Seattle Bikepath Muggings

[TylerDurden]

FYI on the bear-spray (capsaicin):

range: 20'
firings: >50 @ 2sec. burst
cost: <$40/ canister

Non-lethally works on dogs, cougars, muggers, gangs and oddly enough... bears.

 

[Mark_A_W]

What is this? The wild west? It's another world.

Do some of you actually own guns? I've barely even seen a gun. Why? Because it's basically SAFE where I live.


If you need a weapon to feel safe, then your society is BROKEN.

Fix your society first.

 

[set]

What is this? The wild west? It's another world.

Do some of you actually own guns? I've barely even seen a gun. Why? Because it's basically SAFE where I live.


If you need a weapon to feel safe, then your society is BROKEN.

Fix your society first.

I'd rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it.

 

[Mark_A_W]

That's the point.

In a civilised society you don't need it.

 

[Almasi]

That's the point.

In a civilised society you don't need it.

I agree with that...in Montreal if you ride fast and don't go in that worst place, stay in the center of the city, you don't need weapon....but I'm sure that a lot of big city in the USA need a weapon (which is not a great thing).

The worst I would ever carry is a home made tazer, small flash bomb or pepper spray.

Robin

 

[set]

This argument can go on forever. There is a myth that more guns equal more crime but that is not true. Kennesaw, GA had a very high crime rate. It got so bad that there had to be a mandate that require there be one gun in every home. Crime rate plummet to almost nothing (.19%). New Hampshire is among safest states in the country and there are many people practicing open carry. Yes, it is legal to open carry a firearm in NH. Fact is, a would-be "bad guy" would be less likely to mess with someone that they know can protect themselves. It's definitely interesting to think about. You can't always trust people. I'd like to think that everyone is a good person and no harm will come my way. Fortunately, I live in reality and bad things do happen. Think of it as insurance. You never wish it happens to you but when it does, you're glad you have it.

 

[dogman dan]

Heh Heh.... Billy the kid was jailed about a mile from where I work, Pat Garret was murdered in an arroyo about a mile from my house, so yeah, I guess you could say it's the wild wild west. Juarez Mexico is about 40 miles away, and on a good day, only about 6 murders in the drug war going on there for the last 2 years. On a bad day, they shoot up some children. Almost 3000 murders there last year. BTW, guns are absolutely illegal in Mexico. Here, where the gun can be worn on the hip anywhere, there is about one murder a month or less, unless you count the ones who make it across the bridge from mexico and die in the US. HMMM. I wonder what's better, guns or no guns.

 

[vanilla ice]

I've lived in a big US city all my life. I've never needed a gun. But I have one. If I never use it whats the difference to anybody else? For me it covers those long 5 minutes it takes for the cops to get to me and my family. Thats all..

 

[BothellBob]

May I suggest that getting firearm (or firearm legal) advice from an e-bike forum is about as reliable as gettting that education from movies, tv cop dramas, or the six o'clock news? Read something like Gary Kleck's study on Defensive Gun Uses, or John Lott's study on the correlation between violent crime and ease of CCW.

But do be aware that, as found on The Snubnose Files:

...Smith and Wesson introduced the Safety Hammerless .38 S&W in 1887. This gun was often called The Lemon Squeezer because it had a grip safety on the back strap. One had to squeeze the grip in order to fire the gun. In 1888 they produced a few of the .32 S&W Safety Hammerless pistols with 2 barrels. It was nicknamed the Bicycle Gun and may be S&Ws first production snubnose, but the Bicycle Gun is very rare. ...

-BothellBob - BG Trailrider of the electrified RANS Stratus

 

[swbluto]

But, Bothell, who needs schmegal legal advice when you have one of these?

