Build plan: 2008 Trek Fuel EX 5.5

dilbertjth

1 mW
Joined
Feb 24, 2012
Messages
19
Location
Louisville, CO
I'm planning to convert my 2008 Trek Fuel EX 5.5 to an electric commuter. It's pretty much stock with the exception of an upgrade to juicy 3 hydraulic brakes (from avid mechanical disc) and a Serfas Rx seat. Here's the before shot:
Before.JPG

The plan is:

From Grin Cyclery:

Crystalyte HS3540 direct drive rear hub motor w wheel
Infineon 35A controller w. regen.
Cycle Analyst direct connect
Torque Arm Rev 4

From Falcon EV:
48V 15Ah LiFePO4 battery pack
Two chargers

From Amazon:
Ibera seat post rack with quick disconnect bag:

rackAndBag.JPG

The idea behind the quick release bag and the extra charger is to be able to take the battery into the office when I get to work and charge it up for the ride home.

So far I have the bike, which I bought new several years ago, and the rack and bag. The rest is on order but yet to arrive. My plan is to do much of my spring/summer/fall commuting on this. Should give me a way to save gas without an extra garage bay. It will be about a 15 mile ride each way to work, much of it on nice paved bike path. Wouldn't necessarily need full suspension, but I happen to love it and have become spoiled. Got a new 2011 Trek Fuel EX 5 to replace this one for recreational riding.
 
Looks like it will be nice. I broke some seatpost racks, and even broke seatposts before I started bracing them.

You should be ok if the battery weighs less than 10 pounds, but if it weighs 15, I suggest this approach. A metal brace, in this case electric conduit, runs from the beam to the frame, creating a nice triangle.Mongoose blackcomb commuter.JPG
 
The battery will be 16 lb., so with that, the bag, and controller, it should be just under 20 lb. total load on the rack.
It's rated for 22 lb., so breakage is a distinct possibility. In that case I think I would buy one more exactly like it,
and between the new one and what's left of the broken one, I could assemble a reinforced version that mounts on
the post in two places instead of one. Your solution is nicely done, but I would prefer not do do any welding to the
frame if I can avoid it. Thanks!
 
In my opinion, batteries in the seat-post beam racks make the bike handle like a pig. So much so that bicycle hate entered my heart.
The rear-wheel travel on your bike will probably cause the tyre to buzz the underside of the rack as well.
I pissed that idea off after 2 rides and searched for a frame mounted solution for batteries. Enter the Psych Trail Bag
http://www.pcych.com/crosscountry.html.

Handelling of bike is as it should be, unclip, bring inside and recharge. Also easially transferrable across different builds.
 
I'm running on a trek fuel as well (04 ish)
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=34773
It's not ideal to have the weight up high on the back but my battery weighs about 8 lbs so It's not that bad. The bike handles it really well compared to my old hard tail. I also don't have any issue with the tire touching the rack. I just unhooked the shock and let the suspension sag all the way so that I could make sure things would clear when fully compressed.

I am still working on a plan to move my battery into the triangle but for now I've moved it to a pannier which lowered the center of gravity and helped a bit.

I have about 3k miles on this bike with no issues from the seatpost or rack other than the occasional adjustment needed. I dont' jump off curbs though :)
 
Good idea about disconnecting the shock to see worst possible case travel on the rear wheel. Hadn't thought of
that, but might have to give that a try. I'm sure having the weight back there isn't ideal, but I did get used to
having a toddler back there back in the day, so I expect I can deal with it.
 
It was a noticable, not huge, improvement to take the battery off the rack and put it in the panier.

So far to date, my trek fuel has felt really stable at speeds up into the high 30's but once I get into the lower 40's it's not rock solid anymore. I have a smaller frame than most so that is probably part of it but I think having the weight on the back and the wind pushing back on me at that speed is making the front tire light. It does seem better when I duck down but the only place I hit 40 is with traffic and I like to sit up so I can see better. catch 22.

Anyway great bike :) I look forward to seeing your finished product.
 
Well I got the shipment from Grin on Saturday. I would say my experience ordering from them was good but not great.
Feb. 15th placed the order (email option)
16th got email saying all was in stock and there should be no delay
17th got email saying payment had been processed, would begin preparing for shipment right away
27th still no notice of shipment or tracking number, so I emailed asking what was up.
28th got email saying they had been waiting on a shipment of torque arms that was later than they expected. Would go ahead and
ship the rest. They did. Got a tracking number that day.
Mar. 3rd. Delivered. So the actual shipping part was quite fast.

