee.
I can't speak to anything in geared motors other than the Amped Bikes 350-450 Watt (don't let that designation fool you, I have been pulling 700 Watts consistantly on the steep stuff) , but I have made my set-up for hill climbing specifically and part of over-all efficiency is going to keeping weight down.
I have a 52.8V, 6.9 AH battery and I am still breaking in the batteries, but I can tell you that I have been able to go 12MPH up a 7% grade for about 1/16 of a mile with no problem, and I have no heat issues at all, not even a warm motor 8) , albeit with an outdoor temperature of 46F.
I will be able to go the full 2 miles up hill that fluctuates between 5% - 7% once I am done cycling my batteries and am sure that they are properly balanced, another thing is the sound, it makes very little and is almost silent until you get past 2/3 throttle, then it has sort-of a "turbine whine" but it's not too loud and wouldn't be heard over wind noise.
1-track-mind
1 W
- Joined
- Jan 8, 2010
- Messages
- 52
Sorry, it's actually NWMTNBKR. Check out the electric part of bikeforums.pwbset said:
Probably this member here:
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=14366
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=14366
dogman dan
1 PW
So you are looking to ride up the rocky mountians? the 9c suggestion is the way to go for keeping the cost reasonable. But hillbillys bike does climb like a bat out o hell. What we don't know yet though, is what climate your hills are in. My rocky mountains will be 95F or hotter in the summer. Both setups will climb, but which one takes the heat best I still don't know since few are sending us good motor temp data. Many just say, it felt warm or hot.
So here's some data, I find that in 80f weather, my motors will climb about 1500' vertical feet of 5-7% grade before they reach 170F where I like to stop heating em. That's about 2 miles or so. Stopping for even short 5 minuite rests really helps the motor cool.
Some go to 200F, but two entire summers riding hard in hot weather up hills tells me that below 170F is absolutely not going to damage the motor.
That's the temp inside the motor. The motors were both aotema, one brushed the other brushless. Preliminary data indicates the 9 continent may climb a bit better, but mine has not been through a new mexico summer yet.
As for the bike itself, put it on the bike you like. Personally, with a horrible back, I like full suspension.
So here's some data, I find that in 80f weather, my motors will climb about 1500' vertical feet of 5-7% grade before they reach 170F where I like to stop heating em. That's about 2 miles or so. Stopping for even short 5 minuite rests really helps the motor cool.
Some go to 200F, but two entire summers riding hard in hot weather up hills tells me that below 170F is absolutely not going to damage the motor.
That's the temp inside the motor. The motors were both aotema, one brushed the other brushless. Preliminary data indicates the 9 continent may climb a bit better, but mine has not been through a new mexico summer yet.
As for the bike itself, put it on the bike you like. Personally, with a horrible back, I like full suspension.
