New Member Saying Hello

[TotalConfusion]

Hi everyone,
Ide just like to introduce myself, im Wayne and for the past 2 months ive been thinking of selling my Ktm 300 and building myself an ebike. I came across the page Electricbike.com which i have read alot of it and hence why i am on here, Im a Sparky by trade "House hold Electrician with a bit of PLC Control work Experience" but have never liked DC but i guess that has to change.
I have been reading articals on ES for nearly 3 weeks now which isnt long but im currently bored and on holidays so i have read alot for my needs.
My goal is to build an Ebike for general off road use using a Specialized Big Hit Dual Suspension Bike,
Im not looking for a speed machine Compared to most but if i can get close to 60km/h top speed ill be happy as most of my riding will be in the 20 to 35km/h range in the bush" Fire Trails Mainly".
Im 41 yrs old so not looking to take the bike off massive jumps but more like riding tight single trails and going over a few logs and trees would be it, As for hill climbing ability we do have some steep hills around the Ourimbah State Forest but only foot hills and nothing too big but short and steep.
What im having troubles with is deciding which motor i need for my requirments, As i have said i have read alot and used the Simulator and was considering the smaller 35T motors belonging to Crystalite but im sure i read somewhere the new models have weak axles?

My hardest problem is deciding if i want a 36V system with 2 x 20 Amp Batteries so i can switch to 72 volt or an over powered 48V system. Im looking to stay under the $2500AU mark if possible. lol

Anyway that is me in short, I look forward to this site very much and getting to know some of its members.


What can i say but this is the best Forum ive ever come across.

Wayne

 

[efMX Trials Electric Freeride]

welcome to the forum Wayne,

why are you selling the ktm???
my advice is to build your ebike first..
then only sell the ktm if it remains unused
because your new custom built ebike is sooo awesome..
but that will not be an easy task...
and it will not be cheap either.
have you test rode any ebikes yet???
to build something comparable to stealth power & performance
you will likely need to at least double your budget.. ???
and then it will only be a fraction of the ktm power range etc..
but it will be quiet..
maybe that is what your after???
best luck, keep us updated... 8)

 

[TotalConfusion]

Thanks efMx
In Short the Ktm has to go due to finances, My Partner has had a work accident and she can not look after herself so ive had to quit my job to look after her. We have sold the car and moved closer to a Shopping Centre for convienience.
Not looking for something like the Stealth in strength or performance but if i can build a bike to get me around the 30mph mark at most and not brake if i jump a gutter or something like it ill be more than happy as 75% of my riding will be on Paths or the road with about 20% on fire trails and 5% will be on single lane tracks in the bush so ill be more than happy to pick it up over the logs if need be.
Its by far not ment to replace the ktm but more to let me get around when i need too, Because of our situation i dont get out much but lately ive been doing alot of cycling when i can.
Yes i have ridden an ebike before only last week though, it was a folding bike with a 250watt Pas sensored motor with no throttle, i went into my lbs to get some prices for a double wall 24inch rim and when they found out what i was going to do they got a bike from out the back ffor me to go for a ride on it.
I liked very much

 

[dogman dan]

Welcome to the sphere. If you haven't seen Mad Rhino's bikes, search them up. He rides bikes that do about what you want to have happen.

However, there's some money involved there. My approach is a bit different and on a tighter budget. The short explanation is that hubmotors have to spin at a certain minimum rpm when loaded down climbing hills. Too slow, and the motor melts. If you have money for big power (huge motor), you can just run so many watts you fly up the hill. On less money, a motor with a slower minimum rpm allows climbing the hills at 10 mph with less expensive motors and less watts.


Rather than heave huge power at it and do everything, I let the top speed go and still get up the steep hills on a more affordable set up. If I run 72v, I can still have 30 mph. If I run 40 amps of 72v, that's 3000w, and a bit much for the motor. But it will tolerate it long enough in cold weather to do some fun riding for 30-40 min at a time. Ideally, you limit watts with the smaller 28mm magnet motors to 1500, or 2000w max. Often you do that limiting just by going slower even at max throttle. On the flat, 30 mph takes only 1000w. So no worries if you aren't on a steep hill.

My approach involves choosing the slower motors. It could be the HT clyte, but I got even cheaper deals on the 28mm direct drive motors of the 9 continent brand, or similar motors from other factories. EM3ev is the guy that has these motors right now.

You can save some money by starting out with 48v, but 36v will never be fast enough with the slow windings. So if you go with the slow winding motor, look for a controller that can do 48-72v. You will want 72v later.

 

[beast775]

Hello total confusion,there is quite a few mid drives to look into also.72v= fun-36v .

 

[TotalConfusion]

Welcome to the sphere. If you haven't seen Mad Rhino's bikes, search them up. He rides bikes that do about what you want to have happen.

However, there's some money involved there. My approach is a bit different and on a tighter budget. The short explanation is that hubmotors have to spin at a certain minimum rpm when loaded down climbing hills. Too slow, and the motor melts. If you have money for big power (huge motor), you can just run so many watts you fly up the hill. On less money, a motor with a slower minimum rpm allows climbing the hills at 10 mph with less expensive motors and less watts.