It would have been nice if they had:
1. Been more accurate in their check of inventory.
2. Notified me there would be a delay when they discovered they didn't have the full order.
3. Charged my credit card when they were ready to ship, not before.

Aside from the annoyance of a delay, I have several positive observations:
1. They answer emails promptly, in a friendly manner, and very thoroughly. They do take the time to write full sentences and
even paragraphs!
2. I found their overall package and price to be more attractive than other options.
3. Very informative web site. Seems honest and objective too. For example, listing wheel quality as "Poor" (9C) and "OK"
(Crystalyte). Not exactly overselling!

Anyway, my shipment was well packed and undamaged:
View attachment 1

I spent most of Saturday and some of Sunday putting it all together. Pretty straightforward, particularly all the cabling, which is
all nicely done already, just plug it in, route and secure wires. I ran into one disappointing thing, which is that my Juicy 3 hydraulic
rear brake did not fit in the clearance of the hub. So I had to go back to the BB5 mechanical one that the bike came with. It doesn't work very well. I could probably get it to work better with new pads and maybe a new cable, or I might look around for a thinner hydraulic brake that's not too pricey. On the other hand, the regen braking may be about all I really will use for the rear wheel anyway.

Lacking a battery and a torque arm, I did ride it around a bit without those to see how much drag there is from the hub. I didn't
find it to be too bad (initial opinion), but the added weight is pretty noticable, and that's without the 16 lb. of battery. If the
battery gets here before the torque arm, I think I will use the cycle analyst to limit the current to 5A, not connect the regen button,
and go ahead and ride it some without the torque arm.

Here's an after shot:
After.JPG
 
Thanks. I'll post again after I get the battery and try it. I will probably be another week or so before it arrives.

I think I may be able to get the Juicy 3 brakes to work. I've asked ebikes.ca to add a spacer to my order when they ship out the torque arm. I think that and a 203mm rotor might do the trick. Ordered a rotor and adapter yesterday from ebay.
 
Pretty slowly. I just received the disc spacer and torque arm yesterday, so I messed around with it a bit today. It looks like the Juicy
3 rear brake is going to work, but I'm finding it a bit challenging to get no rubbing as the wheel spins. Also, I don't quite like the 12mm
length disc bolts I got. They are not bad, but the head is a regular hex head, and they just kinda sorta touch the wire bundle coming
out of the wheel. So I'm going to order some with the T25 head like the normal 10mm length ones have. They seem to be a bit hard
to find, but can be had online. I'm also looking for some thin half inch washers, so I can add only the minimum I need to to get the
203 mm brake disc to not touch the frame. It just barely touches. I didn't bother with the torque arm yet. I'll do that once I have
the brake all ready to go.

As for the battery... that could be quite a while. Probably around another two months is my best guess, but we'll see. I am
regretting going with FalconEV for that.

I did come up with one small change that I made, that you may want to consider yourself. After installing the throttle, with regen
button, I wasn't real happy with how far left I had to move the shift levers. Couldn't just flick them with my thumb without moving
my hand. Workable, but not great. From your photos, looks like you did the same thing. So now what I did is rotate the throttle about
180 degrees, putting the regen button in the most comfortable place to be pressed by the forefinger. The ergonomics of pressing the
button with the forefinger aren't perfect, but good enough, I think. Then I could slide the shift levers back over where they belong. I
think the operation of the button will be somewhat intuitive, since it is a press in the same direction as the brake lever pull. I expect
to be using that button way less than the shifters, so I decided to give priority to their placement. Where the cable comes out ends up
being about at the top. Here's a photo from underneath, with the bike sitting upside down on the seat and handlebars.
regenButton.jpg
 
btw, i can't stress what dogman said enough. I had a seat post rack and felt it tugging at the seat with only 10lbs of battery. It kinda scared me. Then later i saw a bunch of cracked frames at the seat post due to that... I'd hate to see that Sweet Trek suffer the same fate. maybe something to fix up while you are waiting.
 