 

[kazbluesky]

Here in Japan all the police have guns but only 1 in 10 of them have bullets in the gun - I kind of like that . It seems to me that there is a critical mass thing going on here, if enough criminals have guns then we all need them for sure. But if our governments prevent the bad guys from getting access to them then they are not necessary at all. I'm English, we don't have a gun culture, but I was a member of the pistol club at university - I love using guns. Yet after the Dunblane massacre in Scotland I agreed with the government to getting rid of these deadly things. It is just too easy to pull a trigger and reach out a long way. The sound of the firing is a rush too I think and masks the messy obscenity of what is really happening. No way that that scumbag could have caused the same tragedy if he could only have gotten hold of a knife.

 

[MidniteTweeker]

When seconds count, the police are only minutes away.

MT

 

[graevus]

I drove a taxi at night in downtown Seattle for the entire 1990's, and yes there are some very dangerous people in big American cities. In ten years i was never successfully robbed, couple times a year someone would try though. What worked for me was the physiological thing; you have to think like a mugger. A mugger, like any predator, wants an easy meal. If you don’t look or act like an easy meal he will seek another elsewhere most of the time; that is the trick. Pride will get you killed or locked up forever, the only time you should resort to lethal force is when you can’t get away, or when you are protecting someone who can’t get away. Try not to get pissed off, it clouds your judgment. One simple trick that worked was to scratch your left underarm under your large jacket with your right hand while giving them a look like you have your hand on a gun. Who will start crap with someone holding a piece? No-one ever called me on that bluff. Acting pissed off and crazy helps as well.

I once used this method on two scary guys in the CD at 3Am, and i saw one look at the other and shake his head no in the rearview. They paid the $4 and found someone else to rob.

As far as weapons go, the more the merrier; i had my own bat-utility belt by the end. Knife, mace, gun, brass knucks, asp. I recommend the Asp in particular; do a search for the asp baton. It’s a telescoping big ass steel stick that is a surprise to the mugger when whipped out properly. Whack, whack, whack, the fight is over and no-one dies. Never pull it out on more than 1-2 attackers, they can get it away from you and that will be a problem. Mace sucks, i used it once without considering the wind and we both got it. The civilian stuff just makes it difficult to open your eyes for about 5 min, hardly much when the opponent is enraged. Fighting blind was a drag.

i knew a guy who got robbed at gunpoint, and then as the crook was leaving the driver pulled his gun and killed him. A cop saw the whole thing and he went down for murder 2, ten years i heard. A gun is your only real defense against more than two opponents though, fire a warning shot if you have time, they usually run away, unless they are strapped, and then you have bigger problems. Learn how to properly use your weapons, wades gun range in Bellevue is the closest to the city, next is the Bothell range i forget the name of. Until you put at least 500-1000 rounds through your piece you have no business pulling it out in danger.

Anyway, that’s how i survived ten years of picking up hitchhikers for a living, four people I knew did not, and a few were maimed for life. Coming home alive should always be your biggest priority.

 

[swbluto]

Holy crap. What kind of lifestyle do you live?!

Granted, I've only been in Seattle for 3 months, so I may not have been here enough time but it seems making sure you're not outside after 11 P.M. has worked well for me so far. That and I don't pick up hitchhikers(Not that I recall seeing that many when I was driving.).

 

[graevus]

well, oddly enough i currently am an electrical engineer working at boeing. Sometimes you gotta just change your life, that sort of crap makes you mean after a while...

 

[Dee Jay]

Almost got mugged at the electronics district. I dropped by for some supplies after seeing my family off two stations away. I still had a baby stroller with me which I planned to lock up to a post by the station.

It was a holiday so the place was just packed with shoppers.

As I locked the stroller, I felt I was being watched. Without turning my head I looked to my left and some guy wearing a dust mask was standing suspiciously close to me. At first it seemed like he was trying to decide which way to go, but when I stooped over to lock the stroller, I took a quick glance in such an odd timing and odd position that I caught him looking at me. He seemed to be sizing me up.. maybe it was the bulge in my pants.. wallet . get your mind outta da gutter. :lol:

I wasn't worried about the stroller so I left it and shopped at the nearest electronic parts stalls. Got my fuse holders, fuses, and analog voltmeter.

