35km torture test for low power RC Drive

[Kurt]

Today I set out with a fully charged pack. 36v 20ah headway, Stock 40A 12 fet controller, Matts 4v rc reduction drive all powering a stock turnigy 80- 100. The idea was to go for a good size non stop ride of at least 30 or 40km. I picked a ride that would include a lot of hills. I would also have a go at one very big long climb in the middle of the ride. The biggest and longest climb I can find. I wanted to hit everything at full throttle and just peddle along no effort in top gear contributing my own 200w? to the equation.

It was a perfect day for it around 25 deg and blue sky. I headed out from my home suburb The Gap. I took a back road through a national park and up some very steep climbs "get off your non powered Peddle bike and walk climbs". The road was twisty but very smooth and quiet. I ended up at about 300ft elevation . I passed a popular down hill MTB area with lots of tracks leading off the sealed road. Most head down the hill into the bushland. I followed the road for around 10km more leading out through another typical suburb.I followed a cycle lane along main road with a good share of steep yet short climbs and descents over the next 8km. I then took a bike path along the side highway for around 4km relativity flat riding .

I then made the decision to tackle the biggest climb in my city called Mt Cootha lookout. Its about a 1000ft climb that's virtual straight up with a nice lookout and restaurant at the top.The views are nice looking out over Brisbane city to the water. This climb is very popular with the Lycra crowd trying to prove something to each other.I had used about 7ah of my 20ah pack at this stage so wasn't sure how much more battery this trip to the lookout was going to use. I just set the throttle on full and up I went. Motor and controller were only worm at the top perhaps 10deg C above ambient temp. I think I must have only used 2 or 3ah to do the lookout climb. As the total ah for the trip was around 12ah.

I then took a rather hilly root home for the remaining 10km or so. Rc drives sure can climb hills and modest build like mine can still climb anything I throw at it. From what I learned today it it could do it all day no problem.

Total distance 35.3km
Battery consumption 460wh
Average s 26kmh
Max s 53kmh
Consumption 13 whr km

Edit : I will also include same weight for the ride.

Me 69.5kg
bike complete with battery 31.8kg. The battery alone in its bag is 8.8kg

Total 101.3kg


Kurt

link to ride in detail google maps.
http://maps.google.com.au/maps?saddr=warruga+st+the+gap&daddr=mt+cootha+to:Gap+Creek+Rd+to:Hilder+Road,+The+Gap,+Queensland&hl=en&ll=-27.473287,152.95265&spn=0.071582,0.169086&sll=-27.48054,152.95546&sspn=0.071577,0.169086&geocode=FdFfXf4dk6cdCSmnfz2isFaRazHdPSgStm08EQ%3BFRacXP4d1_gdCSkFPHXA3lCRazEwkd7zWqMCBQ%3BFS64XP4d8n0dCQ%3BFUhfXf4dEZsdCSmxrF6LsFaRazGumOrFgz7yJg&mra=ls&t=f&z=13&ecpose=-27.56245614,152.95266239,10214.7,-0.007,44.795,0
Pics from lookout car park.

 

[Rassy]

Great report. Trike looks good.

 

[dequinox]

That is INSANELY low power consumption for a hilly climb! Well done sir...my beast consumes about twice that power on average. I of course much accelerate hard and generally lay waste to my battery though.

 

[Kurt]

That is INSANELY low power consumption for a hilly climb! Well done sir...my beast consumes about twice that power on average. I of course much accelerate hard and generally lay waste to my battery though.

The funny thing is although I always peddle along gently with minimal effort and today was no different. Today's ride I didn't have my CA connected. I just had a Turnigy watt meter behind me and was tracking the ride with GPS logger. The idea of today's ride was to use a lot of full throttle and try and find the hills and challenging sections to test the motor/controller combo. I could have been a lot more efficient if I had me CA in view when climbing hills. I can then throttle up to a point where I am drawing say 20Amps and then set the cruse at that level and it will hold the set amps up the climb. Today I just went full throttle and top gear on the bike with slow effortless assist.

I have seen 6wh km on a short 10km ride trying to be efficient.

Kurt

 

[dbaker]

Nice, Kurt I did not follow your build. Are you using Hall sensors inside the motor? Did you program the controller or was it bone stock?

 

[AussieJester]

I then took a rather hilly root home for the remaining 10km or so. Rc drives sure can climb hills and modest build like mine can still climb anything I throw at it. From what I learned today it it could do it all day no problem.

Throw another 30v or so at it and it will just about
wheel spin up them hills Kurt LoL... Excellent report
anywayz mate, looks like a similar view i get from
where i live over looking the City of Perth!

KiM

 

[Wheazel]

Beutiful report! Do you have any idea of what your power is at top speed (53km/hr)? Level ground.

 

[Kurt]

Beutiful report! Do you have any idea of what your power is at top speed (53km/hr)? Level ground.

53kmh was rolling down the hills. I could have most likely got up to 80kmh or more. I kept the speed low Because the battery is up high and to the rear of the trike. This makes it a lot less stable and prone to getting twitchy and tipping over easy. The battery will be mid mounted very low in the future. i also want to put hydrologic motorbike/scooter style disk brakes up front on a single brake lever. At the moment you have to be very careful modulating the left and right brake even. Or you brake steer.

The max speed on flat ground is about 40kmh this is a gearing limitation at 36v.At this speed I use about 500w.

Nice, Kurt I did not follow your build. Are you using Hall sensors inside the motor? Did you program the controller or was it bone stock?

