Sport EV & delivery EV

C

CroDriver

100 W
Joined
Jun 11, 2009
Messages
167
Location
Croatia
Hi.

I'm a newbie on this forum but I'm active in some other EV forums.

I intended to build one middle size AC delivery truck and a very powerful DC sports car.

The Mazda RX-8 will be the donor car for the DC conversion. I will purchase the car probably next week.




The batteries will get into the trunk:



(111X ThunderSky 100Ah - 355 V; 35kWh; 10C pulse)

I'm still not sure which car to use for the AC set-up but it will be something like this:



Any thoughts and suggestions are welcome.

Greets from Croatia! :D
 
wow good luck on your project, what are you going to do about the power steering ?
 
I think groups of battery cells need to be strapped with end plates and steel straps to keep sides from swelling
 
nutsandvolts said:
You're doing an rx8 conversion? Cool. I just bought my third rx7, this time the first one available from 79, and the more I think about it, the more this car seems like it's a good candidate for electric. It has no power steering, no power windows, no power mirrors, no power door locks, not much power anything except antenna. It would probably be easy to convert, although there isn't much space for batteries. The thing about converting these types of cars: how to maintain good weight balance for handling, since what makes the cars handle so well is the placement of the engine, such that the weight is centered behind the front axle. It seems that if you don't achieve the same weight distribution when placing motor and batteries, then you'll lose the signature great handling.
Click to expand...

I won't have any gearbox in the RX-8 so I think that the double Kostov will fit in the gearbox tunnel. I think that there will be enough space to put some batteries under the hood to get a good weight distribution.

JPALA said:
wow good luck on your project, what are you going to do about the power steering ?
Click to expand...

I bought a electric power steering pump from a Toyota MR2.

Look at the list at the top of my first post. There are all parts listed.

There have been some changes since my first post. I decided to use the ThunderSkys for the Van. For the RX-8 I decided to build a battery pack out of A123 cells.
 
Puppyjump said:
I think groups of battery cells need to be strapped with end plates and steel straps to keep sides from swelling
Click to expand...

IIRC, at the last Phoenix EAA meeting we watched some film of a guy who used Thudersky cells in an old Porsche 356 - He had strapped the cells into 4-cell blocks with spacers between them (on the ends) to ACCOMODATE the swelling. They were mechanically solid, but had gaps to allow the cells to swell a little (which they would do under high current applications).

This is the guy:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQsng9F0npQ but i'm not sure which of his youtube videos he shows his spaced cells.
 
CroDriver said:
There have been some changes since my first post. I decided to use the ThunderSkys for the Van. For the RX-8 I decided to build a battery pack out of A123 cells.
Click to expand...

est. kWh nao
 
CroDriver, I am interested in the two-motor configuration for several reasons. In your application, the long/thin motor-set might fit where the stock transmission was located, which frees up the entire front bay to position half the battery in any way you desire.

If one motor is damaged, the second motor might provide a limp-home mode.

Also, it is well-known that it takes twice as much power to accellerate than to to maintain speed at cruise-power setting. During cruise mode, a single motor of adequate acceleration size may be operating at its continuous rating, and running very cool. However a motor that large might draw more amps than neccesary, leading to less range than might be possible. By using two motors for accelleration, and only one motor for cruise...it might provide both a pleasing accelleration, and the best possible range.

Will one of the motors idle at cruise speed? and if yes, would it cause some drag on the working motor?
 
spinningmagnets said:
CroDriver, I am interested in the two-motor configuration for several reasons. In your application, the long/thin motor-set might fit where the stock transmission was located, which frees up the entire front bay to position half the battery in any way you desire.

If one motor is damaged, the second motor might provide a limp-home mode.

Also, it is well-known that it takes twice as much power to accellerate than to to maintain speed at cruise-power setting. During cruise mode, a single motor of adequate acceleration size may be operating at its continuous rating, and running very cool. However a motor that large might draw more amps than neccesary, leading to less range than might be possible. By using two motors for accelleration, and only one motor for cruise...it might provide both a pleasing accelleration, and the best possible range.

Will one of the motors idle at cruise speed? and if yes, would it cause some drag on the working motor?
Click to expand...

I didn't thought about that since performance is my primary goal but this sounds very interesting. I don't know what would happen if only one motor gets "juice" and the other is turning with him.

I would have to make some switch since both motors will get the power from only one controller (Zilla).

Btw. Here is a picture from the factory where the motors are being produced.




A few more weeks for assembling and testing and then it goes straight to Croatia :mrgreen:

Link said:
CroDriver said:
There have been some changes since my first post. I decided to use the ThunderSkys for the Van. For the RX-8 I decided to build a battery pack out of A123 cells.
Click to expand...

est. kWh nao
Click to expand...