Cracked frame? Oh, man! Hadn't though of that possibility. I had heard about broken racks and seat posts, which I think I could
take in stride, but frame damage would suck. OK, you guys have talked me into it. I have a design in my head for some
additional support. Same basic idea as dogman's, but a bit of a different implementation. Will post a photo or two once I
have it put together.

I've also done a little modeling work on a second torque arm, for the side with wires. Talked to a friend who can help me
fabricate it and he's up for it. By "modeling" I don't mean CAD like some advanced folks on here. Just a cardboard model.
It will be one piece and mount at the brake disc holes (with longer bolts).
 
dilbertjth said:
Cracked frame? Oh, man! Hadn't though of that possibility. I had heard about broken racks and seat posts, which I think I could
take in stride, but frame damage would suck. OK, you guys have talked me into it. I have a design in my head for some
additional support. Same basic idea as dogman's, but a bit of a different implementation. Will post a photo or two once I
have it put together.

I've also done a little modeling work on a second torque arm, for the side with wires. Talked to a friend who can help me
fabricate it and he's up for it. By "modeling" I don't mean CAD like some advanced folks on here. Just a cardboard model.
It will be one piece and mount at the brake disc holes (with longer bolts).


I have essentially the same bike http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=34773 and 3400+ miles with about 20 lbs on the seat post. Treks are tough bikes unless there was some manufacturing defect I'm pretty sure the post would fail several times over before the frame did. Anyway I do agree that moving the weight off the post is a good idea. I had always planned to do that but once I got it running it just stayed where it was. Until just last weekend, my rack started to fail at the pannier mount so I took the opportunity to change the design. I ended up with a rack attached to the rear suspension rather than on the post. What I did was take a normal rack off of a hardtail bike and mounted it to the suspension. This lowered the CG of the bike and made for a much more stable pannier mount.

I still want to move the battery into the frame triangle though, hopefully before the next 3000 miles pass by.
 
Here's take one of the rack reinforcement. I was happy with it until I sat on the bike and jumped up and
down a bit to compress the rear shock. Yep, it hits the support.
reinforcedRackTake1.jpg

So I made a new lower mounting bracket and shortened it up a bit. Here it is with no air in the shock and fully
compressed. So theoretically it could still bottom out, but I doubt that it ever will. If it does, I could trim off
a bit more giving it a little more travel. Will see if that ever happens. Could always add more air too.
reinforcedRackTake2Compressed.jpg

Here it is with the shock re-inflated and some grip tape around the extra wiring to neaten that up a bit.
reinforcedRackTake2.jpg
 
If the battery bag isn't too wide to fit between your knees, could you swing the rack around 180 degrees & brace it to the top tube?
 
I suppose I could do that if it weren't too wide, but it is. But if it wasn't I think I would just mount it directly on the
top bar rather than have a rack hovering above it.
 
Got battery! That took a while. When I ordered he said it would take a couple weeks to prepare, but made no mention
that it would be shipped by boat from Hong Kong, rather than FL where Falcon EV is. The connectors are also wrong, at
least the main one, which is a SB50 instead of the Power Pole it was supposed to have. And the charging connector is
a male XLR, exactly the same as the male XLR on the charger. So I order some power poles, a crimp tool, and a couple
female/female XLR adapters. Both orders shipped already, so shouldn't be long. The battery looks nicely built though.
 
It goes! Both of my orders arrived today: the power poles and crimper and the XLR adapters. I
sprung for the real crimper, and I must say that works quite nicely. After a brief test ride, I took
it out for a nine mile ride that included some hills. Just like you all say, it's downhill all the time!
I did find a big grin on my face going up hills at 20mph or so, that normally have me down in a
low gear. I have it limited to 20A for now and is pretty decent at that. With the 20A limit, the
top speed on flat without pedaling seems to be around 27 mph. After a bit I'll increase it up to 30,
which should keep the hub in warranty. My controller goes up to 35, so maybe I'll go to that once
the warranty period is over. The weight on the back makes the handling a little squirrely, but not bad.
I think I can deal with it. Will be trying out an actual commute to work tomorrow. Forecast is for
a mild day with a high of 72. That should do nicely.
 
Now shoot that crystalyte up to 40 ah and 72 volts! Just keep an eye on that temp.

With that configuration, my exact setup did 45 mph. Only got in trouble when I tried to go above the amps and volts.

