crystalyte uk for realistic prices

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daveyjones97

10 W
Joined
Dec 7, 2011
Messages
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so i spend 18 months learning about ebikes and anything remotely related in the little spare time i get, decide to just price up clyte 5302 a 40a irfb4110 controller and a cycle anylist. can i get any info on a uk dealer, other than some bloke in his garage, no. so i try europe and everthing seems twice the price! have had a good rummage through the net and not getting anywhere with a clyte uk shop / big dealer. oh and i keep finding threads about 53's being discontinued...
i was wondering what you guys would expect a clyte 5302 or equivelent, irfb4110 controller, throttle and other stuff and a decent c.a to retail for. answers in usd or canadian dollars is fine. if anyone would like to take a guess at postage and customs cost to the uk that would be brilliant too. im not worried about batteries or charger as i have good experience using vapex batteries, including for rc car use so would feel happy knocking up something using those.

i want to pay less than £1000 ($1580ish) for the whole electricals of the project and at this rate i'l be trying to design my own motor and controller again! also i have a motorbike licence and could buy, tax and insure an old trailbike for £1000 and have change.
opinions / advice guys please :cry:
 
Yep, at some point, it's a whole lot cheaper to just buy a honda 125.

I don't know what to say about the motor, except too bad you took 18 months, during which the 5300 clyte went out of production. They are pretty hard to wreck though, so keep a sharp eye on the for sale used section. I'm not sure why you need a 5302, but I assure you if I had the thou, I'd be jumping on this used deal with both feet wearing doc martins.

http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=34447

Hopefully 50+ mph potential will do ya, if fast is why you wanted a 5302. Seems to me like it fits what your are hinting at wanting, and it comes laced for a moped tire. Snooze on it and it's gonna be gone, racers are sniffing already.

If you don't jump this one, at least the controller is easy. Lyens sells international and shipping the small stuff is easy. You might just go get every thing you need from Grin as well, if you are willing to merely go 40 mph. Just grab an HS motor, controller, and CA from them. http://www.ebikes.ca/store/store_nc.php
 
id prefer a 30ish mph tops ebike to a 50mph gas trailbike because you are legally free to go more places and get away with more... as i said in a different post im happy with a bike that has 35mph top speed but i want torque as i will use it off road, especially in summer and it'd need to cope with some short sharp hills without breaking/stalling on anything over 10deg. is it possible to buy a the full electrics minus battery and charger for $1000 before postage?
i already have a bike and a shed full of tools.
 
So for that use, why a 5302? That's the fast winding, usually chosen for race speeds and small diameter rims. Notorious controller blower in a 26" rim.

See this thread, for my solution to a trail bike, 25 mph top speed and climbs like crazy. http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=27364

Unfortunately that motor is not easy to get. But you might be able to source a pretty slow winding version of the 9c motor in europe, due to your kooky street riding laws.

Another good dirt bike motor option may are liking, is the slower winding Mac, from here. http://www.emissions-free.com/

I'm a huge advocate of the slow winding motor using moderate power as a solution for climbing hills, others just do the small rim, huge wattage method, as in the used motor I pointed out. I prefer the slow way, because I only want to fly over the handlebars at 25 mph max. So ripping 40 mph on rugged terrain is not my style.
 
havent read more than the first few lines of the link but its 23:10 here and im tired... that seems exactly what im after, but i'd like it to be able to do 35mph on flat tarmac as everyone drives at 35 in 30 zone here and around town that last few mph would really count getting round large roundabouts and getting from inside to outside lane around town. ive been looking at clyte cos you guys seem to rate it but if theres a reputable manufacturer in the uk you guys know of please reccomend motors and controllers. the more i read the less sure i am i'd be choosing the right components and really cant afford to screw up.
 
just to clarify, the wishlist is 25mph cruise, toruqey as poss and be able to touch but not neccessarily stay at 35mph on flat tarmac, im cool with 35 being the top speed on a full charge, no wind, flat tarmac 25 is about the cruising speed id want. opinions guys, i have no idea what i need :oops:
 
also plan b was to try and find an electric scooter secondhand to adapt and pillage. would that be as bad an idea as it sounds? i know the batteries would probably be junk.
 
So I guess you want to have your cake and eat it too? Go 35mph on the street, but be able to ride slow and in controll on the dirt trails? You don't really get both with a hubmotor. Start looking at stuff that runs a motor through the chain so you can shift into high for the street, and low for the trails. Or are you even talking off road at all? Chances are, the new clyte ht motor would suit your needs fine. Choose the voltage that gets you the top speed you want, likely 72v, such as 20s lipo batteries.

With a hubmotor there are three basic choices.