Then I walked a few blocks to a convenience store to use an ATM. One guy was using the ATM and no one else in line except me. He looked at me as he took his money out of the machine. Couldn't blame him as I've read about so many muggings in the district lately

My turn. Slid the card in. Entered the PIN but the PIN was "incorrect". I hadn't used that card in over a year...Took the card back and paused for a moment when I heard two other young men waiting behind me. Took a quick glance, they didn't seem to dress like thugs. I slid the card back in for another try, again wrong PIN. Took the card out and stepped aside to let the guys use it. I just stood there trying to recall if I had changed the PIN and another guy walked in to use the ATM. Now at this point the two other guys still haven't even started using the machine, but they let the guy who just walked in use it, then they both walked out of the store.

My guess is that they were going to grab my money as soon as the machine opened up and run for it, and the first guy with the mask by the station was their scout looking for victims.

Most Japanese shoppers walk in packs, most of them teens obsessed with toys and games. Then you got tourists. Then there are the kebab addicts wearing headphones walking by himself.

Watch your backs people.

J

 

[JinbaIttai]

May I suggest that getting firearm (or firearm legal) advice from an e-bike forum is about as reliable as gettting that education from movies, tv cop dramas, or the six o'clock news?

You have a good point, however, the kind of people that are compelled to something as non-conventional as putting a motor on their bicycle for transportation; those kinds of people tend to have exposure to facets of life you won't see on TV.

That being said, I think most US citizens have forgotten that owning guns never really was about protecting citizens from the tyranny of street thugs, although that is a huge benefit. It is about protecting US citizens from any future tyranny from the US government.

 

[dazzassj6]

this is what i understand about how criminals vs citizens work with a gun.

Most of you say u wouldnt bring a gun into a robbery because it maybe too much.

The thing is, if you are trained in using guns, you should carry one anyways.

REason being is most of the time, you are just using it to threaten (overpower) that person's force. They dont expect you law abiding citizens to carry guns, so they might pull a gun or knife on you.

Even having a replica pellet gun, would do the job. You dont have to shoot at all. IT is for protection, and you will only shoot if they attack. Most of the time they wont attack if they only have a knife or lesser force.

Be it a real gun or not, you should use it, in case they overpower you in terms of force.

all hail the 2nd ammendment and the US constitution!

i'm australian by the way, no guns for us =(

That being said, I think most US citizens have forgotten that owning guns never really was about protecting citizens from the tyranny of street thugs, although that is a huge benefit. It is about protecting US citizens from any future tyranny from the US government.

omg i totally agree with you there! The founding fathers gave us guns, not because they wanted us to hunt, but to become an immediate militia in case the government turns tyranical again...Because they know no military government can stop a force of millions of armed citizens.

 

[liveforphysics]

I have a whole host of pistols, shotguns, and rifles.

I use them as tools for entertainment, by punching holes in paper or cans from a distance when in safe areas to do so. Tons of practice shooting cans as they jump and roll around. It's loud and dirty and fun, and I enjoy it.

I always keep a pistol on me (somtimes two) when I head out to street race, or when I'm on my motorcycles, or when I'm doing any large cash transaction deals.
I got jumped once. Broke my jaw, front teeth (I have ceramic ones now), eye socket, cut my scalp down to the skull with something, permantely damaged vison in my right eye. It was a bummer, but I'm fine now. Wasn't as bad as some of the motorcycle wrecks, but it did seem like a lot of un-needed beating on my face, and ceramic teeth and all the stitches cost me way more than what they stole, I had no insurance at the time. What doesn't kill you only makes you stronger.

 

[kazbluesky]

America is wonderful country in many ways - scary in the same measure too though. Saying that, England has it's problems too.