Let's say 15kWh for the beginning to make some experience with the cells. Later maybe 40-50.

mrgarci1 said:
Puppyjump said:
I think groups of battery cells need to be strapped with end plates and steel straps to keep sides from swelling
Click to expand...

IIRC, at the last Phoenix EAA meeting we watched some film of a guy who used Thudersky cells in an old Porsche 356 - He had strapped the cells into 4-cell blocks with spacers between them (on the ends) to ACCOMODATE the swelling. They were mechanically solid, but had gaps to allow the cells to swell a little (which they would do under high current applications).

This is the guy:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQsng9F0npQ but i'm not sure which of his youtube videos he shows his spaced cells.
Click to expand...

Great info. Thanks!! :wink:
 
CroDriver said:
Let's say 15kWh for the beginning to make some experience with the cells. Later maybe 40-50.
Click to expand...

$_$

Doesn't help that I have all of about $8 available to me until next friday, either. :(

CroDriver said:
I didn't thought about that since performance is my primary goal but this sounds very interesting. I don't know what would happen if only one motor gets "juice" and the other is turning with him.

I would have to make some switch since both motors will get the power from only one controller (Zilla).
Click to expand...

When the motors are mechanically coupled like this, the extra drag produced by the second motor and inefficiency of one motor losing more energy to resistive losses due to increased heat might mean it'd be better to have both running all the time. Testing, however, would give you far more accurate and reliable results than our speculation. :p

A series-parallel switch might be something to consider, and give you a pseudo-two-gear drive sort of thing.
 
mrgarci1 said:
Puppyjump said:
IIRC, at the last Phoenix EAA meeting we watched some film of a guy who used Thudersky cells in an old Porsche 356 - He had strapped the cells into 4-cell blocks with spacers between them (on the ends) to ACCOMODATE the swelling. They were mechanically solid, but had gaps to allow the cells to swell a little (which they would do under high current applications).

This is the guy:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQsng9F0npQ but i'm not sure which of his youtube videos he shows his spaced cells.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
I'm pretty sure you want them tight so they can't swell. Swelling means they can separate internally leading to early death. It looks to me as if Jacks packs are strapped tightly with no spacers, other than the ribs on the case of each cell.
 
JRP3 said:
There are a few Zillii available for a premium, if you can find them :wink: They may begin production again sometime soon. There is also a challenger to the Zilla in testing phase :twisted:
Click to expand...

There are no Zillas available from Cafe Electric (Otmar) but I had the opportunity to purchase a controller for a high price but I did it. Who know when I would have such an opportunity again. The problem is, it's a 1K (1000 Amps limit). But 1000 Amps @ 360 V is not bad too :mrgreen:

I'm looking for a 2K. If there will be one on the market I will purchase it.
 
JRP3 said:
frodus said:
we've got a LV Z1k

email me travis@evcomponents.com and I can get you more information
Click to expand...
I thought he was getting his HV Z1k from you guys?

(By the way, anyone else not able to get on DIYelectriccar lately?)
Click to expand...

Yes, I can't connect too. I bet that Exxon has something to do with it :mrgreen:
 
wooooooooooooo boy that BMW would be a BEAUTIFUL sport conversion, and those batts do seem to fit pretty well already, eh? :wink:

I got a chill when I saw the pic of the crates of batts, and another one when I saw the BMW pics - go for it!!
 
bmw has made mayor alternation sin their firmware layout the last years, i doubt there´s much more accessible than the wipers or lightening. there wasa like 2-3 years old thread about some north-europeans that intended to convert a 5-series bmw, but i didn´t follow up on this. the company offering this kind of upgrade to the prius does it by a loop into the regular prius oem firmware so it remains into pure electric mode and their extra-batteries feed the prius in direct while locked at this stage. it would most probably end up to be cheaper to just get the prius + this allready existing a123-based pack than upgrading your car.

nice pics and project, keep us updated.

also check with the engien makers if ther´s a wayto install a manual clutch in between 2 of these engines if set in series, that way you coudl just disengage the second engine in the row if the additional torque is not needed ( to maintain travel speed) or in case the first engien of the series fails.

these also do look like a direct-drive setup with few modificationing in the rear could be made to work on a mcc smart. stuffing the hole trunk with some sla´s or the batteries of choice and 1-2 of these engines ( one per rear wheel would be perfect if they show the exact same specifications) should "rip" pretty hard and surprisingly. just an idea in case you have leftovers of your built or if the wife wants an lectric car, too.
 
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