Build for the hill. it will be relatively slow on the flat, perhaps 30 mph max.
Build for the road. It will climb moderate hills fairly well, and go 30-40 mph depending on the volts.
Build for raw power. It will haul ass on the road, It will haul ass on the trail, but It will have a throttle that feels more like an on off switch, so you better be able to ride well, or crash well. Preferably both. People are having big fun on these bikes, but some go to the E room, having overestimated thier riding skill.
 
my commute on a bicycle looking thing would take shotcuts through a park as well as well as more serious off road in good weather for kicks. dont really want a top speed of less than 30 on road though as that would stop me being able to ride on the road in my local town without getting mown down. with a direct drive id have to overcome motor drag if i tried to pedal above the motors top speed right?
do the guys who use mid mount motors find theyre a lot less efficient and ruin the chain and gears? i assumed they would be a fair bit less efficient but as i dont have $ for gas sportsbike power i might have to look at that.
opinions on parts and motor type please guys. 18 months and im still none the bloody wiser!!! :lol: you guys have experience, i have none.
 
I have just bought an HS3540 laced into a wheel with a 72v controller, throttle and CA from ebike.ca posted to the uk for about £500, i have also bought CA's from a bike shop in the uk. Oh and my motor has had halls added aswell all included in that price, and the ohms measurement of the shunt in the controller is marked up for setting the CA up. What more could you want?
I too have looked around in the uk and there is not a lot available when it comes to big hub motors so just get on ebike.ca and get one ordered, think it came within a week aswell!!

Simon.
 
yep im emailing ebike.ca tommorrow with the spec wish list. just as long as theres a function to limit amps so i cant kill it, and it can get to 30 on flat tarmac thats good enough for me. £500 all in is my kind of deal too, but il be waiting til mid jan so the post services are back to normal
 
Given your real needs, and your additional wants, I'd say build for the actual needs on the street primarily. The street ride, if it has not to slick tires will ride moderate trails just fine. For technical trails you really need to built a bike just for that, unless you go for the throw power at it and hang on approach.

A solid plan would be to select a fast motor such as the HT crystalyte, and a controller able to run 36-72v. Then figure out what voltage to use to go the speed you want, 30 mph is pretty much possible on 48v. This will get you a setup that can get the street work done for sure. This all is assuming you would be running a 26" wheel
 
You need 2 bikes.

Or you need a lot more cash. Otherwise you're just going to be making a lot of compromises

If you go to the simulator on Ebikes.ca, you'll see something impressive. The much cheaper and lighter weight 2805 9c motor makes nearly the same torque as the expensive and heavy Clyte HS3540. 5 lbs torque diffrence off the line with the same top speed.


Use the saved cash to build up a second, off road bike.
 
You want a Mac 500W 10T motor and 50A 12fet controller from cell_man

It's a much smaller motor than the 53xx motor, I got one a month ago and I love it. I'm running it on 44V of lipo / 48V ping battery and I see 25mph top speed and enough torque to climb the steepest of hills that my direct drive hub would die on.

Reasonable price, nice guy and cheap(ish) delivery to the UK. It would be within your budget as well, I use a cycle analyst to limit the amps to 30 just so I don't get thrown off the back when accelerating.
 
thanks nonlineartom, i really like the direct drives efficiency, but im starting to think direct drive isnt suitable for my needs. all and any motor / controller / batt voltage / batt charger reccomendations welcome.
 
Well I used to have a few DD hubs but switched to a geared hub for my everyday commuter, this is my current setup..

Mac 10T motor, at 50V hot off the charger it goes about 25mph, slower than a DD hub but far more hill climbing torque

12fet Cell_man controller, good for about 50 amps but I've limited it to 30 amps max on the cycle analyst which stops it from lurching off the line / flipping over it also means I can run the controller inside the frame bag and it doesn't really get warm, better to run a bigger controller well within it's limits than run a smaller controller within an inch of it's life everyday. The cycle analyst controlls the amp limit but interefing with the throttle, making the handlebar throttle an even more "fly by wire" experience. When setting off it just forces the throttle to back off a bit to keep it at 30A / 1300W but it doesn't effect the top speed because the motor is only pulling 700W or so when at full speed on the flat.

I have a 48V 15ah Ping battery which is really good, but it's more than double the weight of the 44V 10ah LiPo battery so I find myself using LiPo everyday because it fits in the frame bag with the controller keeping it simple. I can also balance charge the whole pack every time using a Turnigy 4 x 6s charger.

I've got it all setup on a no suspension cruiser bike, although it looks very pretty, it's not the most practical with all of yorkshires pot holes.

Going from a 1000W direct drive hub to a geared hub, I won't be going back to direct drive for commuting at least, it's a little louder sure but half the weight, half the size and acceleration is far better, which is important to me with lots of stop starts in traffic lights.
 
p.s I've found geared hubs to be MORE efficient than direct drive. I use noticable less watt hours on my commute using the geared motor than I did on the direct drive hub. Mainly because when leaving traffic lights the direct drive hub would pull 30A straight away but take longer to get up to speed, most of that energy would be wasted as heat, the geared hub leaves the line much quicker meaning the time spent pulling 30A is a lot less. You probably thing there is noticeable energy lost in the gearbox through friction but that's far outweighed by the efficiency of a smaller lighter motor running at higher RPM's through a gearbox.
 