I am using hall sensors internally mounted.The controller is a 9c 40a 12 fet. Apparently its identical to the infinion 12 fet controller. The controller is completely stock with factory programming.

Throw another 30v or so at it and it will just about
wheel spin up them hills Kurt LoL... Excellent report
anywayz mate, looks like a similar view i get from
where i live over looking the City of Perth!

KiM

I can see by most of your vids your in a hilly area to. Million dollar views if you can see Perth like that. I'm tucked down in the valley But most of the hills around Brisbane are nation Park or home to the tv networks.There are a few lucky people that have private homes up there.

Hills are hard on the motors, brakes and battery's. I am lucky if I do have the option of following a bike path along the creek on the valley floor from my house 10km to the city . If I ride in any other direction though its all hilly terrain. It makes me laugh when I see video's on here with people riding there bikes up what they call a hill and it looks like what I would call flat ground. :lol:

I think your onto something Kim with the 66v. 15s lipo would give Me 60kmh top speed and that's about as fast as I would want to go on this trike. I was thinking a 18fet controller at 66v with a good 60A for a good 4000w as I am only pushing 1400w at the moment. I was thinking the controllers that have the 3 speed switch option. That way if I want to put around and get some efficiency on speed one. If I want to make a Lycra rider cry. I can just hit speed 3 :lol: If i didn't have the 3 speed switch I would just chew through my battery as its to tempting to just use the power.

I was also thinking some temp monitoring would be nice. Just a probe on the coils "easy to do with a out runner" and a gauge up front. When your riding up a long steep hill its nice to know something isn't cooking behind you.

Kurt

 

[Hardcarve1]

They are very good numbers you are pulling and I would say a lot would be the aero benifits of the trike. In my younger days I would do the trip up Mt Cootha every weekend and it's no easy climb, if the motor & controller were only warm it means you are not hurting them and theirs plenty more to get out of the system.
I ride to work from Brighton to Eagle farm and its all flat. I will pull double your numbers with my 9C hub with 53v 20ah and use about 11ah for 26km trip with an average of 32km/hr. When I had my HXT outrunner running through the nuvincci I was getting bad numbers but great wheelies hence my move to a frock. Now you got me thinking again.
Would be good to get a few of the Brisbane riders together for a rally and do some of the clasic rides around the place. Sick of reading about the perth riders having fun in the sun and then drinking emu piss and watching funny football.

 

[gtadmin]

... and watching funny football.

but at least it's football

 

[Kurt]

They are very good numbers you are pulling and I would say a lot would be the aero benefits of the trike. In my younger days I would do the trip up Mt Cootha every weekend and it's no easy climb, if the motor & controller were only warm it means you are not hurting them and theirs plenty more to get out of the system.
I ride to work from Brighton to Eagle farm and its all flat. I will pull double your numbers with my 9C hub with 53v 20ah and use about 11ah for 26km trip with an average of 32km/hr. When I had my HXT outrunner running through the nuvincci I was getting bad numbers but great wheelies hence my move to a frock. Now you got me thinking again.
Would be good to get a few of the Brisbane riders together for a rally and do some of the clasic rides around the place. Sick of reading about the perth riders having fun in the sun and then drinking emu piss and watching funny football.

This is only my opinion but I put the efficiency down to a few thing to do with the electronics choice and gearing rather than the aero benefits or a trike. I would say with the speed I ride sub 45kmh the aero benefits of a trike would be lucky to be 5% .Especially with the more upright position of a casual leisure trike like mine. Then when you + the drag of 3 wheels and relatively low pressure 40psi 20" wheels on my trike . Then there is the extra weight of a trike that is a disadvantage going up the hills. So I would say efficiency of my trike trike is about even with a nice MTB running slick tyres.

The efficiency comes from the controller, voltage selection, and gearing.

The gearing selection of Matts reduction drive / belt drive is spot on for a 20' wheel. With a 130kv 80-100 it works out to spot on 1kph for every volt . At 36v-around 42 hot off the charge and 39v for most of the ride is around 40kph on the flat . I feel 36....42v hot off charge is a very effective voltage due to wind drag at this modest speed" At full charge 48v is around 50kmh and so on with this gearing. Wind drag would have some efect on that speed as the voltage- top speed went up. My gearing is perfect for a single speed i feel .

The ebike controllers with current limiting and hall sensors are very efficient. They give you lots low speed torque and current limiting 40A for my controller is very effective.

I feel if you were to slap some hall sensors in your 80-100, fitting the sensors internally is the trick to success as well . Its a 15 min job. Get hold of a 12 or 18 fet Lyen controller and run it at between 40 and 60v . Pick your battery current 40 - 80a current limiting depending on how silly you want to go and you have a great reliable low cost combination between 1500w - 5000w.

I would be keen on getting together with some Brisbane ebikers for a ride. I am sure we all would have something to offer when it comes to tweaking our bikes to .

Kurt

 

[John Bozi]

Hats off to you Kurt if your bike could go from the botanical gardens to the summit.

That is huge!

Yes I also would like to an ebike meet up with Brisbanites. I ride mostly round the Gap.

ps another good test for your bike would be Dillon road from the gap up to the round about where the "rocket frog" starts. But turn left up the 20% graded hill there when at the end if your bike can handle gravel head up the fire road which I am guessing is even steeper up past the "dingo" entrance and up to mount cootha. I highly doubt you will have enough traction though.