Unlocking the speed limit on an obscure Chinese scooter brand

[AntoineinArgentina]

Hi,

First post here, didn't find a subforum where to introduce myself so here it goes: French expat in Argentina, bought a brand new e-scooter two days ago.

The model name is Urban Fox X1 (seems quite obscure... likely an underbrand sharing components with other scooters?), 60V, 1500W.

Right now, it's limited to +-50 km/h (31 mi/h), but I think the real speed is even less.

On the right grip, there's the speed selector, with only 3 speeds (I opened this part, only 3 cables are available), while on the tachometer, 4 speeds are displayed.
It's more than likely that this brand an already existing tachometer, but maybe there's a small chance the 4th speed was taken out due to local regulations (?).

I opened the compartment where the cables & controller are. Lots of unused cables, one cable cut (pictures).

I'm really interested in getting a bit more speed (won't be a real problem with the local law enforcement, electric scooters regulations are almost non-existent in Argentina + I'm an experienced biker so no security issue).

Does anyone have a clue about doing so (or not, might be impossible)? I'd even be willing to pay for the right information (would really make a difference for me).
Of course, I know some people install a battery with a slightly higher voltage, but I'd like to keep the parts as they are (except for a modification applied on those preexisting parts).

Posting many pictures, TIA for your knowledge!

 

[RunForTheHills]

Have you considered that there may not be a speed limiter and it is limited by the capabilities of the current controller and battery? Does the power cut off at exactly 50 kph even going downhill? You might be able to get more speed out of it by making it more aerodynamic, such as lowering your riding position and installing a faring. Wind resistance at 50 kph is significant.

 

[amberwolf]

Right now, it's limited to +-50 km/h (31 mi/h), but I think the real speed is even less.

You can measure the actual speed with either a little handlebar speedometer (like for bicycles, scooters, motorcycles, etc) that uses a magnet on a wheel and a frame/fork-mounted sensor. That's best if you want to know the actual speed of the wheel itself, so youc an also test offground.

Or a phone/tablet/etc with any of a number of free GPS speedo apps, if you only care about the speed actually ridden at.


As for limits: if you test the powered wheel off ground, and it reads exactly the same as the fastest speed you can ride on ground, then you have a limit in the controller.

If it's faster off ground, then you're limited by power, which is a battery and controller problem. (and sometimes motor).

On the right grip, there's the speed selector, with only 3 speeds (I opened this part, only 3 cables are available), while on the tachometer, 4 speeds are displayed.
It's more than likely that this brand an already existing tachometer, but maybe there's a small chance the 4th speed was taken out due to local regulations (?).

That's possible. If so, the most practical way around that would be to replace the controller and display**** with a new set that doesn't have a restriction, and that has all of the other features you also want, and also has the same voltage and current limits as your present controller (unless you are also changing the battery for one capable of handling a bigger controller).

It's typically unlikely to find programming software for a controller that would allow access to settings like these, but if you can, that's an option--but most of these don't have much in the way of explanations of what the settings are, and most of them use cryptic and/or poorly-translated terminology (or are completely untranslated, so you'd have to figure out the Chinese).


****Usually displays and controllers are "sets", because there are numerous protocols and such that mean you can't usually just connect any random pair of them and have them work. Even ones that look identical or even have the same names/etc may not work together as expected; different menus or functions may be available on each, or lacking, etc.

Sometiems the displays on scooters/motorcycles are not actually communicating with a display, but are just "dumb" ones that receive analog data from a speedo wire, voltage wire, etc. Some of them read a "speed switch" that is wired to both display and controller. Etc. For these, you can often use the same one with many controllers, but you usually have to figure the wiring out on your own because there's little or no documentation for them.

Does anyone have a clue about doing so (or not, might be impossible)? I'd even be willing to pay for the right information (would really make a difference for me).
Of course, I know some people install a battery with a slightly higher voltage, but I'd like to keep the parts as they are (except for a modification applied on those preexisting parts).