Rather than heave huge power at it and do everything, I let the top speed go and still get up the steep hills on a more affordable set up. If I run 72v, I can still have 30 mph. If I run 40 amps of 72v, that's 3000w, and a bit much for the motor. But it will tolerate it long enough in cold weather to do some fun riding for 30-40 min at a time. Ideally, you limit watts with the smaller 28mm magnet motors to 1500, or 2000w max. Often you do that limiting just by going slower even at max throttle. On the flat, 30 mph takes only 1000w. So no worries if you aren't on a steep hill.

My approach involves choosing the slower motors. It could be the HT clyte, but I got even cheaper deals on the 28mm direct drive motors of the 9 continent brand, or similar motors from other factories. EM3ev is the guy that has these motors right now.

You can save some money by starting out with 48v, but 36v will never be fast enough with the slow windings. So if you go with the slow winding motor, look for a controller that can do 48-72v. You will want 72v later.

Hi Dogman
i understand what your saying and no i dont wish to burn the motor out which is why i have been doing a lot of reading without asking too many questions for now, when i say alot i mean 4 to 6 hours on ES a day for the last 3 weeks just learning and understanding what not to do.Thinking of going a 24 inch rim aswell which should give me a tiny little bit more torque for the hills also.

The actual motor i was looking at was the Clyte HT3525 or i seen a larger HT40 series Clyte? but didnt read too much about it but so far im leaning towards the HT3525 with one of Lyens 12 FET model EC-124110 12 FET controllers set at 45amps with a V3 to limit most of my riding Amps to 20 as my off road will only be every 2nd weekend and its pretty flat around here so i wont need it on tap all the time.
As for Batteries im looking at buying 16 Turnigy nano-tech 4000mah 4S 25~50C Lipo Packs and running them in "Lets hope i get this right" S & P to get a total of 59.2V x 16Amps but im not sure if im better of having a 59V4A x4 packs = 100C rating & 16A total or 59V8A x2 packs = 50C i think ? and so on, This is where i get a little confused with the batteries.
I know the difference in Series and parallel where S = more V's & P = more A's but im a visual person and design and creativeness isnt me, I need them in front of me to work it out
I believe the Batteries in a 16S config is 59.2 nominal charge but when fully charged thats 66Volts and i think more than enough for my needs if thats correct.

9C motors i have read are good but little things i have read have kept me away like the rear disk space and i have Hayes hydraulics brakes and quaulity of finish but that is all, not much but just little things i guess so i have kept reading about the Clyte motors more.



Beast775, Thanks for the Welcome & Yes Mid drives are very nice but this is my 1st build so i wish for a rear Direct drive for my 1st ebike, The Rocha Mountain Drive System "sexy drive i think" will be my 2nd if i can get hold of one with a 3210 motor.

 

[dogman dan]

Sounds like a pretty good plan. The clyte motors can take just a bit more than the cheaper 28mm motors. I don't think you will need to limit your amps much in daily riding unless you go for higher voltage.

Hard to explain it completely in a sentence. Basicly, at 60v or less, the motor will reach a cruise speed that will not require so many amps. So at that speed, the motor will simply not pull too many amps. If you increase voltage more, the faster speed will require more amps, and might overheat the motor. This is what happens when you put 72v into a 9 c motor. With 72v in a medium fast winding, you reach close to 40 mph, and that draws enough amps to start overheating the motor if the ride exceeds 10 miles at full speed. If you run lots of voltage, then you might choose to limit amps, or just use less throttle and keep the speed at 30 mph or less.

So if you run 16s, you will not likely be overheating anything unless you climb steep hills. The choice of the HT will help it climb hills a bit cooler than an HS would.

Re 16s. actually that is a bit of an awkward voltage. Fully charged, that's 67v. Typical 48v controllers can burn out if run above 63v. Many 72v controllers have the low voltage cutoff set to about 60v. However, there are controllers that can run 36-72v. So one of those would be best for 16s.

But if you wish to start out with a less expensive 48v controller, 14s works fine with them. Or drop to 12s, which still works with typical 48v controller settings.

The way I'd wire batteries for 15 ah, would be to make parallel connections first. So three 5 ah packs connected parallel for each 15 ah section. Then make series connections to run the bike at the desired voltage. This would allow flexibility if you have a 36-72v controller. One day 12s, another 16s, depending on your needs. 20s later perhaps.

 

[thewmatusmoloki]

Hey TotalConfusion, welcome to the forum.

Just wanted to add that if you can get hold of one of the h40 (h40-60, h40-65) series motors, you would be doing yourself a favor.
I've seen them in action and they are far superior to the ht/hs35 series, they can take more watts, have dynamic acceleration (if fed correctly), but do have certain faults such as the cover bolts loosening, just need to locktite them in if you get one.

Cheers

 

[TotalConfusion]

Yes im starting to read a little more dogman and im thinking 18s is the go because of the low voltage cut off. My main concern now is who is safe to purchase from as i have read alot of people have had problems with ordering and alot of the good shops like The Grin dont have stock atm of what im after, this is what i think im going for after reading alot,Its a Clyte H40T from ebikessf.com, they seem to be strong enough for what im looking for and as far as strength and Quality, ill be pulling it apart for my mate as he wants to have a look as he owns a motor rewind shop called West Gosford Rewinds and when i told him his eyes lit up and he said i could be interested in this, do they have races, lol
Anyway as i said need to make sure im going to buy from a company im not going to get ripped off by.

Thanks for the welcome thewmatusmoloki