what hub motor is this?

[stefanus]

Dear All,

This is my first post. I am growing tired of googling, so I thought I might have luck here.
I have a problem with my ebike.
1. I can't identify what brand of hub motor this is, and
2. why the speedo is not working?
What tools do I need to open the hub?(I mean the hub itself seems to need some hub opening tool?) There are only 3 screws on 1 side. On the other some kind of grooves?
Is the hall sensor faulty? if yes which type should I buy? how many? i don't want ending up buying something that won't fit.

3. I can't also seem to find the controller unit. Is it inside the hub? Can it take 13s 18650 lipo? (48v)

I have ok skills, I have already built a 10s4p 36v extender battery for this bike. (ncr18650bf)

Below an image of the bike: http://www.stellafietsen.nl/wp-content/uploads/elektrische-fiets-vicenza-nero-1.png

I have tried to google the answers, but believe me, I have found no forum of stella owners.

Thanks in advance,
Stefan

 

[ntr]

Stefanus,

If the motor is not labeled, then it could be a Q85 from bmsbattery, or similar. See this post how to open:
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=43420

I guess the controller is in the battery pack.

This document may be helpfull for hall sensor testing:
https://www.ebikes.ca/documents/HallSensorTestingFinal.pdf

This post could be helpfull too:
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=73524

 

[stefanus]

thanks ntr.

do you think hall sensors can be found somewhere? are there many types? I would like to order directly, then open and mount asap.
for example, are these ok? http://www.ebay.de/itm/50PCS-A3144-3144E-OH3144E-HALLEFFEKT-SENSOR-SCHALTET-IN-92UA-3PIN-SIP-2H2Q-/331722123925?hash=item4d3c2dea95:g:3XUAAOSwnH1WXa1i
wdyt?

 

[SlowCo]

How do you know for certain that your motor is the problem or even a hall sensor? Could it be the controller instead? Or just a wiring/connection fault? Describe the problem(s) your having.

 

[amberwolf]

If all you want to do is just fix problems you don't even know for sure exist, you can just order whatever parts you feel like.

If you've already tested your stuff and found exactly what the problem is, tell us about that, so we don't keep trying to help in ways you can't use.

If you want help finding the actual problem and fixing it, which is really the only reason to post here, you need to answer us with the results of your testing that we've suggested, and more details on exactly what your problems and troubleshooting steps have been, and what the results of those are.

Without those answers we can't really help you.

2. why the speedo is not working?

Is it just the speedometer? Does the rest of the system work?

If so, then where does the speedo get it's data? Is it a display that is part of the motor system, or is it a separate bike computer?

How many wires come out of the motor? Assuming the controller is external, then there will be three thicker ones, for the phases, if it's brushless. Two if its' brushed (not likely).

If it is sensorless, then that's all there will be, just three phase wires, unless it contains a speed sensor, in which case there could be two thin wires (for a reed type speed sensor), or three (for a hall type speed sensor). If it's this type, then you simply need to test for a pulsing signal on one of the wires, probably one pulse per wheel rotation (though there could be many pulses per rotation). The other wires would be 5V and ground. Which are which you'll have to measure with your voltmeter. Also, if it's this type, then this sensor could have a problem (usually just connections/wires outside the motor) without affecting system operation other than the speedo.

If it is sensored, there will be at least five thin wires in addition to the three thick phase wires. One will be 5V, one will be ground, and three will be separate hall sensor outputs (one to match each phase). Which are which you'll have to measure with your voltmeter. If it is this type, then a failure of a sensor itself would keep the entire system from working, as well as the speedo.

But because it could be any one of the sensors that is used as the speedo, but usually not directly--it usually goes to the controller first, and then is wired out to the speedo display, meaning you could have a connection failure anywhere after the controller causing your speedo problem *without* causing a system problem.

So you have to check your wiring as well as the sensors.

Personally, I'd check the wiring and connectors *first* because those almost always fail before sensors.

If you don't want to do any of this troubleshooting, there's not much point in any of us replying further.

 

[stefanus]

hey Amberwolf, thanks.
The problem is: the onboard computer is not working, not counting km and not displaying the speed(started to make problems after a long hill-climb). Sometimes it comes to life for a few seconds, and displays faulty data, sometimes it displays correct data.
This is the connector going to the hub motor. Can you tell me how this is called? so i can google where to measure with the multi-meter.

Cheers,

 

[ntr]

If you don't know the brand of the motor, you can't be sure. But this may give you a starting point:
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=58451

It looks like the colors match with this controller:

https://bmsbattery.com/index.php?controller=attachment&id_attachment=19

In this diagram the upper three wires are on the large pins. The wires on the white connector for Motor hall sensor wire go to the smaller pins. White is not in the diagram, but that would be the speed sensor if the motor has a speed sensor build in.

Suppose this is right, then:
1, 5, 7 = motor phase
3, 4, 6 = hall sensors
2 = +5V
9 = GND
8 = speed sensor

 

[stefanus]

thanks, now the speedo works again. Now I have found the controller, and it's ce:g3m20211-1592-16
i found only russian forums on this. will this take 48v? 13s? Does anybody have such a controller? there are plenty of pics on the net. someone says that 1 capacitor states 50v. Is 50v then the limit?
thx

 

[SlowCo]

If the controller has 50V caps you should stay under that voltage with the battery fully charged. A (nominal) 48V battery can be >56V fully charged. 13s LiPo = 13x4.2V = 54.6V and even 12s is just over 50V fully charged. If the FET's can take it you could solder in 63V caps. But then I suggest to just order a more powerful controller.

 

[stefanus]

thanks for your reply. could you share with me a good brand for controllers? that have the 63v caps? also it should be small, since this one is pretty tiny.
http://www.pedelecforum.de/forum/index.php?attachments/controller14a-jpg.15448/

 

[SlowCo]

No experience myself with them but I read good things about Infineon controllers and supplier em3ev on this site.
Those controllers are programmable so can be adjusted to your system and later projects:
http://em3ev.com/store/index.php?route=product/product&path=41_38&product_id=77 for the <60V controller but if you want more you can order the "up to 90V controller" for only 4 dollars more:
http://em3ev.com/store/index.php?route=product/product&path=41_38&product_id=78

If your current system/controller works again and you just want to have a little more torque to climb then a shunt mod could be a good first try:
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=37776

 

[stefanus]

I think my controller is the fault for the speed sensing. I checked all connections, they are fine.
Can someone tell me if the controller can be the issue for the lack of speed sensing? (my speed is regulated by the battery voltage)
Will my speed limit be removed if I replace it with another controller, like the one recommended by Slowco?

thanks,

 

[stefanus]

Ok, after a few months I have succeeded in checking my hall sensors. They work fine. Voltages vary between max 3.42v to 0.02v. However there is another wire in this hall bundle, a white one. it reads 0.26v. So a total of 6 wires.
Still no speed displayed on the sensor. I would mention that the reading came back and forth a few times. It basically died firstly when climbing a mountain
Also meanwhile I hotrodded the bike, I run 14s 58.8v battery. Speed is greatly increased to 33km/h average, 40km/h top. However I worry since I opened up the controller and saw a cap that states 40v another two 25v(default batt was 36v). Am I running on borrowed time here? if replace controller is recommended, who can tell me where to find a tiny controller. This one is like 9x5x3cm in size. I don't want cables hanging out and controllers not fitting their original place.

Cheers,