Unless the restriction test above shows it's restricted, there's nothing to do with the existing parts to make it faster. You'd need either higher voltage or a faster wind motor.

Note that upping the battery voltage means replacing the battery and the controller/display. (unless it's all lead-acid batteries, in which case you can just add more of them when you replace the controller with one capable of the higher voltage).


If it's power limited you'd need a bigger controller and battery (if you need a lot more power you'd need a bigger motor, too).

You can use the simulator at ebikes.ca to guesstimate required power for the speed you want under your worst case riding conditions.

 

[AntoineinArgentina]

Have you considered that there may not be a speed limiter and it is limited by the capabilities of the current controller and battery? Does the power cut off at exactly 50 kph even going downhill? You might be able to get more speed out of it by making it more aerodynamic, such as lowering your riding position and installing a faring. Wind resistance at 50 kph is significant.

Thanks for the reply! When I run the engine with the rear wheel in the air, it reaches a stable 58 kph.
When going down a hill, I hit 62/63 kph, so it might be limited by the engine's power, not the controller.

 

[AntoineinArgentina]

You can measure the actual speed with either a little handlebar speedometer (like for bicycles, scooters, motorcycles, etc) that uses a magnet on a wheel and a frame/fork-mounted sensor. That's best if you want to know the actual speed of the wheel itself, so youc an also test offground.

Or a phone/tablet/etc with any of a number of free GPS speedo apps, if you only care about the speed actually ridden at.


As for limits: if you test the powered wheel off ground, and it reads exactly the same as the fastest speed you can ride on ground, then you have a limit in the controller.

If it's faster off ground, then you're limited by power, which is a battery and controller problem. (and sometimes motor).




That's possible. If so, the most practical way around that would be to replace the controller and display**** with a new set that doesn't have a restriction, and that has all of the other features you also want, and also has the same voltage and current limits as your present controller (unless you are also changing the battery for one capable of handling a bigger controller).

It's typically unlikely to find programming software for a controller that would allow access to settings like these, but if you can, that's an option--but most of these don't have much in the way of explanations of what the settings are, and most of them use cryptic and/or poorly-translated terminology (or are completely untranslated, so you'd have to figure out the Chinese).


****Usually displays and controllers are "sets", because there are numerous protocols and such that mean you can't usually just connect any random pair of them and have them work. Even ones that look identical or even have the same names/etc may not work together as expected; different menus or functions may be available on each, or lacking, etc.

Sometiems the displays on scooters/motorcycles are not actually communicating with a display, but are just "dumb" ones that receive analog data from a speedo wire, voltage wire, etc. Some of them read a "speed switch" that is wired to both display and controller. Etc. For these, you can often use the same one with many controllers, but you usually have to figure the wiring out on your own because there's little or no documentation for them.



Unless the restriction test above shows it's restricted, there's nothing to do with the existing parts to make it faster. You'd need either higher voltage or a faster wind motor.

Note that upping the battery voltage means replacing the battery and the controller/display. (unless it's all lead-acid batteries, in which case you can just add more of them when you replace the controller with one capable of the higher voltage).


If it's power limited you'd need a bigger controller and battery (if you need a lot more power you'd need a bigger motor, too).

You can use the simulator at ebikes.ca to guesstimate required power for the speed you want under your worst case riding conditions.

Thanks for the detailed reply!

Hadn't thought about using my phone to measure speed, excellent tip.
With the powered wheel off ground, it reaches a stable speed of 58 kph, while I reach 62/63 kph when going down hill (and 34/35 kph when climbing it up, lol).
Indeed, seems I'll need to go for higher voltage, but I'll leave it as is for now. Speed is decent enough, although I wouldn't mind +10 kph.

Again thank you.

 

[biggerpizza]

It could be the battery, hub motor or motor controller. It's buckets effect.
Most likely, the motor or controller is/are over-rated.
I have the same issue with my robot project at the moment.