Ken
 
After a season of commuting, I thought I would post some of my experiences.
I now have a little over 2,300 miles on it, and have had a few problems, but
overall am quite happy with it.

The worst problem was an issue with the motor. Not long into its life it
started occasionally having some roughness, that I would call a rumble-thump.
It was a rough rumble over a small section of rotation of the wheel. It would
come and go, so I didn't worry too much about it. Then one day on the way
home it was solid. Rough rumble all the way around, while delivering almost
no power, and the controller would cut out completely after a few seconds.
So I limped home that day. :eek:( The problem turned out to be a broken lead to
one of the hall sensors. The wire to it stuck out a little too far an would
rub against the side of the hub during one part of the rotation. That eventually
wore through the insulation, which probably shorted out to the hub, causing the
intermittent rumbles. But then repeated press and release with every revolution
eventually fatigued the lead until it broke. Grin Cyclery was very helpful, and
with the wheel under warranty, gave me the options of sending it back to them
for repair or sending me a new hall sensor with detailed instructions for
installing it. I opted for the latter, and was successful on my second attempt.
The first time I did not replace the sensor, but was able to solder the lead
back onto the tiny stump on the chip. Then I made the poor choice of securing
it all with hot glue. Seemed like a good idea at the time, till I thought about
it a bit when I was putting it all back together. Hubs do warm up a bit....
so of course that glue didn't hold. Got me to work and half the way back. Next
time I did a full replace of the one sensor chip, and used epoxy to secure
everything. It's been running smoothly since.

One other minor failure was the bracket I made that attaches the seat rack
reinforcement bars to the seat tube of the frame. It was made from pretty thin
aluminum, and didn't hold up. One end broke off, and the other end was pretty
close to breaking off as well. I made a new one from much thicker aluminum,
and it is holding up nicely so far.

I hate flats, so I run tire liners in addition to the heavy duty slime-filled
tubes. I had one flat that demonstrated the slime tubes at their best. On
the way to work I heard and felt a loud pop at the rear wheel. I hoped it had
just shot a rock the way that sometimes happen when you hit it just right. I
didnn't stop to check it, and things seemed pretty normal till the final turn
into the parking lot, at which time I got a thump thump thump, then nothing as
I straightened out. At the bike rack, I took a look and found a big green spot
where the slime had done its job. There was still decent pressure in the tire.
At lunch time I checked and it was totally flat. I could see a piece of metal
in the green spot, so I pulled on it. It came out two inches, then didn't want
to come out further. After prying a bit I got it out. It was a nail, and had
entered the tire head first! The head measured a quarter inch in diameter.
Anyway, I rotated the wheel to put the wound on the bottom, then pumped it up
partially. When it was time to go home, there was still some pressure in the
tire, so I pumped it up more and made it all the way home! I didn't hold
forever though, so I did have to replace the tube, and replaced the tire while
I was at it since it was such a significant puncture. But still, pretty
impressive!

At one point I discovered three spokes were broken. I ordered some new ones
and replaced them, and also tightened them all up a bit. Since then a few more
have broken, so I keep a better eye on them and replace them as they break. I
got those from ebikessf.

I have found the cycle analyst (computer) to be quite worth the money. I use
the programmable limits to limit the current to 25A and the speed to 31 mph.
I find that to be sufficient power while still maintaining decent range. The
speed limit serves as a cruise control of sorts. 31 mph is what I find to be
about my maximum comfortable cadence, so it's nice to be able to just hold
the throttle open and contribute whatever amount of effort I want to the pedals,
while maintaining a nice cruise speed.

I've found people's reactions to be entertaining on occasion. First of all, it's
always fun to pass the lycra guys. Some of them don't seem to figure out that it's
motorized, and why they're being passed by some dufus wearing a cotton T shirt on
a mountain bike. One of the funniest experiences was after passing and being passed
by a motorcycle several times (I would pass him at the stop lights), he pulls up
next to me and paces me on my the big uphill of my commute. He yells over, "How
are you doing that?". I point to the hub and tell him it's electric. "That's
fuckin awesome!" he yells back, then pulls away.

Toward the end of the summer I finally added a front fender for the few occasions
when I do find myself riding in or after rain. Without that, I would take quite
a bit of tire spray in the face. The spray from the rear seems to be mostly
caught by the rack and battery case.
 
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