I'd have to agree with that, the 10t mac is a really good motor for somebody with hills, or lots of starts and stops. A too fast winding dd motor would tend to lug more on the starts, creating a bit more heat and taking a few wh/mi more. Depending on the top speeds you want, and how much stopping you expect to do, you may want to choose the faster top speed 8t mac if you go for a gearmotor.

But if the ride is long with very few stops, then a dd would be just as efficient and better able to stand the heat of a really long ride.
 
nonlineartom said:
.....it also means I can run the controller inside the frame bag and it doesn't really get warm, better to run a bigger controller well within it's limits than run a smaller controller within an inch of it's life everyday. ....
Click to expand...

Nonlinertom, what frame bag do you use?

Kudos
 
dogman said:
So I guess you want to have your cake and eat it too? Go 35mph on the street, but be able to ride slow and in controll on the dirt trails? You don't really get both with a hubmotor. Start looking at stuff that runs a motor through the chain so you can shift into high for the street, and low for the trails. Or are you even talking off road at all? Chances are, the new clyte ht motor would suit your needs fine. Choose the voltage that gets you the top speed you want, likely 72v, such as 20s lipo batteries.

With a hubmotor there are three basic choices.

Build for the hill. it will be relatively slow on the flat, perhaps 30 mph max.
Build for the road. It will climb moderate hills fairly well, and go 30-40 mph depending on the volts.
Build for raw power. It will haul ass on the road, It will haul ass on the trail, but It will have a throttle that feels more like an on off switch, so you better be able to ride well, or crash well. Preferably both. People are having big fun on these bikes, but some go to the E room, having overestimated thier riding skill.
Click to expand...

I second that.

I had kind of similar wishes. Not necessarily over 40mph, but good hill climber and capable of raw power. At 74V (84V hot of charger) I get 58kmh flat tarmac. And 74V * 45A = more than 3kW of power. Dont forget to simulate some motors in the sim and read up some experiences from users here before you buy (dogman and 2810/2812 comes to mind).

With your needs, I would suggest the following:
  • ask methods or ebike.ca for a nice quote on a HT3525 DD motor laced in a 26" rear wheel, 7-speed freewheel, throttle, and 2 torque arms. You can also choose to go for a nice torquey 9C 2810. Maybe methods has one as well, as described inthis thread.
  • ask Lyen for a quote on the 6-fet cheap 74V controller (should be around $90), and speed switch. Could ask Methods the same.
  • buy 8 bricks of 5S 5Ah lipos, a charger (iCharger 1010b comes to mind), 6 meters of some good 12 or 10AWG wire, and the connectors to go with it
And build the crazy bike yourself. I did.
 
kudos said:
nonlineartom said:
.....it also means I can run the controller inside the frame bag and it doesn't really get warm, better to run a bigger controller well within it's limits than run a smaller controller within an inch of it's life everyday. ....
Click to expand...

Nonlinertom, what frame bag do you use?

Kudos
Click to expand...


I use the Falcon EV frame bag, fits on my beach cruiser perfectly, also fits in the triangle of my 17" hardtail perfectly even though it's designed for a 19" triangle. It really is a quality bit of work the bag, well thought out and even in a really heavy storm the inside stays bone dry. For my daily commute I carry 4 6s 5000mah Lipo packs for 44V 10AH and the 12fet controller in there just loose. There is more than enough room for the birds nest of cables and they rest in the bag in a way that even the biggest of speed bumps don't endanger the equipment. The Lipo is fastened into two pieces of 100mm rectagular PVC pipe to protect from side impact and chaffing. I could fit 8 packs maximum in the frame bag with the controller or 12 packs if I mounted the controller externally, which you should do for longer rides, my commute is only 20 minutes in cold British weather, I wouldn't want to do a highway blast in Texas with this setup.
 
I might be willing to part with my HS3540 motor and Sensorless Lian 12 Fet 45 amp controller, I am in training for another job and will not be able to use my much loved Greyborg bike.

It is technically capable of 42mph on 16 cell Lipo but does like sitting at 35mph for cruising. Sensorless might suit you more as with the English weather we get hall sensors get ruined pretty quick from water. Had this happen with 2 x 9C motors hence why I went to Sensorless.

I live in Wiltshire UK so would be easy to post....see if you can twist my arm :)

Controller works from 36v to 96v
 
thanks for the replies, just want to make it clear that i wont be able to buy a new/high spec ebike kit until the end of jan 12 at the earliest, sorry for not stating that sooner. anyone is welcome to offer parts so i can get a feel for prices, but i have a mortgage, kids, its xmas and the uk is all but in recession.
i dont want to annoy people by fronting like i have a wallet full of cash ready to go, because i definately dont (the missus nicked it for xmas pressies) :roll: just after advice on specs and value for money as i cant afford to screw up. anyone looking to sell in a few months feel free to tell me. thanks
 
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